NATION

PASSWORD

Can Homophobia Be Justified?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Hjallvinter
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 24
Founded: Feb 22, 2021
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Hjallvinter » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:56 am

Shazbotdom wrote:



Links that really have no basis in reality or ridiculous memes seem like a load of shit to me.

Got anything other than links to websites that are opinion pieces? or are you going to attempt to get a rise out of people with your failed logic?


-Pedophiles are tying themselves to the LGBT community
-N-no t-theyre not

K.
Veritas Aequitas

User avatar
Daarwyrth
Diplomat
 
Posts: 666
Founded: Jul 05, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Daarwyrth » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:57 am

Palmyrion wrote:Art, music, societies - they are part of human evolutionary history and fitness. Everything about the human condition can be traced back to evolution. Defending our evolutionary fitness is wise practice of our mental faculties, and homophobia is one such wise practice.

Still devoid of logic and reason. You willingly refuse to make use of your mental and emotional capacity to understand the value of each living being. The tools evolution gave you to understand why having a society is better than having chaos reign. So, no. You fail to practice your evolutionary fitness because you refuse to make use of what evolution gave you.
The Royal State of Daarwyrth

A large, influential state on the continent of Nordeia, where the monarch is considered to be the nation's centre of gravity.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarsted | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


User avatar
Punished UMN
Minister
 
Posts: 2772
Founded: Jul 05, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Punished UMN » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:57 am

Palmyrion wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Let me translate it for you: he said that he understands why someone would want to criminalize homosexual acts, not that he agrees with it.

He gets the rationale, therefore he agrees with it.

Getting the rationale is one step - many steps even - above understanding said rationale.

No, that's just not accurate. Understanding the rationale for something just means you understand what the person's viewpoint is, it has nothing to do with agreeing with their sentiment.
Still lurking in the community, but don't expect much engagement.
Rawlsian socialist and Constitutional Monarchist. Absolute pacifist. Proud member of the Napoleon Bonaparte fandom.
I have borderline personality disorder, if I overreact to something, try to approach me after the fact and I'll apologize

User avatar
Disgraces
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Apr 07, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Disgraces » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:57 am

Palmyrion wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Let me translate it for you: he said that he understands why someone would want to criminalize homosexual acts, not that he agrees with it.

He gets the rationale, therefore he agrees with it.

Getting the rationale is one step - many steps even - above understanding said rationale.

Simply wrong.

User avatar
Palmyrion
Minister
 
Posts: 2171
Founded: Mar 04, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Palmyrion » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:58 am

Nilokeras wrote:
Hjallvinter wrote:
I'm rather certain Darwin didn't publish the study you cited.


he came up with the idea of kin selection, which is a neat mathematical proof of the utility of same-sex pairings in nature.

Gay couple can't reproduce, so they either contribute to raising their respective families' kin because they have no spawn of their own to take care of, or adopt children (in places where they legally can) to raise into adulthood.

The latter may not be "kin" selection in the strict definition of selecting for your own immediate and extended family's evolutionary fitness, but adopting an orphan and raising it to adulthood is still a major contributor to humanity's evolutionary fitness as a whole.
Palmyrion is here to kick ass and chew bubblegum. And he's out of bubblegum.

PALMYRION: RESURGENT (Greater Dienstadi Canon) | Q&A Thread | 【PALMYRIAWAVE】
Diplomatic Outreach Programme | The Dozen Giants | Civilian Storefront | Military Storefront
HERE BE MY REAL-LIFE PERCEPTIONS AND BELIEFS. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

For those who are struggling right now, remember that you are not alone.

User avatar
Disgraces
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Apr 07, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Disgraces » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:59 am

Daarwyrth wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Let me translate it for you: he said that he understands why someone would want to criminalize homosexual acts, not that he agrees with it.

There is no logical or rational argument for the criminalization of homosexual acts. We don't criminalise having blue eyes or brown hair either.

Bad analogy, but FYI I'm against it too.

User avatar
Chuukango
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 388
Founded: Mar 02, 2015
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Chuukango » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:00 am

No, it's not, full stop. The fact that this is a legitimate discussion is pretty discouraging but hey- we get to see the mask off homophobes in all their glory- or rather shame. Good old NS forums.
Elparia's token gay disaster.

User avatar
Palmyrion
Minister
 
Posts: 2171
Founded: Mar 04, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Palmyrion » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:00 am

Hjallvinter wrote:
Shazbotdom wrote:

Links that really have no basis in reality or ridiculous memes seem like a load of shit to me.

Got anything other than links to websites that are opinion pieces? or are you going to attempt to get a rise out of people with your failed logic?


-Pedophiles are tying themselves to the LGBT community
-N-no t-theyre not

K.

Just because paedos are at the gate, asking to be let into the LGBT rights movement, doesn't mean they're part of it.

Just because they claim to be part of LGBT, doesn't mean they are. (And they will never be.)

Daarwyrth wrote:
Palmyrion wrote:Art, music, societies - they are part of human evolutionary history and fitness. Everything about the human condition can be traced back to evolution. Defending our evolutionary fitness is wise practice of our mental faculties, and homophobia is one such wise practice.

Still devoid of logic and reason. You willingly refuse to make use of your mental and emotional capacity to understand the value of each living being. The tools evolution gave you to understand why having a society is better than having chaos reign. So, no. You fail to practice your evolutionary fitness because you refuse to make use of what evolution gave you.


Evolution gave me the capacity to defend humanity's reproductive - and evolutionary - fitness and opposing homosexuality (and sodomy as a whole) is part of the use of that mental capacity.
Palmyrion is here to kick ass and chew bubblegum. And he's out of bubblegum.

PALMYRION: RESURGENT (Greater Dienstadi Canon) | Q&A Thread | 【PALMYRIAWAVE】
Diplomatic Outreach Programme | The Dozen Giants | Civilian Storefront | Military Storefront
HERE BE MY REAL-LIFE PERCEPTIONS AND BELIEFS. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

For those who are struggling right now, remember that you are not alone.

User avatar
Necroghastia
Senator
 
Posts: 4060
Founded: May 11, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Necroghastia » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:01 am

Palmyrion wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Let me translate it for you: he said that he understands why someone would want to criminalize homosexual acts, not that he agrees with it.

He gets the rationale, therefore he agrees with it.

Getting the rationale is one step - many steps even - above understanding said rationale.

nah my dude im pretty sure a lot of people say "get" to mean the same thing as "understand"
like ive got bones to pick with sun's ideology but i don't think this is a hill that even has a place to die on
The Land of Spooky Scary Skeletons!

Pronouns: she/her

User avatar
Daarwyrth
Diplomat
 
Posts: 666
Founded: Jul 05, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Daarwyrth » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:01 am

Disgraces wrote:
Daarwyrth wrote:There is no logical or rational argument for the criminalization of homosexual acts. We don't criminalise having blue eyes or brown hair either.

Bad analogy, but FYI I'm against it too.

No, it's a good analogy. People are born gay, it's a characteristic of their nature. Someone who has blue eyes or brown hair can't change that fact (unless they literally mask it with coloured contacts or hair dye). Their eyes will always be blue and their hair will always be brown. Identically, gay people can't change their sexual orientation. They can mask it (which is extremely unhealthy) but they can't change it.
The Royal State of Daarwyrth

A large, influential state on the continent of Nordeia, where the monarch is considered to be the nation's centre of gravity.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarsted | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


User avatar
Sundiata
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6599
Founded: Sep 27, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Sundiata » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:01 am

Daarwyrth wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Let me translate it for you: he said that he understands why someone would want to criminalize homosexual acts, not that he agrees with it.

There is no logical or rational argument for the criminalization of homosexual acts. We don't criminalise having blue eyes or brown hair either.

Not in any American jurisdiction or of the European Union. While morally repugnant in the EU or the US, it's a different argument under the jurisdiction of Saudi Arabia.
Gender: Male
Religion: Catholic (Opus Dei)
Politics: Solidarity (Catholic Social Teaching)
Economics: Rerum Novarum (The Encyclical)
Alignment: Lawful Good

"Don't say, 'That person bothers me.' Think: 'That person sanctifies me.'"
-St. Josemaria Escriva (Founder of Opus Dei)

User avatar
Shazbotdom
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8848
Founded: Sep 28, 2004
Anarchy

Postby Shazbotdom » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:01 am

Hjallvinter wrote:
Shazbotdom wrote:

Links that really have no basis in reality or ridiculous memes seem like a load of shit to me.

Got anything other than links to websites that are opinion pieces? or are you going to attempt to get a rise out of people with your failed logic?


-Pedophiles are tying themselves to the LGBT community
-N-no t-theyre not

K.


When all your links are loads of unprecedented bullshit...that kinda means that they are unprecedented bullshit.

Sorry, but facts are facts.
Darth Bane/Darth Vader 2024 -- Together, we can Rule the Galaxy!
The Shazbotdom Empire || ShazWeb || Shazbotdom Military Information & History
IIWiki || Embassies v6.0 || Discord: YourDaddyShaz#0741
ShazAir || Shaz City International Airport || Shazbotdom News Corporation (News Thread)
Shazbert Bot's Gaming Adventures || PolyComp: E: -0.52 | S: -3.33 || WSPT: E: 100% | P: 100%

User avatar
Hjallvinter
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 24
Founded: Feb 22, 2021
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Hjallvinter » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:02 am

Chuukango wrote:No, it's not, full stop. The fact that this is a legitimate discussion is pretty discouraging but hey- we get to see the mask off homophobes in all their glory- or rather shame. Good old NS forums.


"How dare people have a discussion about slaughtering my sacred cows."
Veritas Aequitas

User avatar
Daarwyrth
Diplomat
 
Posts: 666
Founded: Jul 05, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Daarwyrth » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:03 am

Palmyrion wrote:Evolution gave me the capacity to defend humanity's reproductive - and evolutionary - fitness and opposing homosexuality (and sodomy as a whole) is part of the use of that mental capacity.

Nope. You aren't practicing evolutionary fitness. You're defending a bias, a flawed bias. By doing so, you refuse to make use of your mental and emotional capacity.
Last edited by Daarwyrth on Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Royal State of Daarwyrth

A large, influential state on the continent of Nordeia, where the monarch is considered to be the nation's centre of gravity.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarsted | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


User avatar
Picairn
Minister
 
Posts: 3267
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:04 am

Hjallvinter wrote:"How dare people have a discussion about slaughtering my sacred cows."

"How dare people stop me from spouting my bigoted beliefs!"
Picairn's Ministry of Foreign Relations
Minister: Edward H. Cornell
WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
Factbook | Constitution | Newspaper
Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Salus Maior wrote:Nothing we say here actually matters.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
Center-left liberal, or "neoliberal scum"
according to the far-left and far-right.
Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.

♔ The Empire of Picairn ♔
-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-—————————-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-
✵ Certified brunch-loving liberal and resident optimist of NSG. All Hail Biden! ✵

User avatar
Palmyrion
Minister
 
Posts: 2171
Founded: Mar 04, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Palmyrion » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:04 am

Sundiata wrote:
Daarwyrth wrote:There is no logical or rational argument for the criminalization of homosexual acts. We don't criminalise having blue eyes or brown hair either.

Not in any American jurisdiction or of the European Union. While morally repugnant in the EU or the US, it's a different argument under the jurisdiction of Saudi Arabia.

just overturn lawrence v texas and obergefell v hodges

Daarwyrth wrote:
Palmyrion wrote:Evolution gave me the capacity to defend humanity's reproductive - and evolutionary - fitness and opposing homosexuality (and sodomy as a whole) is part of the use of that mental capacity.

Nope. You aren't practicing evolutionary fitness. You're defending a bias, a flawed bias. By doing so, you refuse to make use of your mental and emotional capacity.

Biases are a part of human mental faculty. Homosexuality is an evolutionary dead end, and thus will be harmful to the human species.
Last edited by Palmyrion on Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Palmyrion is here to kick ass and chew bubblegum. And he's out of bubblegum.

PALMYRION: RESURGENT (Greater Dienstadi Canon) | Q&A Thread | 【PALMYRIAWAVE】
Diplomatic Outreach Programme | The Dozen Giants | Civilian Storefront | Military Storefront
HERE BE MY REAL-LIFE PERCEPTIONS AND BELIEFS. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

For those who are struggling right now, remember that you are not alone.

User avatar
Picairn
Minister
 
Posts: 3267
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:05 am

Palmyrion wrote:just overturn lawrence v texas and obergefell v hodges

No, you're a tyrant if you want to criminalize gay marriage.
Picairn's Ministry of Foreign Relations
Minister: Edward H. Cornell
WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
Factbook | Constitution | Newspaper
Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Salus Maior wrote:Nothing we say here actually matters.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
Center-left liberal, or "neoliberal scum"
according to the far-left and far-right.
Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.

♔ The Empire of Picairn ♔
-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-—————————-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-
✵ Certified brunch-loving liberal and resident optimist of NSG. All Hail Biden! ✵

User avatar
Disgraces
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Apr 07, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Disgraces » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:05 am

Daarwyrth wrote:
Disgraces wrote:Bad analogy, but FYI I'm against it too.

No, it's a good analogy. People are born gay, it's a characteristic of their nature. Someone who has blue eyes or brown hair can't change that fact (unless they literally mask it with coloured contacts or hair dye). Their eyes will always be blue and their hair will always be brown. Identically, gay people can't change their sexual orientation. They can mask it (which is extremely unhealthy) but they can't change it.

Eye or hair color isn't a mental illness.

No, I'm not homophobic.
Last edited by Disgraces on Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Engadine Mcdonalds 1997
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 52
Founded: Jan 21, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Engadine Mcdonalds 1997 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:06 am

Lmao of course homophobia can't be justified, what's next, is racism justified? Hate the person for their beliefs, not where they shove their junk

User avatar
Picairn
Minister
 
Posts: 3267
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Picairn » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am

Disgraces wrote:Eye or hair color isn't a mental illness.

No, I'm not homophobic.

Did I hear a Freudian slip?
Picairn's Ministry of Foreign Relations
Minister: Edward H. Cornell
WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
Factbook | Constitution | Newspaper
Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Salus Maior wrote:Nothing we say here actually matters.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
Center-left liberal, or "neoliberal scum"
according to the far-left and far-right.
Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.

♔ The Empire of Picairn ♔
-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-—————————-✯ ✯ ✯ ✯ ✯-
✵ Certified brunch-loving liberal and resident optimist of NSG. All Hail Biden! ✵

User avatar
Chuukango
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 388
Founded: Mar 02, 2015
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Chuukango » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am

Picairn wrote:
Hjallvinter wrote:"How dare people have a discussion about slaughtering my sacred cows."

"How dare people stop me from spouting my bigoted beliefs!"

Can't say I think it's worth the effort to try and stop people in forums like these, especially the erh, not so subtle wind up jockeys like Mx. Hjallvinter. That's besides the point anyway, so I'll go back to enjoying my popcorn.
Last edited by Chuukango on Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Elparia's token gay disaster.

User avatar
Disgraces
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Apr 07, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Disgraces » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am

Palmyrion wrote:Just because they claim to be part of LGBT, doesn't mean they are. (And they will never be.)

Sounds familiar.

User avatar
Palmyrion
Minister
 
Posts: 2171
Founded: Mar 04, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Palmyrion » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am

Picairn wrote:
Palmyrion wrote:just overturn lawrence v texas and obergefell v hodges

No, you're a tyrant if you want to criminalize gay marriage.

What you call tyranny, we call moral uprightness. —Tradcons
Palmyrion is here to kick ass and chew bubblegum. And he's out of bubblegum.

PALMYRION: RESURGENT (Greater Dienstadi Canon) | Q&A Thread | 【PALMYRIAWAVE】
Diplomatic Outreach Programme | The Dozen Giants | Civilian Storefront | Military Storefront
HERE BE MY REAL-LIFE PERCEPTIONS AND BELIEFS. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

For those who are struggling right now, remember that you are not alone.

User avatar
Daarwyrth
Diplomat
 
Posts: 666
Founded: Jul 05, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Daarwyrth » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:07 am

Disgraces wrote:
Daarwyrth wrote:No, it's a good analogy. People are born gay, it's a characteristic of their nature. Someone who has blue eyes or brown hair can't change that fact (unless they literally mask it with coloured contacts or hair dye). Their eyes will always be blue and their hair will always be brown. Identically, gay people can't change their sexual orientation. They can mask it (which is extremely unhealthy) but they can't change it.

Eye or hair color isn't a mental illness.

No, I'm not homophobic.

Excuse me, mental illness? You call homosexuality a mental illness? And make the claim you're not homophobic? I guess you missed the memo about the WHO coming to their senses and scrapping homosexuality from the list of mental illnesses... sadly, I don't think there is any hope for you that you'll come to yours.
Last edited by Daarwyrth on Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Royal State of Daarwyrth

A large, influential state on the continent of Nordeia, where the monarch is considered to be the nation's centre of gravity.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarsted | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


User avatar
Hjallvinter
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 24
Founded: Feb 22, 2021
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Hjallvinter » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:08 am

Shazbotdom wrote:
Hjallvinter wrote:
-Pedophiles are tying themselves to the LGBT community
-N-no t-theyre not

K.


When all your links are loads of unprecedented bullshit...that kinda means that they are unprecedented bullshit.


I know that your argument is dependent on goalpost moving. People asked for instances of pedophiles tying themselves to LGBT. I provided. You say it's not good enough because you don't want it to be good enough.

"Oh, but they're unwanted..."

It doesn't change the fact that they are with you, using that movement as a pretext to push their own ends, which was the original crux of the argument that led into this discussion.

Sorry, but facts are facts.
Veritas Aequitas

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: A-Series-Of-Tubes, Baltenstein, Bing [Bot], Kilobugya, Miku the Based, Page, The Archregimancy, The Notorious Mad Jack, Vassenor

Advertisement

Remove ads