Anti-Socialism Thread

[Frazerland]

Socialism is a toxic ideology that has corroded the minds of it blindly faithful adherents. There's no use trying to combat their arguments with facts, logic, statistics, or rational thinking of any kind.... just earlier today I saw on twitter a socialist had quote tweeted a capitalist who had shared a picture of a poverty stricken family in their dirt hovel kitchen in Cuba. Barely clothed, cramped, dirty, barely functioning, poor struggling victims of the corrupt, wreckless, failed leftist experiment that is communism, the psychotic disturbed older brother of socialism. The capitalist stated "socialists see this and go yeah but free healthcare though" (something achievabe easily as stated, in capitalist countries, my own being a great example.) To which the socialist quote tweeter rebutted with "omg capitalists really think having a fully renovated kitchen with granite worktops is the ultimate goal and more important than healthcare. This is an aesthetic. A lifestyle choice. This is what 70% of new york city apartments look like, it's cool now." So yes that is the disturbing state of delusion socialists are living in. So yes I agree that as this sort of thinking becomes more and more mandated and forced upon our populations while any daring to dissent are shamed and vilified, yes it's a threat to societal progress, despite their self declaring as "progressives".

[Ancapstands]

Any Fellow Anarcho-primitivis in here?

[Nevertopia]

which countries?

Like, the entire former Soviet Union.

Man the soviet union was great, heres a book that details how amazing it was for a world superpower to be communist. Its a must-read for every communist who wants to experience the glory of the USSR at its peak.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gulag_Archipelago

[Cordel One]

Marx: The capitalist version of colonialism is progress toward communism. Capitalism is bad, but we can make a post-capitalist society without exploitation.

You: Huh, he must be saying colonialism is good, actually, because it fulfills his political objections.

Yes because he wants it to prove communism can work. Don't you realize thats what hes talking about when colonialism is progress toward communism?

Marx also thinks capitalism is inevitable and it is necessary for the transition to communism. Marx=capitalist????

[Disgraces]

Any Fellow Anarcho-primitivis in here?

Totalitarian primitivism is better

[Nevertopia]

Yes because he wants it to prove communism can work. Don't you realize thats what hes talking about when colonialism is progress toward communism?

Marx also thinks capitalism is inevitable and it is necessary for the transition to communism. Marx=capitalist????

Yes, Marx supported capitalism. That should tell you then even in his idealized model, capitalism was still a module of prosperity.

[-Ra-]

Yes because he wants it to prove communism can work. Don't you realize thats what hes talking about when colonialism is progress toward communism?

Marx also thinks capitalism is inevitable and it is necessary for the transition to communism. Marx=capitalist????

The point here is that Marx abetted colonialism because he thought it would further his political objectives, while liberal thinkers actively opposed it.

[Disgraces]

Marx supported capitalism.

You gotta be fucking kidding

[UniversalCommons]

Time to poke holes in things. The Nordic Model as a base will eclipse the majority of socialist and capitalist economies. As the north opens becomes of climate change, the Nordic Countries will become richer and their model stronger. Variations of social democracy will emerge to challenge both socialism and capitalism. Some of these will include growth in employee ownership and new varieties of investment strategies that are bottom up, like wefunder, kickstarter and similar strategies.

Another counter to the Nordic Model is a mixed economic system based on increased employee ownership-- syndicates, cooperatives, partnerships, and family owned businesses.

[-Ra-]

Time to poke holes in things. The Nordic Model as a base will eclipse the majority of socialist and capitalist economies. As the north opens becomes of climate change, the Nordic Countries will become richer and their model stronger. Variations of social democracy will emerge to challenge both socialism and capitalism. Some of these will include growth in employee ownership and new varieties of investment strategies that are bottom up, like wefunder, kickstarter and similar strategies.

The Nordic Model is capitalist. It's Social capitalism.

[Cloud-Cuckoo-Land]

What if Ra is actually the biggest commie and socialist of us all and he purposefully makes the pro-capitalist narrative sound bad in order to smear it?

Would be based

No. It is not something to be admired - if I am indeed right about Ra (at this point, I have no idea if I am).
It is not an honest rhetoric and it does not lead to communities with variable views reaching out to each other to engage in constructive dialogue. It only gives people more justification to stay in their respective information bubbles, to create the "us" and "them" narrative and to keep indulging and congratulating each other instead of challenging each other's views in pursuit of the actual truth.

[Albrenia]

Time to poke holes in things. The Nordic Model as a base will eclipse the majority of socialist and capitalist economies. As the north opens becomes of climate change, the Nordic Countries will become richer and their model stronger. Variations of social democracy will emerge to challenge both socialism and capitalism. Some of these will include growth in employee ownership and new varieties of investment strategies that are bottom up, like wefunder, kickstarter and similar strategies.

The Nordic Model is capitalist. It's Social capitalism.

I'm pretty ok with the Nordic Model in a lot of ways, tbh.

[Neanderthaland]

Any Fellow Anarcho-primitivis in here?

Totalitarian primitivism is better

Same thing really. Shitty, and shitty without even the luxury of toilet-paper.

[Nevertopia]

Time to poke holes in things. The Nordic Model as a base will eclipse the majority of socialist and capitalist economies. As the north opens becomes of climate change, the Nordic Countries will become richer and their model stronger. Variations of social democracy will emerge to challenge both socialism and capitalism. Some of these will include growth in employee ownership and new varieties of investment strategies that are bottom up, like wefunder, kickstarter and similar strategies.

The Nordic Model is capitalist. It's Social capitalism.

Man this social capitalism sounds great, it brings the best from capitalism while also mitigating its downsides. Maybe this is better than communism. Imagine a system of prosperity that doesnt rely on the forfeiture of economic and civil rights to a centralized government that dictates production. Maybe this is better than what Marx wanted.

[UniversalCommons]

Time to poke holes in things. The Nordic Model as a base will eclipse the majority of socialist and capitalist economies. As the north opens becomes of climate change, the Nordic Countries will become richer and their model stronger. Variations of social democracy will emerge to challenge both socialism and capitalism. Some of these will include growth in employee ownership and new varieties of investment strategies that are bottom up, like wefunder, kickstarter and similar strategies.

The Nordic Model is capitalist. It's Social capitalism.

Not completely, in Norway, there are many state owned enterprises and organizations. This creates a mix of both state owned and private enterprise. I would argue that institutions like the military, police, and fire should be state owned, not private enterprises.

[Nevertopia]

Marx supported capitalism.

You gotta be fucking kidding

Where else would he get the money to fund communism? Or maybe he didnt think that through enough. hmm.

[Cordel One]

Marx also thinks capitalism is inevitable and it is necessary for the transition to communism. Marx=capitalist????

Yes, Marx supported capitalism. That should tell you then even in his idealized model, capitalism was still a module of prosperity.

Ah, that explains why he devoted his life to writing about how terrible it is, how to destroy it, and how to replace it.


You're joking, right? You have to be joking.

[Rusozak]

You gotta be fucking kidding

Where else would he get the money to fund communism? Or maybe he didnt think that through enough. hmm.

I believe they are referring to the belief that capitalism was a necessary stage in the progression of society towards socialism. Not to say it was endorsed as an end in itself, but an essential prerequisite before socialism can emerge.

[Sanghyeok]

Marx also thinks capitalism is inevitable and it is necessary for the transition to communism. Marx=capitalist????

Is Marx a reactionary?

[Sanghyeok]

I believe they are referring to the belief that capitalism was a necessary stage in the progression of society towards socialism. Not to say it was endorsed as an end in itself, but an essential prerequisite before socialism can emerge.

Now I'm sad there weren't any completely feudal countries left when Marx wrote Manifesto. Else we could see a feudal-communist transition attempt.

[-Ra-]

Yes, Marx supported capitalism. That should tell you then even in his idealized model, capitalism was still a module of prosperity.

Ah, that explains why he devoted his life to writing about how terrible it is, how to destroy it, and how to replace it.


You're joking, right? You have to be joking.

Funnily enough, he actually never talked about how to destroy it or replace it. Marx made a critique of capitalism and then supposed that it would ultimately be overthrown, but he never actually specified how it would be overthrown or what a communist society would look like.

[Kiu Ghesik]

I believe they are referring to the belief that capitalism was a necessary stage in the progression of society towards socialism. Not to say it was endorsed as an end in itself, but an essential prerequisite before socialism can emerge.

Now I'm sad there weren't any completely feudal countries left when Marx wrote Manifesto. Else we could see a feudal-communist transition attempt.

I mean, Tsarist Russia was pretty damn close to a feudal country.

[Disgraces]

He never talked about how to replace it.

Communism? What's that?

[Cordel One]

Ah, that explains why he devoted his life to writing about how terrible it is, how to destroy it, and how to replace it.


You're joking, right? You have to be joking.

Funnily enough, he actually never talked about how to destroy it or replace it. Marx made a critique of capitalism and then supposed that it would ultimately be overthrown, but he never actually specified how it would be overthrown or what a communist society would look like.

He couldn't perfectly describe it or give military strategies without visiting every country in the future, and unfortunately he did not have a time machine.
He did describe who would overthrow it as well as how, when, and why it should be overthrown. As far as replacement, there is this whole "communism" thing.

[Kiu Ghesik]

Ah, that explains why he devoted his life to writing about how terrible it is, how to destroy it, and how to replace it.


You're joking, right? You have to be joking.

Funnily enough, he actually never talked about how to destroy it or replace it. Marx made a critique of capitalism and then supposed that it would ultimately be overthrown, but he never actually specified how it would be overthrown or what a communist society would look like.

Hate to break it to you, but Marx co-authored the Communist Manifesto. That very clearly despises capitalism.