MAGAThread XX: A Journal of the Plague Year

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Fun waking up to a message from my mom saying "Google is going to block my from accessing my Parler account! " to which I of course cannot reply "Jesus Christ Mom you're on Parler now?!" Then she says "I think I should change my voter affiliation from Republican to independent." "Why?" "IRS" "What about the IRS?" "They're going to go after Trump supporters" "Mom, that sounds kinda like a conspiracy theory..." "My coworker told me, her husband is a tax attorney!"

The radicalization of my family continues...

[Hurdergaryp]

Then you are complicit in the actions that occurred.
If you keep stating the election was fraudulent with no evidence and wish to overturn the election, that is anti-democratic.

There.. is a grain of truth to that. People who keep spreading the lies that caused the attack on the Capitol share blame.

Is that also legally true ? Is GMS a terrorist ?

A terrorist sympathizer and enabler, as far as I can judge. He wouldn't be the only one here in NationStates General.

[Galloism]

Notably, when you set up armed paramilitary guards on public thoroughfares, check people's IDs like they're crossing a national border, disclaiming state authority over you, disclaiming even being part of the USA at all, preventing people from entering or leaving in many instances, and literally standing in opposition to the law itself, you are acting somewhat more like a secessionist movement than hanging an asshole sign.

Akin to if someone put up a sign saying "congress must throw out the votes" not being the same as storming the capitol building and trying to force them to do so.

For fuck sake...

Yeah. Stop being disingenuous about this.

[Galloism]

Fun waking up to a message from my mom saying "Google is going to block my from accessing my Parler account! " to which I of course cannot reply "Jesus Christ Mom you're on Parler now?!" Then she says "I think I should change my voter affiliation from Republican to independent." "Why?" "IRS" "What about the IRS?" "They're going to go after Trump supporters" "Mom, that sounds kinda like a conspiracy theory..." "My coworker told me, her husband is a tax attorney!"

The radicalization of my family continues...

IRS doesn’t do that. They don’t even know who trump supporters are, nor do they care.

[Celritannia]

For fuck sake...

Yeah. Stop being disingenuous about this.

Stop linking 2 things that are in no way similar.

[Galloism]

Yeah. Stop being disingenuous about this.

Stop linking 2 things that are in no way similar.

Two seditious acts standing against the authority of the United States and the states in which they reside, as part of a pattern of escalating tension and political based violence culminating in a literal attempted coup are key to understanding how we got where we are, where rhetoric from both sides have gone on to endorse violence against the state as a legitimate method to achieve political aims.

No one is innocent here. We all did this.

[Vassenor]

Yeah. Stop being disingenuous about this.

Stop linking 2 things that are in no way similar.

Forced equivalence be like that.

[Galloism]

Stop linking 2 things that are in no way similar.

Forced equivalence be like that.

Hypocrisy is part and parcel of refusal to engage with how we got here.

So we’ll get here again, and again, and again. Because no one wants to acknowledge their part in the blame.

[Celritannia]

Stop linking 2 things that are in no way similar.

Two seditious acts standing against the authority of the United States and the states in which they reside, as part of a pattern of escalating tension and political based violence culminating in a literal attempted coup are key to understanding how we got where we are, where rhetoric from both sides have gone on to endorse violence against the state as a legitimate method to achieve political aims.

No one is innocent here. We all did this.

CHAZ wanted to see an end to police brutality.

Trump supporters wanted to overturn the election by force, planted bombs in offices of Congress people, had semi-automatic weapons and Molotov cocktails in a van, and built a gallows for Pence to be hanged.

[Vassenor]

Two seditious acts standing against the authority of the United States and the states in which they reside, as part of a pattern of escalating tension and political based violence culminating in a literal attempted coup are key to understanding how we got where we are, where rhetoric from both sides have gone on to endorse violence against the state as a legitimate method to achieve political aims.

No one is innocent here. We all did this.

CHAZ wanted to see an end to police brutality.

Trump supporters wanted to overturn the election by force, planted bombs in offices of Congress people, had semi-automatic weapons and Molotov cocktails in a van, and built a gallows for Pence to be hanged.

But you see BLM are the real traitors here. Somehow.

[Galloism]

Two seditious acts standing against the authority of the United States and the states in which they reside, as part of a pattern of escalating tension and political based violence culminating in a literal attempted coup are key to understanding how we got where we are, where rhetoric from both sides have gone on to endorse violence against the state as a legitimate method to achieve political aims.

No one is innocent here. We all did this.

CHAZ wanted to see an end to police brutality.

Doesn’t matter. You’re making an argument that their cause is just, which has nothing to do with their violent seditious acts, setting up border checkpoints, declaring autonomy from the authority of the USA, patrolling streets with paramilitary troops, and murdering teenage children with semi-automatic weapons (assault weapons, if you like that term) they were carrying around and enforcing border checkpoints with. As noted below:

Trump supporters wanted to overturn the election by force, planted bombs in offices of Congress people, had semi-automatic weapons and Molotov cocktails in a van, and built a gallows for Pence to be hanged.

They think the election was a fraud, a farce, and was an act against the United States. They’re wrong, in oh so many fucking ways, but they believe their cause is just just like you think Chaz’s cause was just.

It doesn’t change theirs, and CHAZ’s, violent seditious acts in pursuit of what they feel is a just cause.

It’s important to understand how we got here, and it’s both right and left arguing violence is ok for a just cause. To Biden’s credit, he disavowed the violence on his own side. You should too, and recognize this escalating pattern of political violence is how we got assholes storming the capitol building in an open attempt at a coup.

[Celritannia]

CHAZ wanted to see an end to police brutality.

Doesn’t matter. You’re making an argument that their cause is just, which has nothing to do with their violent seditious acts, setting up border checkpoints, declaring autonomy from the authority of the USA, patrolling streets with paramilitary troops, and murdering teenage children with semi-automatic weapons (assault weapons, if you like that term) they were carrying around and enforcing border checkpoints with. As noted below:

Trump supporters wanted to overturn the election by force, planted bombs in offices of Congress people, had semi-automatic weapons and Molotov cocktails in a van, and built a gallows for Pence to be hanged.

They think the election was a fraud, a farce, and was an act against the United States. They’re wrong, in oh so many fucking ways, but they believe their cause is just just like you think Chaz’s cause was just.

It doesn’t change theirs, and CHAZ’s, violent seditious acts in pursuit of what they feel is a just cause.

Chaz was not attempting an act of sedition.
It was an Occupation Protest.

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition.

[Galloism]

Doesn’t matter. You’re making an argument that their cause is just, which has nothing to do with their violent seditious acts, setting up border checkpoints, declaring autonomy from the authority of the USA, patrolling streets with paramilitary troops, and murdering teenage children with semi-automatic weapons (assault weapons, if you like that term) they were carrying around and enforcing border checkpoints with. As noted below:


They think the election was a fraud, a farce, and was an act against the United States. They’re wrong, in oh so many fucking ways, but they believe their cause is just just like you think Chaz’s cause was just.

It doesn’t change theirs, and CHAZ’s, violent seditious acts in pursuit of what they feel is a just cause.

Chaz was not attempting an act of sedition.
It was an Occupation Protest.

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

They both opposed by force the authority of the United States, and used force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of laws of the United States, and used force to seize property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

That’s sedition.

Also they murdered children. That’s not sedition, but it is heinous.

[Celritannia]

Chaz was not attempting an act of sedition.
It was an Occupation Protest.

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

They both opposed by force the authority of the United States, and used force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of laws of the United States, and used force to seize property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

That’s sedition.

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.

Mayor Jenny Durkan called the zone an attempt to "de-escalate interactions between protesters and law enforcement",[163] and Seattle police chief Carmen Best said that her officers would look at approaches to "reduce [their] footprint" in the Capitol Hill neighborhood.[35] City Council member Kshama Sawant spoke to occupants of Cal Anderson Park on June 8[8] and urged protesters to turn the precinct into a community center for restorative justice.[7][118]

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition by directly attacking the government of the US and wishing to ignore the democratic result of the nation, and strike fear into Congress.

Yes, the murdering of children is heinous, and they should be charged with murder.
But it was not an act of sedition.

[Des-Bal]

I wish I was a fucking ideologue. I've had a headache for the past month because I have to explain to Democrats and republicans why they're both assholes. I wish I could wrap my self in a nice warm blanket of "armed opposition to the government is cool when my side does it".

[Vassenor]

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384



They both opposed by force the authority of the United States, and used force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of laws of the United States, and used force to seize property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

That’s sedition.

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.

Mayor Jenny Durkan called the zone an attempt to "de-escalate interactions between protesters and law enforcement",[163] and Seattle police chief Carmen Best said that her officers would look at approaches to "reduce [their] footprint" in the Capitol Hill neighborhood.[35] City Council member Kshama Sawant spoke to occupants of Cal Anderson Park on June 8[8] and urged protesters to turn the precinct into a community center for restorative justice.[7][118]

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition by directly attacking the government of the US and wishing to ignore the democratic result of the nation, and strike fear into Congress.

Yes, the murdering of children is heinous, and they should be charged with murder.
But it was not an act of sedition.

But that would make BLM not EQUALLY BAD to the Capital Coup.

[Rusozak]

I wish I was a fucking ideologue. I've had a headache for the past month because I have to explain to Democrats and republicans why they're both assholes. I wish I could wrap my self in a nice warm blanket of "armed opposition to the government is cool when my side does it".

The burden of sanity.

[Celritannia]

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.



The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition by directly attacking the government of the US and wishing to ignore the democratic result of the nation, and strike fear into Congress.

Yes, the murdering of children is heinous, and they should be charged with murder.
But it was not an act of sedition.

But that would make BLM not EQUALLY BAD to the Capital Coup.

BLM is too vast and too broad to be considered a singular group, and that is a big difference between the 2, and why they cannot be so easily linked together.
Especially with the reactions of the police in both instances.

[Celritannia]

I wish I was a fucking ideologue. I've had a headache for the past month because I have to explain to Democrats and republicans why they're both assholes. I wish I could wrap my self in a nice warm blanket of "armed opposition to the government is cool when my side does it".

I dislike the democrats and I hate the Republicans.

I want a nice Progressive/Bull Moose Party to remerge in the US again.

[Galloism]

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384



They both opposed by force the authority of the United States, and used force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of laws of the United States, and used force to seize property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

That’s sedition.

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.

Yes the police did step back from the sedition, likely to try to avoid bloodshed, and you saw the DC police do the same when the seditious actors in DC the other day breached the capitol.

Our institutions have utterly failed us, repeatedly, which is another proximate cause for how we got here.

And keep in mind, these people in DC feel the government ignored their continuous plea to end the farce of election fraud (that never happened). They believe their cause is just, just like the CHAZ actors. They believe their rights have been violated and the government is abjectly refusing to act.

You are more alike than you realize.

It was still sedition to prevent by force the application of the law, and seize government rights and property interests to setup your own autonomous zone independent from the USA, enforcing such with semi automatic weapons (I know you thought that was important), going so far as to create national border checkpoints and declare people are leaving the USA by entering.

[Des-Bal]

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384



They both opposed by force the authority of the United States, and used force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of laws of the United States, and used force to seize property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

That’s sedition.

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.

Mayor Jenny Durkan called the zone an attempt to "de-escalate interactions between protesters and law enforcement",[163] and Seattle police chief Carmen Best said that her officers would look at approaches to "reduce [their] footprint" in the Capitol Hill neighborhood.[35] City Council member Kshama Sawant spoke to occupants of Cal Anderson Park on June 8[8] and urged protesters to turn the precinct into a community center for restorative justice.[7][118]

The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition by directly attacking the government of the US and wishing to ignore the democratic result of the nation, and strike fear into Congress.

Yes, the murdering of children is heinous, and they should be charged with murder.
But it was not an act of sedition.

The capitol siege was a direct result of the government not doing enough to investigate election fraud and to prevent the subversion of the democratic process. Their so called "assault on the seat of government" was actually an effort to support and defend the constitution.

Oh yeah it's so warm and snuggly to be pointlessly abd irrationally partisan.

[Des-Bal]

I dislike the democrats and I hate the Republicans.

I want a nice Progressive/Bull Moose Party to remerge in the US again.

No, it'll pretty much be this until we restore communication and reason and the fact that's been impossible has as much to do with the left as the right.

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CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.



The siege of Capitol Hill was sedition by directly attacking the government of the US and wishing to ignore the democratic result of the nation, and strike fear into Congress.

Yes, the murdering of children is heinous, and they should be charged with murder.
But it was not an act of sedition.

The capitol siege was a direct result of the government not doing enough to investigate election fraud and to prevent the subversion of the democratic process. Their so called "assault on the seat of government" was actually an effort to support and defend the constitution.

Oh yeah it's so warm and snuggly to be pointlessly abd irrationally partisan.

You're right, the government was certainly not doing enough to investigate election fraud. If they were, Trump and his whole team, the people attempting election fraud, would all be in trouble right now.

This is ridiculous, I hear people going "this guy voted in Pennsylvania but he was dead!" and "this ballot in Georgia didn't have a date on it."

You know what real election fraud looks like? You let a pandemic spin out of control which makes in person voting unsafe, then when mail in ballots are implemented as a necessary measure, you order all the sorting machines to be removed from the post office to make sure that mail delivery slows to a crawl so that the ballots will come late so that you can later go to court and say they shouldn't count.

The 2020 election was the biggest fraud attempt in US history, it just didn't work.

[Celritannia]

CHAZ was established du to the government ignoring their continuous pleas in an end to police brutality.
And their "armed Paramilitary," can be see as a militia protecting itself from tyranny, i.e. police brutality.
Even the Police Cheif stated they would step back from CHAZ.

Yes the police did step back from the sedition, likely to try to avoid bloodshed, and you saw the DC police do the same when the seditious actors in DC the other day breached the capitol.

Our institutions have utterly failed us, repeatedly, which is another proximate cause for how we got here.

And keep in mind, these people in DC feel the government ignored their continuous plea to end the farce of election fraud (that never happened). They believe their cause is just, just like the CHAZ actors. They believe their rights have been violated and the government is abjectly refusing to act.

You are more alike than you realize.

It was still sedition to prevent by force the application of the law, and seize government rights and property interests to setup your own autonomous zone independent from the USA, enforcing such with semi automatic weapons (I know you thought that was important), going so far as to create national border checkpoints and declare people are leaving the USA by entering.

Compared to, let's say, the Lafayette incident? Or the BLM DC Protests where National Guard members were stationed in the Capital?
They could have planned for this much better if they did the same thing with the BLM DC protests, but they didn't. It would have stopped them storming Capitol Hill.

And their feelings of an election fraud is equal to the injustice of killing unarmed black people? False equivalence right there.
Despite the fact there was no evidence of election fraud, they still believed it. So no, you cannot equate the 2.

Yeah, they were not really leaving the US though, so that's fucking stupid.
And CHAZ was mostly peaceful. Occupational Protest.

[Celritannia]

I dislike the democrats and I hate the Republicans.

I want a nice Progressive/Bull Moose Party to remerge in the US again.

No, it'll pretty much be this until we restore communication and reason and the fact that's been impossible has as much to do with the left as the right.

And when will the Trump supporters stop believing the lies that the election was rigged?