What can we (normal people) do about global oppression?

[Australian rePublic]

I don't get all the anti-Israel sentiment. Especially by the people who go nuts about Indigenous and women's rights in the west. I mean, if you want Indigenous autonomy, you have to support Israel, as the Jews are Indigenous to the area. Further, Israel is one of the only countries in the Middle East which supports women's rights and the only democracy in the Middle East, save for Lebanon. Without Israel, the Jews would be stateless. Why would anybody not support Israel

It might have something to do with the human rights abuses they are committing against the Palestinians.

Such as?

[Australian rePublic]

Socialism is just terrible. Everyone that's tried socialism has suffered greatly for it.

There are the authoritarian variants, and then there are the libertarian variants. The latter have generally been resounding successes, such as the Rojava, Zapatistas, etc.

Rojava has a tiny population in a tiny, niche community of less than 400,000 (there are local governments who have a greater population than them. Seriously, that's like using the Vatican as an example of theocracy being a good idea), and Zapatistas are still technically under the authority of Mexico, and whilst Mexico not have much direct control over them, they do not have the leverage of being an autonomous country. If we look at non-neiche communities or communities with a greater goal in mind, socialism is a total failure. Capitalism isn't perfect, but it's far, far better than socialism. Socialism completely ruined China in every conceivable manner, and whilst China prospered greatly from ditching the ideology, socialism still linger around the joint contributing to China's woes. And let's not even get into what it did to Russia. Everywhere in the world when a country was split in half by socialism- Vietnam, Korea, Germany, etc. the socialist half was poorer and more oppressed than the capitalist half, and every country which has abandoned socialism has since been in a better position. At what point do you stop making excuses and realise that socialism is the problem in and of itself. Sure, there might (disputably) be a fringe cases where socialism works, but it almost always leads to disaster. And don't start with that "no true socialism" bullshit, they're not Hitler, I'm pretty that most of history's socialists weren't actively going out of their way to establish a psychotic dictatorship. I'm pretty sure that Mao and Stalin, for example, weren't actively trying to oppress millions upon millions of people and cause faminines, it's just that that happens to be the end result of socialism. Very few people who have lived under socialism and also under capitalism have anything good to say about socialism, and there's a reason for that. The people who currently live under socialism are either too brainwashed or ignorant to know any better or too afraid to voice their actual opinions. Pointing to a few fringe, highly specialised examples where socialism (disputably) isn't too big of a fuck up doesn't mean that it does now nor will ever work in the mainstream. Now capitalism does have its problems, significant problems, but nothing like socialism. Uless we're talking what the USA considers to be "socialism" (which is still quite capitalist by most measures), in that case, that's not socialism, actual socialism is a total, utter and complete failure

[Soviet Progonya]

You gotta start local. If you see bigot posters, you can tear them down. Will it solve bigotry? No. But it will slightly discourage the idiots putting that shit up.

[Nakena]

Socialism is just terrible. Everyone that's tried socialism has suffered greatly for it.

There are the authoritarian variants, and then there are the libertarian variants. The latter have generally been resounding successes, such as the Rojava, Zapatistas, etc.

The USSR was also quite sucessfull. They became a superpower.

Rojava and Zapatistas? X for doubt.

the Zapatista areas are one of the few places in Mexico free from cartel activity.

Last time i asked about cartels and zapatistas i got labelled a racist.

[Soviet Progonya]

Cut all ties with the State of Israel and arrest/disband the ADL, for a start. Then start arresting heads of major financial institutions and political donors in the United States.

I don't get all the anti-Israel sentiment. Especially by the people who go nuts about Indigenous and women's rights in the west. I mean, if you want Indigenous autonomy, you have to support Israel, as the Jews are Indigenous to the area. Further, Israel is one of the only countries in the Middle East which supports women's rights and the only democracy in the Middle East, save for Lebanon. Without Israel, the Jews would be stateless. Why would anybody not support Israel

Idk if you're a Jew yourself, but as a half ethnically Jewish guy, we wouldn't be "stateless" without Israel. We don't need an ethnostate cos people's nationality is not the same thing as their race. Also don't associate all of us with Israel cos lots of us want nothing to do for it lel.

[Australian rePublic]

You gotta start local. If you see bigot posters, you can tear them down. Will it solve bigotry? No. But it will slightly discourage the idiots putting that shit up.

Silencing people does jack shit except for making them angrier and angrier and potentially push them to . There are two successful ways to deal with people who disagree with- either you have a logical discussion with them or realise or you lock them up. The later makes you an oppressor and makes them political prisoners. The former will either lead to a prosperous discussion or make them into a laughing stock. Silencing people you disagree with makes you an oppressor

[-Ocelot-]

I don't get all the anti-Israel sentiment. Especially by the people who go nuts about Indigenous and women's rights in the west. I mean, if you want Indigenous autonomy, you have to support Israel, as the Jews are Indigenous to the area. Further, Israel is one of the only countries in the Middle East which supports women's rights and the only democracy in the Middle East, save for Lebanon. Without Israel, the Jews would be stateless. Why would anybody not support Israel

Idk if you're a Jew yourself, but as a half ethnically Jewish guy, we wouldn't be "stateless" without Israel. We don't need an ethnostate cos people's nationality is not the same thing as their race. Also don't associate all of us with Israel cos lots of us want nothing to do for it lel.

How can you say this??? There are people who don't have a nation and wish they had one e.g: Kurds. Jews were denied of this and have been persecuted for centuries. Only recently they got to have their own country, and even today the Arab neighbors want to eat them alive. Even a non-Jew like myself can see how necessary Israel is for the Jewish people.

[Soviet Progonya]

Idk if you're a Jew yourself, but as a half ethnically Jewish guy, we wouldn't be "stateless" without Israel. We don't need an ethnostate cos people's nationality is not the same thing as their race. Also don't associate all of us with Israel cos lots of us want nothing to do for it lel.

How can you say this??? There are people who don't have a nation and wish they had one e.g: Kurds. Jews were denied of this and have been persecuted for centuries. Only recently they got to have their own country, and even today the Arab neighbors want to eat them alive. Even a non-Jew like myself can see how necessary Israel is for the Jewish people.

Isral citizen =/= all Jews. Israel wouldn't really do anything for non Israeli Jews, so I don't really consider it a homeland for Jewish people but rather one for Israel citizens. Kurds is a different situation and I don't know enough about that to really have an opinion. But Israel fucks with Palestine so I don't like them all that much.

[Australian rePublic]

There are the authoritarian variants, and then there are the libertarian variants. The latter have generally been resounding successes, such as the Rojava, Zapatistas, etc.

The USSR was also quite sucessfull. They became a superpower.

Measuring a country's success by whether or not their superpower means that communist China, the NAZIs and WWII era Japan are all successes. If you're measuring a country's success based entirely based on military might, then yes, the USSR was a hug success, but in every other measure, the USSR was a total and utter dumpster fire

[Nakena]

Measuring a country's success by whether or not their superpower means that communist China, the NAZIs and WWII era Japan are all successes.

Yes. They are all or were sucessfull to varying degrees and archived superpower status.

If you're measuring a country's success based entirely based on military might, then yes, the USSR was a hug success, but in every other measure, the USSR was a total and utter dumpster fire

No their sucess wasnt just limited to military. They industrialized wide parts of their countries and had significant scientific sucesses and advances etc. This also holds true for Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan and Red China btw.

[Australian rePublic]

I don't get all the anti-Israel sentiment. Especially by the people who go nuts about Indigenous and women's rights in the west. I mean, if you want Indigenous autonomy, you have to support Israel, as the Jews are Indigenous to the area. Further, Israel is one of the only countries in the Middle East which supports women's rights and the only democracy in the Middle East, save for Lebanon. Without Israel, the Jews would be stateless. Why would anybody not support Israel

Idk if you're a Jew yourself, but as a half ethnically Jewish guy, we wouldn't be "stateless" without Israel. We don't need an ethnostate cos people's nationality is not the same thing as their race. Also don't associate all of us with Israel cos lots of us want nothing to do for it lel.

Nope, just ignorant. Which parts of Israeli policy are you against exactly?

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Socialism is the only consistent option here. Companies will always destroy in the name of profit. Boycotting is next to useless if that’s the only thing you’re doing. More awareness is hollow and void if you don’t turn that awareness into substantive political action.

[Australian rePublic]

Socialism is the only consistent option here. Companies will always destroy in the name of profit. Boycotting is next to useless if that’s the only thing you’re doing. More awareness is hollow and void if you don’t turn that awareness into substantive political action.

Keeping companies accountable=/=socialism

[Islamic Holy Sites]

It might have something to do with the human rights abuses they are committing against the Palestinians.

Such as?

Such as blockading Gaza? Bombing it then saying 'oops, didn't see those civilians' or 'HUMAN SHIELDS EVERYONE' (by the way there is no proof for Palestinians using human shields)? Such as using human shields?

[-Astoria-]

[...] in some countries, some religious groups are being oppressed, China has a satanic social credit score, and let's not even get into North Korea.

Define "satanic" in this case.

So this isn't a list of oppression happening, the question here is, what can we (regular people with little voice or power) do about it?

Not much, really; as you've said, we haven't got much power to change anything somewhat - at this point the only thing we can do is to either write letters & petitions en masse.

Well for one thing, we could learn from SJWs.

Ooh... quite a swing & a miss!

[Esternial]

All over the world, there is extreme oppression. Uighurs in China are suffering holocaust-style genocide, in some countries, some religious groups are being oppressed, China has a satanic social credit score, and let's not even get into North Korea.

So this isn't a list of oppression happening, the question here is, what can we (regular people with little voice or power) do about it?

Well for one thing, we could learn from SJWs. SJWs some how have a huge voice but waste it on trying to solve imaginary problems, rather than solving actual problems. We need to learn how they manage to change everything. Secondly, we need to boycott companies who actively promote or use slave labour (e.g. Disney) and third, we need to call out companies which pretend to be moral and care about morals, but actually promote oppression. SO what do you guys think?

Demonstrate. Join activist groups. Go to work for an NGO.

I worked for a nonprofit for almost a year. They did conflict resolution in two regions experiencing a guerrilla war, mostly through their contacts with the political activist wings of the insurgencies. If you're really passionate about doing something about oppression - and I mean, real oppression, like genocide or the violent state-sponsored persecution of minorities - go out and find an agency that works in that field and intern for them, then network like mad and work your way up. It's not difficult.

If you sit around and complain that as a normal person you can do nothing physical or tangible about [X situation], you're not trying hard enough. Or you're more comfortable discussing it casually online rather than adopting it as a cause.

Boycotting is an option, but it's nearly impossible to do properly as nearly every product you can buy is produced unethically (there is basically no such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism).

The food you eat was probably harvested by people being paid substandard wages in poor conditions (this goes for fruits and vegetables as well as meats (slaughterhouse conditions are notoriously atrocious and there is actual slavery involved in some types of fishing)). The rare earth metals in your electronics were probably mined under unethical conditions as well as having severe environmental consequences, unless you're willing to pay a premium your clothing is probably manufactured with slave or underpaid labour somewhere in the supply chain (often this is true even if you are willing to pay a premium) and the environmental degradation associated with manufacturing clothing is also non-trivial.

Personally, I try to buy as little as possible in general, choosing products that minimize suffering and environmental damage as much as I can.

It's about picking your battles. You can't boycott every unethical good, but you can certainly try.

Personally this is what I do: I try to boycott goods made in countries with severe political repression. I read the labels on everything I buy and will pay a premium for a version of the same product made in say, Spain as opposed to the cheapest version made in Laos. I like buying electronics and appliances made in Japan and Taiwan (as in, actually marked as being manufactured in those countries, not just by companies from those countries) because I generally approve of the working conditions in their plants and their relatively good treatment of their manufacturing staff. I'm very reluctant to buy anything that doesn't say where it's made.

I'm aware that most of these products still have some point in the supply chain which I would find personally objectionable. But as long as I'm not directly funding some military dictatorship or totalitarian state, I'm happy.

A good way to do this is buy everything second-hand. This way, you're simply recycling something that would otherwise wind up in a landfill, and you're not directly pouring money into a current retailer, distributor, manufacturer or subcontractor who profits in any way from unethical practices.

As far as food goes, I was raised on a family farm and hope to one day return to agriculture. I'd like to grow all my own vegetables and hunt my own meat rather than paying for something loaded with preservatives and churned out by a factory farm. Not there yet, but I see it as a goal that's certainly achievable in my lifetime.

Agreed. If you want to do the bare minimum you can start paying attention to the origin of produce and meat you buy in the supermarket (or go to a local butcher). I also keep track of which vegetables are produced in my country during which season so I know what will be relatively more abundant, and determine what I'm going to cook based on that.

In my country there are even some services that provide you with boxes of produce sourced directly from nearby farms. It's kind of a mystery box, which is a nice way to try your hand at preparing new dishes. Alternatively you can drive to a nearby farm to buy vegetables directly from the small shop they've set up in their barn. There are even some farms that have potato vending machines.

Prices directly at the source are (in my experience) relatively cheap as you're cutting out the costs of logistics (and sometimes packing) involved to deliver produce to supermarkets.

[Caleonia]

Boycotting is an option, but it's nearly impossible to do properly as nearly every product you can buy is produced unethically (there is basically no such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism).

The food you eat was probably harvested by people being paid substandard wages in poor conditions (this goes for fruits and vegetables as well as meats (slaughterhouse conditions are notoriously atrocious and there is actual slavery involved in some types of fishing)). The rare earth metals in your electronics were probably mined under unethical conditions as well as having severe environmental consequences, unless you're willing to pay a premium your clothing is probably manufactured with slave or underpaid labour somewhere in the supply chain (often this is true even if you are willing to pay a premium) and the environmental degradation associated with manufacturing clothing is also non-trivial.

Personally, I try to buy as little as possible in general, choosing products that minimize suffering and environmental damage as much as I can. I also try to vote for politicians who say they will try to fight oppression and inequality locally and write my elected representatives about these causes more globally. I participate in demonstrations and protests against racism or other forms of oppression. I also do boycott some of the worst offenders as much as I can and I occasionally write some companies about their policies so they are aware that there are consumers who have a problem with their practices.

edit: Oh, and I also give to some charities that try to help those who are worst off when I can (lately it has been the International Rescue Committee). I also keep wanting to participate in micro-loan programmes like Kiva, but I haven't got around to it yet.

This may just be because I live in an area that is mostly comprised of agriculture but most if not all of the produce my family buys is sourced locally at least within the US. Hell our meat is even locally sourced down in Wakarusa (about 35 minutes away), and the beef is processed right next to the farm. We typically buy fruits grown in Michigan (which is at minimum 15 minutes away from home)... apples are my most consumed food, and we go to a local orchard many times a year. It might just be the way I live & that I’ve been born into the restaurant business and know the rights and wrongs of foods.

[Australian rePublic]

[...] in some countries, some religious groups are being oppressed, China has a satanic social credit score, and let's not even get into North Korea.

Define "satanic" in this case.

Imagine any religion's version of Satan having absolute power and thinking of the cruellest possible way to torture people. He'd set up a social credit system

So this isn't a list of oppression happening, the question here is, what can we (regular people with little voice or power) do about it?

Not much, really; as you've said, we haven't got much power to change anything somewhat - at this point the only thing we can do is to either write letters & petitions en masse.

Interesting. I guess more letters have to be written to my country's politicians

Well for one thing, we could learn from SJWs.

Ooh... quite a swing & a miss!

[/quote]
I'm suggesting that we learn the tactics they use to get shit done. I'm not saying we should learn from their ridiculous beliefs. That would be absurd

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Socialism is the only consistent option here. Companies will always destroy in the name of profit. Boycotting is next to useless if that’s the only thing you’re doing. More awareness is hollow and void if you don’t turn that awareness into substantive political action.

Keeping companies accountable=/=socialism

You can’t keep companies accountable in a capitalistic system. The base impulse of capitalism, profit, is what’s causing all the issues. And regulation will never catch up with that basic impulse of capitalism, which conquers everything first.

As long as companies exist that are run for profit, you will never be able to hold the accountable.

[Australian rePublic]

Keeping companies accountable=/=socialism

You can’t keep companies accountable in a capitalistic system. The base impulse of capitalism, profit, is what’s causing all the issues. And regulation will never catch up with that basic impulse of capitalism, which conquers everything first.

As long as companies exist that are run for profit, you will never be able to hold the accountable.

Capitalism isn't perfect, but it's way better than socialism. The best system, it's not perfect but it's the best, the best system is social democracy where you still have an overall capitalistic system, but you have social policies, e.g. universal health care and high accountability for companies, but overall you're capitalist

[Caleonia]

Keeping companies accountable=/=socialism

You can’t keep companies accountable in a capitalistic system. The base impulse of capitalism, profit, is what’s causing all the issues. And regulation will never catch up with that basic impulse of capitalism, which conquers everything first.

As long as companies exist that are run for profit, you will never be able to hold the accountable.

The problem you run into with that is by the nature of some people, if you ban something then it’s going to end up being more popular amongst those people, especially among American people. Basically we have gotten into a situation where you’re screwed six ways from Sunday unless you somehow manage to either change the general psyche of people or completely flip the governmental system on its head.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

You can’t keep companies accountable in a capitalistic system. The base impulse of capitalism, profit, is what’s causing all the issues. And regulation will never catch up with that basic impulse of capitalism, which conquers everything first.

As long as companies exist that are run for profit, you will never be able to hold the accountable.

Capitalism isn't perfect, but it's way better than socialism. The best system, it's not perfect but it's the best, the best system is social democracy where you still have an overall capitalistic system, but you have social policies, e.g. universal health care and high accountability for companies, but overall you're capitalist

Why? Social democracy is constantly backsliding into neoliberalism. Because of capitalism.

You can’t keep companies accountable in a capitalistic system. The base impulse of capitalism, profit, is what’s causing all the issues. And regulation will never catch up with that basic impulse of capitalism, which conquers everything first.

As long as companies exist that are run for profit, you will never be able to hold the accountable.

The problem you run into with that is by the nature of some people, if you ban something then it’s going to end up being more popular amongst those people, especially among American people. Basically we have gotten into a situation where you’re screwed six ways from Sunday unless you somehow manage to either change the general psyche of people or completely flip the governmental system on its head.

Abolishing capitalism is not like banning weed.

[Soviet Progonya]

You gotta start local. If you see bigot posters, you can tear them down. Will it solve bigotry? No. But it will slightly discourage the idiots putting that shit up.

Silencing people does jack shit except for making them angrier and angrier and potentially push them to . There are two successful ways to deal with people who disagree with- either you have a logical discussion with them or realise or you lock them up. The later makes you an oppressor and makes them political prisoners. The former will either lead to a prosperous discussion or make them into a laughing stock. Silencing people you disagree with makes you an oppressor

No offense mate, but I don't care about "oppressing" racist and other bigots. I try to have discussions with people whenever I can, but sometimes people wont listen and I can't be bothered.

[Caleonia]

The problem you run into with that is by the nature of some people, if you ban something then it’s going to end up being more popular amongst those people, especially among American people. Basically we have gotten into a situation where you’re screwed six ways from Sunday unless you somehow manage to either change the general psyche of people or completely flip the governmental system on its head.

Abolishing capitalism is not like banning weed.

Do you really think the American people would actually trust their government managing the entire economy of a multiethnic nation that gets its grimy little hands into just about anything in the world?

[Adamede]

Socialism is just terrible. Everyone that's tried socialism has suffered greatly for it.

There are the authoritarian variants, and then there are the libertarian variants. The latter have generally been resounding successes, such as the Rojava, Zapatistas, etc.

You have a unique understanding of “resounding success” it seems.

Franky looking at the history it’s the authoritarian versions that are the most successful.