Christianity and mental illness

[Dyakovo]

I am a catholic, do I count as christian or not?

Yeah. You count, you have the same basic beleifs that Christians have. Some beliefs differ though, like Purgatory.

The same basic beliefs?
Catholics are christians, period.

[Mad hatters in jeans]

I need help convincing someone that believes in Christianity that mental illness is real and is not just something made up by the Devil.

I know this is a weird topic. I have a new, close friend who is bi-polar and a substance abuser. She has important figures in her life that, although they accept she should get treatment for the substance abuse, say that her diagnoses of mental illness are just lies the Devil has convinced her of and she needs no help for those issues other than prayer.

She won't listen to me because I am not a Christian, so I just don't know.

Obviously any information or links that might be persuasive would be appreciated, but I'm also curious as to what debate this might stir on NSG.

I suppose being there for when she feels bad, and being sociable with her would help.
Does she have any other friends or relatives who are aware of what she's like? perhaps they could try helping her out.

[Chetssaland]

You guys are acting like she's phsyco or something. Next you'll suggest shooting her with a tranqualizer gun and giving her the pill while she's out. You gotta actually talk and listen to her, not "tell her that pills are wafers"

[Treznor]

You guys are acting like she's phsyco or something. Next you'll suggest shooting her with a tranqualizer gun and giving her the pill while she's out. You gotta actually talk and listen to her, not "tell her that pills are wafers"

When someone isn't getting essential medical care because of their belief system, it's hard to figure out how to get around it. The individual in question is more interested in her religious beliefs than in actually getting better. She's been taught that if she can't get better through God's grace, then the problem lies with her faith instead of a legitimate medical reason. We're brainstorming for ways to either circumvent her faith or use it to convince her to get help, and if some of those ideas seem a bit much consider the irrationality of the person in question.

[Dyakovo]

You guys are acting like she's phsyco or something.

She's certainly delusional...

Next you'll suggest shooting her with a tranqualizer gun and giving her the pill while she's out.

Good suggestion...

You gotta actually talk and listen to her,

Yeah, that's really going to work...

not "tell her that pills are wafers"

true on this part, your suggestion is much more likely to work.

[Elite Cows]

In my opinion, they are the same thing.

[Maineiacs]

I am a catholic, do I count as christian or not?

Not to most (but not all) evangelicals.

[UnhealthyTruthseeker]

I am a catholic, do I count as christian or not?

Not to most (but not all) evangelicals.

The Earth is 6000 years old to most of them, though. I don't have much trust in their ability to recognize reality.

[Ashmoria]

I am a catholic, do I count as christian or not?

Yeah. You count, you have the same basic beleifs that Christians have. Some beliefs differ though, like Purgatory.

Meh, my old History teacher would have raised a shitstorm if you said this in her class.


Dunno why though, guess she thinks only Protestants are Christians.

Has anyone mentioned Exorcist?

what school did you go to?

[German Nightmare]

I wonder if those people take aspirin when they have a headache - or whether they simply "pray to remove the demon"?

They sure sound like the latter - although should they ever take pain relieving medicine, that might be an angle from which to get at them.


I've done some research on the topic of mental illness when I myself was taking anti-depressants. Just out of curiosity, I was wondering what the Bible or Jesus would have to say on the matter. I've found many passages which were not helpful as they dealt with how physicians and doctors cannot help when the spirit is in need. Or, even worse, when mentally ill people were indeed harboring demons. That doesn't help in this instance - like, at all!

However, mental illnesses like chemical imbalances of the brain have - in my humble opinion - nothing to do with the spirit, but with the structure in which said spirit resides. Just like a broken bone or torn muscle, it's a physical problem, not a spiritual one.

So, according to my logic, a doctor who is able to help with brain chemistry does definitely not interfere with the spiritual well-being of a person. Not directly, anyway. He's helping the body actively, the mind passively, yet the spirit remains out of the equation. (Same goes for therapy during which the mind is helped actively.)

Besides, even Jesus does believe that there is a place for doctors, otherwise he wouldn't have chosen them in this example:

On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.
But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
(Matthew 9 12/13)

I command you for your interest in a friend's well-being. From what it sounds like, though, it's quite a tough undertaking when dealing with close-minded people. So remember:

Do not answer a fool according to his folly, or you will be like him yourself.
Answer a fool according to his folly, or he will be wise in his own eyes.
(Proverbs 26 4/5)

Edit: Does your friend share the same beliefs as her parents? Are you trying to convince her? Or is she willing to get help but her parents consider that evil? I'd appreciate it if you clarified that. Thanks.

[The Alma Mater]

I am a catholic, do I count as christian or not?

Not to most (but not all) evangelicals.

Catholics outnumber all other denominations of Christianity combined. Viva democracy - the majority has spoken and Catholics are hereby Christian

As for the problem in the OP: would she accept that someone with brain *damage* can have impaired physical functions ? Can she then accept that damaging other parts of the brain will lead to things like memory loss etc ?

Or does she believe that all those old people with dementia or Alzheimers are "faking it" / sinners that have worshipped the devil too much ?

[DMistan]

I need help convincing someone that believes in Christianity that mental illness is real and is not just something made up by the Devil.

I know this is a weird topic. I have a new, close friend who is bi-polar and a substance abuser. She has important figures in her life that, although they accept she should get treatment for the substance abuse, say that her diagnoses of mental illness are just lies the Devil has convinced her of and she needs no help for those issues other than prayer.

She won't listen to me because I am not a Christian, so I just don't know.

Obviously any information or links that might be persuasive would be appreciated, but I'm also curious as to what debate this might stir on NSG.

"someone that believes in Christianity"
Lots of people "believe in Christianity." Christians represent one third of the world's population.

It would help me help you if you could narrow down this "belief" to a particular denomination.

If this person belongs to one of the "mainstream" denominations, I can easily point them to respected medical doctors who are practitioners of that denomination.

Outside of the "mainstream" we have Restorationists, Baptists and Pentecostals. My personal experience is that it gets tough to convince this crowd of anything.

Then you have your non-denominational freelance "I feel the spirit but never studied divinity per se" crowd. Good Luck with that bunch.

[South Lorenya]

Unfortunately, abrahamics usually refuse to accept that believing there's an invisible guy in sky who can do anything is a mental illness.

[Altergo]

I'm a Christian and people who do not believe in mental illnesses are, to me, Mental retards

[Canuck Utopia]

I think the key here is her substance abuse. She needs to get that treated, the faster the better. Professionals who deal with substance abuse are generally pretty good at using belief systems to reinforce the need to recover. They also tend to identify behaviors that support substance abuse and address them, so if you focus on that and downplay the rest of her problems, it should all come together in a neat package.

Well lo and behold.....something that I can entirely agree with you on.

[Treznor]

I think the key here is her substance abuse. She needs to get that treated, the faster the better. Professionals who deal with substance abuse are generally pretty good at using belief systems to reinforce the need to recover. They also tend to identify behaviors that support substance abuse and address them, so if you focus on that and downplay the rest of her problems, it should all come together in a neat package.

Well lo and behold.....something that I can entirely agree with you on.

Uh oh. I must be wrong about something.

[Straughn]

Maybe one way to explain them the issue is to correlate it with physical illness. They will go to the doctor if they have a broken leg, so why not accept help against a 'broken' brain chemistry?

(If they don't search medical help even for these issues, you cannot help them, I guess)

Like the Four Humours?
http://ancienthistory.about.com/cs/hipp ... icmeds.htm

[Straughn]

I'm a Christian and I know that mental illness is real. I'm pretty sure thats not taught anywhere that the devill created mentel illness.

Do you know of any examples in the Bible of someone being mentally ill?

Nebuchadnezzar went crazy about the 4th chapter of Daniel, it wasn't demon possessed or a lie of the devil, he just went crazy... it was implied heavily that it was punishment from God for being arrogant and generally disrespecting the Jewish religion.

I'm not sure that example would be very helpful though, because after wandering around insane for a while, he eventually recovered miraculously.

Coulda been syphilis.

[Kikimo]

Many Christians avoid help for their mental health problems because they view the profession of psychiatry as threatening to their worldview. .

If I didn't know better, I would have thought you were talking about Scientologists!

[Straughn]

Hmmm. my mommy owner is both a licensed psychologist and a baptized christian. she says that the reason you don't hear about mental illness in the bible is because, so many years ago, the mental illness concept did not exist yet. they did refer however to evil spirits that would cause illness. the catholic church still sees possession as a cause of some types of so called mental illness. my mommy though thinks mental illness is a product of bum biology whose effects can be modified by modern day medications and psychological work. by the way, she thinks christianity can assist mental health because you are taught to take responsibility for your actions and you are taught to stop being your own manager, letting god lead you instead.

me on the other hand, i think tuna takes care of every ill.

The Catholic church also only recently pardoned Galileo.

Argh.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/08/ ... 7365.shtml

[Darkvora]

Catholicism is Christian to my church of baptist

[Triniteras]

I once thought there might be a god. I left open the possibility until I had read and considered enough, I really did.
I distinctly recall the sensation of insanity.

[Heinleinites]

Unfortunately, abrahamics usually refuse to accept that believing there's an invisible guy in sky who can do anything is a mental illness.

Aren't you the one who thinks they're a dragon? You might not be the best spoke-person for what is/is not a mental illness.

I'm surprised it took three pages for this particular sentiment to make an appearance, NSG must be mellowing.

[South Lorenya]

Unfortunately, abrahamics usually refuse to accept that believing there's an invisible guy in sky who can do anything is a mental illness.

Aren't you the one who thinks they're a dragon? You might not be the best spoke-person for what is/is not a mental illness.

I'm surprised it took three pages for this particular sentiment to make an appearance, NSG must be mellowing.

Except I know full well that I'm not 100% sane -- whereas I'm pretty sure every cardinal* (and the pope, to boot!) is (1) suffering from the delusion I mentioned and (2) completely unwilling to admit that they could use professional help.

* Small red birds not included.

[German Nightmare]

So, any progress?