White Supremacy discussion thread

[Galloism]

That is by far the most ludicrous thing I've read all day. White supremacists have a lot of power, especially in North America and to a lesser (but still concerning) extent in Europe.

https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/ ... tionalists

11 million Americans is a tiny minority with no power now.

Not going to lie, while that is still a very small percentage, it’s higher than I thought it would be.

[Miku the Based]

White people are superior - racist statement

White people are racist - racist statement

Any statement applying qualities of some members of a race to an entire race - racist statement.

Implying white people or black people exist is racist statement
Implying any race exist is racist statement
If you believe the domesticated pig is a race and the wild pig is race it is racist.
Therefore racist is buzzword with little meaning.

[Suriyanakhon]

With regard to anti-miscegenation arguments, what import does race possess, either intrinsically or in society, that necessitates the state refusing to acknowledge multiracial marriages and families? I cannot think of anything substantive.

What is substantive about it is if the sovereign state in question considers itself a nation-state, as defined by having a majority population with a common culture, ethnicity, genetics, history, and so on. China for example, devotes quite a lot of effort in ensuring that they maintain a Han majority throughout their entire territory. Even going so far as to forcibly sterilize Uyghur women and coercing them into having children with Han men or entering into marriages with such men in exchange for money and so on.

Its obvious to me that China sees maintaining its native traits/skin color as important, beyond just preserving its culture/society from outside influences.

Rather because they waived the One Child Policy for ethnic minorities for decades and then realized that the rising number of young men in the population will be from ethnic minorities who the Chinese government is afraid will have separatist tendencies. There's no difference between Uyghur and Han skin tones and nothing to suggest that the motive has to do with “native traits” (which the Uyghurs would be - native) and not the PRC's own desire to maintain power.

[Sicilian Imperial-Capitalist Empire]

Sai, you do realize that by your own logic, whites pairing with other whites will only diminish their size like ethnic groups remaining confined to their own ethnic group. Therefore race-mixing would actually be a way to advance "whiteness" into the population, ergo race-mixing is actually a blessing and not a curse.

[Dakini]

That is by far the most ludicrous thing I've read all day. White supremacists have a lot of power, especially in North America and to a lesser (but still concerning) extent in Europe.

https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/ ... tionalists

11 million Americans is a tiny minority with no power now.

It's also not taking into account the bit where a lot of white supremacists exercise a disproportionate amount of power in their communities and legislative bodies. For example, white supremacists have infiltrated police departments all over the USA. As the police are authority figures in their communities they exercise a disproportionate amount of power.

[Fahran]

How is what i said harmful?

"Love is love" is not a personally or socially sound justification for marriage or acceptance, and, in fact, is not one we use alone in any extant society. We place all sorts of limits beyond romantic love. Don't get me wrong. Romantic love is important, but it's not and should not be a stand-alone factor.

[Suriyanakhon]

Sai the Chinese aren't concerned about native traits such as skin color or they wouldn't be bigoted toward people who look just like them (The Japanese, Koreans, Vietnamese etc). Your understanding of race is not theirs.

Also you can have an ethnicity without a shared skin color. Not even all white people have the same traits.

It's definitely quite funny to me. Sai acts like white people all have something in common, but in truth they don't. A Basque shares next to nothing in terms of common tradition with a Finn, yet he puts them into the same group. Similarly, he divides Bengalis and Germans into different groups despite both being Indo-Europeans.

That's one of the things that's super ironic to me. Finns aren't even Indo-European, but White Nationalists will call them an “Aryan” and act like an Iranian or Bengali isn't.

[Zurkir]

White people are superior - racist statement

White people are racist - racist statement

Any statement applying qualities of some members of a race to an entire race - racist statement.

Implying white people or black people exist is racist statement
Implying any race exist is racist statement
If you believe the domesticated pig is a race and the wild pig is race it is racist.
Therefore racist is buzzword with little meaning.

A little bit of a ham-fisted analogy but you are correct in the end. To a degree.

Racism exists obviously but unfortunately the true meaning of racism and racial persecution has been grossly diluted in this day and age. At least in America. Nowadays you’ll be called racist for mispronouncing a foreign name or misidentifying someone purely as a mistake, not having enough racial diversity in the workplace, or even questioning people in a positive light about their heritage or native culture for example (s). Oddly enough the common droning is about race not being discussed enough and yet anyone who tries to talk about it “does it wrong”. It’s this never ending paradox of spiraling insanity.

To quote a well known conservative commentator “racism binds us, it surrounds us, it holds the galaxy together!”

[Saiwania]

Sai, you do realize that by your own logic, whites pairing with other whites will only diminish their size like ethnic groups remaining confined to their own ethnic group. Therefore race-mixing would actually be a way to advance "whiteness" into the population, ergo race-mixing is actually a blessing and not a curse.

It won't however, because I explained that the skin color won't change if the two ethnic groups have the same or similar skin color. The other traits might change, but its minor compared to the larger phenotype. The same outcome isn't true if two ethnic groups with different skin colors mix. The darker skin trait will express more than the lighter skin trait in practice.

Therefore, race mixing should be avoided for ethnic groups that have lighter skin. Some ethnic groups are so large that they don't have to worry about shrinking towards extinction but like I said, most ethnic groups are too small in population size to be genetically self sufficient. So the only way for those groups is to sometimes mix with ethnic groups that're geographically adjacent to them, if not similar at minimum, if the objective is to maintain the native phenotype that exists locally.

[Fahran]

What is substantive about it is if the sovereign state in question considers itself a nation-state, as defined by having a majority population with a common culture, ethnicity, genetics, history, and so on.

Race does not measure common culture, ethnicity, genetics, or history in most places.

China for example, devotes quite a lot of effort in ensuring that they maintain a Han majority throughout their entire territory. Even going so far as to forcibly sterilize Uyghur women and coercing them into having children with Han men or entering into marriages with such men in exchange for money and so on.

While this may perpetuate the interests of the Han Chinese and of the PRC, especially in light of global cowardice and economic dependence on the PRC's low-cost labor force, the ethics of such policies are dubious at best. A nation is harmed when its virtue is besmirched.

Its obvious to me that China sees maintaining its native traits/skin color as important, beyond just preserving its culture/society from outside influences.

China's policies aren't really about preserving skin color or other racial characteristics. In fact, they're willing to encourage forced miscegenation, in part, because it speeds up the process of cultural assimilation of ethnic minorities into the Han Chinese majority. They're approaching this from an ethnic, not a racial, perspective.

[Suriyanakhon]

Love is not love for a lot of people. Matter of fact, the further back in time someone goes- the less the concept of love was ever used by anyone as a reason to get married or to become engaged. When marriage was based off of who is a good fit in terms of social status/economics for the other person, was a far more valid system in my eyes than the prevalent norms now.

Love is bullshit enough where divorce is more common for people now than it is to stay married for the long term. As it turns out, it is not a strong foundation for anything because it is a nebulous concept that is subject to fading over time, if it was ever there to begin with.

Good thing we got rid of that. Those marriages were often miserable.

If it fades over time then its not true love and if people divorce then so be it.

Someone who marries someone of another race is a bad person. I don't see why it should matter in the first place and why you should be able to dictate who someone can marry.

Tbh I feel like the very idea of true love is extremely harmful and probably one of the reasons that divorce rates are so high. A successful marriage or relationship has to be based on more than just euphoric feelings. That doesn't make Sai right, but still.

[Sicilian Imperial-Capitalist Empire]

Sai, you do realize that by your own logic, whites pairing with other whites will only diminish their size like ethnic groups remaining confined to their own ethnic group. Therefore race-mixing would actually be a way to advance "whiteness" into the population, ergo race-mixing is actually a blessing and not a curse.

It won't however, because I explained that the skin color won't change if the two ethnic groups have the same or similar skin color. The other traits might change, but its minor compared to the larger phenotype. The same outcome isn't true if two ethnic groups with different skin colors mix. The darker skin trait will express more than the lighter skin trait in practice.

Therefore, race mixing should be avoided for ethnic groups that have lighter skin. Some ethnic groups are so large that they don't have to worry about shrinking towards extinction but like I said, most ethnic groups are too small in population size to be genetically self sufficient. So the only way for those groups is to mix with ethnic groups that're geographically adjacent to them, if not similar.

If this statement was really true, that would imply that it's actually black people that are superior since their skin color overpowers all others.

[The Emerald Legion]

No they aren't?

White Supremacists are a tiny minority of the population with literally no power. Meanwhile you have open supremacists of every other stripe in various positions of power.

You must have been asleep when the last president was in charge. The one who's ragtag band of capitol attackers included many a neo nazi.

An ABC News report which was released in 2007 recounted that past ABC polls which were conducted over a period of several years have tended to find that "six percent have self-reported harboring prejudice against Jews, 27 percent have self-reported harboring prejudice against Muslims, 25 percent have self-reported harboring prejudice against Arabs," and "one in 10 have conceded harboring at least a little bit of prejudice " against Hispanic Americans. The report also stated that a full 34% of Americans reported harboring "some racist feelings" in general as a self-description.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in ... ted_States

Damn that doesn't look like a small minority. 34% of Americans reported openly that they harbor racial prejudice? And I'm supposed to believe that that 34% are just unconscious bigots at best? Please.

Well, interestingly enough, literally a third of the black and hispanic population self report racial prejudice. It's just for some reason the left likes to report it as 'Americans' and then pretend it's white supremacy.

Also, no, the last president wasn't a white supremacist.

[Saiwania]

There's no difference between Uyghur and Han skin tones and nothing to suggest that the motive has to do with “native traits” (which the Uyghurs would be - native) and not the PRC's own desire to maintain power.

The Uyghur and Han phenotypes are visually different, which must be why China wants to supplant the Uyghurs in that specific province with its own favored majority which is Han for the most part. The PRC believes that if there is a Uyghur majority in Xinjiang, that it'll be more vulnerable to declaring secession than will be the case if the province is artificially transformed into having a Han majority.

China has a monoculture and a centrally planned vision for what the society should be and hence, wants its prevalent ethnicity and culture to dominate throughout all of China's territory.

[Neutraligon]

There's no difference between Uyghur and Han skin tones and nothing to suggest that the motive has to do with “native traits” (which the Uyghurs would be - native) and not the PRC's own desire to maintain power.

The Uyghur and Han phenotypes are visually different, which must be why China wants to supplant the Uyghurs in that specific province with its own favored majority which is Han for the most part. The PRC believes that if there is a Uyghur majority in Xinjiang, that it'll be more vulnerable to declaring secession than will be the case if the province is artificially transformed into having a Han majority.

China has a monoculture and hence, wants its prevalent ethnicity and culture to dominate throughout all of China's territory.

Sai, China does not ant to supplant the Uyghurs due to race, they want to supplant them because the Chinese government is authoritarian and the Uyghurs do not want to follow them. Oh wait, you actually said that later in your comment. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with politics. China does not have a monocuture. Beijing is very very different from Shang-hai, which is very different from Xinjiang, which is very different from other parts of China. China in fact recognizes 56 ethnic groups, including the dominant Han, and at least on the face, celebrates many of those groups.

[Neanderthaland]

It's definitely quite funny to me. Sai acts like white people all have something in common, but in truth they don't. A Basque shares next to nothing in terms of common tradition with a Finn, yet he puts them into the same group. Similarly, he divides Bengalis and Germans into different groups despite both being Indo-Europeans.

That's one of the things that's super ironic to me. Finns aren't even Indo-European, but White Nationalists will call them an “Aryan” and act like an Iranian or Bengali isn't.

One of my favorite things that Tolkien ever wrote was not a work of fantasy, but a letter to his German publisher. Who, upon inquiring as to whether Tolkien was Aryan, got met with:
"I am not of Aryan extraction: that is Indo-Iranian; as far as I am aware none of my ancestors spoke Hindustani, Persian, Gypsy, or any related dialects."

It's fun to imagine the Nazis broiling over having been equated to Gypsies. I guessing he didn't sell many book though.

[Saiwania]

Sai, China does not ant to supplant the Uyghurs due to race, they want to supplant them because the Chinese government is authoritarian and the Uyghurs do not want to follow them. Oh wait, you actually said that later in your comment. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with politics.

China is doing what they're doing for both reasons from what I can tell. Beijing in its infinite wisdom, has decided that they want all of China's provinces to have Han majorities and culture and etc, to be enforced. For China, China is Han and Han is China. There is no meaningfully separating out the Chinese system from its people.

If I were subject to China's tyranny for whatever reason, I'd probably be sterilized because I'm not Han, or would be imprisoned somewhere because I'm not productive enough. If I can't find work on my own, they'd surely find work for me and I'd be expected to obey without complaint.

[Neanderthaland]

The Uyghur and Han phenotypes are visually different, which must be why China wants to supplant the Uyghurs in that specific province with its own favored majority which is Han for the most part. The PRC believes that if there is a Uyghur majority in Xinjiang, that it'll be more vulnerable to declaring secession than will be the case if the province is artificially transformed into having a Han majority.

China has a monoculture and hence, wants its prevalent ethnicity and culture to dominate throughout all of China's territory.

Sai, China does not ant to supplant the Uyghurs due to race, they want to supplant them because the Chinese government is authoritarian and the Uyghurs do not want to follow them. Oh wait, you actually said that later in your comment. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with politics. China does not have a monocuture. Beijing is very very different from Shang-hai, which is very different from Xinjiang, which is very different from other parts of China. China in fact recognizes 56 ethnic groups, including the dominant Han, and at least on the face, celebrates many of those groups.

And as many people from China, or just familiar with it's internal politics have pointed out: the "Han" thing is kind of a popular fiction.

I mean, all nationality sort of is in a way. French people are only "French" because they decided the term applied to them over say Gascognes, or Occitanians, or Bretons, or what have you. We have our favorite poster on NSG who insists that he is Northumbrian not English. Etc.

But Han is more this way than most. It's a huge and diverse ethnic group that really struggles to maintain linguistic and cultural ties.

[Neutraligon]

Sai, China does not ant to supplant the Uyghurs due to race, they want to supplant them because the Chinese government is authoritarian and the Uyghurs do not want to follow them. Oh wait, you actually said that later in your comment. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with politics.

China is doing what they're doing for both reasons from what I can tell. Beijing in its infinite wisdom, has decided that they want all of China's provinces to have Han majorities and culture and etc, to be enforced. For China, China is Han and Han is China. There is no meaningfully separating out the Chinese system from its people.

If I were subject to China's tyranny for whatever reason, I'd probably be sterilized because I'm not Han, or would be imprisoned somewhere because I'm not productive enough. If I can't find work on my own, they'd surely find work for me and I'd be expected to obey without complaint.

No Sai, they are not doing it for both reasons. They treat the Tibetan Buddhists the same way, and all you have to do is look at Hong Kong to see how very wrong you are. They act the way they do not because of race, but due to issues of power and control. They want Han majorities because han majorities are easier to control. What does that separation thing even mean?

You might be sterilize, but it would not have anything to do with your race, it would have more to due with you being a political issue. You are aware that homelessness and joblessness is an issue in China...right?

[Rusozak]

China is doing what they're doing for both reasons from what I can tell. Beijing in its infinite wisdom, has decided that they want all of China's provinces to have Han majorities and culture and etc, to be enforced. For China, China is Han and Han is China. There is no meaningfully separating out the Chinese system from its people.

If I were subject to China's tyranny for whatever reason, I'd probably be sterilized because I'm not Han, or would be imprisoned somewhere because I'm not productive enough. If I can't find work on my own, they'd surely find work for me and I'd be expected to obey without complaint.

No Sai, they are not doing it for both reasons. They treat the Tibetan Buddhists the same way, and all you have to do is look at Hong Kong to see how very wrong you are. They act the way they do not because of race, but due to issues of power and control. They want Han majorities because han majorities are easier to control. What does that separation thing even mean?

You might be sterilize, but it would not have anything to do with your race, it would have more to due with you being a political issue. You are aware that homelessness and joblessness is an issue in China...right?

From what I've seen, there seems to be a racial component present in any common people that are aware of and support the PRC's actions. Perhaps they appeal to ethnonationalism in their propaganda. I've seen plenty of PRC apologists use those talking points. But at a state level, you're right. It's all about power.

[Joohan]

https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/ ... tionalists

11 million Americans is a tiny minority with no power now.

Not going to lie, while that is still a very small percentage, it’s higher than I thought it would be.

i'm skeptical of that study. I clicked on the links provided by the articles, but they just kept referencing other articles and a supposed number of ANES question - while only directly mentioning one. I wasn't able to find the actual study conducted.

Likewise, the study only concluded that about 6% of Americans might possibly show sympathy towards the alt-right - not that they actually support them, only that it's possible they might.

[Benzoro]

Good thing we got rid of that. Those marriages were often miserable.

If it fades over time then its not true love and if people divorce then so be it.

Someone who marries someone of another race is a bad person. I don't see why it should matter in the first place and why you should be able to dictate who someone can marry.

Tbh I feel like the very idea of true love is extremely harmful and probably one of the reasons that divorce rates are so high. A successful marriage or relationship has to be based on more than just euphoric feelings. That doesn't make Sai right, but still.

I have always felt the same way. The idea of a soulmate and true love only adds to more problems later in life. Justifying marriage over a silly feeling in your body but looking past their character is an awful way to go about things.

[The Emerald Legion]

No they aren't?

White Supremacists are a tiny minority of the population with literally no power. Meanwhile you have open supremacists of every other stripe in various positions of power.

That is by far the most ludicrous thing I've read all day. White supremacists have a lot of power, especially in North America and to a lesser (but still concerning) extent in Europe.

No. They really don't. That's why the left has to reach so much to find 'white supremacy.'

What there is is a lot of institutions who's entire mandate was founded in fighting white supremacy that make people a LOT of money. And now they need to keep things going by finding new and ever more definitionally strained 'white supremacists' to target.

[San Lumen]

Tbh I feel like the very idea of true love is extremely harmful and probably one of the reasons that divorce rates are so high. A successful marriage or relationship has to be based on more than just euphoric feelings. That doesn't make Sai right, but still.

I have always felt the same way. The idea of a soulmate and true love only adds to more problems later in life. Justifying marriage over a silly feeling in your body but looking past their character is an awful way to go about things.

Of course character matters in a relationship and isn't something one should ignore.

[Atheris]

No they aren't?

White Supremacists are a tiny minority of the population with literally no power. Meanwhile you have open supremacists of every other stripe in various positions of power.

That is by far the most ludicrous thing I've read all day. White supremacists have a lot of power, especially in North America and to a lesser (but still concerning) extent in Europe.

No they don't. There's not a single white nationalist movement currently in power and there's not a single one close to coming to power. There are similar nationalist governments in Poland and Hungary, but they're not white nationalists.