French government denounces American Woke Left

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

Excellent. Yet more division among liberal democracies as China grows stronger and stronger by the day.

It's almost as though these people want to see the downfall of the democratic world order.

Ah yes, the fresh smell the manure of conspiracies.

Not really. It’s not the China abolition thread though.

[Ostroeuropa]

I'd guess that's code for- "This is annoying. It is diverting policy away from issues that I agree with."

The rest are legitimate questions, still IMO it's better than leaving the problem unaddressed.

People having to use foodbanks more, the shite situation Brexit has caused (especially for NI), and the terrible uncertain policies over the pandemic, vs these stupid woke policies that are to distract the public of the Tory Government utter failure of the UK.
I wonder which affects people more, and which deserves the actual help of the National Government.

Okay celrit, let me pose you a hypothetical.

You have two parties running in a district with 90% Native Americans.

The republicans have cottoned on to some concerns that allow them to say;

"We're not going to do anything about the poverty. Might even make it worse. But we promise to basically leave your culture alone.".

Meanwhile, the democrats, high on the smell of their own farts, are telling the native americans that they need to radically change their culture and have parts of it destroyed, engaging in revisionism in their understanding of native culture and so on, but also say "But, you'll get a paycheck.".

Which do you think will win.

Take your time.


"Well they're voting against their own interests because they're thick.".

[Celritannia]

I seem to remember the Nazi Party actually leading the governing coalition majority, and President Hindenburg having to appoint Hitler as Chancellor. But you now, facts.

I seem to remember the existence of the SA. Nazi Party had a huge paramilitary organization. They did murder people and then took power.

And that lead to Hitler being arrested, and showed the failure of violence in the streets by the Nazis.
So they turned to legitimate means of gaining power.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

'Move along, nothing to see here, return to your homes, don't draw any more attention to our suppression of free speech'



Free speech could be added to it, a bit like Article 10 of the Human Rights Act except actually being worth the paper it's written on.

This isn't about free speech, it's about the freedom to attack people willingly.
Universities are a place for learning and understanding facts. Tell me, are conspiracy theories facts?

Freedom to attack people willingly is a part of freedom of speech.

As I said before, ideas are to be debated as long as the environment itself is anti-authoritarian. To create an anti-authoritarian environment stuff such as random protests need to be encouraged while violence needs to be absolutely banned.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

I seem to remember the existence of the SA. Nazi Party had a huge paramilitary organization. They did murder people and then took power.

And that lead to Hitler being arrested, and showed the failure of violence in the streets by the Nazis.
So they turned to legitimate means of gaining power.

Implying that SA thugs did not paralyze Germany before Nazis took power. Elections where SA, Rotfront and other paramilitaries roamed the streets were hardly free.

[Celritannia]

People having to use foodbanks more, the shite situation Brexit has caused (especially for NI), and the terrible uncertain policies over the pandemic, vs these stupid woke policies that are to distract the public of the Tory Government utter failure of the UK.
I wonder which affects people more, and which deserves the actual help of the National Government.

Okay celrit, let me pose you a hypothetical.

You have two parties running in a district with 90% Native Americans.

The republicans have cottoned on to some concerns that allow them to say;

"We're not going to do anything about the poverty. Might even make it worse. But we promise to basically leave your culture alone.".

Meanwhile, the democrats, high on the smell of their own farts, are telling the native americans that they need to radically change their culture and have parts of it destroyed, engaging in revisionism in their understanding of native culture and so on, but also say "But, you'll get a paycheck.".

Which do you think will win.

Take your time.


"Well they're voting against their own interests because they're thick.".

This hypothetical is laughable, and would unlikely happen, so I am not even going to give it any thought.

[Ostroeuropa]

Okay celrit, let me pose you a hypothetical.

You have two parties running in a district with 90% Native Americans.

The republicans have cottoned on to some concerns that allow them to say;

"We're not going to do anything about the poverty. Might even make it worse. But we promise to basically leave your culture alone.".

Meanwhile, the democrats, high on the smell of their own farts, are telling the native americans that they need to radically change their culture and have parts of it destroyed, engaging in revisionism in their understanding of native culture and so on, but also say "But, you'll get a paycheck.".

Which do you think will win.

Take your time.


"Well they're voting against their own interests because they're thick.".

This hypothetical is laughable, and would unlikely happen, so I am not even going to give it any thought.

The point sailed over your head it seems.

[Celritannia]

And that lead to Hitler being arrested, and showed the failure of violence in the streets by the Nazis.
So they turned to legitimate means of gaining power.

Implying that SA thugs did not paralyze Germany before Nazis took power.

Someone needs to brush up on the history of inter-war Germany.

The SA were not even placed all over Germany at that point.

[Celritannia]

This hypothetical is laughable, and would unlikely happen, so I am not even going to give it any thought.

The point sailed over your head it seems.

No, it didn't because this could not happen. A hypothetical has to at least be believable.

[Ostroeuropa]

The point sailed over your head it seems.

No, it didn't because this could not happen. A hypothetical has to at least be believable.

Why could it not happen? Why do you find this example unbelievable?

And are you aware that this is basically what actually happened in a lot of cases?

Americanization policies usually came hand in hand with the equivalent of anti-poverty measures for that time period.

The lack of americanization policies usually resulted in "Okay, so, we're cutting the welfare too.".

[Celritannia]

No, it didn't because this could not happen. A hypothetical has to at least be believable.

Why could it not happen? Why do you find this example unbelievable?

And are you aware that this is basically what actually happened in a lot of cases?

Then why not link an actual case?

[Ostroeuropa]

Why could it not happen? Why do you find this example unbelievable?

And are you aware that this is basically what actually happened in a lot of cases?

Then why not link an actual case?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Because it's racism celrit.

And yet it's the progressive lefts immediate go-to canard when people bring up cultural concerns with their policies.

[Celritannia]

Then why not link an actual case?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Alright, do you have one more recent? Because there are a lot of problems with this, including how the republicans at the time of these boarding schools were the democrats, and the democrats were the republicans.

"white people" do not have to be one race though. White people have the ability to know their history, culture, and nationality.
Black people of the US do not. They had to join together due to being forced to the US via slavery.
Even the Natives of the US were forced onto reservations in an attempt to place them in one category and forget their individual identities.

[Ostroeuropa]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Alright, do you have one more recent? Because there are a lot of problems with this, including how the republicans at the time of these boarding schools were the democrats, and the democrats were the republicans.

Why does that matter at all dude, you're fixated with the labels here rather than bothering to engage the actual point.

I do have a more recent example, but not for native americans. The more recent examples are for whites and europeans.

That's the point being made.

So again;

If you walked up to a native american and said "Why are you voting against your own interests and supporting this nonsense cultural preservation stuff instead of voting for a pay rise for your job at mcdonalds", how many native americans do you think you'd have to ask that to before one punched you?

[Celritannia]

Alright, do you have one more recent? Because there are a lot of problems with this, including how the republicans at the time of these boarding schools were the democrats, and the democrats were the republicans.

Why does that matter at all dude, you're fixated with the labels here rather than bothering to engage the actual point.

I do have a more recent example, but not for native americans. The more recent examples are for whites and europeans.

That's the point being made.

So again;

If you walked up to a native american and said "Why are you voting against your own interests and supporting this nonsense cultural preservation stuff instead of voting for a pay rise for your job at mcdonalds", how many native americans do you think you'd have to ask that to before one punched you?

Good thing I would not ask them that.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Alright, do you have one more recent? Because there are a lot of problems with this, including how the republicans at the time of these boarding schools were the democrats, and the democrats were the republicans.

"white people" do not have to be one race though. White people have the ability to know their history, culture, and nationality.
Black people of the US do not. They had to join together due to being forced to the US via slavery.
Even the Natives of the US were forced onto reservations in an attempt to place them in one category and forget their individual identities.

Guess what? Let’s universally suppress tribal identities.

[Celritannia]

Alright, do you have one more recent? Because there are a lot of problems with this, including how the republicans at the time of these boarding schools were the democrats, and the democrats were the republicans.

"white people" do not have to be one race though. White people have the ability to know their history, culture, and nationality.
Black people of the US do not. They had to join together due to being forced to the US via slavery.
Even the Natives of the US were forced onto reservations in an attempt to place them in one category and forget their individual identities.

Guess what? Let’s universally suppress tribal identities.

Terrible idea.
But that depends what those Native nations want too.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

Guess what? Let’s universally suppress tribal identities.

Terrible idea.

Terrible for authoritarians of all kinds..precisely what I want.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

Then why not link an actual case?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Because it's racism celrit.

And yet it's the progressive lefts immediate go-to canard when people bring up cultural concerns with their policies.

That’s precisely the most serious bug in SJ. Traditionalism is allowed to live and expand if it is not European.

[Celritannia]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_ ... ng_schools

"Oh boy, they sure are lacking an education... We can fix that.".

I think you're being purposefully obstinate instead of actually engaging the point because you might be dimly aware of how ridiculous you sound when you try and argue that purely materialistic concerns trump cultural concerns. You only get away with it when talking about white people, you wouldn't dare do it for another race.

Because it's racism celrit.

And yet it's the progressive lefts immediate go-to canard when people bring up cultural concerns with their policies.

That’s precisely the most serious bug in SJ. Traditionalism is allowed to live and expand if it is not European.

That's a very hard claim to argue.

There are many people who are proud of their European identities.
I'm proud to be both British and a Yorkshireman.

[Odreria]

Terrible idea.

Terrible for authoritarians of all kinds..precisely what I want.

One could probably build a decently functioning country by taking whatever Neko says and doing the opposite

[Celritannia]

Terrible for authoritarians of all kinds..precisely what I want.

One could probably build a decently functioning country by taking whatever Neko says and doing the opposite

I leave that task to you.

[Washington Resistance Army]

That’s precisely the most serious bug in SJ. Traditionalism is allowed to live and expand if it is not European.

That's a very hard claim to argue.

There are many people who are proud of their European identities.
I'm proud to be both British and a Yorkshireman.

Sure but that's not traditionalism. Traditionalism is extreme conservatism, think of Traditional Catholics as an example, and Neko is right that western liberals are willing to tolerate those beliefs as long as they're aren't held by white people. See people like Vass rushing to defend hardline Islamists against criticism for example even though not a small amount of those people view Vass as an abomination against God that should be tossed off a roof.

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

Guess what? Let’s universally suppress tribal identities.

Terrible idea.
But that depends what those Native nations want too.

Or maybe let’s use individualistic terms: what do individual Native Americans want?

[Nekostan-e Gharbi]

Terrible for authoritarians of all kinds..precisely what I want.

One could probably build a decently functioning country by taking whatever Neko says and doing the opposite

Not really.

Thanks for revealing yourself as an authoritarian though.