NationStates

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:05 pm**

Herzpunkt wrote:Satanism is NOT Pagan first off

Satanism, devil worship or the atheistic kind, is inspired by Christianity and other abrahamic faiths.

Even then Satanism is mostly just atheists gaming the system.

Besides this guy never claimed to be a Satanist but did claim to be sent by Satan

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:09 pm**

Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:10 pm**

Thermodolia wrote:
Herzpunkt wrote:Satanism is NOT Pagan first off

Satanism, devil worship or the atheistic kind, is inspired by Christianity and other abrahamic faiths.

Even then Satanism is mostly just atheists gaming the system.

Besides this guy never claimed to be a Satanist but did claim to be sent by Satan

Meh, hes claiming to be "sent by Satan" that's a pretty strong calling lol

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:10 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

Religious experience is all the need evidence I need tbh.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:11 pm**

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

Religious experience is all the need evidence I need tbh.

The fuck is that supposed to be?

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:12 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Religious experience is all the need evidence I need tbh.

The fuck is that supposed to be?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_experience

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:16 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

It's difficult to explain faith to someone who has none.

No offense intended.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:16 pm**

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
The fuck is that supposed to be?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_experience

...temporal insanity? Hallucination? How could I ever accept anything without evidence, without an explanation? That's ridiculous.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:17 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_experience

...temporal insanity? Hallucination? How could I ever accept anything without evidence, without an explanation? That's ridiculous.

So how was the universe made and what came before that?

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:18 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

Because the Lord Buddha was the supreme person and if I had to have faith in anything, I would direct it to him.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:20 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

What's with atheist coming into religious threads and making posts like this?

Are you trying to get people to become atheists or something?

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:22 pm**

Suriyanakhon wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

Because the Lord Buddha was the supreme person and if I had to have faith in anything, I would direct it to him.

This is precisely my question: Why do you think that you "have to have faith"? Isn't faith in itself an immoral act? What is morality but following your reasoning? And what could be more irrational than believing anything without supporting evidence?

I honestly cannot see how I could ever "have faith" in anything. Or why I should ever want to. To me "faith" is... a mental desease.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:24 pm**

Just-An-Illusion wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Why do you feel that you need that thing...faith...at all? Why believe without evidence at all??? I don't get it, what's the appeal?

What's with atheist coming into religious threads and making posts like this?

Are you trying to get people to become atheists or something?

I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:25 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
Just-An-Illusion wrote:
What's with atheist coming into religious threads and making posts like this?

Are you trying to get people to become atheists or something?

I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

"Get rid of it for good."

Buddy that sounds like your advocating for genocide.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:25 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
Just-An-Illusion wrote:
What's with atheist coming into religious threads and making posts like this?

Are you trying to get people to become atheists or something?

I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

Well, this isn't a thread for you to come and threaten or antagonize

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:27 pm**

Just-An-Illusion wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

"Get rid of it for good."

Buddy that sounds like your advocating for genocide.

Cognicide lol... I'd compare it to getting rid of racism or homophobia more like.

Herzpunkt wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

Well, this isn't a thread for you to come and threaten or antagonize

Who's threatened anyone? If your stance is threatened by open questions you should perhaps think about it again.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:28 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:This is precisely my question: Why do you think that you "have to have faith"?

Because, as hackneyed as the expression is, everyone has faith in something.

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:Isn't faith in itself an immoral act? What is morality but following your reasoning?

No? That's a weird moral judgement that's a product of the Enlightenment which I don't subscribe to. Reasoning can be useful but is imperfect and can lead to a “thicket of views” (to use a term from the suttas).

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:31 pm**

Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:To me "faith" is... a mental desease.

There is no empirical evidence to suggest that Communism is remotely feasible. And yet, Communists have faith that it is.

Faith is not a religious monopoly. Everyone has faith. Atheists have faith. You have faith. You have faith when you believe you can make it one more mile on an empty tank of gas, you have faith when you believe that your lotto card will have the winning numbers, you have faith when you believe the girl you like will say yes when you ask her out. Everyone has faith; and faith is in everything. That religious faith happens to place belief in cosmic, metaphysical, primordial, interdimensional, supernatural, or universal concepts does not make it any more absurd than the faith you regularly and subconsciously display in every day life.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:31 pm**

Just-An-Illusion wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:
I'm just curious about your reasoning...know thy enemy and all that. Maybe if we can figfure out why you abandon reason and chose "faith" instead we can figure out how to get rid of it for good

"Get rid of it for good."

Buddy that sounds like your advocating for genocide.

I think that they think having faith is equal to mental illness, and getting rid of it is also equal to getting rid of homophobia and racism, said all we need to know.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:32 pm**

Lady Victory wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:To me "faith" is... a mental desease.

There is no empirical evidence to suggest that Communism is remotely feasible. And yet, Communists have faith that it is.

Faith is not a religious monopoly. Everyone has faith. Atheists have faith. You have faith. You have faith when you believe you can make it one more mile on an empty tank of gas, you have faith when you believe that your lotto card will have the winning numbers, you have faith when you believe the girl you like will say yes when you ask her out. Everyone has faith; and faith is in everything. That religious faith happens to place belief in cosmic, metaphysical, primordial, interdimensional, supernatural, or universal concepts does not make it any more absurd than the faith you regularly and subconsciously display in every day life.

Very well put

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:34 pm**

Lady Victory wrote:
Jianxi Fujian Soviet wrote:To me "faith" is... a mental desease.

There is no empirical evidence to suggest that Communism is remotely feasible. And yet, Communists have faith that it is.

Faith is not a religious monopoly. Everyone has faith. Atheists have faith. You have faith. You have faith when you believe you can make it one more mile on an empty tank of gas, you have faith when you believe that your lotto card will have the winning numbers, you have faith when you believe the girl you like will say yes when you ask her out. Everyone has faith; and faith is in everything. That religious faith happens to place belief in cosmic, metaphysical, primordial, interdimensional, supernatural, or universal concepts does not make it any more absurd than the faith you regularly and subconsciously display in every day life.

My girlfriend has faith that I won't burn down the house whenever she leaves.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:35 pm**

Suriyanakhon wrote:
Lady Victory wrote:
There is no empirical evidence to suggest that Communism is remotely feasible. And yet, Communists have faith that it is.

Faith is not a religious monopoly. Everyone has faith. Atheists have faith. You have faith. You have faith when you believe you can make it one more mile on an empty tank of gas, you have faith when you believe that your lotto card will have the winning numbers, you have faith when you believe the girl you like will say yes when you ask her out. Everyone has faith; and faith is in everything. That religious faith happens to place belief in cosmic, metaphysical, primordial, interdimensional, supernatural, or universal concepts does not make it any more absurd than the faith you regularly and subconsciously display in every day life.

My girlfriend has faith that I won't burn down the house whenever she leaves.

That's true love, right there.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:38 pm**

Samudera Darussalam wrote:
Suriyanakhon wrote:
Thanks for sharing, I was aware that Indonesia still had animist beliefs from the Pre-Islamic period, but didn't know that it had a name.

Modern Indonesia has a weird law where every major religion has to be monotheistic, doesn't it?

Yes, afaik it is implied in Indonesia's founding principle and government-enforced ideology. The thing is composed as a compromise for Indonesian factions, where the first sila/principle is a compromise for the religious factions (there are Muslim and Christian factions, but the Islamic ones are the most influential out of the two), thus the 'belief in Almighty God' thing. Pancasila is enshrined in the preambule of the constitution, and the constitution is the highest legal authority in the country's system of government, and the three branches of government must defer to it. Hence, there is a saying that pancasila is the first and foremost source of laws in Indonesia.

Funnily enough, I think this is why my maternal grandparents converted to Islam in the first place. My grandfather specifically happened to be a state public servant of a quite high echelon, so his rivals started spreading gossips about him being a non-monotheistic infidel who don't do prayers (especially since he, like many animists, puts "Islam" on his ID card). Though, it was also the de-Benny-zation period (the purging of the General Benny Moerdani's influence from Suharto's government), where Suharto cozies up with the "green" faction of the army and intellectual Muslims, at a time of increased Islamic conservativism. Then again, they seemed satisfied with themselves after hiring a Quranic teacher and eventually converting to Islam, so who cares.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:44 pm**

Samudera Darussalam wrote:
Just-An-Illusion wrote:

"Get rid of it for good."

Buddy that sounds like your advocating for genocide.

I think that they think having faith is equal to mental illness, and getting rid of it is also equal to getting rid of homophobia and racism, said all we need to know.

Its clear they're not here to discuss in good faith... I'm not Pagan myself, but I don't understand why atheist like that are so determined to get rid of religion.

Posted: **Tue May 25, 2021 5:44 pm**

Resilient Acceleration wrote:
Samudera Darussalam wrote:Yes, afaik it is implied in Indonesia's founding principle and government-enforced ideology. The thing is composed as a compromise for Indonesian factions, where the first sila/principle is a compromise for the religious factions (there are Muslim and Christian factions, but the Islamic ones are the most influential out of the two), thus the 'belief in Almighty God' thing. Pancasila is enshrined in the preambule of the constitution, and the constitution is the highest legal authority in the country's system of government, and the three branches of government must defer to it. Hence, there is a saying that pancasila is the first and foremost source of laws in Indonesia.

Funnily enough, I think this is why my maternal grandparents converted to Islam in the first place. My grandfather specifically happened to be a state public servant of a quite high echelon, so his rivals started spreading gossips about him being a non-monotheistic infidel who don't do prayers (especially since he, like many animists, puts "Islam" on his ID card). Though, it was also the de-Benny-zation period (the purging of the General Benny Moerdani's influence from Suharto's government), where Suharto cozies up with the "green" faction of the army and intellectual Muslims, at a time of increased Islamic conservativism. But since they seemed pretty satisfied with themselves after hiring a Quranic teacher and eventually converting to Islam, then who cares.

Rivalry is quite nasty for that time. My maternal grandpa was a non-practicing Muslim (mom mentioned she never see him pray) who worked as the head of some department in regional level, and mom said she can't count how many attempts his rivals/enemies tried to frame him. One of them succeeded in framing him for bribery, that led to his downfall (and indirectly, death, as he fell sick after that).

Sorry that happened to yours. That thing shouldn't happen to anyone.

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