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Is Hexing/Cursing Minors Ever Okay?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Senkaku
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Postby Senkaku » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:39 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Senkaku wrote:is kids getting turned into frogs or whatever enough of a problem in society that there needs to be a discussion of its morality lol


in the occult world, there's a group called the Order of Nine Angels. Google them. They tried to start a war. Think some sort of neo nazi demonology cult that focused too hard on the occult interests of certain Nazis. So, yeah, morality in occultism is a discussion that has to happen now, and soon, even if it's more broadly about whether or not it's okay to try to harm a massive demographic.

uh alright seems like the thing we should be worried about here is the "Nazi" component rather than the "occult interest" component though lmao
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Borderlands of Rojava
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Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:40 pm

Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.
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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:40 pm

Salus Maior wrote:Tbh, if hexing/cursing really were an effective way to bring harm to someone, people who do that should waste less of their time on petty disputes and more on...Idk, combating world terrorism and totalitarianism or something.

Maybe the government can employ a hexing taskforce.


people hexed Trump, and Giuliani, and the annoying turtle from Kentucky. did turtle man's hands get that way all by himself? i sure hope so.

also, I've not really met witches that want to use magick to implement that on a large scale. Most of us aren't that ambitious.

even with the Christian God, Elohim, changes came from powerful institutions - and people that influenced those institutions.

and certain changes in psychology and psychiatry came from occultists like Carl Jung, and his King Paimon. shadow work has helped a lot of people. one with DID might even use it to communicate with an alter. People forget that occultism just basically means "secret knowledge", and that a lot of things started as these dark, murky, mysterious areas like the nascent (and even later) stages of alchemy that later developed into chemistry. It can be pretty useful, but it's usually on... like... a personal scale.

Carl Jung is actually why I wanted to become a psychiatrist in the first place, tbh.

if people could change the world with witchcraft, we'd have a Sauron by now
they/them, please.

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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:41 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.


You know some kind of women, Rojava.
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This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:41 pm

Senkaku wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
in the occult world, there's a group called the Order of Nine Angels. Google them. They tried to start a war. Think some sort of neo nazi demonology cult that focused too hard on the occult interests of certain Nazis. So, yeah, morality in occultism is a discussion that has to happen now, and soon, even if it's more broadly about whether or not it's okay to try to harm a massive demographic.

uh alright seems like the thing we should be worried about here is the "Nazi" component rather than the "occult interest" component though lmao


I was mocking them. They stole the weirdest part of a failed ideology. I still haven't an idea why
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Giovenith
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Postby Giovenith » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:42 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Giovenith wrote:
Nobody thinks they can't be dangerous, but they have to actually get up and do something to be dangerous, not wave their hands around singing "bippity boppity boo!" while imagining someone's head exploding in their bedroom. If that's the extent of your "magic," then there really is nothing to condemn on a moral level except for maybe your personality.


I've never hexed someone in my life, and have no intention of doing so. It's a.) too much work with my system, b.) i dont want to waste my time on that when i can just get someone out of my life/never speak to them again, and c.) most of my occultism talents revolge around mental health, self improvement, etc, rather than trying to kill people by talking to some ancient old world goddess. TBH, I much prefer talking to people about, say, detaching a harmful entity and tbe benefits of that. whether the entity was actually real, or something to dowith the mind where I put things that harmed me so that i could discard it doesnt matter much, since it does the same thing whether or not it's strictly real.

exploration of the mind, myself, and my writings is why i got into occultism in the first place. the secret knowledge is, for me, largely a coping skill for a deeply traumatic past.

meditation, confronting my fears, confronting the toxicity i got from.my people aroundme, communicating with my shadow self. modern occultism with a root in Jung's work is more my speed, tbh.

i find personalities that dismiss complex religious issues that, in this instance, show a disturbing, underlying thought process more problematic in all honesty. they get in the way of actually confronting the issues in my communiry, of which there are soooo many, but i just wanted to talk about this one right now.


These issues are not "complex" at all, no more complex than a debate about whether flapping your arms or flapping your wrists is the proper way to fly into the sky. Just because a person has convinced themselves that something is very serious and real does not mean that it actually is, and contrary to popular belief, nobody else is obligated to respect an idea or belief just because you believe very strongly in it. Faith is not a virtue. No religious beliefs are "owed" respect, not even ones that bring people comfort.

I think the thought process of believing in the supernatural and other things that have no evidence is problematic, because it promotes a culture where comfortable falsehoods are valued over truth and that in turn can lay the foundation for belief systems which are a lot less silly and harmless than mysticism. If you allow bad logic to go unchecked in one belier because you thought that belief was "respectable" even if false, it becomes a lot harder to argue why that logic shouldn't hold for an equally false but less respectable belief because not only are you arguing a double standard at that point, but you have also established the idea that a strong desire to believe something is a good enough reason by itself. "It makes me happy" sounds real warm and fuzzy until you remember that some people are "made happy" believing in things like racial supremacy.

You are getting an answer to this "issue," you're just not getting the kind of answers that you wanted to hear. And my answer is that no, there's no moral issue with hexing a child because there are no such thing as hexes, but there is an issue with enabling and encouraging the idea that someone can perform hexes.
Last edited by Giovenith on Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:43 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
What would the effect of casting a curse on a child be?


I don’t think using magic to harm children is good policy :(

Even if they did wrongful things

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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:44 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:Tbh, if hexing/cursing really were an effective way to bring harm to someone, people who do that should waste less of their time on petty disputes and more on...Idk, combating world terrorism and totalitarianism or something.

Maybe the government can employ a hexing taskforce.


people hexed Trump, and Giuliani, and the annoying turtle from Kentucky. did turtle man's hands get that way all by himself? i sure hope so.

also, I've not really met witches that want to use magick to implement that on a large scale. Most of us aren't that ambitious.

even with the Christian God, Elohim, changes came from powerful institutions - and people that influenced those institutions.

and certain changes in psychology and psychiatry came from occultists like Carl Jung, and his King Paimon. shadow work has helped a lot of people. one with DID might even use it to communicate with an alter. People forget that occultism just basically means "secret knowledge", and that a lot of things started as these dark, murky, mysterious areas like the nascent (and even later) stages of alchemy that later developed into chemistry. It can be pretty useful, but it's usually on... like... a personal scale.

Carl Jung is actually why I wanted to become a psychiatrist in the first place, tbh.

if people could change the world with witchcraft, we'd have a Sauron by now


So, apparently magic can be used against leaders in the government, but can't "change the world".

This is pretty silly. Why can't we use hexing to combat the spread of Communism? Let's take down Xi.

Also, I really hope you realize that chemistry isn't magic, and neither is psychology.
Last edited by Salus Maior on Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“No one in the world can change Truth. What we can do and should do is to seek truth and to serve it when we have found it. The real conflict is the inner conflict. Beyond armies of occupation and the hecatombs of extermination camps, there are two irreconcilable enemies in the depth of every soul: good and evil, sin and love. And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?”
~ St. Maximilian Kolbe

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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:45 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.


perhaps her magick, but not Carl Jung's. also, she sounds suuuper toxic. sorry you had to deal with that, lmao
they/them, please.

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The Holy Therns
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Postby The Holy Therns » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:46 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.


And I'd get away with it if it weren't for those meddling facts.
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Postby Kowani » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:47 pm

The Holy Therns wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.


And I'd get away with it if it weren't for those meddling facts.

and to the awesome quotes thread you go
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:47 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Been cursed by a girl. It didn't do shit cause magic is fake.


perhaps her magick, but not Carl Jung's. also, she sounds suuuper toxic. sorry you had to deal with that, lmao


Do you actually believe that Carl Jung is magical?
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist.

This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“No one in the world can change Truth. What we can do and should do is to seek truth and to serve it when we have found it. The real conflict is the inner conflict. Beyond armies of occupation and the hecatombs of extermination camps, there are two irreconcilable enemies in the depth of every soul: good and evil, sin and love. And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?”
~ St. Maximilian Kolbe

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Postby Farnhamia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:50 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
perhaps her magick, but not Carl Jung's. also, she sounds suuuper toxic. sorry you had to deal with that, lmao


Do you actually believe that Carl Jung is magical?

Frau Jung told me that after a couple of schnapps he was. ;)
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The Holy Therns
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Postby The Holy Therns » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:51 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
perhaps her magick, but not Carl Jung's. also, she sounds suuuper toxic. sorry you had to deal with that, lmao


Do you actually believe that Carl Jung is magical?


Carl did, didn't he?
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:53 pm

The Holy Therns wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
Do you actually believe that Carl Jung is magical?


Carl did, didn't he?


I don't actually know very much about Jung.

I'm fairly certain that his career as a psychologist isn't due to magic though.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist.

This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“No one in the world can change Truth. What we can do and should do is to seek truth and to serve it when we have found it. The real conflict is the inner conflict. Beyond armies of occupation and the hecatombs of extermination camps, there are two irreconcilable enemies in the depth of every soul: good and evil, sin and love. And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?”
~ St. Maximilian Kolbe

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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:54 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
people hexed Trump, and Giuliani, and the annoying turtle from Kentucky. did turtle man's hands get that way all by himself? i sure hope so.

also, I've not really met witches that want to use magick to implement that on a large scale. Most of us aren't that ambitious.

even with the Christian God, Elohim, changes came from powerful institutions - and people that influenced those institutions.

and certain changes in psychology and psychiatry came from occultists like Carl Jung, and his King Paimon. shadow work has helped a lot of people. one with DID might even use it to communicate with an alter. People forget that occultism just basically means "secret knowledge", and that a lot of things started as these dark, murky, mysterious areas like the nascent (and even later) stages of alchemy that later developed into chemistry. It can be pretty useful, but it's usually on... like... a personal scale.

Carl Jung is actually why I wanted to become a psychiatrist in the first place, tbh.

if people could change the world with witchcraft, we'd have a Sauron by now


So, apparently magic can be used against leaders in the government, but can't "change the world".

This is pretty silly. Why can't we use hexing to combat the spread of Communism? Let's take down Xi.

Also, I really hope you realize that chemistry isn't magic, and neither in psychology.


Google Carl Jung lmao Psychology, nor psychiatry, is magic, but Carl Jung worked with and wrote about an entity/god/thing caled King Paimon that taught him about core Jungian concepts. He's the blueprint for how occultists can implement change, and, yes, even that included institutions. Do you think occultists and witches don't have jobs? That they aren't in acadamia? That's very strange.

and chemistry is not magic, but it did start out as alchemy, which is... uhm... alchemy. So, google that, too? I guess. I don't have the time to explain entire concepts to people. There is one specific person I can think of that kind of helped establish chemistry, and moved alchemy towards that. I think his name was Paracelsus. Granted, iirc he also had some ideas about resurrection or something, but I can't really remember... so.

Xi is less communist,and more authoritarian.

And yes, it can be used on specific people. But hexing entire ideas, nations, ideologies? Nah. It can't change the world. Institutions, like the Catholic Church, could and did- and often not for the better. No lone person has enough power to change certain kinds of things unless they're the ultra wealthy or in other positions of power. If witches could change the world, they would have by now, and idk if you've noticed this, but the time for witches changing the world kinda passed about the time the Catholics started butchering Pagans.

Occultists /do/ vote, possess significant buying power, and cultural influence, though, so people can implement some kind of change through that... I guess?

But yeah. A lot of people I've met on the LHP (left hand path) are just uhh... mmm... petty wankers.
they/them, please.

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Mannixa Prime
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Postby Mannixa Prime » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:55 pm

Ah finally an interesting topic on this forum.

I am quite agnostic/borderline atheist in my beliefs, but I am fascinated by pagan beliefs and any “religion” or belief system that is centred around actual people, and with that a connection to nature and the elements.

I think there is a lot we don’t understand when it comes to what we as humans are capable of and as we uncover more knowledge about ourselves and our planet, coupled with advancements in science I think conversations like this will be more relevant.

But to answer your question I don’t think it’s a good idea to harm any young person regardless of intent. Unless it’s self defence of course but I digress.
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:56 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
So, apparently magic can be used against leaders in the government, but can't "change the world".

This is pretty silly. Why can't we use hexing to combat the spread of Communism? Let's take down Xi.

Also, I really hope you realize that chemistry isn't magic, and neither in psychology.


Google Carl Jung lmao Psychology, nor psychiatry, is magic, but Carl Jung worked with and wrote about an entity/god/thing caled King Paimon that taught him about core Jungian concepts. He's the blueprint for how occultists can implement change, and, yes, even that included institutions. Do you think occultists and witches don't have jobs? That they aren't in acadamia? That's very strange.

and chemistry is not magic, but it did start out as alchemy, which is... uhm... alchemy. So, google that, too? I guess. I don't have the time to explain entire concepts to people. There is one specific person I can think of that kind of helped establish chemistry, and moved alchemy towards that. I think his name was Paracelsus. Granted, iirc he also had some ideas about resurrection or something, but I can't really remember... so.

Xi is less communist,and more authoritarian.

And yes, it can be used on specific people. But hexing entire ideas, nations, ideologies? Nah. It can't change the world. Institutions, like the Catholic Church, could and did- and often not for the better. No lone person has enough power to change certain kinds of things unless they're the ultra wealthy or in other positions of power. If witches could change the world, they would have by now, and idk if you've noticed this, but the time for witches changing the world kinda passed about the time the Catholics started butchering Pagans.

Occultists /do/ vote, possess significant buying power, and cultural influence, though, so people can implement some kind of change through that... I guess?

But yeah. A lot of people I've met on the LHP (left hand path) are just uhh... mmm... petty wankers.


So your argument is that occultists can influence the world...By doing things that literally everyone does.

Idk if that's magical but this conversation certainly is.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist.

This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“No one in the world can change Truth. What we can do and should do is to seek truth and to serve it when we have found it. The real conflict is the inner conflict. Beyond armies of occupation and the hecatombs of extermination camps, there are two irreconcilable enemies in the depth of every soul: good and evil, sin and love. And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?”
~ St. Maximilian Kolbe

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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:57 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
The Holy Therns wrote:
Carl did, didn't he?


I don't actually know very much about Jung.

I'm fairly certain that his career as a psychologist isn't due to magic though.


it is, actually. thoroughly linked to it. in fact, he wrote a book(s?) about bis working with King Paimon (a goetia) to come up with concepts (classical Jungian concepts) and invent shadow work.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paimon

king Paimon is this dude.
they/them, please.

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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:00 pm

Bluepillar wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
I don't actually know very much about Jung.

I'm fairly certain that his career as a psychologist isn't due to magic though.


it is, actually. thoroughly linked to it. in fact, he wrote a book(s?) about bis working with King Paimon (a goetia) to come up with concepts (classical Jungian concepts) and invent shadow work.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paimon

king Paimon is this dude.


Yeah, I saw Hereditary.

Did Jung ever do drugs, out of curiosity?
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist.

This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“No one in the world can change Truth. What we can do and should do is to seek truth and to serve it when we have found it. The real conflict is the inner conflict. Beyond armies of occupation and the hecatombs of extermination camps, there are two irreconcilable enemies in the depth of every soul: good and evil, sin and love. And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?”
~ St. Maximilian Kolbe

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Crossbe
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Hexing don't make factories don't make me happy.

Postby Crossbe » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:00 pm

no factory no happy

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Bluepillar
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Postby Bluepillar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:02 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
Google Carl Jung lmao Psychology, nor psychiatry, is magic, but Carl Jung worked with and wrote about an entity/god/thing caled King Paimon that taught him about core Jungian concepts. He's the blueprint for how occultists can implement change, and, yes, even that included institutions. Do you think occultists and witches don't have jobs? That they aren't in acadamia? That's very strange.

and chemistry is not magic, but it did start out as alchemy, which is... uhm... alchemy. So, google that, too? I guess. I don't have the time to explain entire concepts to people. There is one specific person I can think of that kind of helped establish chemistry, and moved alchemy towards that. I think his name was Paracelsus. Granted, iirc he also had some ideas about resurrection or something, but I can't really remember... so.

Xi is less communist,and more authoritarian.

And yes, it can be used on specific people. But hexing entire ideas, nations, ideologies? Nah. It can't change the world. Institutions, like the Catholic Church, could and did- and often not for the better. No lone person has enough power to change certain kinds of things unless they're the ultra wealthy or in other positions of power. If witches could change the world, they would have by now, and idk if you've noticed this, but the time for witches changing the world kinda passed about the time the Catholics started butchering Pagans.

Occultists /do/ vote, possess significant buying power, and cultural influence, though, so people can implement some kind of change through that... I guess?

But yeah. A lot of people I've met on the LHP (left hand path) are just uhh... mmm... petty wankers.


So your argument is that occultists can influence the world...By doing things that literally everyone does.

Idk if that's magical but this conversation certainly is.


Who told you occultists didn't do those things? We do. We also definitely perform actual witchraft, rites, rituals, and actions. Some of it isn't witchcraft, though, technically speaking, and some of it shows very real personal or interpersonal benefits... or at least it has for me, and a million other witches, but that's cause most of us dont try to change the world, abd also dont hex people. Did you forgetwhat the threadis about? This conversation is abiut jf it's ever justifiable to curse a child. Occultists that hex, I've found, are petty creatures or those so grievously wounded that they find some relief in the misery of their tormentors... but sometimes it is, in fact, okay to harm someone. The question is more a veiled critique though, for those in the know about these things, and to prompt a wider conversation about how fucked in the head some people seem to be.
they/them, please.

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Kandorith
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Postby Kandorith » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:03 pm

It's never okay to turn someone into a newt.

Eventually they will get better though.
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Postby Northwest Slobovia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:04 pm

Giovenith wrote:
Bluepillar wrote:
I've never hexed someone in my life, and have no intention of doing so. It's a.) too much work with my system, b.) i dont want to waste my time on that when i can just get someone out of my life/never speak to them again, and c.) most of my occultism talents revolge around mental health, self improvement, etc, rather than trying to kill people by talking to some ancient old world goddess. TBH, I much prefer talking to people about, say, detaching a harmful entity and tbe benefits of that. whether the entity was actually real, or something to dowith the mind where I put things that harmed me so that i could discard it doesnt matter much, since it does the same thing whether or not it's strictly real.

exploration of the mind, myself, and my writings is why i got into occultism in the first place. the secret knowledge is, for me, largely a coping skill for a deeply traumatic past.

meditation, confronting my fears, confronting the toxicity i got from.my people aroundme, communicating with my shadow self. modern occultism with a root in Jung's work is more my speed, tbh.

i find personalities that dismiss complex religious issues that, in this instance, show a disturbing, underlying thought process more problematic in all honesty. they get in the way of actually confronting the issues in my communiry, of which there are soooo many, but i just wanted to talk about this one right now.


These issues are not "complex" at all, no more complex than a debate about whether flapping your arms or flapping your wrists is the proper way to fly into the sky.

Well of course not! Arms have nothing to do with it, it's all in the form of how you throw yourself at the ground and miss. :P
Last edited by Northwest Slobovia on Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Founded: Jan 18, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Old Tanokiana » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:05 pm

In other words, the thread slightly derailed
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