Armenia-Azerbaijan Conflict: The Great Betrayal

[Rio Cana]

Again, you must take a history lesson. Please do not look at the problem in a religious or nationalist way.

I have looked into the history. The region was given to Azerbaijan by the USSR as a compromise gesture. It worked until the USSR collapsed and the locals (who were majority-Armenian) didn't want to be an ethnic minority, which triggered the war with Azerbaijan. There were many such cases in the FSU.

It seems, under Soviet law an autonomous republic cannot separate from the Union republic which they are part of but that same autonomous republic can choose to remain in the greater Union if that Union republic decides to go independent. So if the people of Nagorno had decided to stick with Russia while Armenia and Azerbaijan went independent they could have legally done it. Supposedly, some time later they could have gone independent themselves.

Got above information from here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomou ... _Republics

[Punished UMN]

I have looked into the history. The region was given to Azerbaijan by the USSR as a compromise gesture. It worked until the USSR collapsed and the locals (who were majority-Armenian) didn't want to be an ethnic minority, which triggered the war with Azerbaijan. There were many such cases in the FSU.

It seems, under Soviet law an autonomous republic cannot separate from the Union republic which they are part of but that same autonomous republic can choose to remain in the greater Union if that Union republic decides to go independent. So if the people of Nagorno had decided to stick with Russia while Armenia and Azerbaijan went independent they could have legally done it. Supposedly, some time later they could have gone independent themselves.

Got above information from here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomou ... _Republics

It shouldn't matter, the Soviet Union no longer existed, its constitution was irrelevant.

[Heloin]

I have looked into the history. The region was given to Azerbaijan by the USSR as a compromise gesture. It worked until the USSR collapsed and the locals (who were majority-Armenian) didn't want to be an ethnic minority, which triggered the war with Azerbaijan. There were many such cases in the FSU.

It seems, under Soviet law an autonomous republic cannot separate from the Union republic which they are part of but that same autonomous republic can choose to remain in the greater Union if that Union republic decides to go independent. So if the people of Nagorno had decided to stick with Russia while Armenia and Azerbaijan went independent they could have legally done it. Supposedly, some time later they could have gone independent themselves.

Got above information from here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomou ... _Republics

They had actually asked the Soviet Government if they could join the Armenian SSR in 1987.

[Rio Cana]

It seems, under Soviet law an autonomous republic cannot separate from the Union republic which they are part of but that same autonomous republic can choose to remain in the greater Union if that Union republic decides to go independent. So if the people of Nagorno had decided to stick with Russia while Armenia and Azerbaijan went independent they could have legally done it. Supposedly, some time later they could have gone independent themselves.

Got above information from here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomou ... _Republics

It shouldn't matter, the Soviet Union no longer existed, its constitution was irrelevant.

No more Soviets means the autonomous republics cannot be tied to anyone if they choose not too. I think this Nagorno problem could have been solved via legal means a long time ago. They just need good lawyers.

[Punished UMN]

It shouldn't matter, the Soviet Union no longer existed, its constitution was irrelevant.

No more Soviets means the autonomous republics cannot be tied to anyone if they choose not too. I think this Nagorno problem could have been solved via legal means a long time ago. They just need good lawyers.

The international community disagrees, there are many cases where this happened, Artsakh is one of 5 cases.

[Baltenstein]

We've already talked about how that's bullshit propaganda.

The so-called Nagorno-Karabakh republic does not even recognized in the international community.

And we can't just go around endorsing unrecognized states that aren't recognized by the international community, can we now, eh, Hakinda?

[Heloin]

It shouldn't matter, the Soviet Union no longer existed, its constitution was irrelevant.

No more Soviets means the autonomous republics cannot be tied to anyone if they choose not too. I think this Nagorno problem could have been solved via legal means a long time ago. They just need good lawyers.

No it couldn't. The peaceful attempt to join the Armenian SSR was being violently put down by the Azeribaijani SSR in the late 80s. The war began when the Soviet Union was still a thing.

[Rio Cana]

No more Soviets means the autonomous republics cannot be tied to anyone if they choose not too. I think this Nagorno problem could have been solved via legal means a long time ago. They just need good lawyers.

The international community disagrees, there are many cases where this happened, Artsakh is one of 5 cases.

I think there are nations which carry weight in the international community which themselves have territorial issues which they rather not come to light. Its like Spain not recognizing Kosovo. Spain does not recognize Kosovo, which broke away from Serbia, because of Catalonia. They tell the Catalans if they break away no one will recognize you.

[Punished UMN]

No more Soviets means the autonomous republics cannot be tied to anyone if they choose not too. I think this Nagorno problem could have been solved via legal means a long time ago. They just need good lawyers.

No it couldn't. The peaceful attempt to join the Armenian SSR was being violently put down by the Azeribaijani SSR in the late 80s. The war began when the Soviet Union was still a thing.

^part of the reason the USSR collapsed as it did was that the military attempted to coup the central government in August 1991 because of violence in the Caucuses beginning in 1989-90. There were miniature coups against local SSR governments at the same time including one in Baku in 1991 as Azerbaijan and Georgia attempted to maintain control of ethnic minority regions through force.

[Rio Cana]

Armenia and Azerbaijan became fully independent on December 26, 1991 when the Soviets no longer existed. The autonomous Republics thus should have been free to choose who they wanted to be part of. Imperialistic, it does seem Azerbaijan is being imperialistic in wanting to keep Nagorno.

[Punished UMN]

Armenia and Azerbaijan became fully independent on December 26, 1991 when the Soviets no longer existed. The autonomous Republics thus should have been free to choose who they wanted to be part of. Imperialistic, it does seem Azerbaijan is being imperialistic in wanting to keep Nagorno.

That's not how the international community has seen it in the other cases where the same thing has happened.

[Salus Maior]

Artsakh was never Azeri. That's the problem.

This isn't reclamation, this is expansionism.

Again, you must take a history lesson. Please do not look at the problem in a religious or nationalist way.

I’m a history major, Hakinda.

History lessons are what I do with 80% of my time. Not that this fact would matter to you, because it’s not a serious issue with my knowing history, it’s me not adhering to the Turkish Nationalist interpretation of history which you are repeating and holding as true.

And this problem _is_ nationalism. Turkish nationalism which is prevalent in Azerbaijan and their reasoning to go to war in the first place.

[Haja-Mishu]

this wouldn't have been a problem had the seljuks been contained in central asia where they belonged

[New haven america]

We've already talked about how that's bullshit propaganda.

The so-called Nagorno-Karabakh republic does not even recognized in the international community.

That's because they don't want to be their own country, they want to be part of Armenia.

Kinda hard to recognize a country that doesn't really wanna be a country.

[Europa Undivided]

Nagorno-Karabakh is Armenian through and through. There is literally no reason for Azerbaijan to keep it.

[Heloin]

this wouldn't have been a problem had the seljuks been contained in central asia where they belonged

When looking at the causes of the First World War one must look to it's root in the fall of Babylon.

[Andsed]

this wouldn't have been a problem had the seljuks been contained in central asia where they belonged

When looking at the causes of the First World War one must look to it's root in the fall of Babylon.

"Look all I'm saying is that the assassination of Caesar is the root cause of the existence of Mario."

[Ethel mermania]

this wouldn't have been a problem had the seljuks been contained in central asia where they belonged

When looking at the causes of the First World War one must look to it's root in the fall of Babylon.

By the rivers of Babylon
There we sat down
Yeah, we wept
When we remembered Zion

When the wicked
Carried us away in captivity
Required from us a song
Now how shall we sing the Lord's song
In a strange land?

When the wicked
Carried us away in captivity
Requiring of us a song
Now how shall we sing the Lord's song
In a strange land?

[Lower Nubia]

So Azerbaijan has failed to capture the villages, but today claimed that a SCUD missile hit near Baku. This was the evidence they sent.

https://i.redd.it/ck4tiguwz4r51.jpg

Apparently, shrubs are quite resistant to missile casings when landing.

Does the US know of this resilient anti-missile armour? the common shrub.

Oh, and this one too apparently, but this one allegedly hit a damn closer to the front:

https://m.imgur.com/ByBa6k7

An even more hilarious angle. Notice the wood wedges between the casing and the tarmac on the left. You genuinely couldn’t make this stuff up. It’s hilarious.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HikmetHajiye ... 01/photo/2

[Europa Undivided]

So Azerbaijan has failed to capture the villages, but today claimed that a SCUD missile hit near Baku. This was the evidence they sent.

https://i.redd.it/ck4tiguwz4r51.jpg

Apparently, shrubs are quite resistant to missile casings when landing.

Does the US know of this resilient anti-missile armour? the common shrub.

Oh, and this one too apparently, but this one allegedly hit a damn closer to the front:

https://m.imgur.com/ByBa6k7

An even more hilarious angle. Notice the wood wedges between the casing and the tarmac on the left. You genuinely couldn’t make this stuff up. It’s hilarious.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HikmetHajiye ... 01/photo/2

If they're going to frame Armenia they should at least make it believable owo

[Lower Nubia]

So Azerbaijan has failed to capture the villages, but today claimed that a SCUD missile hit near Baku. This was the evidence they sent.

https://i.redd.it/ck4tiguwz4r51.jpg

Apparently, shrubs are quite resistant to missile casings when landing.

Does the US know of this resilient anti-missile armour? the common shrub.

Oh, and this one too apparently, but this one allegedly hit a damn closer to the front:

https://m.imgur.com/ByBa6k7

An even more hilarious angle. Notice the wood wedges between the casing and the tarmac on the left. You genuinely couldn’t make this stuff up. It’s hilarious.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HikmetHajiye ... 01/photo/2

If they're going to frame Armenia they should at least make it believable owo

If Azerbaijan are faking missile landings with these high quality productions we can only conclude they’re lying, literally, everywhere else.

[Salus Maior]

Nagorno-Karabakh is Armenian through and through. There is literally no reason for Azerbaijan to keep it.

Which is why it's properly called Artsakh. ; )

That's the Armenian name for it.

[Pasong Tirad]

We've already talked about how that's bullshit propaganda.

The so-called Nagorno-Karabakh republic does not even recognized in the international community.

The so-called Turkish Republic of Cyprus is not even recognized in the international community.

The Turkish occupation of Afrin and Sere Kaniye is not even recognized in the international community.

The Turkish attempt to create a "buffer zone" by annexing northern Syria, depopulating it of Kurds, Syriacs, Assyrians, Chaldeans, Yazidis and Armenians and repopulating it with Arabs and Turkmen is not even recognized in the international community

[The Restored Danelaw]

Again, you must take a history lesson. Please do not look at the problem in a religious or nationalist way.

I have looked into the history. The region was given to Azerbaijan by the USSR as a compromise gesture. It worked until the USSR collapsed and the locals (who were majority-Armenian) didn't want to be an ethnic minority, which triggered the war with Azerbaijan. There were many such cases in the FSU.

It didn't really work until 1989. The Azeris tried their best to displace the Armenian minority through settlement and repression.

Armenia and Azerbaijan became fully independent on December 26, 1991 when the Soviets no longer existed. The autonomous Republics thus should have been free to choose who they wanted to be part of. Imperialistic, it does seem Azerbaijan is being imperialistic in wanting to keep Nagorno.

It was, and it did. Armenians voted to join Armenia, Azeris boycotted the referendum and helped Baku attack with the hopes of ethnically cleansing Artsakh... didn't end as well as they'd hoped.

[Lower Nubia]

Updates!

The northern and southern land that was captured has seemingly been repelled and returned to Artsakh. Talish village has been taken by Azerbaijani forces - there is video. This does mean that no villages in the south have been taken, as the Azerbaijani MoD immediately released footage of Talish villages capture. In that regard, it’s likely this is the only village currently under their control - otherwise they would of released footage immediately of other captured villages, just like Talish. Additionally, Azerbaijan claimed to capture Talish at the start of this fighting on the 27th. The fact video is released today, on the 5th of October, illustrates that we require High levels of caution concerning their claims.

However, this village also fell in 2016, and was recaptured - it seems everyone in the village was evacuated.