NATION

PASSWORD

What did the Ancient Egyptians look like?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:51 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:I heard about this, and no, an Israeli should not play an Egyptian queen.

As for what the ancient Egyptians looked like, well, that would be a lot like asking what an Arab looks like.
However, to say “Ancient Egyptian were white” would be false.
While yes, there were periods when ethnic Greeks ruled Egypt, occasional intermixing with black and brown Egyptians and life under the hot Egyptian sun had made them much darker than their Aegean counterparts. Egyptians were varying mixes of Abyssinian, Nubian/Kushite, Greek and Italian, and Coptic ancestry. Now, it’s that plus Arab ancestry, occasionally some Turkish ancestry, and in some relatively rare cases, Hausa ancestry.

Basically, if you want to portray an Egyptian correctly, use an actual Egyptian, or your average Arab, or even an Ethiopian or Sudanese.

But not an Israeli. Definitely not an Israeli.


The average Israeli looks like your average Arab. I've been there before and I couldn't tell them apart based on phenotype alone.


Maybe your average Syrian.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:52 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:I heard about this, and no, an Israeli should not play an Egyptian queen.

As for what the ancient Egyptians looked like, well, that would be a lot like asking what an Arab looks like.
However, to say “Ancient Egyptian were white” would be false.
While yes, there were periods when ethnic Greeks ruled Egypt, occasional intermixing with black and brown Egyptians and life under the hot Egyptian sun had made them much darker than their Aegean counterparts. Egyptians were varying mixes of Abyssinian, Nubian/Kushite, Greek and Italian, and Coptic ancestry. Now, it’s that plus Arab ancestry, occasionally some Turkish ancestry, and in some relatively rare cases, Hausa ancestry.

Basically, if you want to portray an Egyptian correctly, use an actual Egyptian, or your average Arab, or even an Ethiopian or Sudanese.

But not an Israeli. Definitely not an Israeli.


Egypt wasn't Islamicised until several centuries after the death of Cleopatra. It has existed for longer as a non-Muslim country than it has as a Muslim.


Hence why I said “Now”.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

User avatar
Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 194289
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:53 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:
Egypt wasn't Islamicised until several centuries after the death of Cleopatra. It has existed for longer as a non-Muslim country than it has as a Muslim.


Hence why I said “Now”.


Insaan, if we’re going to go for historical accuracy here, it’s either an actress that looks Greek/Macedonian or Levantine.
Code name: Ratatouille Strychnine
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Heartless, ''transgendered non-binary kawaii Chan'', & a d*ck.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

User avatar
Aeolympos
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 5
Founded: Sep 01, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Aeolympos » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:54 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Egyptian Pharoahs must have been pretty messed up if their parents were siblings. How did the royal legacy even last with all that inbreeding?


12 Ptolemies doesn't imply 12 generations. When brother succeeded / deposed brother, the new pharaoh would be called Ptolemy just like the last one.

The last three Ptolemies (XII - XIV) were descended from the Greek mistress of number X - so at last there had been some admixture of fresh blood.

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:54 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:
Hence why I said “Now”.


Insaan, if we’re going to go for historical accuracy here, it’s either an actress that looks Greek/Macedonian or Levantine.


I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

User avatar
Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 194289
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:55 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Insaan, if we’re going to go for historical accuracy here, it’s either an actress that looks Greek/Macedonian or Levantine.


I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.


Have you looked at Cleopatra’s coinage?
Code name: Ratatouille Strychnine
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Heartless, ''transgendered non-binary kawaii Chan'', & a d*ck.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19702
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:56 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:
Egypt wasn't Islamicised until several centuries after the death of Cleopatra. It has existed for longer as a non-Muslim country than it has as a Muslim.


Hence why I said “Now”.


No. An Israeli is suitable for the role. Don't politicise it more than it already has been.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19702
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:59 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Insaan, if we’re going to go for historical accuracy here, it’s either an actress that looks Greek/Macedonian or Levantine.


I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.


The Siwi Berbers never attained any power in Egypt and most of them lived in the far west. The remainder of the Berbers lived in Algeria, Libya, and Morocco, and the Berber kingdoms and states were concentrated in Algeria and Morocco.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Aeolympos
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 5
Founded: Sep 01, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Aeolympos » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:03 pm

Rusozak wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
It didn’t last. With subsequent marriages between siblings, it weakened entirely. Why do you think the Ptolemies were able to take hold of it?


Because Ptolemy was a friend of Alexander the Great when he took Egypt from the Persians?


Ptolemy was Alexander's half-brother (bastard son of Phillip II, to be exact). Alexander took Egypt from the Persians, who had defeated the last indigenous "dynasty"(just one father and one son and gone).

Before them, there had been Assyrian pharaohs and Nubian pharaohs and Libyan pharaohs.

The last long-lasting indigenous dynasty were the Ramessides, who's zenith was around 1200 BCE.

----------------

Almost every dynasty follows this pattern:
- Ambitious and energetic young man takes throne.
- Promising son takes over after young man has grown old and died.
- Maybe one more generation of greatness
- Incest and slow decline
- Outsider is ambitious end energetic and becomes new pharaoh with new dynasty.

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:
I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.


The Siwi Berbers never attained any power in Egypt and most of them lived in the far west. The remainder of the Berbers lived in Algeria, Libya, and Morocco, and the Berber kingdoms and states were concentrated in Algeria and Morocco.


I am aware. I’m part Amazigh.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

User avatar
Borderlands of Rojava
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5745
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
The average Israeli looks like your average Arab. I've been there before and I couldn't tell them apart based on phenotype alone.


Maybe your average Syrian.


The ancient Egyptians were genetically closest to levantines. If they looked anything like modern Egyptians who share most of their DNA, they probably looked like Gal Gadot.
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

User avatar
Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 194289
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:
Hence why I said “Now”.


No. An Israeli is suitable for the role. Don't politicise it more than it already has been.


I mean she is Levantine.

I still don’t get how with all that’s happening, some have managed to get the energy and time to get outraged over this casting choice.
Code name: Ratatouille Strychnine
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Heartless, ''transgendered non-binary kawaii Chan'', & a d*ck.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Insaanistan wrote:
I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.


Have you looked at Cleopatra’s coinage?


Yes.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

User avatar
Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 194289
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:06 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Have you looked at Cleopatra’s coinage?


Yes.


She looks pretty Greek/Macedonian in them to me. Not Bereber.
Code name: Ratatouille Strychnine
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Heartless, ''transgendered non-binary kawaii Chan'', & a d*ck.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

User avatar
UniversalCommons
Senator
 
Posts: 4008
Founded: Jan 24, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby UniversalCommons » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:06 pm

There is a facial reconstruction of Cleopatra based on her statuary. The main issue is skin tone. There is a pretty good idea of the facial structure, height and weight of Cleopatra. By our standards she is not particularly beautiful.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_cpToIwY89Rc/T ... ructed.jpg

User avatar
Borderlands of Rojava
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5745
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:07 pm

Insaanistan wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Insaan, if we’re going to go for historical accuracy here, it’s either an actress that looks Greek/Macedonian or Levantine.


I’d say your average Berber would be best. Or, ya know, an Egyptian.


Tunisians are mainly of berber heritage (according to recent studies 88% of their genes are native to North africa).

Just some examples of what tunisians look like:

https://theconversation.com/amp/why-tun ... tion-90163

https://thearabweekly.com/tunisia-eases ... irus-cases

https://images.app.goo.gl/eZ1geigUF48k7SRQ8

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/04/opin ... t.amp.html

Idk man. I can't tell them apart from Greeks or Italians
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

User avatar
Salus Maior
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20109
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:09 pm

Cleopatra was a Greek-Egyptian from a very...Erm..."Well insulated" family.

She wasn't black if that's what people are angry about. Although certainly plenty of Egyptians were black and all sorts of colors if Egyptian art is anything to go by.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist.

This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. -1 Timothy 1:15

“My entire endeavor has always been to clearly recognize the Will of God in all things and to follow it as completely as possible.” -Blessed Charles of Austria, last Habsburg Emperor

User avatar
Borderlands of Rojava
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5745
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:10 pm

UniversalCommons wrote:There is a facial reconstruction of Cleopatra based on her statuary. The main issue is skin tone. There is a pretty good idea of the facial structure, height and weight of Cleopatra. By our standards she is not particularly beautiful.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_cpToIwY89Rc/T ... ructed.jpg


Idk she's kinda cute. Not as fuck ugly as some said.
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

User avatar
Borderlands of Rojava
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5745
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:11 pm

Salus Maior wrote:Cleopatra was a Greek-Egyptian from a very...Erm..."Well insulated" family.

She wasn't black if that's what people are angry about. Although certainly plenty of Egyptians were black and all sorts of colors if Egyptian art is anything to go by.


When you compare Egyptians in their artwork to nubians, it becomes clear the Egyptians were not identical in appearance to your average sub Saharan African
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

User avatar
Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 194289
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:11 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:Cleopatra was a Greek-Egyptian from a very...Erm..."Well insulated" family.

She wasn't black if that's what people are angry about. Although certainly plenty of Egyptians were black and all sorts of colors if Egyptian art is anything to go by.


When you compare Egyptians in their artwork to nubians, it becomes clear the Egyptians were not identical in appearance to your average sub Saharan African


Do you think the casting is fine?
Code name: Ratatouille Strychnine
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Heartless, ''transgendered non-binary kawaii Chan'', & a d*ck.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 33720
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:12 pm

They should find an Egyptian actress to do it.

Anything else is... not the correct way to go. Cleopatra is Egyptian, not Jewish. This is bad. I object to the casting.

User avatar
UniversalCommons
Senator
 
Posts: 4008
Founded: Jan 24, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby UniversalCommons » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:13 pm

Traditionally Romans liked shorter darker people. They considered tall people not very attractive.

User avatar
Aeolympos
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 5
Founded: Sep 01, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Aeolympos » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:13 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
UniversalCommons wrote:There is a facial reconstruction of Cleopatra based on her statuary. The main issue is skin tone. There is a pretty good idea of the facial structure, height and weight of Cleopatra. By our standards she is not particularly beautiful.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_cpToIwY89Rc/T ... ructed.jpg


Idk she's kinda cute. Not as fuck ugly as some said.


Attractiveness is way more than just physical beauty. She was probably very attractive: expressive eyes, luscious smile, sparkling wit, and the like...

User avatar
Borderlands of Rojava
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5745
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:14 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
When you compare Egyptians in their artwork to nubians, it becomes clear the Egyptians were not identical in appearance to your average sub Saharan African


Do you think the casting is fine?


Completely fine. There were probably a million Egyptian women who looked like Gal Gadot.

For christ's sake I live in an area with a coptic church right down the street. Those folks are the descendants of the ancient Egyptians and they don't look any different from other Middle Eastern people. They aren't black if thats one some think.
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

User avatar
Insaanistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2692
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby Insaanistan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:14 pm

Salus Maior wrote:Cleopatra was a Greek-Egyptian from a very...Erm..."Well insulated" family.

She wasn't black if that's what people are angry about. Although certainly plenty of Egyptians were black and all sorts of colors if Egyptian art is anything to go by.

While I agree with you, there’s a significant change she was part Nubian. Though all Afro-centrists beware, because this almost certainly would barely affect her phenotype at all.
السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركته
May the peace and blessings of God be with you!
Hello brother (or sister),
I’m an unapologetic Muslim and overall peaceful person.
My parents think I am an Indophile and Arabophile.
If you have any questions about Islam, or want to debate in a civil manner, I’m open to it.
Peace and Love.

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baltenstein, Estanglia, Ethel mermania, Lost Memories, Thepeopl, Thermodolia, Valentine Z, Vassenor

Advertisement

Remove ads