Afghan Conflict: Russian Political Leader Meets With Massoud

[Heloin]

That the Taliban paid it’s soldiers on time unlike the Afghan National Army being a significant factor in why the ANA disintegrated is clearly lost on you.

That's probably because it's bogus, the Taliban didn't give paychecks to its fighters by and large

By and large the ANA didn’t get pay cheques but that doesn’t change the point that the Taliban fighters did get paid. Soldiers can’t really fight for nothing and the wealth of the Taliban is a widely known fact.

[Kowani]

Qatar’s emir Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad Al Thani urges world leaders not to boycott the Taliban

The ruling emir of Qatar, whose nation has played a pivotal role in Afghanistan in the wake of the U.S. withdrawal, urged world leaders gathered at the United Nations on Tuesday against turning their backs on the country’s Taliban rulers.

Speaking from the podium of the U.N. General Assembly, Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad Al Thani stressed “the necessity of continuing dialogue with Taliban because boycott only leads to polarization and reactions, whereas dialogue could bring in positive results.”

His warning was directed at the many heads of state worried about engaging with the Taliban and recognizing their takeover of Afghanistan.

The Taliban say they want international recognition. The group challenged the credentials of Afghanistan’s former U.N. ambassador and are asking to speak at the U.N. General Assembly’s high-level meeting of world leaders. They say it is the responsibility of the United Nations to recognize their government and for other countries to have diplomatic relations with them. Senior State Department officials said they were aware of the Taliban’s request as the U.S. is a member of the U.N. credentials committee, but they would not predict how that panel might rule. However, one of the officials said the committee “would take some time to deliberate,” suggesting that the Taliban’s envoy would not be able to speak at the General Assembly at this session, at least during the high-level leaders’ week.

To date, no nation has yet formally recognized the Taliban’s ascension by force to power or its all-male Cabinet, which is stacked with senior figures who were previously detained in the U.S. detention facility in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba or are on a United Nations sanctions list. The group has said this exclusively Taliban-run Cabinet is only interim, offering hope that a future government could be more inclusive.

In the spirit of diplomacy, Sheikh Tamim said Qatar agreed years ago to host the Taliban’s political leadership in exile because “we were confident that war offers no solution and that there would be dialogue in the end.”

Qatar is a close U.S ally and hosts the largest U.S. military base in the Middle East, but the tiny Gulf Arab state also has some sway with the Taliban. Because of its unique role, Qatar hosted direct U.S.-Taliban talks around the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and helped facilitate evacuations from Kabul.

Now, countries like the U.S. and Japan have relocated their diplomatic staff in Afghanistan to Qatar to continue diplomacy from there. Qatar is also assisting with the facilitation of needed humanitarian aid and with operations at Kabul airport.

Sheikh Tamim on Tuesday urged against repeating past mistakes in Afghanistan “to impose a political system from outside.” “Regardless of intentions, efforts made and money invested, this experience in Afghanistan has collapsed after 20 years,” Sheikh Tamim said.

The 41-year-old leader said the international community must continue to support Afghanistan at this critical stage and “to separate humanitarian aid from political differences.” Afghanistan is among the world’s poorest countries and receives billions of dollars in foreign aid a year, though that could change with the U.S.-backed government out of power and the Taliban now in charge.

Uzbekistan, another neighboring country to Afghanistan, has resumed the supply of oil and electricity to the war-torn country, according to President Shavkat Mirziyoyev.

“It is impossible to isolate Afghanistan and leave it within the range of its problems,” he said in remarks at the U.N. on Tuesday. He called for a permanent U.N. Committee on Afghanistan.

Earlier this week, Pakistan’s foreign minister told reporters at U.N. headquarters that Taliban rulers should understand that if they want recognition and assistance in rebuilding the war-battered country “they have to be more sensitive and more receptive to international opinion and norms.” The top leadership of the Taliban for years has operated out of Pakistan, which shares a border with Afghanistan and is home to large numbers of Afghan refugees.

Despite their promises of an open and inclusive system, there have been numerous troubling signs that the Taliban are restricting women’s rights and targeting activists and those they battled against as they settle into government after taking control of the capital of Kabul last month. During their previous rule of Afghanistan in the 1990s, the Taliban had denied girls and women the right to education and barred them from public life.

Sheikh Tamim said it is up to the Afghan people to achieve a comprehensive political settlement and pave the way for stability. He touted Qatar’s outsized role in assisting with the chaotic U.S.-led evacuation of more than 100,000 Afghans and others from Kabul in August.

“This was our humanitarian duty,” he said.

[Chess Reloaded]

That's probably because it's bogus, the Taliban didn't give paychecks to its fighters by and large

By and large the ANA didn’t get pay cheques but that doesn’t change the point that the Taliban fighters did get paid. Soldiers can’t really fight for nothing and the wealth of the Taliban is a widely known fact.

The Taliban didn't fight for a living and no, guerilla forces and revolutionaries don't generally get paid. The Taliban was not wealthy, no. Their armament was mostly taken from ANA or left by the Soviets

[Heloin]

By and large the ANA didn’t get pay cheques but that doesn’t change the point that the Taliban fighters did get paid. Soldiers can’t really fight for nothing and the wealth of the Taliban is a widely known fact.

The Taliban didn't fight for a living and no, guerilla forces and revolutionaries don't generally get paid. The Taliban was not wealthy, no. Their armament was mostly taken from ANA or left by the Soviets

You know shockingly little about Afghanistan for someone who's in love with the Taliban and Al-Qaeda.

[Chess Reloaded]

The Taliban didn't fight for a living and no, guerilla forces and revolutionaries don't generally get paid. The Taliban was not wealthy, no. Their armament was mostly taken from ANA or left by the Soviets

You know shockingly little about Afghanistan for someone who's in love with the Taliban and Al-Qaeda.

You don't know what you're talking about and are literally just guessing. What books have you read or people living in Afghanistan have you talked to?

[HISPIDA]

By and large the ANA didn’t get pay cheques but that doesn’t change the point that the Taliban fighters did get paid. Soldiers can’t really fight for nothing and the wealth of the Taliban is a widely known fact.

The Taliban didn't fight for a living and no, guerilla forces and revolutionaries don't generally get paid. The Taliban was not wealthy, no. Their armament was mostly taken from ANA or left by the Soviets

the taliban are incredibly wealthy, at least for a guerilla force

the taliban budget for 2019-2020 was estimated to be $1.6 billion by the united states

that's more than the nominal gdp of 23 countries

not 23 guerilla movements, 23 countries (sorted by lowest UN estimate)

[Chess Reloaded]

The Taliban didn't fight for a living and no, guerilla forces and revolutionaries don't generally get paid. The Taliban was not wealthy, no. Their armament was mostly taken from ANA or left by the Soviets

the taliban are incredibly wealthy, at least for a guerilla force

the taliban budget for 2019-2020 was estimated to be $1.6 billion by the united states

that's more than the nominal gdp of 23 countries

not 23 guerilla movements, 23 countries (sorted by lowest UN estimate)

CIA guessing the Taliban's income means absolutely nothing to me, as the CIA are notorious liars. The fact is many Taliban fighting for Kabul literally were barefoot out of poverty

[HISPIDA]

the taliban are incredibly wealthy, at least for a guerilla force

the taliban budget for 2019-2020 was estimated to be $1.6 billion by the united states

that's more than the nominal gdp of 23 countries

not 23 guerilla movements, 23 countries (sorted by lowest UN estimate)

CIA guessing the Taliban's income means absolutely nothing to me, as the CIA are notorious liars. The fact is many Taliban fighting for Kabul literally were barefoot out of poverty

so you're not arguing in good faith, gotcha

[Cosmic79]

The UN allows Communist China, Iran, and North Korea on the Human Rights Council. The representative of the Islamic Emirate would probably be welcomed with Thunderous Applause

Unironically calling China "Communist" is a great way to discredit yourself fyi.

They're a hyper-capitalist dystopia lmao. About as Communist as a stock exchange.

Xi is trying really hard to change that. At this point I wouldn't call China capitalist. Their system is closer to fascism/communism, even if they still have free market rules.

[The Alma Mater]

Their system is closer to fascism/communism, even if they still have free market rules.

What exactly is "fascism/communism" supposed to mean ?
Remember that this is a nation simulation forum. People tend to know the meaning of such words .

[Chess Reloaded]

CIA guessing the Taliban's income means absolutely nothing to me, as the CIA are notorious liars. The fact is many Taliban fighting for Kabul literally were barefoot out of poverty

so you're not arguing in good faith, gotcha

By good faith you mean presuming the CIA's honesty and the Taliban's dishonesty? I can give you Taliban sources, will you accept those, or not? Since I doubt it, let's look at the clear fact that many Taliban literally had no shoes

[Cosmic79]

Their system is closer to fascism/communism, even if they still have free market rules.

What exactly is "fascism/communism" supposed to mean ?
Remember that this is a nation simulation forum. People tend to know the meaning of such words .

Their authoritarian style of governing reminds me of communist and fascist practices. Especially on their mania with replacing ethnic minorities with Han Chinese.

[Al-Harreh Danistarab]

What exactly is "fascism/communism" supposed to mean ?
Remember that this is a nation simulation forum. People tend to know the meaning of such words .

Their authoritarian style of governing reminds me of communist and fascist practices. Especially on their mania with replacing ethnic minorities with Han Chinese.

That’s fascist but not communist. I’m against both fascism and communism by the way even though you could say I’m far-right.

[Fahran]

Regime change = no.

While I'm not keen on regime change generally, it's a sensible solution to an international-scale threat. If the Taliban begins collaborating with IS-K or al-Qaeda, they have, once again, become an international-scale threat. At that point, regime change is probably preferable to a long-term war - if our concern is expedience. I feel as though human rights would remain broadly in the same place regardless. I'd rather we support the guys making the Taliban and IS-K face the wall than the Taliban or IS-K who have still not abandonned hopes of spreading their apocalyptic cults globally and are presently engaging in an orgy of murder.

But what's the feasibility (and counterarguments) for limited wars? United States is extremely capable in long-range surgical operations of "bomb from far away and forget", such as the Reagan-era raids to Libya or the Qasem Suleimani assassination.

The War in Afghanistan had ceased to take a serious toll on us in all respects except those relating to economic and home-front morale considerations. Had we sustained the occupation, the Taliban would never have been able to retake the country. My guess is that we, rightly, thought it wasn't worth the effort. Drone strikes without adequate support is a recipe for even more civilian deaths, though I imagine civilian deaths have sky-rocketed in Kabul and Panjshir anyway.

There isn't really anything stopping the US from maintaining continuous drone or air presence aiming to continuously prevent the Bad Guys from gaining too much power. (Which I guess is similar to Israel's strategy against Hamas of accepting that they'll be there forever, and as such Israel only needs to regularly deflate their powers from time to time.) Peferably acting as a collosal support for local forces who comprises the bulk of the military operations, as shown in America's (and Russia's) strategy in how to deal with ISIS.

Regime change is heavily reliant on local forces - in this case, probably Tajiks and the NRF.

[Fahran]

Allegedly, the Taliban have disallowed women from working in Herat. No women will be included in the cabinet or government either. When questioned about this, a Taliban spokesperson mentioned they had no need for women in government, that women were incapable of doing such a thing, and that it was best for them to stay home and tend children.

There's reports swirling at the moment than schools exceeding grade seven will reopen for boys but that girls will not be allowed to attend. Contradictory claims state that girls may attend school, but will be required to travel in buses with covered windows and not be in the presence of any males. Gender segregation will also be enforced sternly between children of any age. It's quite possible both are technically true, with boys getting the priority on education, which will be Islamic.

[Picairn]

so you're not arguing in good faith, gotcha

By good faith you mean presuming the CIA's honesty and the Taliban's dishonesty? I can give you Taliban sources, will you accept those, or not? Since I doubt it, let's look at the clear fact that many Taliban literally had no shoes

Since you said that you don't trust the CIA, why exactly should we trust the Taliban?

The Taliban is quite wealthy for a militia.

The group's annual income from 2011 onwards has been estimated at around $400m (£290m) by the United Nations (UN).

But by the end of 2018 this may have increased significantly, to as much as $1.5bn a year, according to BBC investigations.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-46554097

An average Taliban fighter is paid $300 a month, better than the Afghan Army's wages. No wonder many soldiers defected. https://www.wired.com/2010/07/taliban-p ... -pays-his/

[Arvenia]

Their authoritarian style of governing reminds me of communist and fascist practices. Especially on their mania with replacing ethnic minorities with Han Chinese.

That’s fascist but not communist. I’m against both fascism and communism by the way even though you could say I’m far-right.

Are you far-right for real?!

[Galimencia]

Allegedly, the Taliban have disallowed women from working in Herat. No women will be included in the cabinet or government either. When questioned about this, a Taliban spokesperson mentioned they had no need for women in government, that women were incapable of doing such a thing, and that it was best for them to stay home and tend children.

There's reports swirling at the moment than schools exceeding grade seven will reopen for boys but that girls will not be allowed to attend. Contradictory claims state that girls may attend school, but will be required to travel in buses with covered windows and not be in the presence of any males. Gender segregation will also be enforced sternly between children of any age. It's quite possible both are technically true, with boys getting the priority on education, which will be Islamic.

Well, what more can we expect from a bunch of savage barbarians who are hell bent on establishing their crooked version of Islam over the populace? Nobody expected then to change really, and no, they didn't changed. I am not worried about whatever shit they do in Afghanistan, I don't live there and thus it means nothing to me. Some of the Afghani people(and also a handful of non-Afghani morons too) seem to like the Talibans, so good for them I guess.

What I am worried about is that a terrorist coming to power in a country, will inevitably lead that country towards becoming a breeding ground for other terrorist outfits, all of which means a bunch of bad things happening to those who live in the West and India. I am worried about the fact that the rate of knife attacks might increase in the place where I live.

[Galimencia]

That’s fascist but not communist. I’m against both fascism and communism by the way even though you could say I’m far-right.

Are you far-right for real?!

If people in the forums can openly declare themselves to be far left, I find no reason for people to not declare themselves far right openly. That being said, I don't speak for the user and it is just my personal opinion.

[Arvenia]

Are you far-right for real?!

If people in the forums can openly declare themselves to be far left, I find no reason for people to not declare themselves far right openly. That being said, I don't speak for the user and it is just my personal opinion.

I see. I was just baffled.

[Christian Confederation]

Unironically calling China "Communist" is a great way to discredit yourself fyi.

They're a hyper-capitalist dystopia lmao. About as Communist as a stock exchange.

Xi is trying really hard to change that. At this point I wouldn't call China capitalist. Their system is closer to fascism/communism, even if they still have free market rules.

The PRC is a Communist State with Slight Market Tendencies in the Economy.

[Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum]

Turkish political Islam, which appoints an ambassador to the Taliban terrorist organization, supports terrorists just like in Syria. Terrorism has no language, religion, race or gender, terrorism is terrorism. No matter where terrorism comes from, to be against is to serve humanity.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Xi is trying really hard to change that. At this point I wouldn't call China capitalist. Their system is closer to fascism/communism, even if they still have free market rules.

The PRC is a Communist State with Slight Market Tendencies in the Economy.

Just admit that you have no idea what you are waffling on about.
Edit: Same for Hakinda tbqh.

[Chess Reloaded]

By good faith you mean presuming the CIA's honesty and the Taliban's dishonesty? I can give you Taliban sources, will you accept those, or not? Since I doubt it, let's look at the clear fact that many Taliban literally had no shoes

Since you said that you don't trust the CIA, why exactly should we trust the Taliban?

The Taliban is quite wealthy for a militia.

The group's annual income from 2011 onwards has been estimated at around $400m (£290m) by the United Nations (UN).

But by the end of 2018 this may have increased significantly, to as much as $1.5bn a year, according to BBC investigations.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-46554097

An average Taliban fighter is paid $300 a month, better than the Afghan Army's wages. No wonder many soldiers defected. https://www.wired.com/2010/07/taliban-p ... -pays-his/

That's an extraordinary extrapolation. As per your article they don't get paid by the month, they get $10 per day of fighting. That's not the same as $300 a month at all and the article actually says this. The article also uses soldiers in the Afghan army for under three years as a baseline, which is not average in a war of twenty years. Their experienced soldiers make a lot more than $300 a month actually

[Chess Reloaded]

Allegedly, the Taliban have disallowed women from working in Herat. No women will be included in the cabinet or government either. When questioned about this, a Taliban spokesperson mentioned they had no need for women in government, that women were incapable of doing such a thing, and that it was best for them to stay home and tend children.

There's reports swirling at the moment than schools exceeding grade seven will reopen for boys but that girls will not be allowed to attend. Contradictory claims state that girls may attend school, but will be required to travel in buses with covered windows and not be in the presence of any males. Gender segregation will also be enforced sternly between children of any age. It's quite possible both are technically true, with boys getting the priority on education, which will be Islamic.

It's astounding to me that westerners can actually freely get information from people in Afghanistan in Kabul but opt for random allegations by people outside the country