NationStates

Tekke wrote:

Albionist Great Britain wrote:The Armenians need to continue their fight until every last Azeri out for their blood is driven from Artsakh.

Would it have been wrong for the partisans to defend their homes and drive away the Nazis? This is no different. I don’t have problems with Azeris that can see through the lies told by Baku, but those that buy into it are a threat to innocent Armenians and their homeland.

Albionist Great Britain wrote:

Tekke wrote:

Would it have been wrong for the partisans to defend their homes and drive away the Nazis? This is no different. I don’t have problems with Azeris that can see through the lies told by Baku, but those that buy into it are a threat to innocent Armenians and their homeland.

Seems you need to look at the bigger picture. Like I said already, whats left of Artsakh most likely will not be economically viable especially with most of the population not wanting to go back. Any international investment they had would dry up. That means what is left of Artsakh will be depopulated. Then there is the fact that in those five years the Russians will be guarding the place, the Azeris will most likely be fortifying there border with Armenian proper and around whats left of Artsakh. Azerbaijan will be investing in the parts they reannexed but none of there money will be going to the Armenian Artsakh. This war was lost when the Soviets placed Artsakh in Azerbaijan.

Armenia needs to cut its losses. Being landlocked is a disadvantage and increases there costs. They need to concentrate on building up there economy. Found an article in which a former Turkish General said that Armenia could not win this war since there economy could not afford to continue purchasing weapons. Without money to pay, other nations would not sell them weapons. Armenia also needs to increase their population. Lets check the population of Armenia's neighbors.

Turkey population is 82 million and increasing. Azerbaijan is 10 million and increasing. Iran, the population of Iran is almost 84 million and increasing. Georgia population is 3.98 million with a slow increase. Armenia's population is 2.96 million. Should point out that Armenia counts 1.3 million Armenians who currently have migrated to other nations but return for a few weeks a year. Not counting those people, this means Armenia's real population is really 1.69 million. It has gone down. It is expected to slightly increase before going down. But never reaching 3 million (which includes those who have migrated to other nations) unless they do something about it.

Generally, around the capital city they have babies. But in the outer provinces they are not really having babies. The two southern provinces of Armenia need people. If nothing is done to stop this depopulation in these southern provinces, Azerbaijan could just walk in and annex it uniting Azerbaijan proper with Nakhchivan.
Map which shows the southern region - https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... ns_map.png

Read this informative article on Armenia's population - https://jamestown.org/program/armenias- ... rm-trends/

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Cut the shit already

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Armenia has and never had anything to apologise for. Cut the shit, we all know who the real fascists are: the Turks. Every action taken to disempower the Turks is justified, if it were even happening in the first place, which it unfortunately isn’t.

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

You're the last person to have any right to talk against fascism after shilling for Baku and Turkey in this very thread lmao.

The Huskar Social Union wrote:

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Cut the shit already

Albionist Great Britain wrote:

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Armenia has and never had anything to apologise for. Cut the shit, we all know who the real fascists are: the Turks. Every action taken to disempower the Turks is justified, if it were even happening in the first place, which it unfortunately isn’t.

The Restored Danelaw wrote:

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

You're the last person to have any right to talk against fascism after shilling for Baku and Turkey in this very thread lmao.

Talk to those who want to break the peace. Fascists were stopped in the lands of Azerbaijan, as in Stalingrad (1943). I think it's pointless to argue with people like you. Turkophobia is bad like any kind of racism. Against the fascists who want the war to continue, I and those who think like me will continue to be the defenders of peace.


Explanation
You can argue between you, please do not confuse me in your conversations

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

The Huskar Social Union wrote:Cut the shit already

Albionist Great Britain wrote:
Armenia has and never had anything to apologise for. Cut the shit, we all know who the real fascists are: the Turks. Every action taken to disempower the Turks is justified, if it were even happening in the first place, which it unfortunately isn’t.

The Restored Danelaw wrote:You're the last person to have any right to talk against fascism after shilling for Baku and Turkey in this very thread lmao.

Talk to those who want to break the peace. Fascists were stopped in the lands of Azerbaijan, as in Stalingrad (1943). I think it's pointless to argue with people like you. Turkophobia is bad like any kind of racism. Against the fascists who want the war to continue, I and those who think like me will continue to be the defenders of peace.

Explanation
You can argue between you, please do not confuse me in your conversations

Ah yes of course, everyone who disagrees with you is a fascist or turkophobic or racist. A totally unexpected answer.

Cut the shit and wise up and drop the propaganda routine.

edit: Here do me a favour and put me down in that little enemies list of yours.

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.We stand shoulder to shoulder against fascism

Haven't you Azeris got Israeli weapons to buy?

Rio Cana wrote:[...]Armenia needs to cut its losses. Being landlocked is a disadvantage and increases there costs. They need to concentrate on building up there economy. Found an article in which a former Turkish General said that Armenia could not win this war since there economy could not afford to continue purchasing weapons. Without money to pay, other nations would not sell them weapons. Armenia also needs to increase their population. Lets check the population of Armenia's neighbors.

Armenia can't 'cut it's loses', as this is a major humanitarian and military disaster for them, that will likely bring down their government, and I really hope Armenia doesn't end up a dictatorship, which is what happened to Azerbaijan after they lost the first war. This will cause major national trauma, re-criminations, and so forth. Armenia has to continue buying weapons as ethnic hatred towards Armenians is extreme in Azerbaijan, and they can't improve their economy drastically because they are blockaded by Turkey and Azerbaijan, which will never end the blockade as their long-stated goal is to destroy Armenia, unless Erdogan decides otherwise.

Rio Cana wrote:[...]Azerbaijan could just walk in and annex it uniting Azerbaijan proper with Nakhchivan.

Only if Putin decides to end CSTO, and as the latest peace deal proves, Russia still wants an independent Armenia more tightly under their geo-political control. This won't help corruption, which is prolific in Russia and tends to find its way to any country that is in their sphere of influence.

Without some major political re-conciliation, which given ethnic hatred seems unlikely, Armenia will continue to be a low population country at the mercy of Putin, and its neighbors. If Azerbaijan, Turkey, and Armenia, were all democracies, and could develop empathy and understanding with one another, then there would be hope. Though as long as Erdogan and his party control Turkey, and Azerbaijan is a dictatorship built on ethnic hatred and soviet instilled founding myths, there can be no peace in that part of the Caucasus, and Armenia will have to buy the weapons it can.

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:

Rio Cana wrote:So when does Turkey and Azerbaijan re-open there borders with Armenia. This should help Armenia's economy.

When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.

In other news, the World Jewish Congress has offered an official apology for the crimes and persecution inflicted upon the German people. More at 11.

Albionist Great Britain wrote:

Tekke wrote:

Would it have been wrong for the partisans to defend their homes and drive away the Nazis? This is no different. I don’t have problems with Azeris that can see through the lies told by Baku, but those that buy into it are a threat to innocent Armenians and their homeland.

They're losing the war. They should live to fight another day instead of going out in a blaze of glory if they have any sense about them. And you'll struggle to get Americans, Europeans, or Russians to take a hardline approach either in favor of Armenia or Azerbaijan, because it turns out, most of us are not fans of letting Erdogan start World War 3 between NATO and Russia over, quite literally, some damn fool thing in the Caucasus. The Armenians will have to just eat shit now and figure things out later, as the Kurds have had to for much the same reason. Not saying they've not been very hard done by by Turkish atrocities and bullying over the years, but unfortunately in that region, especially when it comes to small powers, the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must. That's what happens when you're close to God, but far from the United States.

The absolute fucking irony of calling the people under threat of extermination "Fascists" is mind-boggling. Hakinda has gone full-blown ethnic nationalist in his disgusting victim blaming.

It makes my blood boil watching him defend these genocidal warmongers and act like their victims are the "bad guys". Absolutely revolting.

Senkaku wrote:

Albionist Great Britain wrote:
Would it have been wrong for the partisans to defend their homes and drive away the Nazis? This is no different. I don’t have problems with Azeris that can see through the lies told by Baku, but those that buy into it are a threat to innocent Armenians and their homeland.

They're losing the war. They should live to fight another day instead of going out in a blaze of glory if they have any sense about them. And you'll struggle to get Americans, Europeans, or Russians to take a hardline approach either in favor of Armenia or Azerbaijan, because it turns out, most of us are not fans of letting Erdogan start World War 3 between NATO and Russia over, quite literally, some damn fool thing in the Caucasus. The Armenians will have to just eat shit now and figure things out later, as the Kurds have had to for much the same reason. Not saying they've not been very hard done by by Turkish atrocities and bullying over the years, but unfortunately in that region, especially when it comes to small powers, the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must. That's what happens when you're close to God, but far from the United States.

From what I hear, some Armenian military units are refusing to stand down.

I imagine they're going to continue an insurgency in Artsakh for a while. Which, tbh, will probably be more effective than a conventional war.

Salus Maior wrote:

Senkaku wrote:They're losing the war. They should live to fight another day instead of going out in a blaze of glory if they have any sense about them. And you'll struggle to get Americans, Europeans, or Russians to take a hardline approach either in favor of Armenia or Azerbaijan, because it turns out, most of us are not fans of letting Erdogan start World War 3 between NATO and Russia over, quite literally, some damn fool thing in the Caucasus. The Armenians will have to just eat shit now and figure things out later, as the Kurds have had to for much the same reason. Not saying they've not been very hard done by by Turkish atrocities and bullying over the years, but unfortunately in that region, especially when it comes to small powers, the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must. That's what happens when you're close to God, but far from the United States.

From what I hear, some Armenian military units are refusing to stand down.

I imagine they're going to continue an insurgency in Artsakh for a while. Which, tbh, will probably be more effective than a conventional war.

God be with them. They'll need it.

Baltenstein wrote:

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:When the Armenian government apologized for the persecution of the Turkish people.

In other news, the World Jewish Congress has offered an official apology for the crimes and persecution inflicted upon the German people. More at 11.

....What?

I don't even know how this is supposed to be comparable.

Salus Maior wrote:

Senkaku wrote:They're losing the war. They should live to fight another day instead of going out in a blaze of glory if they have any sense about them. And you'll struggle to get Americans, Europeans, or Russians to take a hardline approach either in favor of Armenia or Azerbaijan, because it turns out, most of us are not fans of letting Erdogan start World War 3 between NATO and Russia over, quite literally, some damn fool thing in the Caucasus. The Armenians will have to just eat shit now and figure things out later, as the Kurds have had to for much the same reason. Not saying they've not been very hard done by by Turkish atrocities and bullying over the years, but unfortunately in that region, especially when it comes to small powers, the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must. That's what happens when you're close to God, but far from the United States.

From what I hear, some Armenian military units are refusing to stand down.

I imagine they're going to continue an insurgency in Artsakh for a while. Which, tbh, will probably be more effective than a conventional war.

Probably so, hybrid war and all that. Hopefully it doesn't lead the Azerbaijanis to continue attacking and taking more territory, would be my main concern.

Not saying it's not a bitter pill to ask the Armenian people to swallow, but I am not interested in seeing North America reduced to radioactive ash because they were losing a war against some crazy Turk's friends and called Moscow for help.

Salus Maior wrote:

Baltenstein wrote:
In other news, the World Jewish Congress has offered an official apology for the crimes and persecution inflicted upon the German people. More at 11.

....What?

I don't even know how this is supposed to be comparable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide

they are understandably still a bit peeved about it

Senkaku wrote:

Salus Maior wrote:
....What?

I don't even know how this is supposed to be comparable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide

they are understandably still a bit peeved about it

Having read first hand accounts of the Armenian genocide, I'm well aware of it.

I don't know how Jews supposedly apologizing to Germany is comparable.

I would say Turkey apologizing to Armenia is more comparable to a hypothetical victorious Nazi Germany apologizing to Jews worldwide.

Edit: I completely misread all the posts.

Senkaku wrote:

Salus Maior wrote:
From what I hear, some Armenian military units are refusing to stand down.

I imagine they're going to continue an insurgency in Artsakh for a while. Which, tbh, will probably be more effective than a conventional war.

Probably so, hybrid war and all that. Hopefully it doesn't lead the Azerbaijanis to continue attacking and taking more territory, would be my main concern.

Not saying it's not a bitter pill to ask the Armenian people to swallow, but I am not interested in seeing North America reduced to radioactive ash because they were losing a war against some crazy Turk's friends and called Moscow for help.

Considering the Armenian people just couped their government over this, they're not going to swallow it.

They're probably going to support an insurgency in Artsakh for as long as possible.

Salus Maior wrote:

Senkaku wrote:Probably so, hybrid war and all that. Hopefully it doesn't lead the Azerbaijanis to continue attacking and taking more territory, would be my main concern.

Not saying it's not a bitter pill to ask the Armenian people to swallow, but I am not interested in seeing North America reduced to radioactive ash because they were losing a war against some crazy Turk's friends and called Moscow for help.

Considering the Armenian people just couped their government over this, they're not going to swallow it.

They're probably going to support an insurgency in Artsakh for as long as possible.

Fighting this ferociously over a couple of towns in an area smaller than Delaware remains bananas to me, but whatever. If they want to, then I guess go for it, but they're surrounded by powerful enemies who seem to be winning, and their history should show them that things can always get worse. Azerbaijan lost the last war, bought new weapons, and won this one. The Armenians are perfectly capable of doing the same if they'd rather do that than... any other meaningful collective national effort, I guess.

Senkaku wrote:

Salus Maior wrote:
Considering the Armenian people just couped their government over this, they're not going to swallow it.

They're probably going to support an insurgency in Artsakh for as long as possible.

Fighting this ferociously over a couple of towns in an area smaller than Delaware remains bananas to me, but whatever. If they want to, then I guess go for it, but they're surrounded by powerful enemies who seem to be winning, and their history should show them that things can always get worse. Azerbaijan lost the last war, bought new weapons, and won this one. The Armenians are perfectly capable of doing the same if they'd rather do that than... any other meaningful collective national effort, I guess.

That's because you're looking at this from the position of American privilege. And I don't mean that as a jab.

The Armenian people have been on the losing side of history for a very long time, and they've lost so much of their heritage and homeland already through unimaginable injustices. We in the West, especially not in America, really know what it's like to live through that and be born in that context. We take for granted the security of our homeland, and the fact that we have a homeland.

Salus Maior wrote:

Senkaku wrote:Probably so, hybrid war and all that. Hopefully it doesn't lead the Azerbaijanis to continue attacking and taking more territory, would be my main concern.

Not saying it's not a bitter pill to ask the Armenian people to swallow, but I am not interested in seeing North America reduced to radioactive ash because they were losing a war against some crazy Turk's friends and called Moscow for help.

Considering the Armenian people just couped their government over this, they're not going to swallow it.

They're probably going to support an insurgency in Artsakh for as long as possible.

They haven't couped the government yet. They just broke into parliament and beat up the President of the National Assembly, Ararat Mirzoyan.

Senkaku wrote:

Salus Maior wrote:
From what I hear, some Armenian military units are refusing to stand down.

I imagine they're going to continue an insurgency in Artsakh for a while. Which, tbh, will probably be more effective than a conventional war.

Probably so, hybrid war and all that. Hopefully it doesn't lead the Azerbaijanis to continue attacking and taking more territory, would be my main concern.

Not saying it's not a bitter pill to ask the Armenian people to swallow, but I am not interested in seeing North America reduced to radioactive ash because they were losing a war against some crazy Turk's friends and called Moscow for help.

I am very afraid of the radicals in the Armenian government. because they can brutally kill women and children for the supposed dream of great Armenia.There is this hostility from the bad mentality of politicians and radicals, it is just that neither side should be racist towards each other.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_ ... Federation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_ ... of_Armenia