Is voting useless in the US?

[San Lumen]

Because its not. A 33 year old man with no political experience is now a US senator.

Aside that one example doesn't break a rule, this 33 year old man with no political experience getting elected didn't magically evaporate all poverty, make every single political ideology palatable to the public, make every person willing to go into politics nor give every single person all the free time and money they need to campaign and feasibly win. The one example of this person completely fails to disprove my reasoning why "go run" is not a workable solution for a lot of people.

Who made any such suggestion?

[Esalia]

Aside that one example doesn't break a rule, this 33 year old man with no political experience getting elected didn't magically evaporate all poverty, make every single political ideology palatable to the public, make every person willing to go into politics nor give every single person all the free time and money they need to campaign and feasibly win. The one example of this person completely fails to disprove my reasoning why "go run" is not a workable solution for a lot of people.

Who made any such suggestion?

You, indirectly/unintentionally.

Since my reason for calling "go run" a shit solution was, in short, that people aren't always capable of running (or willing to run), primarily because they a) may not have a lot of money behind their name, b) a lot of free time to run, c) an ideology palatable enough for them to stand a solid chance at getting elected, or d) the will or desire to go into a career of politics. It also e) ignores any other way the person in question is helping their cause.

By saying that this 33 year old means the solution is not shit, it must mean that the election of this 33 year old eliminated poverty, gave everyone much more free time, made all ideologies equally capable of winning, and made everyone want to go into politics.

[San Lumen]

Who made any such suggestion?

You, indirectly/unintentionally.

Since my reason for calling "go run" a shit solution was, in short, that people aren't always capable of running (or willing to run), primarily because they a) may not have a lot of money behind their name, b) a lot of free time to run, c) an ideology palatable enough for them to stand a solid chance at getting elected, or d) the will or desire to go into a career of politics. It also e) ignores any other way the person in question is helping their cause.

By saying that this 33 year old means the solution is not shit, it must mean that the election of this 33 year old eliminated poverty, gave everyone much more free time, made all ideologies equally capable of winning, and made everyone want to go into politics.

That’s not even remotely what I said. Nothing changes by whining and complaining. Great change didn’t just come from protests and activism it also took voting and organizing.

[Sanghyeok]

You, indirectly/unintentionally.

Since my reason for calling "go run" a shit solution was, in short, that people aren't always capable of running (or willing to run), primarily because they a) may not have a lot of money behind their name, b) a lot of free time to run, c) an ideology palatable enough for them to stand a solid chance at getting elected, or d) the will or desire to go into a career of politics. It also e) ignores any other way the person in question is helping their cause.

By saying that this 33 year old means the solution is not shit, it must mean that the election of this 33 year old eliminated poverty, gave everyone much more free time, made all ideologies equally capable of winning, and made everyone want to go into politics.

That’s not even remotely what I said. Nothing changes by whining and complaining. Great change didn’t just come from protests and activism it also took voting and organizing.

Your response to many of our complaints regarding the system has been "run yourself."

[Wadua]

The 2020 US election has so far failed to materialise the changes that were expected. Therefore, I wanted to ask: is voting useless in the US for change and progressivism? Will people finally realise the futility of electoralism there, and begin to use methods of direct action such as general strike and disruption? Or do you still believe that voting isn't useless in their system?

I've argued that voting in the US has been useless for some time due to the broken and outdated electoral system, although I didn't post this yesterday to avoid accusations that I'm a Russian spy/Chinese saboteur/Kim Yo-Jung. I think the only way forward would be direct action such as large scale nonviolent protests and strikes. But that is my opinion, and I want to ask you in the words of comrade Lenin, "what is to be done?"

I was watching congress reconvene the other night, and I heard something that woke my brain up, these words "Abolish Electoral College". The electoral system if it's not going to be abolished needs some sort of reform, but as long as there is some sort of electoral college that votes directly, then I will think citizens getting a say in an election is more of an illusion and opinion, which is the popular vote.

[The Lone Alliance]

And that 33 year old man will accomplish absolutely nothing of value as a US senator with an idea of his own, he will do what he is told by his betters because he has no political experience, you could have replaced that 33 year old man with a cardboard cut out and gotten the same level of competence.

Better yet, a then 70-year-old man with no political experience hated every last establishment politician, ran, and was elected, and he's been doing his darnedest these past four years to set the country back as far back as possible.

Ah yes he is another good example to bring up about the utter failings of simply using the power of hate and "OUTSIDER" to change things.
Despite all his attempts that man has accomplished very little to do that as well, even with the entire weightly power of the executive branch behind him.

The best that man could do was put the country into political gridlock on any sort of structural change for four years with his own inability to get things done because of his non-existent political experience beyond yelling really loudly and being a noxious asshole, even with his supposed party of choice supposedly backing him he accomplished very little in regards to any sort of actual 'change' in the country, ultimately he, like in most things he did, failed to accomplish much of anything he set out to do.

In the end he was ultimately a tool as well, just like the 33 year old will be, because if you have no political experience then it's quite easy for the system to use you to their own advantage and then ultimately discard you when you outlive your usefulness if you continue to refuse to play the game.


That is what will happen to that 33 year old in the end, if they refuse to play the game and bend the knee ultimately the party's support will be stripped from them and they will be replaced with a puppet who better understands their strings.

And they know they can replace them with puppets because in the end the fact that politics in the United States have become a form of sport, and some people will vote for them simply because they have the right party color and letter beside their name.

[Esalia]

You, indirectly/unintentionally.

Since my reason for calling "go run" a shit solution was, in short, that people aren't always capable of running (or willing to run), primarily because they a) may not have a lot of money behind their name, b) a lot of free time to run, c) an ideology palatable enough for them to stand a solid chance at getting elected, or d) the will or desire to go into a career of politics. It also e) ignores any other way the person in question is helping their cause.

By saying that this 33 year old means the solution is not shit, it must mean that the election of this 33 year old eliminated poverty, gave everyone much more free time, made all ideologies equally capable of winning, and made everyone want to go into politics.

That’s not even remotely what I said.

It's not what you said directly, but how else am I supposed to interpret you bringing up this individual?

Either they're irrelevant, or they're relevant. If they're relevant, they have to have had done everything I said they must have done for your solution to be not bad, or they're not relevant.

Nothing changes by whining and complaining. Great change didn’t just come from protests and activism it also took voting and organizing.

Indeed.

But when you drop the "go run" stuff, you ignore every single reason someone has to not run, and all the contributions the person made that isn't running. You ignore whether or not they've protested, engaged in activism, voted, or organised, in favour of this one specific way of contributing.

Which is why "if you don't like it, go run" is a bad suggestion. What if I haven't ran and don't want to run, but instead donated £5,000 to support my chosen candidates? Should I still have to run to meet your standards? If not, why is "go run" your standard?

[San Lumen]

That’s not even remotely what I said.

It's not what you said directly, but how else am I supposed to interpret you bringing up this individual?

Either they're irrelevant, or they're relevant. If they're relevant, they have to have had done everything I said they must have done for your solution to be not bad, or they're not relevant.

Nothing changes by whining and complaining. Great change didn’t just come from protests and activism it also took voting and organizing.

Indeed.

But when you drop the "go run" stuff, you ignore every single reason someone has to not run, and all the contributions the person made that isn't running. You ignore whether or not they've protested, engaged in activism, voted, or organised, in favour of this one specific way of contributing.

Which is why "if you don't like it, go run" is a bad suggestion. What if I haven't ran and don't want to run, but instead donated £5,000 to support my chosen candidates? Should I still have to run to meet your standards? If not, why is "go run" your standard?

You are completely utterly missing the point of what I’m saying.

[Esalia]

It's not what you said directly, but how else am I supposed to interpret you bringing up this individual?

Either they're irrelevant, or they're relevant. If they're relevant, they have to have had done everything I said they must have done for your solution to be not bad, or they're not relevant.



Indeed.

But when you drop the "go run" stuff, you ignore every single reason someone has to not run, and all the contributions the person made that isn't running. You ignore whether or not they've protested, engaged in activism, voted, or organised, in favour of this one specific way of contributing.

Which is why "if you don't like it, go run" is a bad suggestion. What if I haven't ran and don't want to run, but instead donated £5,000 to support my chosen candidates? Should I still have to run to meet your standards? If not, why is "go run" your standard?

You are completely utterly missing the point of what I’m saying.

What is your point then?

[San Lumen]

You are completely utterly missing the point of what I’m saying.

What is your point then?

That while activism and protests are important and have an impact changing who you send to elected office has a major impact as well.

[Sanghyeok]

What is your point then?

That while activism and protests are important and have an impact changing who you send to elected office has a major impact as well.

Direct action is as important if not more important than electoralism when those elections hardly make any difference in policy outcomes anyways.

[Kowani]

That while activism and protests are important and have an impact changing who you send to elected office has a major impact as well.

Direct action is as important if not more important than electoralism when those elections hardly make any difference in policy outcomes anyways.

hm
this overstates the similarities between the two parties, but it's still accurate in certain ways
but that's less because the dems are actually good and more because the GOP is veering off the deep end into insanity

[San Lumen]

Direct action is as important if not more important than electoralism when those elections hardly make any difference in policy outcomes anyways.

hm
this overstates the similarities between the two parties, but it's still accurate in certain ways
but that's less because the dems are actually good and more because the GOP is veering off the deep end into insanity

Yes but that doesn’t make voting useless

[San Montalbano]

hm
this overstates the similarities between the two parties, but it's still accurate in certain ways
but that's less because the dems are actually good and more because the GOP is veering off the deep end into insanity

Yes but that doesn’t make voting useless

voting is absolutely useless, it's a direct result of corporate/political powers moving money to push the nation towards their ideal, usually one against it's own interest.

[San Lumen]

Yes but that doesn’t make voting useless

voting is absolutely useless, it's a direct result of corporate/political powers moving money to push the nation towards their ideal, usually one against it's own interest.

Why don’t you run yourself?

[San Montalbano]

voting is absolutely useless, it's a direct result of corporate/political powers moving money to push the nation towards their ideal, usually one against it's own interest.

Why don’t you run yourself?

Eventually, when i say Useless I mean at a federal level btw

local politics is the best option for people, change the local area then work your way up.

[The Reformed American Republic]

Why don’t you run yourself?

Eventually, when i say Useless I mean at a federal level btw

local politics is the best option for people, change the local area then work your way up.

With your account set up the way that is, I am a bit concerned what type of change you seek.

[San Montalbano]

Eventually, when i say Useless I mean at a federal level btw

local politics is the best option for people, change the local area then work your way up.

With your account set up the way that is, I am a bit concerned what type of change you seek.

Id say the same about yourself, but meh to each their own

[The Reformed American Republic]

With your account set up the way that is, I am a bit concerned what type of change you seek.

Id say the same about yourself, but meh to each their own

Is your Nazism OOC? That's what I was referring to. As for my stats, they're messed up after I selected the wrong option on an issue.

[San Montalbano]

Id say the same about yourself, but meh to each their own

Is your Nazism OOC? That's what I was referring to. As for my stats, they're messed up after I selected the wrong option on an issue.

what would something like that have to do with voting rights in the USA?

[The Reformed American Republic]

Is your Nazism OOC? That's what I was referring to. As for my stats, they're messed up after I selected the wrong option on an issue.

what would something like that have to do with voting rights in the USA?

Well, voting is to enact change is it not? What you want changed in our government also has an influence on how you view voting as well, though I digress.

[San Montalbano]

what would something like that have to do with voting rights in the USA?

Well, voting is to enact change is it not? What you want changed in our government also has an influence on how you view voting as well, though I digress.

yes this is digressing

what I want is irrelevant, im just commenting on the "is voting useless in the US" aspect.

[New Visayan Islands]

Well, voting is to enact change is it not? What you want changed in our government also has an influence on how you view voting as well, though I digress.

yes this is digressing

what I want is irrelevant, im just commenting on the "is voting useless in the US" aspect.

It's also gravedigging, which is why I am locking this thread.

Thanks!
NVI