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PR for Beginners(A Dutch Election Thread)

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Who do you support?

VVD
7
5%
PVV
16
12%
CDA
4
3%
D66
15
12%
GL
33
26%
SP
16
12%
PvdA
13
10%
CU
2
2%
PvdD
6
5%
Other(State Whom)
17
13%
 
Total votes : 129

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Jershaland
Attaché
 
Posts: 86
Founded: Dec 30, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Jershaland » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:13 pm

D66 definitely aligns with my views the most. Them and PvdA. I don't know much about Dutch politics but those are the parties I seem to align with.
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Thepeopl
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1985
Founded: Feb 24, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Thepeopl » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:41 pm

I feel like Dutch politics has become cable TV, 89 channels, none of them I want to choose. Maybe it's time to start my own party?

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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:44 pm

Thepeopl wrote:I feel like Dutch politics has become cable TV, 89 channels, none of them I want to choose. Maybe it's time to start my own party?


Alas, you're in the Netherlands, not Israel. Starting your own party's a little more difficult.
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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:52 pm

Shrillland wrote:
Thepeopl wrote:I feel like Dutch politics has become cable TV, 89 channels, none of them I want to choose. Maybe it's time to start my own party?


Alas, you're in the Netherlands, not Israel. Starting your own party's a little more difficult.


Actually, it is incredibly easy. You need to register your new party, pay a deposit of about 12.000 euros (which you get back if your party gets enough votes) and then get signatures on a support statement from voters out of each district where you wish to appear on the ballot. To appear on the ballot in every district you will need a total of 580 of such signatures.

And then all you need to do is make certain you get enough votes to get your deposit back. Or even a seat ;)

Well, ok. It is harder than it sounds. For example, the required signatures are public - which was a big problem for the "pedophile party" when they wanted to participate in the elections; since almost nobody was willing to publicly announce they support having sex with kids.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
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Juristonia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5171
Founded: Oct 30, 2006
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Juristonia » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:11 am

The Alma Mater wrote:Was she ? She caused a fallout in the party and was herself not really knowledgeable about IT matters. While certainly intelligent, nice to look at and quite able to debate she was not the ideal posterchild for a party whose main focus point is cybersecurity and privacy.

All very true, but she was also one of the big things that put the party on the map. Before she came along, barely anyone knew about the party and even fewer took them seriously.
She made them visible and, to a lot more people than before, viable.

It's not my party, but I would like to see them get a seat or two so there's at least a party in there who actually knows something about IT and privacy, because politics tends to be woefully behind when it comes to that stuff.
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Anatoliyanskiy
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 494
Founded: Jan 19, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Anatoliyanskiy » Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:34 am

Thepeopl wrote:I feel like Dutch politics has become cable TV, 89 channels, none of them I want to choose. Maybe it's time to start my own party?


Have you heard of Bij1? Formerly Artikel1? They're probably the largest actually left-wing party (sad socialist party noises) who are anti-capitalist and progressive, which I guess might fit you? Got like 0.24% of the vote so not too off from gaining a seat.
Pro: Environmentalism, Eco-Socialism, Democratic Socialism, Social Democracy,Progressivism, Pro-choice, Pro-LGTBQ+ rights, Immigration, Bernie Sanders,Secularism, Palestine And Israel, Internationalism, Alter-Globalization.
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VW53Aland
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 56
Founded: Jun 30, 2018
New York Times Democracy

Postby VW53Aland » Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:19 am

Oh, Bij1 is the former Art1kel?
I did not know that yet. Good to know. Thanks.

(Yes, I called them "artéénkel" as that was their logo. In the same way I called that group that once sang in the Eurovision song contest "Ogdriene" instead of ogene.)
Last edited by VW53Aland on Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Blaatschapen
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 58709
Founded: Antiquity
Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:46 am

https://www.ad.nl/dossier-instagram/ass ... ~af33d8e7/

Social democrats continue to implode.

For those who do not speak Dutch (shame), the party leader resigned as leader.
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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:52 am

The Blaatschapen wrote:https://www.ad.nl/dossier-instagram/asscher-stapt-op-pvda-moet-op-zoek-naar-nieuwe-lijsttrekker~af33d8e7/

Social democrats continue to implode.

For those who do not speak Dutch (shame), the party leader resigned as leader.


Well, I put it through Translate, and, admittedly, I knew naught about the Benefits Affair(for everyone else, basically what happened was that roughly 26,000 families were wrongly suspected of Childcare Allowance fraud by the Social Affairs and Employment Ministry and the Belastingdienst-basically the Dutch Revenue service-and Asscher was the Social Affairs and Employment Minister at the time it was all going down for six years) though it would explain why PvdA's dropped in the polls...you think Ploumen will be lijstrekker after this?
Last edited by Shrillland on Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Blaatschapen
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 58709
Founded: Antiquity
Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:55 am

Shrillland wrote:
The Blaatschapen wrote:https://www.ad.nl/dossier-instagram/asscher-stapt-op-pvda-moet-op-zoek-naar-nieuwe-lijsttrekker~af33d8e7/

Social democrats continue to implode.

For those who do not speak Dutch (shame), the party leader resigned as leader.


Well, I put it through Translate, and, admittedly, I knew naught about the Benefits Affair, though it would explain why PvdA's dropped in the polls...you think Ploumen will be lijstrekker after this?


She'll take it up, then after the elections they'll call for a new leader for a longer time period.
Forumer mod, now a rocker mocker. Thank you Ringo
Five blank lines will now follow





This is the 8th line. If your sig is longer than mine, it is too long.

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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:58 am

The Blaatschapen wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
Well, I put it through Translate, and, admittedly, I knew naught about the Benefits Affair, though it would explain why PvdA's dropped in the polls...you think Ploumen will be lijstrekker after this?


She'll take it up, then after the elections they'll call for a new leader for a longer time period.


Well, when it becomes official, I'll update the OP accordingly. It'll make forming a government that much easier though, without him I think PvdA may stand a better chance of getting in.

Also, upon closer reading, there's something that says Rutte's using him as a scapegoat too, since a lot of the mess continued after he left the Cabinet.
Last edited by Shrillland on Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Here's my Takes on LatAm Votes!
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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Fri Jan 15, 2021 2:56 am

Shrillland wrote:
The Blaatschapen wrote:https://www.ad.nl/dossier-instagram/asscher-stapt-op-pvda-moet-op-zoek-naar-nieuwe-lijsttrekker~af33d8e7/

Social democrats continue to implode.

For those who do not speak Dutch (shame), the party leader resigned as leader.


Well, I put it through Translate, and, admittedly, I knew naught about the Benefits Affair(for everyone else, basically what happened was that roughly 26,000 families were wrongly suspected of Childcare Allowance fraud by the Social Affairs and Employment Ministry and the Belastingdienst-basically the Dutch Revenue service-and Asscher was the Social Affairs and Employment Minister at the time it was all going down for six years) though it would explain why PvdA's dropped in the polls...you think Ploumen will be lijstrekker after this?


There is a pretty high chance the Dutch government will fall today due to said Benefits affair... so it is possible we will see soon.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:37 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
Well, I put it through Translate, and, admittedly, I knew naught about the Benefits Affair(for everyone else, basically what happened was that roughly 26,000 families were wrongly suspected of Childcare Allowance fraud by the Social Affairs and Employment Ministry and the Belastingdienst-basically the Dutch Revenue service-and Asscher was the Social Affairs and Employment Minister at the time it was all going down for six years) though it would explain why PvdA's dropped in the polls...you think Ploumen will be lijstrekker after this?


There is a pretty high chance the Dutch government will fall today due to said Benefits affair... so it is possible we will see soon.


And it fell. The Netherlands is an anarchy. Be afraid!
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
- Terry Pratchett, Hogfather

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The Huskar Social Union
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 50188
Founded: Apr 04, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:40 am

So is it likely that the VVD will remain the top party?
Irish Nationalist from Belfast / SDLP-Alliance Party / Leftwinger / Atheist
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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:49 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:So is it likely that the VVD will remain the top party?


I'm not sure at this point. It'll be a few weeks before we get the full fallout for the parties over the Benefits Affair.

ALso, involving the scandal, the government has confirmed that no one has yet received the €30,000 in compensation they've been promised as of yet: https://www.ad.nl/dossier-val-kabinet/nog-geen-enkele-gedupeerde-van-toeslagenaffaire-heeft-30-000-euro-compensatie-ontvangen~aa75d7d5/
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The Huskar Social Union
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Posts: 50188
Founded: Apr 04, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:53 am

Shrillland wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:So is it likely that the VVD will remain the top party?


I'm not sure at this point. It'll be a few weeks before we get the full fallout for the parties over the Benefits Affair.

ALso, involving the scandal, the government has confirmed that no one has yet received the €30,000 in compensation they've been promised as of yet: https://www.ad.nl/dossier-val-kabinet/nog-geen-enkele-gedupeerde-van-toeslagenaffaire-heeft-30-000-euro-compensatie-ontvangen~aa75d7d5/

Interesting, thank you
Irish Nationalist from Belfast / SDLP-Alliance Party / Leftwinger / Atheist
Miniature Painting, Cheese, Curry, Tanks and English Gals are my Kryptonite


I never thought in terms of being a leader. I thought very simply in terms of helping people’ - John Hume


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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:05 am

An English article on the resignation of the government for those who do not speak Dutch/dislike google translate:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55674146
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
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The Huskar Social Union
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Posts: 50188
Founded: Apr 04, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:07 am

The Alma Mater wrote:An English article on the resignation of the government for those who do not speak Dutch/dislike google translate:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55674146

Just started reading it but oh boy thats some mess like.
Irish Nationalist from Belfast / SDLP-Alliance Party / Leftwinger / Atheist
Miniature Painting, Cheese, Curry, Tanks and English Gals are my Kryptonite


I never thought in terms of being a leader. I thought very simply in terms of helping people’ - John Hume


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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:08 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:An English article on the resignation of the government for those who do not speak Dutch/dislike google translate:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55674146

Just started reading it but oh boy thats some mess like.


Yeah, it is. I only just learned about it yesterday when Asscher resigned.
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Shrillland
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Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Fri Jan 15, 2021 9:57 am

Rutte's already issued a 26-page document to the Tweede Kamer discussing how allowances should be reformed to avoid another Benefits Affair: https://nos.nl/collectie/13855/artikel/2364532-rutte-toeslagensysteem-op-de-schop-beleidsstukken-openbaar-maken
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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Fri Jan 15, 2021 11:22 pm

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:An English article on the resignation of the government for those who do not speak Dutch/dislike google translate:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55674146

Just started reading it but oh boy thats some mess like.


Yes. Though I personally still do not see the issue with giving extra scrutiny to people with dual nationality. Heck, in same cases that is even required - like with a dual US/Dutch nationality due to American taxlaws.
But all the "the comma is in the wrong place, pay back 50k now, no chance of appeal" stuff is.. insane.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
- Terry Pratchett, Hogfather

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Molither
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 101
Founded: Dec 19, 2020
Father Knows Best State

Postby Molither » Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:09 am

Not Dutch but I'd go for Geert Wilders
Molither is ruled by a mostly benevolent King


My IRL politics: Patriotism, LGBT rights, Social democracy

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The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21832
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:58 am

Pan Evropa wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:
I quite like the environmentalism of the CU as well. But I simply cannot take them seriously anymore after they seriously claimed metal music was to blame for terrorist attacks like those of Breivik.

ok i would vote for them just because reading that made me laugh lol


I can imagine :P

The odd thing of the CU (to me at least) that while I fundamentally disagree with their basic beliefs and reasoning, their policies often do align quite well with my wishes. Different reasoning, same outcome. The environmentalism is a prime example - they believe we are the caretakers of earth, "renting" it so to speak from God - and therefor have to treat it well instead of exploiting it. Which is also what I want. Their policy on abortion is another - they oppose it and consider it murder - but their policy is to plead for easy and free access to contraceptives so that unwanted pregnancies can be prevented as much as possible. Which is indeed also something I can get behind.

It just feels... wrong.. to consider voting for them.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
- Terry Pratchett, Hogfather

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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:36 am

I'm adding Ja21 to the OP(not to the poll) now that this has happened: https://nos.nl/artikel/2364636-brabantse-fractie-forum-voor-democratie-valt-uiteen.html

The Provincial FvD in Brabant has disbanded with most of its members joining Ja21.

In other news, Hoekstra was re-elected CDA lijstrekker with 95% of the vote: https://nos.nl/artikel/2364620-hoekstra-zoals-verwacht-gekozen-tot-cda-lijsttrekker.html
Last edited by Shrillland on Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Stand with Content Creators Like Me! Stand With The Union!
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Here's my Takes on LatAm Votes!
In 1963, Doctor Who taught us all we need to know about politics when a cave woman said, "Old men see no further than tomorrow's meat".

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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15980
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:28 am

It's official, Ploumen will be PvdA Lijstrekker when the party meets on Saturday to formalise the revised party list: https://nos.nl/artikel/2364910-pvda-draagt-lilianne-ploumen-voor-als-lijsttrekker.html

She actually was originally a GL member but thought Labour was more pragmatic and down to earth: https://nos.nl/artikel/2364948-wie-is-beoogd-pvda-lijsttrekker-lilianne-ploumen.html
Stand with Content Creators Like Me! Stand With The Union!
Plebiscite Plaza 2021
Here's my Takes on LatAm Votes!
In 1963, Doctor Who taught us all we need to know about politics when a cave woman said, "Old men see no further than tomorrow's meat".

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