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American Politics IV: 1400 Reasons Why(A Stimulus Serial)

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Umeria
Diplomat
 
Posts: 910
Founded: Mar 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Umeria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:27 pm

Picairn wrote:
Umeria wrote:In terms of the relief bill, you can pass it through budget reconciliation with 51 votes. You literally don't have to compromise. Unless, of course, the people who you think are on your side actually aren't.

Congress can only pass 3 recon bills per year, and the Byrd rule restricts them down to addressing the budget spending only. After this package any other non-budgetary reform will need 10 Repub votes.

The pandemic is an urgent enough situation to justify the relief bill being one of those 3 imo.

San Lumen wrote:Give me your solution and what you’d do if you were governor for example.

How was he elected governor? Via a grassroots campaign or with corporate funding? If it's the latter then he has enormous pressure to act in the interest of those corporations instead of the people.
Ambassador Anthony Lockwood, at your service.
Author of GAR #389

"Umeria - We start with U"

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San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:28 pm

Umeria wrote:
Picairn wrote:Congress can only pass 3 recon bills per year, and the Byrd rule restricts them down to addressing the budget spending only. After this package any other non-budgetary reform will need 10 Repub votes.

The pandemic is an urgent enough situation to justify the relief bill being one of those 3 imo.

San Lumen wrote:Give me your solution and what you’d do if you were governor for example.

How was he elected governor? Via a grassroots campaign or with corporate funding? If it's the latter then he has enormous pressure to act in the interest of those corporations instead of the people.


No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

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Sundiata
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7110
Founded: Sep 27, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sundiata » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:29 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Sundiata wrote:I hate to say it but their odds are better, they might even push the Democrats further to the right as time goes on.


How do you come to that conclusion? If they can't make inroads on the coast and the Willamette valley they have no hope of winning the state legislature or statewide office.

Because if the Republicans try to become more like the Democrats then the voters will most likely just vote for the Democrats. By going further to the right, agree of disagree, they'll be giving the people of Oregon something to vote for.
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San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:29 pm

Sundiata wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
How do you come to that conclusion? If they can't make inroads on the coast and the Willamette valley they have no hope of winning the state legislature or statewide office.

Because if the Republicans try to become more like the Democrats then the voters will most likely just vote for the Democrats. By going further to the right, agree of disagree, they'll be giving the people of Oregon something to vote for.


Why would Democrats do that when the most populous area of the state is trending even further their way?

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Picairn
Senator
 
Posts: 3854
Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Picairn » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:30 pm

Umeria wrote:
Picairn wrote:Congress can only pass 3 recon bills per year, and the Byrd rule restricts them down to addressing the budget spending only. After this package any other non-budgetary reform will need 10 Repub votes.

The pandemic is an urgent enough situation to justify the relief bill being one of those 3 imo.

True but after this our luck is over.
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Umeria
Diplomat
 
Posts: 910
Founded: Mar 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Umeria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:35 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Umeria wrote:How was he elected governor? Via a grassroots campaign or with corporate funding? If it's the latter then he has enormous pressure to act in the interest of those corporations instead of the people.

No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

Then he won't get that funding next election cycle, meaning he'll be replaced by someone more obedient.
Ambassador Anthony Lockwood, at your service.
Author of GAR #389

"Umeria - We start with U"

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Sundiata
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7110
Founded: Sep 27, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sundiata » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:36 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Sundiata wrote:Because if the Republicans try to become more like the Democrats then the voters will most likely just vote for the Democrats. By going further to the right, agree of disagree, they'll be giving the people of Oregon something to vote for.


Why would Democrats do that when the most populous area of the state is trending even further their way?

Because their donors can't afford them to move further to the left. Generally speaking, that's not good for the interests of business.
Gender: Male
Religion: Catholic (Opus Dei)
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Economics: Rerum Novarum (The Encyclical)
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San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:36 pm

Umeria wrote:
San Lumen wrote:No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

Then he won't get that funding next election cycle, meaning he'll be replaced by someone more obedient.


There is something called a primary or general and the people can chose to keep that person who backstabbed the corporations.

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Dresderstan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6027
Founded: Jan 18, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dresderstan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:37 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Umeria wrote:The pandemic is an urgent enough situation to justify the relief bill being one of those 3 imo.


How was he elected governor? Via a grassroots campaign or with corporate funding? If it's the latter then he has enormous pressure to act in the interest of those corporations instead of the people.


No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

Politicians only act in the interest of their bourgeoisie buddies and and lobbyists, not the people.
22 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Anti-government revolutionary, one's terrorist is another's freedom fighter

Revolution for America
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and tries to strip away your constitutional rights.
Doesn't matter Democrat or Republican, both parties need to be abolished and their politicians arrested.

User avatar
San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:39 pm

Dresderstan wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

Politicians only act in the interest of their bourgeoisie buddies and and lobbyists, not the people.


Are you aware that even causes you support have lobbyists? or should we just get rid of it entirely?

You are generalizing to a ludicrous extent. Do you think politicians fall from the sky from another reality? people chose them in a primary and then elected them in a general election.

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Greater Miami Shores
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8979
Founded: Aug 06, 2010
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Greater Miami Shores » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:40 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Umeria wrote:The pandemic is an urgent enough situation to justify the relief bill being one of those 3 imo.


How was he elected governor? Via a grassroots campaign or with corporate funding? If it's the latter then he has enormous pressure to act in the interest of those corporations instead of the people.


No they don't. act in the interest of the people and backstab them if this not in the people best interest.

Both Republicans and Democrats don't always act in the interests of the people.
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Umeria
Diplomat
 
Posts: 910
Founded: Mar 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Umeria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:40 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Umeria wrote:Then he won't get that funding next election cycle, meaning he'll be replaced by someone more obedient.

There is something called a primary or general and the people can chose to keep that person who backstabbed the corporations.

So you agree that the only politicians who have the people's interests in mind are the ones not taking corporate money?
Ambassador Anthony Lockwood, at your service.
Author of GAR #389

"Umeria - We start with U"

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Dresderstan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6027
Founded: Jan 18, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dresderstan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:40 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Politicians only act in the interest of their bourgeoisie buddies and and lobbyists, not the people.


Are you aware that even causes you support have lobbyists? or should we just get rid of it entirely?

You are generalizing to a ludicrous extent. Do you think politicians fall from the sky from another reality? people chose them in a primary and then elected them in a general election.

Yes.

You're just mad that it's true, corruption, lobbying, cronyism, it is the lifeblood of the so called "democratic" system you continue to defend, there go defending the same corrupt politicians you despise.
22 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Anti-government revolutionary, one's terrorist is another's freedom fighter

Revolution for America
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and tries to strip away your constitutional rights.
Doesn't matter Democrat or Republican, both parties need to be abolished and their politicians arrested.

User avatar
San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:43 pm

Dresderstan wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
Are you aware that even causes you support have lobbyists? or should we just get rid of it entirely?

You are generalizing to a ludicrous extent. Do you think politicians fall from the sky from another reality? people chose them in a primary and then elected them in a general election.

Yes.

You're just mad that it's true, corruption, lobbying, cronyism, it is the lifeblood of the so called "democratic" system you continue to defend, there go defending the same corrupt politicians you despise.


even environmental, conservation, civil rights and voting rights groups shouldnt have lobbyists?

No it isn't. Is their corruption? Yes I won't deny it but its not everyone. You dont like whose in power chose new people.
Last edited by San Lumen on Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Dresderstan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6027
Founded: Jan 18, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dresderstan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:46 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Yes.

You're just mad that it's true, corruption, lobbying, cronyism, it is the lifeblood of the so called "democratic" system you continue to defend, there go defending the same corrupt politicians you despise.


even environmental, conservation, civil rights and voting rights groups shouldnt have lobbyists?

No it isn't. Is their corruption? Yes I won't deny it but its not everyone. You dont like whose in power chose new people.

Yes, get action done without the lobbyists or red tape getting in the way of actual progress.

No I want them gone through actual action and force, I want them out the same way we pushed the fucking British out.
22 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Anti-government revolutionary, one's terrorist is another's freedom fighter

Revolution for America
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and tries to strip away your constitutional rights.
Doesn't matter Democrat or Republican, both parties need to be abolished and their politicians arrested.

User avatar
Umeria
Diplomat
 
Posts: 910
Founded: Mar 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Umeria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:47 pm

San Lumen wrote:No it isn't. Is their corruption? Yes I won't deny it but its not everyone. You dont like whose in power chose new people.

It sounds like you're in favor of electing politicians who don't take corporate money, aka getting money out of politics. Is that correct?
Ambassador Anthony Lockwood, at your service.
Author of GAR #389

"Umeria - We start with U"

User avatar
San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:48 pm

Dresderstan wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
even environmental, conservation, civil rights and voting rights groups shouldnt have lobbyists?

No it isn't. Is their corruption? Yes I won't deny it but its not everyone. You dont like whose in power chose new people.

Yes, get action done without the lobbyists or red tape getting in the way of actual progress.

No I want them gone through actual action and force, I want them out the same way we pushed the fucking British out.


You are aware of the good things groups like the NAACP, ACLU, World Wildlife Fund and NARAL have done correct?

a insurrection then? Is that what your advocating for? Like what happened in DC?
Last edited by San Lumen on Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Dresderstan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6027
Founded: Jan 18, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dresderstan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:53 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Yes, get action done without the lobbyists or red tape getting in the way of actual progress.

No I want them gone through actual action and force, I want them out the same way we pushed the fucking British out.


You are aware of the good things groups like the NAACP, ACLU, World Wildlife Fund and NARAL have done correct?

a insurrection then? Is that what your advocating for? Like what happened in DC?

And nothing has actually been done, words mean nothing, action does.

Revolution, one of the people for the people by the people.
22 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Anti-government revolutionary, one's terrorist is another's freedom fighter

Revolution for America
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and tries to strip away your constitutional rights.
Doesn't matter Democrat or Republican, both parties need to be abolished and their politicians arrested.

User avatar
Sundiata
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7110
Founded: Sep 27, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sundiata » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:54 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Yes, get action done without the lobbyists or red tape getting in the way of actual progress.

No I want them gone through actual action and force, I want them out the same way we pushed the fucking British out.


You are aware of the good things groups like the NAACP, ACLU, World Wildlife Fund and NARAL have done correct?

a insurrection then? Is that what your advocating for? Like what happened in DC?
You believe that corporations should be allowed to lobby politicians?
Gender: Male
Religion: Catholic (Opus Dei)
Politics: Solidarity (Catholic Social Teaching)
Economics: Rerum Novarum (The Encyclical)
Alignment: Lawful Good

"Don't say, 'That person bothers me.' Think: 'That person sanctifies me.'"
-St. Josemaria Escriva (Founder of Opus Dei)

User avatar
San Lumen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58925
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:55 pm

Umeria wrote:
San Lumen wrote:No it isn't. Is their corruption? Yes I won't deny it but its not everyone. You dont like whose in power chose new people.

It sounds like you're in favor of electing politicians who don't take corporate money, aka getting money out of politics. Is that correct?


Yes.
Sundiata wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
You are aware of the good things groups like the NAACP, ACLU, World Wildlife Fund and NARAL have done correct?

a insurrection then? Is that what your advocating for? Like what happened in DC?
You believe that corporations should be allowed to lobby politicians?

Groups like the ones I mentioned arent corporations.

User avatar
Novokria
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 111
Founded: Feb 17, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Novokria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:07 pm

Dear Americans


Please get your embassy out of Ukraine and take Zelensky and his fellow Multiculturalists with you.
America & Russia are two sides of the same poisonous coin

Zelensky is just another puppet of the Satanic American Imperialist Government

America is like the Cookie Monster but with Oil not Cookies

Svoboda, Ultra-Nationalism, Orthodox Christianity, Azov, Stepan Bandera, Latvia, Lithuania and Ukraine
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Sundiata
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7110
Founded: Sep 27, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sundiata » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:07 pm

San Lumen wrote:Groups like the ones I mentioned arent corporations.

So in your book, because non-profit entities lobby politicians corporations should also be allowed to lobby politicians?

Should corporations be allowed to lobby politicians or not? Please give me a straight answer.
Gender: Male
Religion: Catholic (Opus Dei)
Politics: Solidarity (Catholic Social Teaching)
Economics: Rerum Novarum (The Encyclical)
Alignment: Lawful Good

"Don't say, 'That person bothers me.' Think: 'That person sanctifies me.'"
-St. Josemaria Escriva (Founder of Opus Dei)

User avatar
Umeria
Diplomat
 
Posts: 910
Founded: Mar 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Umeria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:11 pm

Sundiata wrote:
San Lumen wrote:Groups like the ones I mentioned arent corporations.

So in your book, because non-profit entities lobby politicians corporations should also be allowed to lobby politicians?

Should corporations be allowed to lobby politicians or not? Please give me a straight answer.

Well Lumen said yes to getting money out of politics, and prohibiting corporate lobbying is a necessary part of that.
Ambassador Anthony Lockwood, at your service.
Author of GAR #389

"Umeria - We start with U"

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 40352
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:11 pm

Novokria wrote:Dear Americans


Please get your embassy out of Ukraine and take Zelensky and his fellow Multiculturalists with you.

No. Deal with it.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Novokria
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 111
Founded: Feb 17, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Novokria » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:12 pm

New haven america wrote:
Novokria wrote:Dear Americans


Please get your embassy out of Ukraine and take Zelensky and his fellow Multiculturalists with you.

No. Deal with it.

Take your lost property back now
America & Russia are two sides of the same poisonous coin

Zelensky is just another puppet of the Satanic American Imperialist Government

America is like the Cookie Monster but with Oil not Cookies

Svoboda, Ultra-Nationalism, Orthodox Christianity, Azov, Stepan Bandera, Latvia, Lithuania and Ukraine
Russia, Zelensky, Poland, Islam, Judaism, Communism, America, Multiculturalism, Democracy, Gay Marriage and Germany

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