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Rise of Domestic US terrorism fueled mostly by far right

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Neu California
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Rise of Domestic US terrorism fueled mostly by far right

Postby Neu California » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:10 am

(Title pared down out of necessity)

Philidelphia Inquirer (republished from Washington Post) wrote:Domestic terrorism incidents have soared to new highs in the United States, driven chiefly by white-supremacist, anti-Muslim and antigovernment extremists on the far right, according to a Washington Post analysis of data compiled by the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

The surge reflects a growing threat from homegrown terrorism not seen in a quarter-century, with right-wing extremist attacks and plots greatly eclipsing those from the far left and causing more deaths, the analysis shows.

The number of all domestic terrorism incidents in the data peaked in 2020.

Since 2015, right-wing extremists have been involved in 267 plots or attacks and 91 fatalities, the data shows. At the same time, attacks and plots ascribed to far-left views accounted for 66 incidents leading to 19 deaths.

"What is most concerning is that the number of domestic terror plots and attacks are at the highest they have been in decades," said Seth Jones, director of the database project at CSIS, a nonpartisan Washington-based nonprofit that specializes in national security issues. "It's so important for Americans to understand the gravity of the threat before it gets worse."

More than a quarter of right-wing incidents and just under half of the deaths in those incidents were caused by people who showed support for white supremacy or claimed to belong to groups espousing that ideology, the analysis shows.

Victims of all incidents in recent years represent a broad cross-section of American society, including Blacks, Jews, immigrants, LGBTQ individuals, Asians and other people of color who have been attacked by right-wing extremists wielding vehicles, guns, knives and fists.

Dozens of religious institutions — including mosques, synagogues and Black churches — as well as abortion clinics and government buildings, have been threatened, burned, bombed and hit with gunfire over the past six years.

Kenneth Robinson, pastor of Briar Creek Road Baptist Church in Charlotte, N.C., — one of several predominantly Black churches attacked in the spring and summer of 2015 — said some members remain apprehensive.

"Trauma is a way of life for us," Robinson said. "So we grieve, but we keep pushing forward."

Both far-left and far-right attacks hit groundbreaking levels in 2020, the database shows, with far-right incidents still the much larger group.

The 73 far-right incidents were an all-time annual high in the CSIS database, which goes back to 1994.

Left-wing attacks reached 25 in 2020. Those incidents include multiple attempts by extremists to derail trains to hinder oil pipeline construction and at least seven incidents in which police and their facilities were targeted with guns, firebombs and graffiti. The incidents included the burning of a Minneapolis police precinct during protests over the death of George Floyd.

In August, a supporter of President Donald Trump was shot dead in Portland, Ore., by a suspected gunman who was a self-described antifa supporter. That killing was the only death last year attributed to far-left violence, the data shows. There were two deaths attributed to far-right attacks.

The Jan. 6 riot at the Capitol spurred renewed national attention on domestic terrorism and on hate-driven violence.

The Post focused its analysis primarily on far-right attacks since 2015 because they account for a clear majority of the rising domestic terrorism events and fatalities charted by the CSIS.

The far-right incidents last year broke into distinct waves emerging amid government shutdowns in the spring, widespread racial demonstrations in the summer and confrontations over the presidential election results in the late fall, The Post's review of the CSIS data shows.

The CSIS database is one of the best public sources of information about domestic terrorism incidents, which the group's analysts define as attacks or plots involving a deliberate use or threat of violence to achieve political goals, create a broad psychological impact or change government policy. That definition excludes many violent events, including incidents during nationwide unrest last year, because CSIS analysts could not determine whether attackers had a political or ideological motive.

Data released by the CSIS on Monday includes the Jan. 6 breach of the Capitol as one of 11 far-right terrorism incidents that month — the most for any January in the database. The new report highlights more involvement in far-right attacks and plots by military service members, veterans and current and former police officers, some of whom participated in the riot at the Capitol.

Following the Capitol incident, FBI Director Christopher Wray told federal lawmakers that confronting domestic terrorism is a top national security priority of the agency.

Nearly every state has seen at least one domestic terrorist attack or plot in recent years, The Post's analysis of the database shows, a notable expansion of the communities afflicted by terrorism over prior decades.

“January 6 was not an isolated event,” Wray told the Senate Judiciary Committee on March 2. “The problem of domestic terrorism has been metastasizing across the country for a long time now and it’s not going away anytime soon.”

The database includes 980 incidents since 1994, the first year in the CSIS records.

Incidents do not have to be adjudicated in the court system to be included. Dozens of incidents have no identified perpetrator but have details about the attacks, including evidence of motive and the target that led to the case being categorized in the database.

The attacks and plots on U.S. soil are bucketed as far right, far left, religious or "ethnonationalist," which supports nationalist goals that often include dividing society along ethnic lines. Under the CSIS system, the attacks on 9/11 are in the religious category because the perpetrators were Islamist terrorists.

The data shows that far-right attacks diminished following a federal crackdown in response to the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. In the attack, Timothy McVeigh detonated a truck bomb outside a federal building, killing 168 people. It remains the deadliest homegrown terrorist attack in American history.

Right-wing extremism began gathering fresh momentum after the election of Barack Obama, the nation's first Black president, according to an April 2009 Department of Homeland Security intelligence assessment. "Right-wing extremists have capitalized on the election of the first African American president, and are focusing their efforts to recruit new members, mobilize existing supporters, and broaden their scope and appeal through propaganda," the assessment said.

Some attacks do not have an easily discerned motive or a single ideological thread. To refine the types of extremism involved in each case, The Post compiled court records, social media postings, news accounts and other material from local, state and federal law enforcement authorities.

For example, the extended review enabled the The Post to determine that at least 15 attacks or plots involved predominantly Black churches over the past six years. One of them was New Shiloh Christian Center in Melbourne, Fla. Three times in early 2015 fires were set at the church and cars vandalized. No suspect was caught.

Some members left the congregation and others remain fearful, said New Shiloh Bishop Jacquelyn Gordon.

"We all felt threatened," she said. "I'm always on high alert, because I had no idea who did this."

Over the past six years, 16 mosques and 13 synagogues also were attacked or threatened by extremists on the far right, The Post's analysis of the database found.

One of those, Anshe Sholom B'nai Israel in Chicago, was hit with molotov cocktails in 2019. The perpetrators remain unidentified.

Rabbi David Wolkenfeld said worshipers began to fret about security even as they gave thanks that the building was not destroyed.

“It’s really hard. Shocking, shocking to see,” he said. “I’m at a loss when I think about that. Violence toward innocent people is just something I can’t get my head around.”

Pastor Ernest Richards said he had the same sense of disbelief as he watched his church burning in July 2018, an incident that the CSIS includes as a far-left attack. The attackers set the church in Vale, N.C., afire and spray-painted the words "ANTI-GAY HATE GROUP" on a wall, apparently thinking it was a church with a similar name where a pastor was critical of homosexuality. A suspect was never identified.

"I was just angry at a person who could do this," said Richards, 88, who no longer leads the church. "My anger turned into a state of pity. How can you do that?"

Most perpetrators work independently
Members of militias and other extremist groups — such as the KKK, Aryan Cowboys and the Base — had roles in at least 67 attacks since 2015, according to The Post's examination.

But a large majority of perpetrators appear from the data to be operating independently, a defining characteristic of many recent attacks, counterterrorism researchers have said. Some of those loners are prolific users of social media out of which they assemble a jumble of personal beliefs or ideologies, researchers said.

The beliefs have included a tangle of white supremacy, anti-Semitism, misogyny, homophobia and a host of baseless and debunked claims.

One of the prevailing theories among far-right conservatives is about a "Great Replacement," the belief that the White race is being replaced by people of color, according to a nationally representative survey of 1,000 American adults last month by the Chicago Project on Security and Threats at the University of Chicago.

The Post's review of the database found 30 attacks or plots attributed to right-wing violence against Black Lives Matter since 2015, a large majority of them last year.

Perpetrators beat BLM activists in the streets and attacked them with mace, knives, guns or explosives, records show. Right-wing extremists used their vehicles as weapons against activists, plowing into crowds of racial justice demonstrators on at least nine occasions over the past six years, according to The Post's analysis.

Businesses affiliated with racial justice protests were vandalized and torched, among them a Black-owned coffee shop in Shoreline, Wash. It was pelted with molotov cocktails after midnight on Sept. 30 last year.

Darnesha Weary, co-owner of Black Coffee Northwest and a Black Lives Matter coordinator in Shoreline, said the shop later was vandalized with neo-Nazi graffiti. Weary expressed outrage about the attacks and the fact that no one has been caught.

"No one should feel like they have the audacity to go try and burn someone's building," she said. "And just because they're mad."

Bruce Hoffman, a professor and counterterrorism specialist at Georgetown University, said extremists have exploited social media and the internet in recent years to share theories, along with grievances,tactics and potential targets.

"It's the propellant," Hoffman said about social media. "That's what's giving the reach."

From 2015 to 2020, the use of websites or social media such as Facebook and encrypted chat services by right-wing extremists rose in five of the six years, The Post's analysis found.

The Post review included a case if the social media engagement was mentioned by investigators in incidents or cited in news accounts.

The trend peaked in 2020, with 24 incidents that The Post could identify. That represents about one out of five incidents of right-wing violence in that year.

Extremists who lurk online and are unaffiliated with a group pose special challenges for law enforcement because they leave few clues about their intentions and targets, counterterrorism officials and researchers said in interviews.

"Social media has afforded absolutely everything that's bad out there in the world the ability to come inside your home," one federal counterterrorism official told The Post, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss law enforcement matters. "And so that makes it hard for law enforcement to see potential tripwires and indicators."

Among the extremists drawing inspiration online was Taylor Michael Wilson, a 26-year-old from Missouri. Before and after Wilson attended a deadly 2017 right-wing rally in Charlottesville, he immersed himself in right-wing propaganda, court records showed later.

On Oct. 22, 2017, Wilson slipped into the engine compartment of an Amtrak train and pulled the brakes in a remote stretch of Nebraska. At the time, he was carrying a .38-caliber handgun, ammunition speed-loaders and a knife. He also had with him a business card for the neo-Nazi National Socialist Movement, court records show.

After a struggle, a train conductor pinned him down until authorities arrived. Wilson later told a deputy: "I was going to save the train from the black people," records state.

Federal authorities later confiscated more than a dozen firearms, including an automatic rifle and hundreds of rounds of ammunition, tactical gear and white-supremacist literature, documents show. A roommate told investigators Wilson joined a neo-Nazi group after meeting members online. Wilson expressed interest in "killing black people," court records show.

Wilson pleaded guilty in 2018 to a count of terrorism attacks and other violence against railroad carriers and mass transportation systems. He was sentenced to 14 years in federal prison.

Migrants targeted
Attacks on immigrants have been recurring in recent years. So have attacks on people of color assumed to be immigrants or Muslim, according to statements by perpetrators during the episodes as recounted by the victims.

There have been 15 anti-immigrant-related incidents since 2015, resulting in 27 fatalities and dozens of injuries, a review of the CSIS cases shows. Some of those attacks drew national attention, including an Aug. 3, 2019, massacre at a Walmart in El Paso, Texas, by a gunman who authorities say posted a manifesto railing against a "Hispanic invasion" of the state. The shootings left 23 people, including eight Mexican nationals, dead and two dozen others wounded.

But there also were local incidents, such as the shootings in Wisconsin by now-convicted killer Dan J. Popp of his neighbors. On March 6, 2016, Popp, then 39, approached a father and son in the hallway of the apartment complex where he lived, court records show. Popp demanded to know where they were from.

When they told him they were from Puerto Rico, Popp said, "Oh, that's why you don't speak English."

Popp retrieved a rifle from his room, told them, "You guys got to go," and shot dead Jesus R. Manso-Perez, 40. He kicked down the door to another unit that belonged to a Hmong family. Popp found them hiding in a bedroom and killed Phia Vue, 36, and Mai Vue, 32.

During his trial for homicide, a jury rejected a claim by Popp that he was insane. A judge sentenced him in February 2018 to life in prison.

Among emerging trends is the number of military service members and veterans involved in attacks and plots in recent years.

The Post found 36 instances in the CSIS data from 2015 through January 2021, including the Jan. 6 Capitol riot.

In that incident alone, more than 40 people charged with conspiracy and other crimes had served in the military, according to another, separate Post analysis of arrests related to the riot. More than a dozen were current or former law enforcement officers, including police and corrections officers.

Police officers, government officials and politicians also were targets in 2020 in at least 15 right-wing domestic terrorism attacks or plots, a review of the CSIS data shows.

In Monday’s CSIS report, the security group warned that right-wing extremists are increasingly attempting to recruit military service members and veterans.

The report, titled "The Military, Police, and the Rise of Terrorism in the United States," cited a Department of Defense report sent to the House and Senate Armed Services Committees last month. That report said that DOD "is facing a threat from domestic extremists (DE), particularly those who espouse white supremacy or white nationalist ideologies."

One of the right-wing terrorism incidents in 2020 involved Navy veteran Timothy Wilson, 36. He had been planning for months to commit some kind of attack that was based on his hatred of Black people, Jewish people, the federal government, refugees and other potential targets, according to a federal affidavit.

Wilson, a father of four who worked for a time at a charitable organization after his Navy stint, communicated with other extremists through an encrypted chat app, the affidavit shows. He shared bombmaking techniques, boasted about his arsenal of guns and ammunition, and talked about recruiting potential collaborators, according to the affidavit.

His contacts included Jarrett William Smith, a 24-year-old Army infantry soldier stationed at Fort Riley, Kan., who offered information online about how to make improvised explosive devices, according to federal investigators. On Facebook, Smith wrote about traveling to Ukraine to fight with a far-right paramilitary group, investigators said.

Smith was arrested and in February 2020 pleaded guilty to unlawfully distributing instructions for making explosive devices. He was sentenced in August to 30 months in prison.

For his part, Wilson began meeting an undercover FBI agent who was posing as an extremist collaborator. Wilson plotted to bomb a public building, and in March 2020, as coronavirus shutdowns were taking hold, Wilson decided to accelerate his plans and blow up a hospital treating COVID-19 patients, according to investigators.

Wilson accepted an offer from an undercover agent of a truck he was told contained explosives. When authorities tried to take him into custody, Wilson fatally shot himself.

In congressional hearings in recent years, counterterrorism specialists and other witnesses told lawmakers the federal government needs more data on domestic terrorism to understand how to address the rising violence.

“Any expert is going to tell you that this is the most serious security threat to the American people today,” said Rep. Jamie Raskin, D-Md., who held oversight hearings in 2019 that questioned the federal response to rising white-supremacist violence. “And yet we don’t have any good description of the magnitude and the dimensions of the problem.”

Published April 12, 2021


A little over four times as many right wing terror attacks as left wing. Not surprising to anyone paying attention, but really, this leads to two questions:

1. Why is the right so much more violent than the left?
2. What can be done to reduce the instances of right-wing terrorism?

For me the answers aren't simple but can be boiled (mostly accurately) down to this:

1. The right has this sense of their old power slipping away and they're lashing out. This is why we had Trump and the storming of the capitol as well.
2. Honestly, I have no good answers here. The best I can say is keep the modern neo-nazis out of the spotlight and make it harder for people who could be converted to find their rhetoric. Is it deplatforming? You could say that, but most places don't want to host hate speech anyway, and they can legally kick people who espouse this sort of thing off so I don't see a big problem.
Last edited by Neu California on Fri Apr 16, 2021 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Saiwania » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:47 am

Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American Right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.
Last edited by Saiwania on Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby New haven america » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:48 am

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Postby Vivolkha » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:52 am

Quick post for now but the right is more violent than the left simply because they draw more support and sympathy (at least in America), so their terrorist activity is naturally higher as they have more recruits to carry them out with.
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Postby Dowaesk » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:53 am

If funny how some far-right members such as Brenton Tarrant say he doesnt hate muslims, jews and black people. I read his manifesto. In the beginning of a paragraph he would start with claiming he doesnt hate. But by the end, he would have called for all his fellow supporters to stand up and kill them and to not care about gender or age.
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Postby Suriyanakhon » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:58 am

Saiwania wrote:Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American Right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.


Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.
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Postby Kilobugya » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:01 am

Neu California wrote:1. Why is the right so much more violent than the left?


There are both general and specific reasons for that.

The left, usually, only resorts to violence to defend itself, or against violent oppression. Ideologically, philosophically, violence is alien to the leftist way of thinking. There are have been some extreme left violent groups in the world, but nowhere near the level of KKK or Nazi/Fascists in the 1920s or 1930s. Sure there are revolutions and guerillas, but those always happen against dictatorial regimes (which includes Colombia, IMHO, but that's another topic).

Then there is the fact that the right is basically losing the culture wars in the USA - acceptance for LGBT or abortion is going up especially among younger generations, the demographic evolution make the "whites" become more of a minority, even stricter gun control has a majority supporting it. So they lash out from desperation.

Neu California wrote:2. What can be done to reduce the instances of right-wing terrorism?


That's a though question, and I don't think there is a silver bullet for that, but more of a wide range of action.

First, not surrender to it, but continue pushing for all the policies that are backed by a majority, making them the new normal. Having better mental healthcare - lots of those who do commit acts of terror are mentally unstable and unwell. We should also work with (or coerce) social network to police themselves, not so much as censoring but as not having algorithms that favor so much "clashy" content. Gun control is a must, to make it harder for would-be terrorists to access weapons. Trying to address some of the issues that can fuel their rage is also important, when those issues are real and can addressed without being a capitulation - like helping impoverished farmers or blue collar workers in the rust belt.

Saiwania wrote:Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.


So, complete capitulation to terrorism ? No way.
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Postby Vassenor » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:01 am

Suriyanakhon wrote:
Saiwania wrote:Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American Right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.


Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.


You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.
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Postby New Jacobland » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:04 am

Vassenor wrote:
Suriyanakhon wrote:
Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.


You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.

Hold up, Saiwania is a neo-Nazi? How do you infer this?
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Postby Alien Overlord » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:05 am

Suriyanakhon wrote:
Saiwania wrote:Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American Right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.


Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.

So then why were we doing exactly that when BLM were rioting and looting? Besides only a fool would continue provoking half of the population with increasingly radical legislation when those radical positions led to thousands of normal working joe's storming the capital. These aren't terrorists, these are people concerned with losing their rights which is a completely human and normal reaction. If you want proof look at the thousands of examples throughout history of similar events, especially in the former Soviet Union.

A democracy is supposed to work for all of it's citizens, something the left hasn't been doing.
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Postby Dowaesk » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:05 am

Vassenor wrote:
Suriyanakhon wrote:
Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.


You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.

Dangerous move, bruh. :!:
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Postby New haven america » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:07 am

Dowaesk wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.

Dangerous move, bruh. :!:

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Postby Neu California » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:09 am

Alien Overlord wrote:
Suriyanakhon wrote:
Giving in to terrorists is objectively a bad idea.

Besides that, it's moral cowardice of the lowest order.

So then why were we doing exactly that when BLM were rioting and looting? Besides only a fool would continue provoking half of the population with increasingly radical legislation when those radical positions led to thousands of normal working joe's storming the capital. These aren't terrorists, these are people concerned with losing their rights which is a completely human and normal reaction. If you want proof look at the thousands of examples throughout history of similar events, especially in the former Soviet Union.

A democracy is supposed to work for all of it's citizens, something the left hasn't been doing.

Examples of this increasingly radical legislation?

And what rights are these people losing? (the ability to discriminate against someone over their race, religion, gender, sexuality, gender identity, or other immutable characteristics is not a right, BTW, but seems to be the big thing on the right with all the transgender sports bans)
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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:13 am

New Jacobland wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.

Hold up, Saiwania is a neo-Nazi? How do you infer this?

Because he is literally a nazi, he idolises the third reich and espouses nazi rhetoric in almost every single thread he takes part in. Just have a stroll through his post history and this will become clear.

Here is a recent example in a hypothetical scenario where he says he would use his wealth to fund neo nazi coups across the world and to further the alt right:

Saiwania wrote:It's hard to say what it'd be like, other than that it'd be pretty dang good for me. But the outside world would perhaps find it "controversial" because other than spending on assets/things that'll keep me rich- I'd plan to also spend on what is seen as "evil" things, with the only line that I draw being that I don't want to do anything I could be criminally charged for.

Would still use my vast resources to maybe back neo-Nazi coups overseas, sending money to racist organizations to pit them against eachother to cause outcomes I hope for or to build the alt-right's message, maybe purchasing this website to turn it into my personal playground where the policies are vastly different and so on.

The one thing that'd be beneficial that I do want to push hard for is a global ban on plastic and to somehow make it so that people just don't know how to make it anymore, and we can't until we know how to easily remove the plastic that's polluted the planet/food chain already.
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Kilobugya
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Kilobugya » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:14 am

Alien Overlord wrote:So then why were we doing exactly that when BLM were rioting and looting?


First, the overwhelming majority of BLM protesters were peaceful, and most violence occurred after the police attacked them.

Then, riots and terrorism are fully different things. Terrorism kills on purpose to inflict fear. Riots very rarely have intent to kill - they just lash out a (rightfully in this case) anger against a situation they feel peaceful protests won't be enough to address. I'm not saying rioting is fine, but it's not comparable at all to terrorism.

And finally, doing police and justice reform isn't "giving in" to BLM, it's something that should have been done even if BLM didn't exist. I'm not saying we should voluntarily refuse to do something "right-wing terrorists" want just because they want it, if it was a good idea to do it anyway (like, giving help to rust belt blue collar workers or rural states).

Alien Overlord wrote:These aren't terrorists, these are people concerned with losing their rights which is a completely human and normal reaction.


Which "rights" are they losing ? The right to oppress people of a different skin color, gender or sexual orientation ? Those aren't rights, but privileges. There is no rights that are stripped from white heterosexual men when rights are granted to colored people, women or LGBT.

Alien Overlord wrote:A democracy is supposed to work for all of it's citizens, something the left hasn't been doing.


Which is exactly what the left is doing (at least, those who really to the left, not the center-right Biden) - ensuring the democracy work for all of its citizens, not for a tiny elite of ultra-wealthy, or just for those who have the "right" gender, skin color or sexual orientation.
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The Huskar Social Union
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:14 am

New haven america wrote:i am shocked

shocked i say
I know right

Literally no one could have ever predicted this.
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Page
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Page » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:26 am

Saiwania wrote:Pushing for the Democratic party's policies is only going to make the American Right angrier, so the solution is perhaps to just give the right wing what it wants across the board. Much of the leadership of the Democratic party aren't fans of the far Left or Progressives anyways. They'll be at home adopting enough right wing positions to triangulate like Clinton or Obama did.


What's funny is that while you have a more repugnant ideology here than anyone here, you correctly see something none of the liberals here see: That liberals will sooner bow down to fascists if it lets them keep their power and privilege rather than allow the left to change the system.
Last edited by Page on Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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CoraSpia
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Anarchy

Postby CoraSpia » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:32 am

How strange that pushing divisive policies leads to the other side getting angry enough to fight. It's truly a shocking revelation.
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Vivolkha
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Founded: Oct 15, 2017
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vivolkha » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:32 am

More detailed answers to OP's questions:

1. Why is the right so much more violent than the left?
There are several reasons for this. The main one, as I explained in a previous post, is higher support. This translates in higher membership in right-wing terrorist groups, more funding, and in general more capacity to carry out attacks. It translates in other ways too, with white supremacist speech having more visibility than the far-left (obvious example: Trump) and their attacks being condoned more.

Another, significantly less important reason is ideology. Right-wing groups tend to be more supportive of Second Amendment rights (and most terrorist attacks in America are carried out with firearms) and to attack people over corporations and public property.

2. What can be done to reduce the instances of right-wing terrorism?
Generally speaking, the same measures can be applied to far-right and far-left terrorism. The two main reasons fueling them are, in my opinion, the extreme political polarization in the US and the ease of access to firearms.

To address political polarization, the US needs to improve the quality of its local elections and destroy gerrymandering. The drawing of electoral districts should be left to independent commissions, never to state legislatures. Another fundamental flaw is the first-past-the-post electoral system in America, entrenching two-party, "black or white" rule.

The ease of access to firearms can be reduced by introducing increased gun control. Honestly the Second Amendment entirely needs to go, but that would be hugely unpopular in America.

Neither of these reforms are easy to implement in any way, because of their unpopularity, lack of political will, or both. Thus, I expect America's terrorism problem to grow worse in the future.
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Latvijas Otra Republika
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Postby Latvijas Otra Republika » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:36 am

So the radicals who aligned themselves with BLM and Antifa didn’t burn down and loot major U.S urban centres, it was Incel Paul who hasn’t seen the light of day with his whites supremacist bodies. Get a fucking grip
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Neu California
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Neu California » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:39 am

Latvijas Otra Republika wrote:So the radicals who aligned themselves with BLM and Antifa didn’t burn down and loot major U.S urban centres, it was Incel Paul who hasn’t seen the light of day with his whites supremacist bodies. Get a fucking grip

Reminder that most BLM protests are peaceful, and riots are not terrorism
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Latvijas Otra Republika
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Postby Latvijas Otra Republika » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:43 am

New Jacobland wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
You're criticising the Neo-Nazi for saying we should give Neo-Nazis whatever they want.

Hold up, Saiwania is a neo-Nazi? How do you infer this?

He’s a troll account meant to bait, look at his post history for his Neo-Nazi shit. The way he writes his posts is plastic
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CoraSpia
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Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Anarchy

Postby CoraSpia » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:44 am

Vivolkha wrote:More detailed answers to OP's questions:

1. Why is the right so much more violent than the left?
There are several reasons for this. The main one, as I explained in a previous post, is higher support. This translates in higher membership in right-wing terrorist groups, more funding, and in general more capacity to carry out attacks. It translates in other ways too, with white supremacist speech having more visibility than the far-left (obvious example: Trump) and their attacks being condoned more.

Another, significantly less important reason is ideology. Right-wing groups tend to be more supportive of Second Amendment rights (and most terrorist attacks in America are carried out with firearms) and to attack people over corporations and public property.

2. What can be done to reduce the instances of right-wing terrorism?
Generally speaking, the same measures can be applied to far-right and far-left terrorism. The two main reasons fueling them are, in my opinion, the extreme political polarization in the US and the ease of access to firearms.

To address political polarization, the US needs to improve the quality of its local elections and destroy gerrymandering. The drawing of electoral districts should be left to independent commissions, never to state legislatures. Another fundamental flaw is the first-past-the-post electoral system in America, entrenching two-party, "black or white" rule.

The ease of access to firearms can be reduced by introducing increased gun control. Honestly the Second Amendment entirely needs to go, but that would be hugely unpopular in America.

Neither of these reforms are easy to implement in any way, because of their unpopularity, lack of political will, or both. Thus, I expect America's terrorism problem to grow worse in the future.

Unfortunately this choice was made in the UK, where I live and it has led to a government that has far too much power in our lives. If Americans want to be free then the worst thing they could do is implement gun control measures. If an increased risk from terrorism or random shootings is the cost for keeping the right to forcibly resist government actions, which is the right which underpins and guarantees all other rights, then it is the cost that a society must pay.
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Alien Overlord
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Posts: 331
Founded: Feb 10, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Alien Overlord » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:44 am

Neu California wrote:
Alien Overlord wrote:So then why were we doing exactly that when BLM were rioting and looting? Besides only a fool would continue provoking half of the population with increasingly radical legislation when those radical positions led to thousands of normal working joe's storming the capital. These aren't terrorists, these are people concerned with losing their rights which is a completely human and normal reaction. If you want proof look at the thousands of examples throughout history of similar events, especially in the former Soviet Union.

A democracy is supposed to work for all of it's citizens, something the left hasn't been doing.

Examples of this increasingly radical legislation?

And what rights are these people losing? (the ability to discriminate against someone over their race, religion, gender, sexuality, gender identity, or other immutable characteristics is not a right, BTW, but seems to be the big thing on the right with all the transgender sports bans)

Federal Assault Weapons Ban (AWB) (1993) - I don't know why our Supreme Court didn't strike this down as unconstitutional, but it clearly was
Affordable Care Act (ACA) (2010)
Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) (2012)
DREAM Act (Technically hasn't passed, but the Democrats keep pushing for it so it's relevant)

Executive Order 13985 (Advancing Racial Equity and Support for Underserved Communities Through the Federal Government)
Executive Order 13991 (Protecting the Federal Workforce and Requiring Mask-Wearing)
Executive Order 14006 (Reforming Our Incarceration System to Eliminate the Use of Privately Operated Criminal Detention Facilities)
Executive Order 14011 (Executive Order on the Establishment of Interagency Task Force on the Reunification of Families)
Executive Order 14010 (Executive Order on Restoring Faith in Our Legal Immigration Systems and Strengthening Integration and Inclusion Efforts for New Americans)
Executive Order 14012 (Executive Order on Rebuilding and Enhancing Programs to Resettle Refugees and Planning for the Impact of Climate Change on Migration)
Executive Order 14009 (Executive Order on Strengthening Medicaid and the Affordable Care Act)

Just to name a few.


That's not to mention the constant attempts at gun control and other radical legislation that are discussed and pushed for by left-wingers. With the exception of the DREAM Act, everything I mentioned was actually passed or put into law. Regarding transgender sports bans I believe the primary concern is that transgender athletes have an advantage over non-transgender athletes. If that's true then it takes away from the value and legitimacy of the sports themselves. That shouldn't even be a right-wing thing if it's true, it should be universal in support against.
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Ayissor wrote:
Alien Overlord wrote:You mean the proles living in tribes right? The ones who were also brainwashed 1984 style?

Yup, who else? Workers? Ha, as if we need them in our anarcho-primitivist-orwellian utopia dystopia federation.

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Latvijas Otra Republika
Minister
 
Posts: 2593
Founded: Feb 22, 2017
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Latvijas Otra Republika » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:48 am

Neu California wrote:
Latvijas Otra Republika wrote:So the radicals who aligned themselves with BLM and Antifa didn’t burn down and loot major U.S urban centres, it was Incel Paul who hasn’t seen the light of day with his whites supremacist bodies. Get a fucking grip

Reminder that most BLM protests are peaceful, and riots are not terrorism

‘Riots are not terrorism’
Joke, actively using violence and intimidation to achieve a political ends. All the smashed up store fronts, ruined lives, arson and people dead or injured is just a little activism on the side

I didn’t even mention the protests. I’m talking about the riots, some of which are still happening. There is a clear distinction between both.
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