MAGAThread XX: A Journal of the Plague Year

[Pax Forti]

So Pelosi and Harris can manipulate our genes to the point of "abolishing basic biology", implement universal healthcare, increase taxes on the rich to fund social programs, and deplatform domestic terrorists and insurrectionists?

Don't threaten me with a good time.

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
You think that your universal healthcare is free? But of course, if you're in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes. That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?
Facts don't care about your feelings. Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills. That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.
I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your psychotic needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings. Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. Monetary incentive is much more effective than government force. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.
Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.

For legal reasons, as the minister of security for the global union consortium, I am legally obligated to indicate that our member states have the freedom to express themselves, but unless an official letterhead is attached, our region is not to be taking part in this discussion. In an official way.

[An Alan Smithee Nation]

For legal reasons, as the minister of security for the global union consortium, I am legally obligated to indicate that our member states have the freedom to express themselves, but unless an official letterhead is attached, our region is not to be taking part in this discussion. In an official way.

General is an out of character discussion forum.

[Picairn]

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.

Buddy you are the only one here assuming about my character based on your own biased perception of a sarcastic response.

You think that your universal healthcare is free?

Free at the point of service, obviously. Europeans never have to see a bill when they go to a hospital, and their prices are far cheaper than our premiums and deductibles.

But of course, if you're in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes.

Wrong. The poor also have to pay sales tax, consumption tax, fees and charges, as well as income tax, federal and state.

That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?

"Basic mammalian biology", or a bullshit outdated view of gender by society?

Facts don't care about your feelings.

Yet you came here armed with only feelings.

Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills.

That's a bold faced lie. Only the richest would see their tax rates go up. There's this thing called "Progressive tax rates", you know.

That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.

"Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.

I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your psychotic needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings.

Transphobia much? What beef do you have with transgender people that you hate them so much?

Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.

I don't recall government investments in European countries and even in the US that have led to these countries collapsing. The Internet was created by government research. So are spaceships and aircraft technology.

Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.

When did Antifa storm the Capitol? I'll wait.

[The NCNSA]

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.

Buddy you are the only one here assuming about my character based on your own biased perception of a sarcastic response.

You think that your universal healthcare is free?

Free at the point of service, obviously. Europeans never have to see a bill when they go to a hospital, and their prices are far cheaper than our premiums and deductibles.

But of course, if you're in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes.

Wrong. The poor also have to pay sales tax, consumption tax, fees and charges, as well as income tax, federal and state.

That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?

"Basic mammalian biology", or a bullshit outdated view of gender by society?

Facts don't care about your feelings.

Yet you came here armed with only feelings.

Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills.

That's a bold faced lie. Only the richest would see their tax rates go up. There's this thing called "Progressive tax rates", you know.

That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.

"Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.

I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your psychotic needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings.

Transphobia much? What beef do you have with transgender people that you hate them so much?

Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.

I don't recall government investments in European countries and even in the US that have led to these countries collapsing. The Internet was created by government research. So are spaceships and aircraft technology.

Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.

When did Antifa storm the Capitol? I'll wait.

Alright, let's take these points down one by one.
First of all, if you aren't a selfish lib, I'm sorry for assuming. I only had your message to go off of, and believe me, some people don't view that with sarcasm. If you don't want to seem like a selfish lib, don't talk like one.

Your second point: True, poor people have to pay taxes, but at a much, much lower percentage than those who are in higher income brackets. Also, there's this thing called social programs, which I really want an overhaul of, that gives money right back to the poor, so in essence, it's a net zero.

Third point: Keep in mind that there's a very clear distinction between gender and sex. I failed to recognize that (my bad), but I believe that for all government processes, legal processes, and medical processes, biological sex should be used, not gender. Gender only applies to everyday life, and I have already said, if you have a preferred pronoun, I'll use it! It would be rude to not comply. I simply view the movement as rather silly, and that these people have better things to do.

Fourth point: That is the exact reason as to why I hate UH! Money doesn't grow from the ground. The rich people are rich because of hard work and gumption (or their parents). I believe it would be extremely unfair to take their hard-earned money from them and give it to the poor, who frequently don't deserve it. (I live in a homeless-ridden area, so this assumption may be a bit local.)

Fifth point: If government gives everything to poor people for free, that's not gonna help their prospects: it will only make it worse. By giving them things they have not earned, you incentivize laziness and lack of responsibility. As for the "working their asses off and staying in the same position," I can personally prove you wrong there. My family is a counterexample to that argument. They came to America with basically nothing, and after years of hard work, we have established a good life here. Education is the key, and if our education system is the same bullshit government-run system in the future, then perhaps your claim may be substantiated.

Sixth point: I hold nothing against transgenderism (may not have come across like that). I merely believe that the concept ought not to be enforced by law. I don't think that's asking a lot.

Seventh point: In fact, you are wrong there. Most of our military tech, like fighter planes and tanks, come not from a government-run program, but government investment in a private enterprise. The government played as a player in the private market, which is totally fine. What's not fine is control of the private market, like a socialist regime, or your gene editing thing. I could argue morals, but that's boring. Rather, government can invest in gene-editing companies, but in no way should they try to take control of the business. JPL is a private company, but the US gov owns 100% of the stock. There's a difference between that and some National Institute of Propulsion, as the labor has been paid for fairly by the gov in the first place.

Seventh point II: If what's above is what you mean, where gov funds private industry, that leads to things like corporate oligarchies and monopolies, so if you want your gene-editing to stay cheap, make it completely and utterly privately-funded.

Final point: Are you blind? Antifa has done wayyy more damage than the alt-right. The BLM protests basically trashed every major city there is in America. Seattle was a warzone. Portland was like Seattle. There was an estimated cost of well over $1 billion total. If that doesn't count as domestic terrorism, I don't know what is.

[Pax Forti]

Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.

I don't really have a side in this debate, but I will say that this is definitively incorrect. My grandmother grew up in a period of great internal turmoil in the country she came from, she was one of 12 children, half of which survived into adulthood. When she was five the entire family was living on less than $1,000 a year. Yet my grandmother was still able to attend college on scholarships, right through a period in the cultural revolution when government funding for what was considered Western education was considerably reduced, and she was able to set up a comfortable middle-class living for my mother. My mother was then, in turn, able to emigrate to the United States, where she met my father, and today they're making over $450,000 annually. I'm currently the age of 22, and my family is more or less pure evidence that, at least in rare scenarios if you will, that prospects do work out better as generations go by.

When it comes to capitalism, how hard you work is less relevant versus to how smart you work. I would argue that getting a good education, preferably on merit scholarships or need-based scholarships is far more important than toiling in the coal mines when it comes to improving your odds of advancing in the social hierarchy.

Despite this, I really don't care about politics, I just wanted to make that known.

[Jedi Council]

Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.

I don't really have a side in this debate, but I will say that this is definitively incorrect. My grandmother grew up in a period of great internal turmoil in the country she came from, she was one of 12 children, half of which survived into adulthood. When she was five the entire family was living on less than $1,000 a year. Yet my grandmother was still able to attend college on scholarships, right through a period in the cultural revolution when government funding for what was considered Western education was considerably reduced, and she was able to set up a comfortable middle-class living for my mother. My mother was then, in turn, able to emigrate to the United States, where she met my father, and today they're making over $450,000 annually. I'm currently the age of 22, and my family is more or less pure evidence that, at least in rare scenarios if you will, that prospects do work out better as generations go by.

When it comes to capitalism, how hard you work is less relevant versus to how smart you work. I would argue that getting a good education, preferably on merit scholarships or need-based scholarships is far more important than toiling in the coal mines when it comes to improving your odds of advancing in the social hierarchy.

Despite this, I really don't care about politics, I just wanted to make that known.

The point is you are the exception, not the rule.

A bootstrap mentality works for an infinitesimally small number of families.

[Jedi Council]

Buddy you are the only one here assuming about my character based on your own biased perception of a sarcastic response.


Free at the point of service, obviously. Europeans never have to see a bill when they go to a hospital, and their prices are far cheaper than our premiums and deductibles.


Wrong. The poor also have to pay sales tax, consumption tax, fees and charges, as well as income tax, federal and state.


"Basic mammalian biology", or a bullshit outdated view of gender by society?


Yet you came here armed with only feelings.


That's a bold faced lie. Only the richest would see their tax rates go up. There's this thing called "Progressive tax rates", you know.


"Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.


Transphobia much? What beef do you have with transgender people that you hate them so much?


I don't recall government investments in European countries and even in the US that have led to these countries collapsing. The Internet was created by government research. So are spaceships and aircraft technology.


When did Antifa storm the Capitol? I'll wait.

Alright, let's take these points down one by one.
First of all, if you aren't a selfish lib, I'm sorry for assuming. I only had your message to go off of, and believe me, some people don't view that with sarcasm. If you don't want to seem like a selfish lib, don't talk like one.

Your second point: True, poor people have to pay taxes, but at a much, much lower percentage than those who are in higher income brackets. Also, there's this thing called social programs, which I really want an overhaul of, that gives money right back to the poor, so in essence, it's a net zero.

Third point: Keep in mind that there's a very clear distinction between gender and sex. I failed to recognize that (my bad), but I believe that for all government processes, legal processes, and medical processes, biological sex should be used, not gender. Gender only applies to everyday life, and I have already said, if you have a preferred pronoun, I'll use it! It would be rude to not comply. I simply view the movement as rather silly, and that these people have better things to do.

Fourth point: That is the exact reason as to why I hate UH! Money doesn't grow from the ground. The rich people are rich because of hard work and gumption (or their parents). I believe it would be extremely unfair to take their hard-earned money from them and give it to the poor, who frequently don't deserve it. (I live in a homeless-ridden area, so this assumption may be a bit local.)

Fifth point: If government gives everything to poor people for free, that's not gonna help their prospects: it will only make it worse. By giving them things they have not earned, you incentivize laziness and lack of responsibility. As for the "working their asses off and staying in the same position," I can personally prove you wrong there. My family is a counterexample to that argument. They came to America with basically nothing, and after years of hard work, we have established a good life here. Education is the key, and if our education system is the same bullshit government-run system in the future, then perhaps your claim may be substantiated.

Sixth point: I hold nothing against transgenderism (may not have come across like that). I merely believe that the concept ought not to be enforced by law. I don't think that's asking a lot.

Seventh point: In fact, you are wrong there. Most of our military tech, like fighter planes and tanks, come not from a government-run program, but government investment in a private enterprise. The government played as a player in the private market, which is totally fine. What's not fine is control of the private market, like a socialist regime, or your gene editing thing. I could argue morals, but that's boring. Rather, government can invest in gene-editing companies, but in no way should they try to take control of the business. JPL is a private company, but the US gov owns 100% of the stock. There's a difference between that and some National Institute of Propulsion, as the labor has been paid for fairly by the gov in the first place.

Seventh point II: If what's above is what you mean, where gov funds private industry, that leads to things like corporate oligarchies and monopolies, so if you want your gene-editing to stay cheap, make it completely and utterly privately-funded.

Final point: Are you blind? Antifa has done wayyy more damage than the alt-right. The BLM protests basically trashed every major city there is in America. Seattle was a warzone. Portland was like Seattle. There was an estimated cost of well over $1 billion total. If that doesn't count as domestic terrorism, I don't know what is.

This is just a garbled mass of right wing talking points.

[The NCNSA]

I don't really have a side in this debate, but I will say that this is definitively incorrect. My grandmother grew up in a period of great internal turmoil in the country she came from, she was one of 12 children, half of which survived into adulthood. When she was five the entire family was living on less than $1,000 a year. Yet my grandmother was still able to attend college on scholarships, right through a period in the cultural revolution when government funding for what was considered Western education was considerably reduced, and she was able to set up a comfortable middle-class living for my mother. My mother was then, in turn, able to emigrate to the United States, where she met my father, and today they're making over $450,000 annually. I'm currently the age of 22, and my family is more or less pure evidence that, at least in rare scenarios if you will, that prospects do work out better as generations go by.

When it comes to capitalism, how hard you work is less relevant versus to how smart you work. I would argue that getting a good education, preferably on merit scholarships or need-based scholarships is far more important than toiling in the coal mines when it comes to improving your odds of advancing in the social hierarchy.

Despite this, I really don't care about politics, I just wanted to make that known.

The point is you are the exception, not the rule.

A bootstrap mentality works for an infinitesimally small number of families.

Unless if you can make a valid counterexample, this point flows through.
And when I mean valid, I mean that some guy who had a kid in high school, or went on drugs, or committed a crime, doesn't count.
Both rich and poor are subject to those pitfalls. Bootstrapping has nothing to do with this. Give me a valid example, where the guy worked hard as a kid, wasn't a delinquent, had a moderately successful school career, (Don't give me bullshit that poor ppl can't have successful school careers) and is still poor. This also applies into adulthood too.

[Jedi Council]

The point is you are the exception, not the rule.

A bootstrap mentality works for an infinitesimally small number of families.

Unless if you can make a valid counterexample, this point flows through.
And when I mean valid, I mean that some guy who had a kid in high school, or went on drugs, or committed a crime, doesn't count.
Both rich and poor are subject to those pitfalls. Bootstrapping has nothing to do with this. Give me a valid example, where the guy worked hard as a kid, wasn't a delinquent, had a moderately successful school career, (Don't give me bullshit that poor ppl can't have successful school careers) and is still poor. This also applies into adulthood too.

These tropes are just a right wing persons stereotype of what being poor is like. Repeating them just makes it sound like you've either been watching too much FOX, are massively entitled, or have never met a person who is truly living in crushing poverty. Go tell the single mom working two minimum wage jobs that she needs to work harder, I would love to see her reponse.

Taking your first point; many people commit crimes or take drugs for reasons beyond their control. Some are born with a predisposition, like fetal alcohol syndrome, while others are pushed towards these things because of a broken home or other childhood experiences such as abuse. These are more common in poorer families.

Poverty itself makes life more difficult and just saying "well work hard" is not actually useful. Most poor people are working hard, have you never heard of "the working poor?" Poorer people have less opportunity for work, less flexibility in their lives, are generally less healthy, and more prone to the very habits (drugs, crime etc) that you seem to dislike so much. Poverty itself is a self-reinforcing cycle.

To your second point, specifically about school; many poor people cannot afford higher education, in which case whether they do well or not in school is a moot point. A highschool diploma only gets you so far these days, and with the low wages, high cost of living, and crippling debt that student loans imply, many people cant even consider moving to something beyond it.

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

If people elect Trump again knowing now exactly what sort of President he is, I'm sad to say my sympathy for the American public will be... much reduced.

Congratulations, you have elected a president who is basically gonna be a puppet leader run by psychos like Pelosi and Harris. Basic biology will be abolished, medicare-for-all will be established, our income tax will skyrocket, and speech will be suppressed.
I'll be damned if Biden actually has a will.

So basically, Biden will turn Americans into femboys. Cool, gonna sort my Visa out once COVID buggers off.

[Picairn]

Your second point: True, poor people have to pay taxes, but at a much, much lower percentage than those who are in higher income brackets. Also, there's this thing called social programs, which I really want an overhaul of, that gives money right back to the poor, so in essence, it's a net zero.

What you said was just the income tax. Poor people have to pay flat taxes as well, such as sales tax, consumption tax, fees and charges etc. They may be pennies for the rich but a real pain for the poor, since the poor have much less income.

If the poor had to pay more taxes then they most likely would starve or become homeless. A billionaire will still live comfortably if he loses several millions, a poor person may starve if he doesn't get any money from his paycheck.

Fourth point: That is the exact reason as to why I hate UH! Money doesn't grow from the ground. The rich people are rich because of hard work and gumption (or their parents). I believe it would be extremely unfair to take their hard-earned money from them and give it to the poor, who frequently don't deserve it. (I live in a homeless-ridden area, so this assumption may be a bit local.)

Universal healthcare means healthier citizens, which leads to a healthier workforce, which leads to greater economic benefits. You can hardly work more if you are bed-ridden. That's why I believe UH will be a net benefit for society and the economy at large.

The rich lives in this society and benefits from common goods (roads, R/D grants, subsidies, etc.) and thus they must contribute back. Virtually all citizens must contribute if they desire a good society for themselves and others. The rich should contribute more, since they benefited greatly from society and government.

Fifth point: If government gives everything to poor people for free, that's not gonna help their prospects: it will only make it worse. By giving them things they have not earned, you incentivize laziness and lack of responsibility.

No, you don't. By giving welfare, you actually incentivize more work, because now the poor won't be worrying too much about surviving or scrambling to take care of their family members. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theatl ... le/555119/

As for the "working their asses off and staying in the same position," I can personally prove you wrong there. My family is a counterexample to that argument. They came to America with basically nothing, and after years of hard work, we have established a good life here. Education is the key, and if our education system is the same bullshit government-run system in the future, then perhaps your claim may be substantiated.

Yet many poor people can not even afford a decent education. You think your family is poor? If they can move then they are already richer than the poorest in many societies. The story of your family is a cool anecdote, and it doesn't prove me wrong because it's an exception, not a trend.

I live in a small South East Asian country, and I know of families who remain poor throughout generations. They are farmers or fishermen, who live in remote areas (mountains or seashores), on barren lands awash with storms, cut off from the rest of the country, who can't afford education for their children because they can barely make enough to survive everyday. One bad day or bad season may actually mean starvation for the entire family. How can they lift themselves by their bootstraps if they have no education nor time nor money to make inventions and work smarter?

Sixth point: I hold nothing against transgenderism (may not have come across like that). I merely believe that the concept ought not to be enforced by law. I don't think that's asking a lot.

"Enforced by law" is a vague term. For example, the Supreme Court declared that homosexual marriage is legal in 2015. Since it was enforced by law, are you against homosexual marriage?

Seventh point: In fact, you are wrong there. Most of our military tech, like fighter planes and tanks, come not from a government-run program, but government investment in a private enterprise. The government played as a player in the private market, which is totally fine. What's not fine is control of the private market, like a socialist regime, or your gene editing thing. I could argue morals, but that's boring. Rather, government can invest in gene-editing companies, but in no way should they try to take control of the business. JPL is a private company, but the US gov owns 100% of the stock. There's a difference between that and some National Institute of Propulsion, as the labor has been paid for fairly by the gov in the first place.

It is precisely government grants and funding that helped create new inventions. I'm not wrong there. Who here even advocated for full control of the market? And gene editing may actually be the next step in evolution. We now have the ability to purge genetic diseases from our offsprings and even enhance their abilities. Isn't this a good thing for all?

Seventh point II: If what's above is what you mean, where gov funds private industry, that leads to things like corporate oligarchies and monopolies, so if you want your gene-editing to stay cheap, make it completely and utterly privately-funded.

Monopolies and oligarchies stem from lack of control in the market, not from government grants. We have regulations and the trust-busting act to prevent that. And no, make it privately-funded without regulations may cause companies to keep their inventions a secret and raise prices for everybody else.

Final point: Are you blind? Antifa has done wayyy more damage than the alt-right. The BLM protests basically trashed every major city there is in America. Seattle was a warzone. Portland was like Seattle. There was an estimated cost of well over $1 billion total. If that doesn't count as domestic terrorism, I don't know what is.

Antifa and BLM et al are loose networks of like-minded individuals. They are decentralized movements that do not make organized attacks on the US. The riots were mostly opportunistic looting and burning by some LARPing anarchists, not organized terrorism with clear preparation and malicious intent. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.brooki ... ually/amp/

The alt-right killed more people, much more. The FBI identified white supremacy, a pillar of the alt-right, as the number one threat of terrorism. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politi ... dhs-409236

Also they stormed the Capitol, a major government building. Those who participated in that are rightfully insurrectionists.

[Page]

Can we please not call the MAGA rioters anarchists? If your goal is to overturn an election to keep an aspiring dictator in power, you're not an anarchist. By definition, anarchists are against the state, Trumpers are statists to the extreme.

[Picairn]

I don't really have a side in this debate, but I will say that this is definitively incorrect. My grandmother grew up in a period of great internal turmoil in the country she came from, she was one of 12 children, half of which survived into adulthood. When she was five the entire family was living on less than $1,000 a year. Yet my grandmother was still able to attend college on scholarships, right through a period in the cultural revolution when government funding for what was considered Western education was considerably reduced, and she was able to set up a comfortable middle-class living for my mother. My mother was then, in turn, able to emigrate to the United States, where she met my father, and today they're making over $450,000 annually. I'm currently the age of 22, and my family is more or less pure evidence that, at least in rare scenarios if you will, that prospects do work out better as generations go by.

When it comes to capitalism, how hard you work is less relevant versus to how smart you work. I would argue that getting a good education, preferably on merit scholarships or need-based scholarships is far more important than toiling in the coal mines when it comes to improving your odds of advancing in the social hierarchy.

Despite this, I really don't care about politics, I just wanted to make that known.

Generational poverty is a real phenomenon, and your anecdote does not disprove that. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycle_of_poverty

If your grandmother truly managed to get into school on government scholarship, congrats. And your mother gathered enough money to emigrate to the US? Even better. You are already luckier than my family. And my family is still luckier than unofficial garbage collectors, those who go house to house to collect papers, bottles, and sell them to recycling factories or junkyards. Harsh job, with poor working conditions (toiling on the streets and in junkyards under the burning sun for more than 8 hours isn't good for your health), and they make barely enough for their families to live one more day. Same goes for farmers or fishermen. How can they afford education if they can only make barely enough to survive, without government help?

[Gravlen]

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
Y'all think that your universal healthcare is free?

Yeah, arguing for healthcare for all, how can you be so selfish and think only about yourself?

[Page]

So Pelosi and Harris can manipulate our genes to the point of "abolishing basic biology", implement universal healthcare, increase taxes on the rich to fund social programs, and deplatform domestic terrorists and insurrectionists?

Don't threaten me with a good time.

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
Y'all think that your universal healthcare is free? But of course, if you guys are in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes. That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?
Facts don't care about your feelings. Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills. That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.
I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your mental needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings. Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. Monetary incentive is much more effective than government force. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.
Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.
Also, just because I believe gender ought not to be changed doesn't mean I won't respect your opinion and call you by your prefered pronoun, only if you try to get your opinion made into law.
Believe me, now that I'm editing this, this really makes me seem like a hardline alt-righter, but I promise, I don't condone violence or discrimination against trans or homo communities in anyway, and I also firmly believe that the disabled ought to be helped in society, and those who act like they're disabled just for the benefits and positive stigma should perhaps rethink their actions.

Can you really not understand the simple concept that instead of paying for health insurance from profit seeking entities, all the money could go to a single, public insurance that could either provide the same services for less (because it only needs to break even) or even more services for what people pay now.

For profit insurance of any kind is a scam because the same thing that insurance accomplishes could be done simply by a collective pooling their money together without a middleman taking a cut.

And while it wouldn't be free, health care would be even cheaper if instead of just having single-payer we just nationalized everything. Then the hospital is no longer charging $5 for one of those little paper cups pills come in because the public owns the hospital, so everything is provided at cost.

[Borderlands of Rojava]

So Pelosi and Harris can manipulate our genes to the point of "abolishing basic biology", implement universal healthcare, increase taxes on the rich to fund social programs, and deplatform domestic terrorists and insurrectionists?

Don't threaten me with a good time.

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
Y'all think that your universal healthcare is free? But of course, if you guys are in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes. That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?
Facts don't care about your feelings. Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills. That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.

Buddy considering how much you've been arguing on here about your hot takes I probably work more hours than you do in these current times, and yet after all that hard work i barely can keep the heat on. That "better yourself" mentality only goes so far, and I dont think it's too much to ask for people with more money than they'll ever need to pay a little more in taxes so those who can barely get by survive. They're not afraid to pay more taxes cause they'll end up on the street. They (Jeff Bezos, Mark Zuckerberg, Mitt Romney, Donald Trump, Elon Musk etc) are just being greedy. Your "hard work will save you" mentality so far hasn't stopped the homeless crisis out west nor has it helped millions of american families put food on the table. So in short, you don't know what you're talking about and probably haven't ever actually met a poor person in your life. It must be cool not having to see the suffering of the world out in your safe exurban home. Being able to pretend there's justice in it when there isn't. No one wants the government to be daddy. We want the government do what it's supposed to do which is provide for the wellbeing of its citizens.

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Pull yourself up by the bootstraps" have been repeatedly debunked by generational poverty. There are poor people who work their asses off in factories, mines and junkyards, under horrific conditions, yet their prospects are no better throughout years. It seems to me, that there are factors beyond our control that traps us into poverty.

I don't really have a side in this debate, but I will say that this is definitively incorrect. My grandmother grew up in a period of great internal turmoil in the country she came from, she was one of 12 children, half of which survived into adulthood. When she was five the entire family was living on less than $1,000 a year. Yet my grandmother was still able to attend college on scholarships, right through a period in the cultural revolution when government funding for what was considered Western education was considerably reduced, and she was able to set up a comfortable middle-class living for my mother. My mother was then, in turn, able to emigrate to the United States, where she met my father, and today they're making over $450,000 annually. I'm currently the age of 22, and my family is more or less pure evidence that, at least in rare scenarios if you will, that prospects do work out better as generations go by.

When it comes to capitalism, how hard you work is less relevant versus to how smart you work. I would argue that getting a good education, preferably on merit scholarships or need-based scholarships is far more important than toiling in the coal mines when it comes to improving your odds of advancing in the social hierarchy.

Despite this, I really don't care about politics, I just wanted to make that known.

Good for your grandmother. I went to college too but the scholarship i got was barely adequate and even while working my way through, I still didn't have enough money and had to drop out.

If poverty was that easy to escape, this society would have very few poor people.

[Istoreya]

And while it wouldn't be free, health care would be even cheaper if instead of just having single-payer we just nationalized everything. Then the hospital is no longer charging $5 for one of those little paper cups pills come in because the public owns the hospital, so everything is provided at cost.

*blinks in British*
you what
every time I learn more about healthcare in America the more glad I am that I am not American

[Borderlands of Rojava]

And while it wouldn't be free, health care would be even cheaper if instead of just having single-payer we just nationalized everything. Then the hospital is no longer charging $5 for one of those little paper cups pills come in because the public owns the hospital, so everything is provided at cost.

*blinks in British*
you what
every time I learn more about healthcare in America the more glad I am that I am not American

We're really behind the other western nations in most aspects, except for being warlike. We're such a warlike nation that millions of our people wanna go to war with each other.

[Myrensis]

So Pelosi and Harris can manipulate our genes to the point of "abolishing basic biology", implement universal healthcare, increase taxes on the rich to fund social programs, and deplatform domestic terrorists and insurrectionists?

Don't threaten me with a good time.

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
Y'all think that your universal healthcare is free? But of course, if you guys are in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes. That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?
Facts don't care about your feelings. Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills. That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.
I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your mental needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings. Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. Monetary incentive is much more effective than government force. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.
Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.
Also, just because I believe gender ought not to be changed doesn't mean I won't respect your opinion and call you by your prefered pronoun, only if you try to get your opinion made into law.
Believe me, now that I'm editing this, this really makes me seem like a hardline alt-righter, but I promise, I don't condone violence or discrimination against trans or homo communities in anyway, and I also firmly believe that the disabled ought to be helped in society, and those who act like they're disabled just for the benefits and positive stigma should perhaps rethink their actions.

Ya know, you didn't actually need to make a puppet just to cut and paste Ben Shapiro screeds.

[An Alan Smithee Nation]

Ya know, you didn't actually need to make a puppet just to cut and paste Ben Shapiro screeds.

If only these posters actually had the balls to own their statements, instead of creating a new puppet every time.

[Page]

Oh God. Another lib who only thinks about himself or herself.
Y'all think that your universal healthcare is free? But of course, if you guys are in the lower income bracket, you would know nothing about paying taxes. That your feelings are more important than basic mammalian biology?
Facts don't care about your feelings. Your healthcare would raise marginal tax rates to at least 50%. In other words, half of your salary would go to sleazebags who do nothing all day and wait for big daddy government to pay their bills. That is no way to live. Life isn't about finding a daddy to pay your bills for you, its about bettering yourself over time. Don't wait for somebody else to pick up your slack. It's the same with social programs. Don't force hard-working Americans to give up their hard-earned money to feed bozos who only play and don't work.
I couldn't give two hoots and a hell if you prefer to cut yourself up, change your biology, just to satisfy your mental needs. Just don't force the normal people to, by law, recognize you based on your personal feelings. Also, gene editing is far off, and if you think the government forcing scientists to research gene editing technology would be faster than a private industry motivated by wealth, you're completely wrong. Monetary incentive is much more effective than government force. There's a reason as to why basically all socialist countries have collapsed or are on the brink of collapsing.
Oh, and perhaps when you mean domestic terrorists, you mean not only the alt-right, whom I despise, but Antifa, who have wreaked so much more havoc than the alt-right could even dream of.
Also, just because I believe gender ought not to be changed doesn't mean I won't respect your opinion and call you by your prefered pronoun, only if you try to get your opinion made into law.
Believe me, now that I'm editing this, this really makes me seem like a hardline alt-righter, but I promise, I don't condone violence or discrimination against trans or homo communities in anyway, and I also firmly believe that the disabled ought to be helped in society, and those who act like they're disabled just for the benefits and positive stigma should perhaps rethink their actions.

Ya know, you didn't actually need to make a puppet just to cut and paste Ben Shapiro screeds.

Nah, if they were copypasting stuff from Ben Shapiro there would be a mention of how he's all about that DAP.

[Vassenor]

...So Trump is threatening that more insurrection will result if he is impeached for inciting insurrection.


We're past 47D chess at this point.

[Nakena]

Has anyone else noticed that theres barely any conservatives or trump supporters etc left on NSG?

This place has become a left-liberal echo chamber for the better or the worse.

[Adamede]

Has anyone else noticed that theres barely any conservatives or trump supporters etc left on NSG?

This place has become a left-liberal echo chamber for the better or the worse.

I still see a fair few conservatives, however rightists on here as long as I can remember have tended towards the authoritarian side of things.

And Trump and his supporters have been busy burning bridges.