New Arizona Immigration Law Poll

[North Calaveras]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

I have no visual or audio basis to know who you are, typing on a computer gives me nothing on you.

[Dyakovo]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

Especially since he identified himself as being Latino...

[Grave_n_idle]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

I have no visual or audio basis to know who you are, typing on a computer gives me nothing on you.

Neither does a thick accent, lining up for jobs, or being Hispanic - but you've defended all of those as reliable indicators of illegal immigrant status.

You really should quit while you're ahead. Well, behind.

[Grave_n_idle]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

Especially since he identified himself as being Latino...

Right. There's actually better evidence in this particular case.

[Angelicpeople]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Exacttly, but I must be mexican since I can speak fluent spanish, sounds educated, right?

[North Calaveras]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

I have no visual or audio basis to know who you are, typing on a computer gives me nothing on you.

Neither does a thick accent, lining up for jobs, or being Hispanic - but you've defended all of those as reliable indicators of illegal immigrant status.

You really should quit while you're ahead. Well, behind.

You gotta be fucken kidding me I never defended it, i thought it would help but i said it was fucked up, that's not defending it.

If there are things already in place to prevent illegal immigration how come were having this issue? since there's obviously to many crossing the border.

[Vervaria]

its not racist, Mexicans are not a race.

And you can tell just from looking at someone whether they are Mexican?

Ya I can look at someone and make educated guess- the guy speaks Spanish fluently with an accent, obviously hes either Latino(Mexican or another spanish speaking nation), Spanish, or learned Spanish very well in the US. Its not about race.

Yeah, so you're saying the policemen are just going to pull over random people, not because they don't think they're of heritage of different races???

So let me ask you this, I'm of dominican descent, you can obviously tell with my physical features. So do you consider me mexican?

I have no idea who you are, as your behind a computer screen.

Irrelevant. You're capable of making just as good a judgement of his legal/illegal Mexican/not-Mexican status as you've claimed for people you've seen in the street.

i.e. You can't make a good judgement... which is the point you should have got from that.

I have no visual or audio basis to know who you are, typing on a computer gives me nothing on you.

Neither does a thick accent, lining up for jobs, or being Hispanic - but you've defended all of those as reliable indicators of illegal immigrant status.

You really should quit while you're ahead. Well, behind.

You gotta be fucken kidding me I never defended it, i thought it would help but i said it was fucked up, that's not defending it.

If there are things already in place to prevent illegal immigration how come were having this issue? since there's obviously to many crossing the border.

viewtopic.php?p=2014411#p2014411 Interesting how your cop-outs only apply to the thread they were made in.

[North Calaveras]

I went to get my freind but he wasn't home, so I'm not going to the movies now.

[Gift-of-god]

....

If there are things already in place to prevent illegal immigration how come were having this issue? since there's obviously to many crossing the border.

Because a great many businesses and industries depend on a steady stream of inexpensive labour. If illegal immigration were actually curtailed to a significant degree, the economy of the southwest USA would have several major difficulties.

[North Calaveras]

Could I go to Mexico illegally and sneak in then when a Mexican cop shows up and asks if I'm a Mexican citizen could i consider that "rascist"?

[Grave_n_idle]

....

If there are things already in place to prevent illegal immigration how come were having this issue? since there's obviously to many crossing the border.

Because a great many businesses and industries depend on a steady stream of inexpensive labour. If illegal immigration were actually curtailed to a significant degree, the economy of the southwest USA would have several major difficulties.

Indeed. I heard a report a few years back estimating the overall impact of illegal immigration in the US economy being a tiny (well, about 1%, so not teeny tiny) profit. i.e. we're actually better off for it.

[Grave_n_idle]

Could I go to Mexico illegally and sneak in then when a Mexican cop shows up and asks if I'm a Mexican citizen could i consider that "rascist"?

Did he pull you over and ask you for ID because you looked a bit foreign?

[Dyakovo]

Could I go to Mexico illegally and sneak in then when a Mexican cop shows up and asks if I'm a Mexican citizen could i consider that "rascist"?

If they did it because you are white (which I am assuming you are), then yes.

[Nordicus]

I would ask if perhaps there was a reason that they can't.

Why would that matter?

There are hundreds of possible reasons, not least being how long and expensive the process is, especially for people that might be trying to get out of immediate hardship.

I was referring to the possibility that they could have been denied immigration.

Proof of insurance would not, or at should not be able to be denied, as an SSN is necessary to obtain insurance and all motorists are required to have proof of insurance in their vehicles.

The bold part is factually incorrect.

No, it doesn't appear to be. The penalties vary from state to state, but it seems that every state in the U.S. requires drivers to present their proof of insurance if an officer requests it after having pulled you over. I have never heard of any state that does not require proof of insurance, and a quick Google search supported this everywhere I looked.

Only if the vehicle is registered as being insured. Some states allow the registration of uninsured vehicles or the acceptance of proof of ability to pay claims personally in lieu of insurance; in either of those cases the operator is not required to furnish proof of insurance.

The first type, I have never heard of; the second type I have only heard of where it is called "self-insured," and you still need proof of that status.

What's your plan then? how do we deal with the problem of illegal immigration? do we just let them in?

There are already the mechanisms in place to deal with it.

With 7m-20m illegal immigrants already in our nation, and approximately a quarter of our prison population being illegal immigrants, those mechanisms seem to be rather inefficient, if not wholly faulty.

[Dyakovo]

What's your plan then? how do we deal with the problem of illegal immigration? do we just let them in?

There are already the mechanisms in place to deal with it.

With 7m-20m illegal immigrants already in our nation, and approximately a quarter of our prison population being illegal immigrants, those mechanisms seem to be rather inefficient, if not wholly faulty.

Which would indicate that those mechanisms should be reformed or given more funding not that you should layer more laws on top of the existing ones.

[NotnotgnimmiJymmiJ]

Could I go to Mexico illegally and sneak in then when a Mexican cop shows up and asks if I'm a Mexican citizen could i consider that "rascist"?

Pretty much. But I've been down here for 4 months so far and have never experienced or heard of such a thing. I guess they just respect civil rights in Mexico.

[North Calaveras]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

[Dyakovo]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

Not really. The simple fact is it is impossible to completely eliminate illegal immigration (note: I am not saying that we shouldn't try). Passing bad laws on top of inefficient execution of current laws is not going to change anything (at least not for the better).

[DaWoad]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

[North Calaveras]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

[DaWoad]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

like
1) opening immigration laws slightly
2) Closing Immigration Laws
3)implementing plans to allow current illegals the opportunity to become full citizens while cracking down on illegals in another way (reduce the "need" for illegals by opening laws slightly or increase the "cost" by increasing penalties against those who are caught trafficking)
4)no change
etc. etc. etc.

and this isn't about Mexico's policy (nor about your own blatant racism) this is about Arizona's law

[North Calaveras]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

like
1) opening immigration laws slightly
2) Closing Immigration Laws
3)implementing plans to allow current illegals the opportunity to become full citizens while cracking down on illegals in another way (reduce the "need" for illegals by opening laws slightly or increase the "cost" by increasing penalties against those who are caught trafficking)
4)no change
etc. etc. etc.

and this isn't about Mexico's policy (nor about your own blatant racism) this is about Arizona's law

hmmmm Mexicans are not a race (idk how many times ive said this) and It is just as much Mexico's problem.

[DaWoad]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

like
1) opening immigration laws slightly
2) Closing Immigration Laws
3)implementing plans to allow current illegals the opportunity to become full citizens while cracking down on illegals in another way (reduce the "need" for illegals by opening laws slightly or increase the "cost" by increasing penalties against those who are caught trafficking)
4)no change
etc. etc. etc.

and this isn't about Mexico's policy (nor about your own blatant racism) this is about Arizona's law

hmmmm Mexicans are not a race (idk how many times ive said this) and It is just as much Mexico's problem.

no they are not which doesn't mean you are not being racist and no . .. no it's not read the OP and stop trying to worm your way out of this by shifting the goalposts.

[North Calaveras]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

like
1) opening immigration laws slightly
2) Closing Immigration Laws
3)implementing plans to allow current illegals the opportunity to become full citizens while cracking down on illegals in another way (reduce the "need" for illegals by opening laws slightly or increase the "cost" by increasing penalties against those who are caught trafficking)
4)no change
etc. etc. etc.

and this isn't about Mexico's policy (nor about your own blatant racism) this is about Arizona's law

hmmmm Mexicans are not a race (idk how many times ive said this) and It is just as much Mexico's problem.

no they are not which doesn't mean you are not being racist and no . .. no it's not read the OP and stop trying to worm your way out of this by shifting the goalposts.

So its not Mexico's problem that many of its citizens are trying to enter the United States illegally?

[Zoharland]

Look, Its either you come into the United State or Mexico legally, or both country's completely open there borders to each other.

false dichotomy. There are a multitude of other possibilities.

Like? and why are we complaining about the United States immigration policys and laws, look at what Mexico does to illegal immigrants, its horrifying.

like
1) opening immigration laws slightly
2) Closing Immigration Laws
3)implementing plans to allow current illegals the opportunity to become full citizens while cracking down on illegals in another way (reduce the "need" for illegals by opening laws slightly or increase the "cost" by increasing penalties against those who are caught trafficking)
4)no change
etc. etc. etc.

and this isn't about Mexico's policy (nor about your own blatant racism) this is about Arizona's law

hmmmm Mexicans are not a race (idk how many times ive said this) and It is just as much Mexico's problem.

no they are not which doesn't mean you are not being racist and no . .. no it's not read the OP and stop trying to worm your way out of this by shifting the goalposts.

So its not Mexico's problem that many of its citizens are trying to enter the United States illegally?

How could it be, thats less mouths for them to feed...