American Politics Impeachment: 2 fast? No, we're 2 furious

[Neutraligon]

I have a question for those who are saying that impeaching and removing Trump from office will just cause more violence, are you ok with using that excuse when it comes to Muslim extremists, like those who took issue with those cartoons?

[The Alma Mater]

Except their death tolls are far lower than the US. The UK, which has the highest death toll out of all countries in Europe, has 83k deaths as of January 13, 2021. That's not even half the US' deaths, which sit at nearly 390k. https://www.statista.com/statistics/109 ... y-country/


We blame Trump for his inept preparations for the virus and his neglect that leads to over 300k American deaths. This mantra of "Don't blame Trump for the virus" is so boring and tiresome, it has been debunked repeatedly but some people still won't get it.

Oh and in absolute numbers, the US still ranks first in Covid deaths.

You need to go by per-capita rates. The USA also has a much bigger population than Belgium or the UK.

But a much smaller population density. Which means that it should have been *easier* for the USA to get things under control.

[The Alma Mater]

Who will you blame in a couple weeks when Biden is in charge if people keep dying? Trump is not God (despite what a few enthusiastic people might believe).

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

And they will try to impeach him for that on january 21st.
I am not kidding.

[Comerciante]

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

And they will try to impeach him for that on january 21st.
I am not kidding.

Of course, nothing good ever happens on my birthday...

[Bombadil]

You need to go by per-capita rates. The USA also has a much bigger population than Belgium or the UK.

But a much smaller population density. Which means that it should have been *easier* for the USA to get things under control.

..and the US is catching up anyway, take the last 7 days and of the countries mentioned only the UK is worse.

[Bombadil]

And they will try to impeach him for that on january 21st.
I am not kidding.

Of course, nothing good ever happens on my birthday...

Given how much he's come up recently.. George Orwell died on the 21st January.. you bastard!

[The Alma Mater]

Yeah, there's no saving the Republican voter base: GOP voters choose Trump. However, Trump does poorly enough with "traditional Republicans" that while it would be enough for him to win the nomination in 2024, they wouldn't be enough to carry him to victory, especially since Independents support his removal and oppose him as a nominee.

Yet, while Republicans appear united, it's the Trump Type Republicans that are very united: Just 1% of Trump Republicans — versus about one-in-four traditional Republicans — think Trump should be removed from office. The Trump Republicans are still large enough of a group to either stay and dominate primary politics or walk away if Trump is cast out, which would weaken the GOP's force posture against Democrats.

That said, I still think McConnell and others will take the short term pain over the long term gains they can make.

Removing Trump after the 20th you mean, so he can never run again ?

A pity that that would still make him an ex-president with all the associated rights and benefits - to be denied those you need to be removed before your term ends.

[Eahland]

Removing Trump after the 20th you mean, so he can never run again ?

A pity that that would still make him an ex-president with all the associated rights and benefits - to be denied those you need to be removed before your term ends.

Those aren't Constitutionally guaranteed, and can be removed by simple majority vote in Congress. And the Democrats will shortly control both houses and the Presidency.

[Freiheit Reich]

Who will you blame in a couple weeks when Biden is in charge if people keep dying? Trump is not God (despite what a few enthusiastic people might believe).

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

The only things that Trump failed to do is to encourage people to wash their hands more, social distance, reduce visits to elderly people, and establish a national health care program. Many (including me) are afraid to go to hospitals in the USA due to high costs which means people will delay or not get treatment and show up to work until they physically are passing out. He should have been more like Dr. Ron Paul and admit the virus was serious (Dr. Paul mentioned that it killed people) but that people should be allowed to make choices after having the facts. I believe Trump wanted to show that he was cool under fire and tough. He is an old-school leader that doesn't believe in showing softness or fear because that could be implied as weakness.

Many companies lack sick days at work, so if workers feel sick, they still go. One place I worked at required a doctor's note to get a sick day so I usually showed up when sick (even when I could barely speak). If I am forced to leave my home anyways, I might as well get paid for it instead of paying to see a doctor and not getting my work pay. I would be happy to call in and not get paid but the issue is having to leave home and go to a doctor when bed rest and cold & flu medicine are sometimes enough. These dumb policies encourage people to spread diseases (and this is a worldwide situation). Trump is not to blame for dumb policies like this.

[Kowani]

Biden will not be taking Amtrak into his inaugeration

[The Reformed American Republic]

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

The only things that Trump failed to do is to encourage people to wash their hands more, social distance, reduce visits to elderly people, and establish a national health care program. Many (including me) are afraid to go to hospitals in the USA due to high costs which means people will delay or not get treatment and show up to work until they physically are passing out. He should have been more like Dr. Ron Paul and admit the virus was serious (Dr. Paul mentioned that it killed people) but that people should be allowed to make choices after having the facts. I believe Trump wanted to show that he was cool under fire and tough. He is an old-school leader that doesn't believe in showing softness or fear because that could be implied as weakness.

Many companies lack sick days at work, so if workers feel sick, they still go. One place I worked at required a doctor's note to get a sick day so I usually showed up when sick (even when I could barely speak). If I am forced to leave my home anyways, I might as well get paid for it instead of paying to see a doctor and not getting my work pay. I would be happy to call in and not get paid but the issue is having to leave home and go to a doctor when bed rest and cold & flu medicine are sometimes enough. These dumb policies encourage people to spread diseases (and this is a worldwide situation). Trump is not to blame for dumb policies like this.

People like him deregulate and allow companies to set such policies.

[Salus Maior]

Biden will not be taking Amtrak into his inaugeration

...Ok?

Why does that matter?

[Comerciante]

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

The only things that Trump failed to do is to encourage people to wash their hands more, social distance, reduce visits to elderly people, and establish a national health care program. Many (including me) are afraid to go to hospitals in the USA due to high costs which means people will delay or not get treatment and show up to work until they physically are passing out. He should have been more like Dr. Ron Paul and admit the virus was serious (Dr. Paul mentioned that it killed people) but that people should be allowed to make choices after having the facts. I believe Trump wanted to show that he was cool under fire and tough. He is an old-school leader that doesn't believe in showing softness or fear because that could be implied as weakness.

So in other words he's a relic from another era that has no business running a modern nation and failed to do the bare minimum to keep people safe?

Boy, who could have seen that coming?

[Omniabstracta]

Biden will not be taking Amtrak into his inaugeration

...Ok?

Why does that matter?

It would’ve been a nice start to his term in terms of raising attention for issues like infrastructure and public transport, but not too important in the grand scheme I suppose.

[Bombadil]

...Ok?

Why does that matter?

It would’ve been a nice start to his term in terms of raising attention for issues like infrastructure and public transport, but not too important in the grand scheme I suppose.

He's known for generally traveling to and from Washington by train, he likes trains, he still likes trains..

[Cannot think of a name]

A week before Biden is sworn in and he's already criticized for not genie blinking away a year of Trump's incompetent and destructive response to the pandemic.

The only things that Trump failed to do is to encourage people to wash their hands more, social distance, reduce visits to elderly people, and establish a national health care program.

Also made masks a political issue when it wasn't needed. And congratulations, all Trump failed to do was all the things that would have mitigated the severity of the pandemic.

The short version is he did a shitty job and thousands of Americans died that didn't have to.

Add to that his slipshod and frankly ridiculous handling of resources in the early days that hamstrung medical responders, and almost fuckered the emergency production of ventilators. If it weren't for GM essentially going, "You know what, we've done war time production before, we're just going to soldier ahead and hope he figures this out eventually" he would have sunk that ship as well.

Many (including me) are afraid to go to hospitals in the USA due to high costs which means people will delay or not get treatment and show up to work until they physically are passing out.

If only there was a healthcare plan from a previous president that put millions of Americans on healthcare that he could have spent three years strengthening instead of eroding it while promising a never revealed alternative.

He should have been more like Dr. Ron Paul and admit the virus was serious (Dr. Paul mentioned that it killed people) but that people should be allowed to make choices after having the facts. I believe Trump wanted to show that he was cool under fire and tough. He is an old-school leader that doesn't believe in showing softness or fear because that could be implied as weakness.

Or, like every other medical and infectious disease professional including people on his staff. Or if he still had the infectious disease offices that a previous president had in China because even Bush II knew that this was a very real possibility. Instead he dismantled that.

Many companies lack sick days at work, so if workers feel sick, they still go. One place I worked at required a doctor's note to get a sick day so I usually showed up when sick (even when I could barely speak). If I am forced to leave my home anyways, I might as well get paid for it instead of paying to see a doctor and not getting my work pay. I would be happy to call in and not get paid but the issue is having to leave home and go to a doctor when bed rest and cold & flu medicine are sometimes enough. These dumb policies encourage people to spread diseases (and this is a worldwide situation). Trump is not to blame for dumb policies like this.

Except that he and the Republican party repeatedly stood in the way of relief packages that would have mitigated those things that every other country that didn't shit the bed like the US enacted, so yes, Trump is to blame for the dumb policies he endorsed and the good policies that he and his party blocked.

[Cannot think of a name]

Biden will not be taking Amtrak into his inaugeration

That has to bum him out.

[The Reformed American Republic]

[Redacted]

[Cannot think of a name]

The only things that Trump failed to do is to encourage people to wash their hands more, social distance, reduce visits to elderly people, and establish a national health care program. Many (including me) are afraid to go to hospitals in the USA due to high costs which means people will delay or not get treatment and show up to work until they physically are passing out. He should have been more like Dr. Ron Paul and admit the virus was serious (Dr. Paul mentioned that it killed people) but that people should be allowed to make choices after having the facts. I believe Trump wanted to show that he was cool under fire and tough. He is an old-school leader that doesn't believe in showing softness or fear because that could be implied as weakness.

So in other words he's a relic from another era that has no business running a modern nation and failed to do the bare minimum to keep people safe?

Boy, who could have seen that coming?

[Kowani]

Biden will not be taking Amtrak into his inaugeration

...Ok?

Why does that matter?

do people just
not
open links


he's not taking Amtrak because of security concerns
and Biden loves trains

something big scared his team off

[Bombadil]

The key damage Trump did around the virus was announce a ban on travel.. except the tens of thousands of Americans who returned from Europe and China with zero testing or quarantine at all, which exploded the virus in New York and SF.. given a lot of overseas American workers are in finance or tech.

Every country that dealt with it well immediately put quarantine laws in place and tested everyone who returned to the country.

The second is the no brainer of asking people to please wear masks. Finally placing some restrictions on large indoor gatherings, hence churches are great spreaders of the virus.

That's pretty much all that was required to maintain the virus at a low level. Trump failed on all counts.

But hey.. freedom..

[Salus Maior]

...Ok?

Why does that matter?

do people just
not
open links


he's not taking Amtrak because of security concerns
and Biden loves trains

something big scared his team off

Probably because there was an insurrection like a week ago.

[Rusozak]

do people just
not
open links


he's not taking Amtrak because of security concerns
and Biden loves trains

something big scared his team off

Probably because there was an insurrection like a week ago.

Isn't a train like the safest mode of transit though? Motorcades can be ambushed and driven off the road, planes can be shot down, Boats are, well it's over land so...

[Salus Maior]

Probably because there was an insurrection like a week ago.

Isn't a train like the safest mode of transit though? Motorcades can be ambushed and driven off the road, planes can be shot down, Boats are, well it's over land so...

Maybe they were worried about a bombing.

[Freiheit Reich]

Peru and Mexico and Brazil also had high death rates and they are mostly non-white.

Personally, I would rather have a higher death rate and not bend towards dictator like tactics. New Zealand and Australia behaved eerily like China with their trampling of human rights to stop the virus. Short-term, it looks great that they solved the issue. Long-term, it may cause their country to become an authoritarian nation because leaders know that they can trample rights in the name of 'safety.'

"Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" We must not forget these words.

I'm afraid the events of last week showed that America is far closer to becoming an authoritarian hellhole than Australia or NZ.. at this point you're really just talking unsubstantiated idealistic bullshit. Being sensible is not the same as being authoritarian. Taking due precautions in a pandemic given near 3M deaths worldwide is not sliding into authoritarianism. Listening to medical advice given a viral disease is not restricting freedom.

It's amazing the claims people make when their very own are doing exactly those claims.

Allow people CHOICES and give them the facts. Allow restaurants to require masks but don't force them to do so. Allow them to have reduced capacity but don't require it. Discourage big house parties but don't ban them. New Zealand and Australia and many US governors took choices away from adults and forced their ideas on them. Encouragement and force are different things. A leader encourages and motivates people and a tyrant forces people to comply. We can also reduce murder rates by putting all men age 15-35 in prison but would this make society better? We can make roads safer by banning private motorized vehicles. Would this make society better?

Xi Jinping is a tyrant and it seems we need to put Jacinda Ardern in the same category as well. There are advantages to having tyrants as leaders. Tyrants get things done. Ghenghis Khan was a tyrant and he led Mongolia to its peak power. Qin Shi Huang was also a tyrant but he definitely got things done as well. However, would you vote for a leader like Ghenghis Khan or Qin Shi Huang today? I want a leader that respects civil liberties. Sadly, it seems few people in New Zealand value real freedom. This should not be surprising in a nation that has always been proud of its wool industry.

This person made excellent points about New Zealand's tyrannical leader.

From Prime Minister to Tyrant

https://www.oliviapierson.org/blog/from ... -to-tyrant

Yet, even worse than all of this – much worse in fact, is her government’s hastily processed, reckless Covid 19 Public Health Response Bill, which passed into law on May 13th 2020.

This bill handed the police ludicrously panoptic powers for the first time ever seen in this country. Police can now enter a private home without a warrant. This is no longer a First World standard of justice – it’s Banana republic territory.

Jacinda Ardern has crossed the line from New Zealand’s Prime Minister to its tyrant.

We have watched her toe this line for several years as she promised to crack down on free speech laws – and she did indeed begin to politicise the police force by having them regularly visit the homes of many conservative bloggers and social media users to ask questions about their posts.

Also came her swift gun control legislation after the Christchurch shooting, and the fiasco of the buy-back, which saw decent, law abiding gun owners handing in their guns while gangs and criminals got to keep theirs.

But now “JacArd” has leapt all the way over the other side of the demarcation between leadership and tyranny with her nationwide lockdown, and subsequent destruction of thousands of NZ private businesses.

Yet, even worse than all of this – much worse in fact, is her government’s hastily processed, reckless Covid 19 Public Health Response Bill, which passed into law on May 13th 2020.

This bill handed the police ludicrously panoptic powers for the first time ever seen in this country. Police can now enter a private home without a warrant. This is no longer a First World standard of justice – it’s Banana republic territory.

As if all this is not horrific enough, there remains a much more sinister aspect to this repugnant bill which should be of utmost concern to NZ citizens: it has handed unprecedented powers to the Ministry of Health to create a class of “authorised” people, i.e., citizens whom The Ministry appoint, or employ, to make sure that businesses and public places enforce social distancing rules and all the rest of the high panic measures around COVID-19. If businesses are seen to not comply fully, they can be shut down on the spot.

This “authorised person or class of persons” is the very definition of a Stasi – a state security service (or safety service) – whose main task in the communist dictatorship of the German Democratic Republic was to spy on the population and create a network of citizen informants.

Here’s the wording in the bill which passed last week:

Subpart 3 – Enforcement, offences and penalties
Authorised persons

18 Authorised persons
(1) The Director-General may authorise a suitably qualified and trained person who is not an employee of the Ministry of Health, or a class of suitably qualified and trained persons who are not employees of the Ministry of Health, to carry out any functions and powers of an enforcement officer under this Act.
(2) An authorisation under subsection (1) must –
(a) be in writing; and
(b) specify –
(i) the authorised person our the class of persons; and
(ii) the functions and powers that may be carried out by the authorised person or class of persons; and
(iii) the term of the authorisation.
(3) The Director-General may renew any authorisation given under subsection (1).
(4) The Director-General may revoke an authorisation given under this section –
(a) in the case of an individual, for incapacity, neglect of duty, or misconduct; or
(b) in the case of an individual, on the written request of the authorised person; or
(c) if the Director-General considers the the authorisation is no longer necessary or desirable.
(5) If a person ceases to be an authorised person, they must surrender to the Director-General all articles and documents received by the person in relation to the authorisation.

During the Covid so-called emergency, we already saw a hotline quickly created for folks to anonymously snitch on their neighbours and fellow countrymen and women.

Now JacArd’s government has legislated for a whole new bureaucracy of people to be employed to spy on other citizens in an official capacity.

The cultural effect on our country of unleashing these pernicious laws are unimaginable, but we can be in no doubt that this dystopian territory is no longer democratic, nor healthy, nor patriotic.

Professor Paul Hunt, NZ’s current Human Rights Commissioner, expressed his “deep concern” about the rushed lack of scrutiny with the passing of the bill. He said:

“This is a great failure of our democratic process. The new legislation, if passed in its current state, will result in sweeping police powers unseen in this country for many years.

In times of national emergency sweeping powers are granted. There is a risk of overreach. Mistakes are made and later regretted.”

When radical Lefties, such as Professor Hunt, voice their “deep concern” at a lack of scrutiny in a new bill permitting undue police powers, we’re really in dire straits – since Professor Hunt was brought to New Zealand to help this government enact anti hate speech laws.

The bill’s sunset clause of two years was amended to being “reviewed” every three months, and funerals and tangis have been allowed up to 50 people instead of just 10, but apart from those small amendments, the bill did pass “in its current state.”

JacArd is not even putting up the pretence of appearing to lead a free and democratic country anymore, she has instead become intoxicated on dictatorial powers and the honking hurrahs of a large gaggle of global press geese.

This is now an untenable situation for the free people of New Zealand who truly value liberty.

Governments are instituted among men in order to effect the safety and security of their natural rights, as America’s Declaration of Independence instructed the world and set the example for all free nations.

– When a government becomes abusive of these ends, as citizens it is our right as well as our duty to remove such a government from office.

– When police can enter at will private homes and businesses with no warrant in order to enforce new laws against the owners, that is an egregious abuse of freedom.

– When government empowers citizens to be transformed into a network of spies to police new laws in the public and private spheres, that is an egregious abuse of freedom.

– Locking down an entire population of citizens, as communist China set the example for everyone to do, is an egregious abuse of freedom.

– Recklessly vandalising a country’s economy in the name of enforced “safety” is an egregious abuse of freedom.

The New Zealand public had no say in the bill’s passing – the fact that it was hurtled through parliament at break-neck speed with enough votes from the Coalition shows New Zealand that chillingly, this government cares not a whit for upholding the precious cornerstone principles of our liberty and natural rights.
​
This government has chosen to blackmail NZ citizens in the most emotive terms imaginable – to quote Ardern when she pitched the idea of lockdown over the TV airways: “If we don’t do this now, tens of thousands of people WILL die!”

That was pure, hyperbolic nonsense; fake news built on false information and designed to instil panic and fear in a population – and it worked.

Jacinda Ardern’s government is not worthy to lead a free people.

They well know this, which is why they are taking our freedoms away.