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American Politics Thread VI: Can't We All Just Get Along?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Is it no longer possible to collaborate with political opponents at this stage?

It is no longer possible.
232
36%
It is possible.
166
25%
Collaboration is possible if we have similar economic views.
47
7%
Collaboration is possible if we have similar cultural/social views.
106
16%
Why would I collaborate with anyone? Going monke is the best way forward.
102
16%
 
Total votes : 653

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Kowani
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Posts: 41753
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:27 pm

Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."
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San Lumen
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New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:27 pm

Kowani wrote:Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."


I'm fairly certain that's illegal.

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Bombadil
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Bombadil » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:28 pm

Cannot think of a name wrote:
Bahia Roja wrote:
Well, no. Cut slavery, sexism, poor sanitation and medicine, poor quality of living, industralization and the civil wars. Keep duels.

The last guy I met who was all gung ho for duels lost three straight to me in a sword fight with practice swords.

I have virtually no training in sword fighting.

I don’t think people yearning for duels have really thought their shit through. Or, you know, like…looked a community calendar or something to find a place you can sword fight and not die, or run around with pretendy guns and play soldier person and not die.

I’ll never understand people thinking it’d be cool to kill a person they’re beefing with.


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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:35 pm

Picairn wrote:
Kowani wrote:...i just now realized I marked Sinema as a republican in this post
ooops

At this point she's very much a Republican-lite.

To make my previous point more explicit... y'all are acting like Republicans did under Trump when a representative didn't universally tow the party line. Pretty much beat-for-beat, if I'm being honest.

Kowani wrote:Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."

>rawstory
Oh, so this is a lie then
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Picairn
Senator
 
Posts: 4667
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:42 pm

Proctopeo wrote:To make my previous point more explicit... y'all are acting like Republicans did under Trump when a representative didn't universally tow the party line. Pretty much beat-for-beat, if I'm being honest.

:roll: If I have a dollar for each time someone makes a "bothsame" tripe, I'll be rich.
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Kowani
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Posts: 41753
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:45 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
Picairn wrote:At this point she's very much a Republican-lite.

To make my previous point more explicit... y'all are acting like Republicans did under Trump when a representative didn't universally tow the party line. Pretty much beat-for-beat, if I'm being honest.

Kowani wrote:Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."

>rawstory
Oh, so this is a lie then

yeah man its not like there's a link to a local news site running the story on the page
Sex is great. But have you tried data visualizations of partisan spatial segregation?
Its a terrible day to be literate.
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Proctopeo
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12332
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:47 pm

Picairn wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:To make my previous point more explicit... y'all are acting like Republicans did under Trump when a representative didn't universally tow the party line. Pretty much beat-for-beat, if I'm being honest.

:roll: If I have a dollar for each time someone makes a "bothsame" tripe, I'll be rich.

I'm completely right and you know it. It's the same shit. Bitching about me making a simple observation only serves to show that I'm too accurate for comfort.

Kowani wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:To make my previous point more explicit... y'all are acting like Republicans did under Trump when a representative didn't universally tow the party line. Pretty much beat-for-beat, if I'm being honest.


>rawstory
Oh, so this is a lie then

yeah man its not like there's a link to a local news site running the story on the page

Ah, my mistake. Generally when it's some tabloid like Rawstory I assume it's mostly falsehoods mixed in with one or two partial truths for flavor.
Last edited by Proctopeo on Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Picairn
Senator
 
Posts: 4667
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:51 pm

Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it. It's the same shit. Bitching about me making a simple observation only serves to show that I'm too accurate for comfort.

LMAO keep giving yourself a pat on the back. I don't care if you're comfortable telling yourself a repeated lie.
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Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
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Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.
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Proctopeo
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Posts: 12332
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:54 pm

Picairn wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it. It's the same shit. Bitching about me making a simple observation only serves to show that I'm too accurate for comfort.

LMAO keep giving yourself a pat on the back. I don't care if you're comfortable telling yourself a repeated lie.

Explain, then, why people in favor of the Democratic party in this thread are acting exactly like Republicans did a few years ago, under very comparable circumstances (that is to say, a representative under the name of the party not unilaterally supporting everything endorsed by the party bigwigs)

The only lie here is your belief that shouting "you said bothsame!!!" constitutes a valid refutation.
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Genivaria
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Genivaria » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:57 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
Picairn wrote:LMAO keep giving yourself a pat on the back. I don't care if you're comfortable telling yourself a repeated lie.

Explain, then, why people in favor of the Democratic party in this thread are acting exactly like Republicans did a few years ago, under very comparable circumstances (that is to say, a representative under the name of the party not unilaterally supporting everything endorsed by the party bigwigs)

The only lie here is your belief that shouting "you said bothsame!!!" constitutes a valid refutation.

Who exactly are you talking about? Do tell.
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Picairn
Senator
 
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Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:58 pm

Proctopeo wrote:Explain, then, why people in favor of the Democratic party in this thread are acting exactly like Republicans did a few years ago, under very comparable circumstances (that is to say, a representative under the name of the party not unilaterally supporting everything endorsed by the party bigwigs)

You are literally lying. There aren't "very comparable circumstances" here, unless you can't differentiate between the actions of the Democratic and Republican party.

The only lie here is your belief that shouting "you said bothsame!!!" constitutes a valid refutation.

Feel free to craft more lies and projections masquerading as valid arguments, it doesn't change a single thing.
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WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
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Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
Center-left liberal, passionate political observer, and naval warfare enthusiast.
Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.
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Proctopeo
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Posts: 12332
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:02 pm

Genivaria wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:Explain, then, why people in favor of the Democratic party in this thread are acting exactly like Republicans did a few years ago, under very comparable circumstances (that is to say, a representative under the name of the party not unilaterally supporting everything endorsed by the party bigwigs)

The only lie here is your belief that shouting "you said bothsame!!!" constitutes a valid refutation.

Who exactly are you talking about? Do tell.

I said it in parenthesis very, very soon after the underlined. Please read.

Picairn wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:Explain, then, why people in favor of the Democratic party in this thread are acting exactly like Republicans did a few years ago, under very comparable circumstances (that is to say, a representative under the name of the party not unilaterally supporting everything endorsed by the party bigwigs)

You are literally lying. There aren't "very comparable circumstances" here, unless you can't differentiate between the actions of the Democratic and Republican party.

I'm not lying. Again, the circumstances are thus: a representative does not, 100%, support everything championed by the head(s) of the party, and is being declared a "secret member" of the other party. Republicans did it under Trump. Democrats (or people who broadly support them) are doing it right here, under Biden.

The only lie here is your belief that shouting "you said bothsame!!!" constitutes a valid refutation.

Feel free to craft more lies and projections masquerading as valid arguments, it doesn't change a single thing.

I can't tell if this is a terrible attempt at gaslighting me, or a skilled attempt at maintaining your own delusions.
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Thermodolia
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:03 pm

Kowani wrote:Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."

Oh look fascism in action. When are we going to RICO the GOP? Oh right the Dems are too pussyfooted to actually do anything important like passing election reform or filibuster reform.
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Bahia Roja
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Founded: Dec 28, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Bahia Roja » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:05 pm

Cannot think of a name wrote:I don’t think people yearning for duels have really thought their shit through. Or, you know, like…looked a community calendar or something to find a place you can sword fight and not die, or run around with pretendy guns and play soldier person and not die.

I’ll never understand people thinking it’d be cool to kill a person they’re beefing with.


I was just... joking. I don't want to, you know, kill people. It's a joke.
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Corrian
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Corrian » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:06 pm

What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?
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Bahia Roja
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Bahia Roja » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:07 pm

Corrian wrote:What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?


Recently, I guess.
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Proctopeo
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Posts: 12332
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:07 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Kowani wrote:Trump supporters are now going door to door in Pennsylvania demanding to know which candidate people backed


Donald Trump supporters calling themselves an "election integrity committee" are going door to door in Pennsylvania and demanding to know whom residents voted for in the November election. York County president commissioner Julie Wheeler, a Republican, said she received numerous calls about alleged voter intimidation by members of the so-called committee, and has referred the matter to law enforcement, the York Dispatch reported Thursday. Wheeler added that the committee has no affiliation with county government.

County officials are currently weighing whether to comply with a "forensic audit" of the 2020 election spearheaded by GOP state Sen. Doug Mastriano, based on the former president's false claims of widespread fraud. Chad Baker, chair of the Democratic Party of York County, said members of the "election integrity committee" appear to be targeting Democrats. "There is an intimidation factor, and that's what their intent is," Baker said. "The timing of this doesn't seem suspect given the recent request of the audit by Sen. Mastriano."

Oh look fascism in action. When are we going to RICO the GOP? Oh right the Dems are too pussyfooted to actually do anything important like passing election reform or filibuster reform.

Ah yes, start a massive criminal organization investigation on an entire political party because... of some weirdos in Nowheresville, Pennsylvania? If we're gonna be doing nonsensical shit like that, we might as well revive the HUAC and use it to establish an elective monarchy.
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Thermodolia
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Posts: 67218
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:09 pm

Corrian wrote:What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?

Well the female senator from Arizona pitched a fit about it and threatened to vote against it if it wasn’t watered down more than it is.

Then the republicans kept filibustering everything but Biden doesn’t support filibuster reform because his mind is stuck in the 90s back when the GOP wasn’t batshit insane and still thinks he can work with them.
Male, State Socialist, Cultural Nationalist, Welfare Chauvinist lives somewhere in AZ I'm GAY! Disabled US Military Veteran
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>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
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Thermodolia
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Posts: 67218
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:10 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Oh look fascism in action. When are we going to RICO the GOP? Oh right the Dems are too pussyfooted to actually do anything important like passing election reform or filibuster reform.

Ah yes, start a massive criminal organization investigation on an entire political party because... of some weirdos in Nowheresville, Pennsylvania? If we're gonna be doing nonsensical shit like that, we might as well revive the HUAC and use it to establish an elective monarchy.

I mean I’ve advocated many a time for HUAC. I’ve petition to Congress about it but they haven’t returned my calls.
Male, State Socialist, Cultural Nationalist, Welfare Chauvinist lives somewhere in AZ I'm GAY! Disabled US Military Veteran
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies

RIP Dya

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Punished UMN
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5003
Founded: Jul 05, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Punished UMN » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:10 pm

Genivaria wrote:
Sundiata wrote:But in some ways, neither were as good as the Middle Ages.

Then you clearly are very ignorant of the relevant history.

No, he's got a point actually. The middle ages obviously wasn't great, in large part for reasons down to the level of technology rather than their political and economic system, but there were some admirable things about the middle ages in the sense that the leadership and upper class actually had a stake in the decisions they made. Maybe we would have fewer wars today if the president and Congress had to go lead the war from the front and fight in it instead of being able to order bombings from the safety of office buildings.
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Kowani
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Posts: 41753
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:10 pm

Corrian wrote:What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?

broad strokes: republican delaying tactics+centrist deisire for having a deal over the actual substance of one+none of the principal dealmakers actually having any experience in infrastructure policy
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Bahia Roja
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Posts: 268
Founded: Dec 28, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Bahia Roja » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:12 pm

Kowani wrote:
Corrian wrote:What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?

broad strokes: republican delaying tactics+centrist deisire for having a deal over the actual substance of one+none of the principal dealmakers actually having any experience in infrastructure policy


Broader strokes: we're fucked.
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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 67218
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:13 pm

Punished UMN wrote:
Genivaria wrote:Then you clearly are very ignorant of the relevant history.

No, he's got a point actually. The middle ages obviously wasn't great, in large part for reasons down to the level of technology rather than their political and economic system, but there were some admirable things about the middle ages in the sense that the leadership and upper class actually had a stake in the decisions they made. Maybe we would have fewer wars today if the president and Congress had to go lead the war from the front and fight in it instead of being able to order bombings from the safety of office buildings.

I vote we require an elected official at random have to serve 3 months of the front lines of whatever war they voted for. And no fobbits
Male, State Socialist, Cultural Nationalist, Welfare Chauvinist lives somewhere in AZ I'm GAY! Disabled US Military Veteran
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies

RIP Dya

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Picairn
Senator
 
Posts: 4667
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:22 pm

Proctopeo wrote:I'm not lying. Again, the circumstances are thus: a representative does not, 100%, support everything championed by the head(s) of the party, and is being declared a "secret member" of the other party. Republicans did it under Trump. Democrats (or people who broadly support them) are doing it right here, under Biden.

Overtly simplistic narratives created for a specific agenda aren't true in any circumstances. Sinema has been going further right in recent years. She used to be a social worker and a Green Party member before joining the Democratic Party in 2004. She has moved from supporting left-wing positions in the 2000s to becoming one of the most conservative Democrats in Congress today. Even Manchin of all people is on board with the recon bill. What does that say about Sinema? My remark that Sinema at this point is a Republican-lite seems very much in line with her voting record and statements.

I can't tell if this is a terrible attempt at gaslighting me, or a skilled attempt at maintaining your own delusions.

The confusion is mutual, I can't tell if you are deliberately baiting people or merely spreading propaganda.
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WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
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Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
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Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.
♔ The Empire of Picairn ♔
-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-—————————-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-
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Corrian
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 71714
Founded: Mar 19, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Corrian » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:26 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Corrian wrote:What's with this weak ass bipartisan deal? When did we fuck over even the bipartisan infrastructure plan?

Well the female senator from Arizona pitched a fit about it and threatened to vote against it if it wasn’t watered down more than it is.

Then the republicans kept filibustering everything but Biden doesn’t support filibuster reform because his mind is stuck in the 90s back when the GOP wasn’t batshit insane and still thinks he can work with them.

I seriously need to get the fuck out of this useless ass country. Its a joke. I had a moment of hope, but man, it seems we're in a perpetual state of getting nothing done.
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