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Iranian response to the One State Solution

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Greater Cesnica
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Postby Greater Cesnica » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:09 am

Glorious Hong Kong wrote:Anyway, this thread is about Iran's hypothetical response to Israel's de facto annihilation by BDS and I hesitate to veer into a general discussion of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict without possibly raising the ire of the mods so I think it's best if we all get back on track.

You don't get to spew inflammatory stuff and then "veer" us back onto topic. You started this.

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Insaanistan
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Postby Insaanistan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:14 am

Glorious Hong Kong wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:
What I want is for all the land to go back to Palestine. But I know that’s impossible, and that the best solution is Israel is forced to demolish it’s illegal West Bank settlements while it and Egypt end the Gaza blockade and Israel stops bombing it just because. Also, Jerusalem recognized as the capitol of Palestine.


And I've already explained why that isn't a good idea. A one state solution is a bad idea and a red line for Israel. A two-state solution, while certainly ideal, has proven exceedingly difficult to put into practice.

Major-Tom wrote:
I'm pretty Pro-Israel and certainly think that they have an existential right to exist and that they should defend themselves from all threats. But your what-aboutism is not constructive.

Just as one can launch into a tirade about the actions of Palestinians, one can do the same about the Israelis. There are bad actors and malicious groups on both sides, it is one of the rare situations where you can say "both sides" in good faith. What we also have to recognize is that most Palestinians are good and noble people against increased violence, the same way that most Israeli Jews are good and noble folk who have the same goal of peace.

Creating blanket statements about the populace of either Palestine or Israel is not constructive, rather, the focus should be on how we criticize (rightfully) groups like Hamas and Fatah, but also the militant, far-right-wing absolutists on the Israeli side. Netanyahu has done nothing to improve the chances of peace in the region either.


It doesn't matter who the Israeli PM is. I don't see an easy way out either for Jerusalem. Left-wing Labor tried to be generous and Israel got burned so badly during the Second Intifada and the multiple wars with Hamas-ruled Gaza that nobody's willing to risk their lives for the sake of peace at this point. Labor is now viewed as being overly dovish and has practically wiped itself out as a domestic political force. There's simply too much at stake.

As for the Palestinians, communist and Islamist terror groups enjoy an outsize presence in the Territories and Mahmoud Abbas certainly isn't helping to calm the situation down with the PA's terror-riddled textbooks and children's television programs urging kids to "commit martyrdom". People literally celebrate in the streets whenever one of their own mounts a terror attack and is killed in the process. They use the funerals of dead terrorists to dishonestly portray themselves as the victims of Israeli "aggression" and incite further antisemitic violence against Israelis. Streets and schools are named after prominent terrorists in Palestinian history such as Leila Khaled. Imagine if Pennsylvania Avenue was renamed to Adolf Hitler Avenue with the explicit blessing of the White House and Congress. Just imagine.

Israelis, for the most part, value human life way more than Palestinians do. They are willing to fight tooth and nail just to rescue just one of their soldiers in exchange for the release of thousands of Palestinian terrorists, some of whom have been caught feigning hunger strikes in order to elicit undeserved international sympathy. They are the exact opposite of a genocidal fascist regime. Hamas, by contrast, is a literal death cult and it was the Palestinian people who voted them in.

Not all Palestinians endorse terror and genocide, but terror groups have to enjoy a not-insignificant amount of popular support in order to remain relevant. Hamas was elected by the Palestinians in a democratic process. The Palestinians are as much to blame for the rise of Hamas as the German people were to blame for the rise of the Nazis at the time.

Having read the intro to the wiki article for Black September, I'm even more convinced than ever that the Palestinians simply don't deserve a state. They have proven themselves incapable of governing themselves peacefully and responsibly and coexisting with their neighbors, both Arab and Jewish alike, without launching deadly terror attacks against Israeli and Jordanian citizens. It's small wonder many Arab countries have turned their backs on them and Israel is formally at peace with both Jordan and Egypt.

I would be pleasantly surprised if none of that was the case and a Palestinian state in the West Bank turns out to be entirely peaceful and democratic. In that case, so much the better for Israelis and Palestinians alike now that we can finally see a two-state solution and pave the way for a lasting peace agreement that both sides are happy with.

Tokora wrote:Israel already has Arab citizens so I don't see how giving rights to the rest of them and amending their constitution to make any attempts of genocide illegal. We can learn from Germany's mistakes can't we? I personally believe that it's possible for two groups of people to coexist without murdering each other.


I agree. No one should have to murder one another just to survive. I don't think we as a species are quite there yet. And Arab-Israelis (often misleadingly termed Palestinian-Israelis by AJE and other fake news sources) are equal before the law in Israel.

Anyway, this thread is about Iran's hypothetical response to Israel's de facto annihilation by BDS and I hesitate to veer into a general discussion of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict without possibly raising the ire of the mods so I think it's best if we all get back on track.


There are Palestinian terrorists for the same reason the IRA exists.
Last edited by Insaanistan on Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Suwhoigro
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Postby Suwhoigro » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:36 am

:unsure: :unsure: :arrow: :?:

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Echo Chamber Thought Police
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Postby Echo Chamber Thought Police » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:36 am


You don't need to tell us that. Reports are an internal matter for moderation and bringing them up on NSG could be considered gloating.
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RedSovietComrade
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Postby RedSovietComrade » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:41 am

Insaanistan wrote:
Glorious Hong Kong wrote:
And I've already explained why that isn't a good idea. A one state solution is a bad idea and a red line for Israel. A two-state solution, while certainly ideal, has proven exceedingly difficult to put into practice.



It doesn't matter who the Israeli PM is. I don't see an easy way out either for Jerusalem. Left-wing Labor tried to be generous and Israel got burned so badly during the Second Intifada and the multiple wars with Hamas-ruled Gaza that nobody's willing to risk their lives for the sake of peace at this point. Labor is now viewed as being overly dovish and has practically wiped itself out as a domestic political force. There's simply too much at stake.

As for the Palestinians, communist and Islamist terror groups enjoy an outsize presence in the Territories and Mahmoud Abbas certainly isn't helping to calm the situation down with the PA's terror-riddled textbooks and children's television programs urging kids to "commit martyrdom". People literally celebrate in the streets whenever one of their own mounts a terror attack and is killed in the process. They use the funerals of dead terrorists to dishonestly portray themselves as the victims of Israeli "aggression" and incite further antisemitic violence against Israelis. Streets and schools are named after prominent terrorists in Palestinian history such as Leila Khaled. Imagine if Pennsylvania Avenue was renamed to Adolf Hitler Avenue with the explicit blessing of the White House and Congress. Just imagine.

Israelis, for the most part, value human life way more than Palestinians do. They are willing to fight tooth and nail just to rescue just one of their soldiers in exchange for the release of thousands of Palestinian terrorists, some of whom have been caught feigning hunger strikes in order to elicit undeserved international sympathy. They are the exact opposite of a genocidal fascist regime. Hamas, by contrast, is a literal death cult and it was the Palestinian people who voted them in.

Not all Palestinians endorse terror and genocide, but terror groups have to enjoy a not-insignificant amount of popular support in order to remain relevant. Hamas was elected by the Palestinians in a democratic process. The Palestinians are as much to blame for the rise of Hamas as the German people were to blame for the rise of the Nazis at the time.

Having read the intro to the wiki article for Black September, I'm even more convinced than ever that the Palestinians simply don't deserve a state. They have proven themselves incapable of governing themselves peacefully and responsibly and coexisting with their neighbors, both Arab and Jewish alike, without launching deadly terror attacks against Israeli and Jordanian citizens. It's small wonder many Arab countries have turned their backs on them and Israel is formally at peace with both Jordan and Egypt.

I would be pleasantly surprised if none of that was the case and a Palestinian state in the West Bank turns out to be entirely peaceful and democratic. In that case, so much the better for Israelis and Palestinians alike now that we can finally see a two-state solution and pave the way for a lasting peace agreement that both sides are happy with.



I agree. No one should have to murder one another just to survive. I don't think we as a species are quite there yet. And Arab-Israelis (often misleadingly termed Palestinian-Israelis by AJE and other fake news sources) are equal before the law in Israel.

Anyway, this thread is about Iran's hypothetical response to Israel's de facto annihilation by BDS and I hesitate to veer into a general discussion of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict without possibly raising the ire of the mods so I think it's best if we all get back on track.


There are Palestinian terrorists for the same reason the IRA exists.

I do belive isrial should not have the land but they cant just give it back though israil the only reason it exist is because of amercia the zionist did terrtist attcks on the british who owned it and when un made a council practialley bribed them

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Greater Cesnica
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Postby Greater Cesnica » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:44 am

Echo Chamber Thought Police wrote:
Greater Cesnica wrote:[snip]

You don't need to tell us that. Reports are an internal matter for moderation and bringing them up on NSG could be considered gloating.

Ah, I'll snip it.
Last edited by Greater Cesnica on Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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-Ocelot-
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Postby -Ocelot- » Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:28 pm

Tokora wrote:Short question, what would Iran's response be to the One-State Solution? On the one hand, if Palestinians were given Israeli citizenship and treated as equals then Iran no longer have any ideological reason to continue hostilities. On the other hand, it's possible that Iran has invested too much into the rivalry and needs an enemy to focus outward on and that a united Israel could be a threat to their sphere of influence. What would Iran's response be?

I've tried checking to see if Iran has an official response to the idea but I couldn't find anything regarding Tehran's opinion on the idea at all.


Iran's government wants the Jewish people dead. The only solution they believe in is one where all the Jews in the region are murdered or driven away.

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Insaanistan
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Postby Insaanistan » Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:30 pm

-Ocelot- wrote:
Tokora wrote:Short question, what would Iran's response be to the One-State Solution? On the one hand, if Palestinians were given Israeli citizenship and treated as equals then Iran no longer have any ideological reason to continue hostilities. On the other hand, it's possible that Iran has invested too much into the rivalry and needs an enemy to focus outward on and that a united Israel could be a threat to their sphere of influence. What would Iran's response be?

I've tried checking to see if Iran has an official response to the idea but I couldn't find anything regarding Tehran's opinion on the idea at all.


Iran's government wants the Jewish people dead. The only solution they believe in is one where all the Jews in the region are murdered or driven away.

Uhhhhh...
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته-Peace be with you!
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:54 pm

It happens to what the American wants. Wherever there is political Islam, there is America.
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Greater Cesnica
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Postby Greater Cesnica » Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:56 pm

-Ocelot- wrote:
Tokora wrote:Short question, what would Iran's response be to the One-State Solution? On the one hand, if Palestinians were given Israeli citizenship and treated as equals then Iran no longer have any ideological reason to continue hostilities. On the other hand, it's possible that Iran has invested too much into the rivalry and needs an enemy to focus outward on and that a united Israel could be a threat to their sphere of influence. What would Iran's response be?

I've tried checking to see if Iran has an official response to the idea but I couldn't find anything regarding Tehran's opinion on the idea at all.


Iran's government wants the Jewish people dead. The only solution they believe in is one where all the Jews in the region are murdered or driven away.

Sure, and I'm Rick James.

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Tokora
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Postby Tokora » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:54 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:It happens to what the American wants. Wherever there is political Islam, there is America.

Can you rephrase that because I'm not catching what you're trying to say.

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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:57 pm

Tokora wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:It happens to what the American wants. Wherever there is political Islam, there is America.

Can you rephrase that because I'm not catching what you're trying to say.
Political Islam policies coincide with America. An imperialist developed country needs immaturity. Political Islam is the ideology that feeds this argument the most, so the Israeli attitude of Iran will be the way America wants.
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Tokora
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Postby Tokora » Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:57 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Tokora wrote:Can you rephrase that because I'm not catching what you're trying to say.
Political Islam policies coincide with America. An imperialist developed country needs immaturity. Political Islam is the ideology that feeds this argument the most, so the Israeli attitude of Iran will be the way America wants.

Can somebody translate this because I think he's talking about imperialism but I'm not understanding what he's trying to say.

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