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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:55 pm
by Washington Resistance Army
Crysuko wrote:
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:It has been far more successful than libertarian communism, if for no other reason than the failure of these communes to organize any kind of competent military

far more successful at causing disasters.European countries that went fascist got their heads caved in, the only exception being Spain which was an odd sort of hybrid system which fell apart the moment Franco shuffled off anyway. Fascism thrives on conflict, and if it doesn't exist, it will create it. By it's own nature, it will inevitably burn itself out. LibSoc groups basically just want to be allowed to exist, and fight for self-preservation more than anything.


Spain very explicitly wasn't fascist. Franco cucked the Falange and stripped them of any and all power and the regime just became a TradCath junta.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:59 pm
by Crysuko
Kexholm Karelia wrote:
Crysuko wrote:who are you trying to fool. you say you are, and yet fail to do any criticising at all, and have vehemently defended it and cried MUH WHATABOUTISM at every turn. stop lying, you're terrible at it.

Your entire argument is based on whataboutism though

your entire argument is based on denial though

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:43 pm
by Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Crysuko wrote:far more successful at causing disasters.European countries that went fascist got their heads caved in, the only exception being Spain which was an odd sort of hybrid system which fell apart the moment Franco shuffled off anyway. Fascism thrives on conflict, and if it doesn't exist, it will create it. By it's own nature, it will inevitably burn itself out. LibSoc groups basically just want to be allowed to exist, and fight for self-preservation more than anything.


Spain very explicitly wasn't fascist. Franco cucked the Falange and stripped them of any and all power and the regime just became a TradCath junta.

That’s one of the main reasons I have mixed feelings about him, still a far better alternative to the Marxist leaning Second Republic, however. The poverty in Spain, while reduced under Franco, could have been reduced and sustained far better if the Falange had managed to bring their National Syndicalism to fruition, unfortunately, the Carlists saw that didn’t happen because they wanted their king and all that shit

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 5:55 pm
by Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Spain very explicitly wasn't fascist. Franco cucked the Falange and stripped them of any and all power and the regime just became a TradCath junta.

That’s one of the main reasons I have mixed feelings about him, still a far better alternative to the Marxist leaning Second Republic, however. The poverty in Spain, while reduced under Franco, could have been reduced and sustained far better if the Falange had managed to bring their National Syndicalism to fruition, unfortunately, the Carlists saw that didn’t happen because they wanted their king and all that shit

Adding a bit to that, it’s also important to mention Franco was allegedly partially responsible for the death of Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera, who, if he had survived, would likely have taken over the Nationalist movement as he enjoyed far more popular support and was more ideologically motivated as compared to Franco, who just went after power where he saw it. It’s clear Franco was not dedicated to his ideology when he caved in and adopted a capitalist system, alebit still a regulated one, but just imagine if this man replaced Franco

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:15 pm
by Crysuko
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:That’s one of the main reasons I have mixed feelings about him, still a far better alternative to the Marxist leaning Second Republic, however. The poverty in Spain, while reduced under Franco, could have been reduced and sustained far better if the Falange had managed to bring their National Syndicalism to fruition, unfortunately, the Carlists saw that didn’t happen because they wanted their king and all that shit

Adding a bit to that, it’s also important to mention Franco was allegedly partially responsible for the death of Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera, who, if he had survived, would likely have taken over the Nationalist movement as he enjoyed far more popular support and was more ideologically motivated as compared to Franco, who just went after power where he saw it. It’s clear Franco was not dedicated to his ideology when he caved in and adopted a capitalist system, alebit still a regulated one, but just imagine if this man replaced Franco

Franco lied, Primo died.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:22 pm
by Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana
Crysuko wrote:
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:Adding a bit to that, it’s also important to mention Franco was allegedly partially responsible for the death of Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera, who, if he had survived, would likely have taken over the Nationalist movement as he enjoyed far more popular support and was more ideologically motivated as compared to Franco, who just went after power where he saw it. It’s clear Franco was not dedicated to his ideology when he caved in and adopted a capitalist system, alebit still a regulated one, but just imagine if this man replaced Franco

Franco lied, Primo died.

Pretty much, yeah. He also wanted to appease the Carlists, who were basically neofeudalist theocrats

PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 3:44 am
by Suriyanakhon
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Crysuko wrote:far more successful at causing disasters.European countries that went fascist got their heads caved in, the only exception being Spain which was an odd sort of hybrid system which fell apart the moment Franco shuffled off anyway. Fascism thrives on conflict, and if it doesn't exist, it will create it. By it's own nature, it will inevitably burn itself out. LibSoc groups basically just want to be allowed to exist, and fight for self-preservation more than anything.


Spain very explicitly wasn't fascist. Franco cucked the Falange and stripped them of any and all power and the regime just became a TradCath junta.


Most historians such as Stanley Payne seem to categorize it as semi-fascist and that seems the most accurate designation. The best parallel would be Austrofascism with Dollfuss.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 8:33 pm
by Lamoni
This thread has been locked, due to moderation team concerns that this topic is far too broad to be effectively addressed, arguably even more so than a thread discussing what Socialism is would be. Moderation would lock such a thread, just as we did the RWDT/LWDT threads. If you want to discuss for and against socialist theory, you'll need a much more specific and defined topic than "people who hate socialism come hang here." These moderation team concerns are coupled with the recent thread hijacks in the Anti-Socialism thread, to include discussions about Asians and sexuality, as well as discussions about slavery, and theocratic government structures, none of which have anything to do with the actual topic of discussion.

Thus, after discussion among the moderation team, it has been decided that this thread will be locked, and remain so.