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2020 US General Election Thread IX: One Month and Counting

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Will the Third Debate Even Happen?

Yes
27
16%
No
61
36%
I Don't Know
36
21%
Too Early to Say
44
26%
 
Total votes : 168

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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:36 am

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Liriena wrote:At the very least it proves that Republican politicians do represent their voters: power hungry, morally bankrupt, etc.


Why do they even fly the flag anymore? People like Mitch McConnell and of course the president are more than willing to harm the United States if it accomplishes their selfish goals.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax they did not succeed with, for their selfish political reasons.

The biased partisan Democrats like Adam Schiff tried to get Trump impeached for the Ukraine Gate charges, to hurt President Trump politically, for their selfish political reasons.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to destroy Brett Kavanaugh's reputation and career as a highly qualified US Supreme Court Justice, for their selfish political reasons.

During the US Supreme Court hearings.

The biased partisan Democrats for their selfish political reasons, want to impeach Trump again, if he nominates a US Supreme Court Justice during his term in office, as the US democratic constitution grants him the right to do at anytime he wishes.

I can see it all now, Mr President, they tried the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax, they tried the Ukraine Gate, scam hoax, and now here we go again, with anything they can think of.

Trump has an obligation and a duty to do so to the voters who elected him based on his campaign promises to do so.

With a 4 to 4 Political divide in the court, President Trump has a right, a duty and an obligation to nominate a US Supreme Court justice and try to get him or her confirmed, anytime he wishes during his term.

As the Democratic US constitution allows him too.

A Republican President would nominate and try to confirm a highly qualified right wing Conservative Republican US Supreme Court Justice candidate.

A Democrat President would nominate and try to confirm a highly qualified Leftist Liberal Democrat US Supreme Court Justice candidate, if the situation were reversed or not reversed.

I share these three stories with my fellow Republican Trump supporter nations who post on this thread that care and with all my fellow nations, as I can do so:

Today I met a lady who says they have a Trump sign in front of their house, and they have noticed the mail man in their area is not delivering mail to her house, tomorrow they are going to their area s post office to file an official complaint against the mail man in question.

If this story is true, it shows that certain mail man might delay in delivering mail in ballots they think might be of Republicans. Might throw away certain ballots they think might be of Republicans.

Today as I was walking by this usually busy street, wearing my Republican Red shirt and my Republican Red Trump 2020 Maga Cap Hat, a black American in his car passed by and beeped his car horn towards me, looks at me and holds his thumb up in support of President Trump, It was awesome, I am not lying.

Now I know at least 13 African Americans supporters of President Trump who are going to vote for President Trump. Naturally, I cant personally know the over 100,000 black Americans who are going to vote for President Trump. Just like Democrat supporters cant personally know the millions of black Americans who are going to vote for Biden.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:37 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Senkaku wrote:...I mean, he kinda did. That doesn't mean it was "rigged" or illegal, but it's pretty clear that party elites consolidated around a candidate they felt was more electable and less extreme and that this consolidation played a significant role in his subsequent capture of the nomination. Biden was getting thumped until Clyburn stepped in to help in South Carolina and Obama subsequently maneuvered behind the scenes to get people to drop out and endorse him, and this consolidation behind him played a significant role in stopping what had looked like was going to be the conclusion until that point- Bernie taking the nomination with a plurality of votes.

I can't really condemn it, since that's basically how parties are supposed to behave and what they're designed to do. Part of the reason we think it's weird is simply because the GOP, an outlier in so many other ways as well, failed to do the same to stop Trump, but denying that it happened is ahistorical nonsense more rooted in a desire to attribute a broader mandate or greater charisma to Biden than he actually has. However, I don't think it's unreasonable for people who would've preferred a more left-wing candidate to be quite frustrated that the party elites decided that a moderate was a safer bet (which is in fact a debatable proposition).

I agree, the Democrats did it to Bernie Again.


You barely remember it. You're just MeToo-ing because you think it makes Democrats look bad.

Bernie was FAR FAR to the left of you. If he'd been chosen by the Democrats YOU WOULD HAVE CALLED HIM A COMMUNIST.

Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton.

Your guy got 44% of the primary vote but got the nomination anyway. In the Democratic party, that would not be possible.
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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:39 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Why do they even fly the flag anymore? People like Mitch McConnell and of course the president are more than willing to harm the United States if it accomplishes their selfish goals.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax



Bullshit. I'm assuming the rest of your post is bullshit too, and I'm not reading it.
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
High rate of Nobel prizes and other academic achievements.

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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:07 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:I agree, the Democrats did it to Bernie Again.


You barely remember it. You're just MeToo-ing because you think it makes Democrats look bad.

Bernie was FAR FAR to the left of you. If he'd been chosen by the Democrats YOU WOULD HAVE CALLED HIM A COMMUNIST.

Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton.

Your guy got 44% of the primary vote but got the nomination anyway. In the Democratic party, that would not be possible.

Wrong my friend. I am MeToo-ing because I mean everything I say and I strongly agree with Senkaku.

If Bernie he'd been chosen by the Democrats, I would have pointed out Bernie's support for Fidel, the Cuban regime, Maduro and Chávez in Venezuela, his support for the Sandinista Communist Socialists of Nicaragua at the time, his endorsement and support by the communist socialists of America, who call themselves Comrades, and support the Cuban regime, a small branch of the Democratic Party, Alexandra Ocasio Cortez and 2 of the 3 leftist Muslim Democrat ladies also belong too, as I have posted with proof and links in the past. But I have never and will never call Bernie a communist, this is not my style.

I have posted to you and a few of you here, I like Bernie Personally, I think he is a nice guy that means well, but I cant support his leftist socialist policies, and his views and feelings I just posted above.

"Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton."

President Trump being outright bad, is to the Democrats and Democrat supporters, not to most of us Republicans.

You have probably seen, and I might have posted to you directly. I support my fellow Cuban American Senator Ted Cruz of Texas. Therm gave me a compliment he did not intend as a compliment, I make Ted Cruz sound like a leftist liberal Democrat, thank you Therm.

Those were not Therms actual words, I cant remember right now, but this is what he meant.

I would love to see my fellow Cuban Americans, Senator Marco Rubio of Florida, or Ted Cruz of Texas, or both, as a future President of the USA. But I think Ted Cruz has a better chance in the future than Marco Rubio.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Senkaku
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Postby Senkaku » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:09 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
You barely remember it. You're just MeToo-ing because you think it makes Democrats look bad.

Bernie was FAR FAR to the left of you. If he'd been chosen by the Democrats YOU WOULD HAVE CALLED HIM A COMMUNIST.

Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton.

Your guy got 44% of the primary vote but got the nomination anyway. In the Democratic party, that would not be possible.

Wrong my friend. I am MeToo-ing because I mean everything I say and I strongly agree with Senkaku.

If Bernie he'd been chosen by the Democrats, I would have pointed out Bernie's support for Fidel, the Cuban regime, Maduro and Chávez in Venezuela, his support for the Sandinista Communist Socialists of Nicaragua at the time, his endorsement and support by the communist socialists of America, who call themselves Comrades, and support the Cuban regime, a small branch of the Democratic Party, Alexandra Ocasio Cortez and 2 of the 3 leftist Muslim Democrat ladies also belong too, as I have posted with proof and links in the past. But I have never and will never call Bernie a communist, this is not my style.

I have posted to you and a few of you here, I like Bernie Personally, I think he is a nice guy that means well, but I cant support his leftist socialist policies, and his views and feelings I just posted above.

"Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton."

President Trump being outright bad, is to the Democrats and Democrat supporters, not to most of us Republicans.

You have probably seen, and I might have posted to you directly. I support my fellow Cuban American Senator Ted Cruz of Texas. Therm gave me a compliment he did not intend as a compliment, I make Ted Cruz sound like a leftist liberal Democrat, thank you Therm.

Those were not Therms actual words, I cant remember right now, but this is what he meant.

I would love to see my fellow Cuban Americans, Senator Marco Rubio of Florida, or Ted Cruz of Texas, as a future President of the USA. But I think Ted Cruz has a better chance in the future than Marco Rubio.

I am begging you to download grammarly or at least take some sort of online syntax course idk but your posts are incredibly difficult to read and each sentence seems to be carefully composed to be as impenetrable and confusing to follow as possible while still getting the buzzwords in
agreed honey. send bees

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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:14 am

Senkaku wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:Wrong my friend. I am MeToo-ing because I mean everything I say and I strongly agree with Senkaku.

If Bernie he'd been chosen by the Democrats, I would have pointed out Bernie's support for Fidel, the Cuban regime, Maduro and Chávez in Venezuela, his support for the Sandinista Communist Socialists of Nicaragua at the time, his endorsement and support by the communist socialists of America, who call themselves Comrades, and support the Cuban regime, a small branch of the Democratic Party, Alexandra Ocasio Cortez and 2 of the 3 leftist Muslim Democrat ladies also belong too, as I have posted with proof and links in the past. But I have never and will never call Bernie a communist, this is not my style.

I have posted to you and a few of you here, I like Bernie Personally, I think he is a nice guy that means well, but I cant support his leftist socialist policies, and his views and feelings I just posted above.

"Furthermore, if Republicans hadn't been blinded by how outright bad Donald Trump was, and they'd got their stuff together so only one of them ran against Trump, you'd be in the horrible position now of trying to defend President Cruz ... or deplore President Clinton."

President Trump being outright bad, is to the Democrats and Democrat supporters, not to most of us Republicans.

You have probably seen, and I might have posted to you directly. I support my fellow Cuban American Senator Ted Cruz of Texas. Therm gave me a compliment he did not intend as a compliment, I make Ted Cruz sound like a leftist liberal Democrat, thank you Therm.

Those were not Therms actual words, I cant remember right now, but this is what he meant.

I would love to see my fellow Cuban Americans, Senator Marco Rubio of Florida, or Ted Cruz of Texas, as a future President of the USA. But I think Ted Cruz has a better chance in the future than Marco Rubio.

I am begging you to download grammarly or at least take some sort of online syntax course idk but your posts are incredibly difficult to read and each sentence seems to be carefully composed to be as impenetrable and confusing to follow as possible while still getting the buzzwords in

I strongly agreed with your post as I posted. Sorry, but I will not take your constructive advice. I think my post is not as bad as you say, but, my English not very good, not very bad, but not very good, :) lol.

I agree, each sentence is very carefully composed, by intent.

I could have broken it down by paragraphs like I usually do. But I did not do so in this case, sorry about that.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:37 am, edited 2 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:20 am

Senkaku wrote:
New haven america wrote:Actually, he wasn't.

Sure, if you follow the Sanders Spam you might believe that, but Biden did great among older voters (The largest voting block) and pretty well among adults 35-50.

...I mean, he kinda did. That doesn't mean it was "rigged" or illegal, but it's pretty clear that party elites consolidated around a candidate they felt was more electable and less extreme and that this consolidation played a significant role in his subsequent capture of the nomination. Biden was getting thumped until Clyburn stepped in to help in South Carolina and Obama subsequently maneuvered behind the scenes to get people to drop out and endorse him, and this consolidation behind him played a significant role in stopping what had looked like was going to be the conclusion until that point- Bernie taking the nomination with a plurality of votes.


A majority is required. I think that's what the insiders feared more than a Bernie nomination: a convention where delegates from the states had to switch their votes at the convention. Bernie would not necessarily have won. Having the plurality does not guarantee that. In fact there's no mechanism to force delegates to form a majority ... messy enough not even counting the Superdelegates and coronavirus!

The wraith of 1968 still looms over them I'm sure. If they had their way I'm sure there would be 30% or so Superdelegates to be sure it's always decided on the first vote (or second vote with the new Superdelegate rules).
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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:29 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax



Bullshit. I'm assuming the rest of your post is bullshit too, and I'm not reading it.

I mean everything I post. No Bullshit about it, you all say you love Facts, and I never post Facts, these are Facts, you strongly disagree with, and all of you strongly disagree with.

Which most Republicans agree with.

There is nothing wrong with disagreeing with each other, we are not here to agree with each other. We are here to share and argue our views with each other. We are not going to change each others minds, that rarely happens on NS.

I encourage you all to read my post, agree with it or not, and posted too me. This is your democratic right in America, the USA, and the western style multi political party nations we are posting from. But it is also my democratic right to post my views to any of you.

As you guys love to say, These are Facts, most Republicans agree with.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:40 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Bullshit. I'm assuming the rest of your post is bullshit too, and I'm not reading it.

I mean everything I post. No Bullshit about it, you all say you love Facts, and I never post Facts, these are Facts ...


There was a conspiracy to affect the 2016 election, led by Russian agents of GRU and "Internet Research Agency".

I'm not saying Trump was involved. Nor even that any of his staff were involved.

I am just asking you to acknowledge that Russia did interfere in the election, and that wasn't a "scam hoax".
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:51 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:I mean everything I post. No Bullshit about it, you all say you love Facts, and I never post Facts, these are Facts ...


There was a conspiracy to affect the 2016 election, led by Russian agents of GRU and "Internet Research Agency".

I'm not saying Trump was involved. Nor even that any of his staff were involved.

I am just asking you to acknowledge that Russia did interfere in the election, and that wasn't a "scam hoax".

Yes, I admit to a certain extent the Russians did interfere, but they wasted their money no matter which side they supported.

I think it did not change many voters mind either way, if any.

The Russians are laughing their A s off at the Americans and American Politicians Political reaction too it, in this sense to them they did not waste their money, they loved it. They are having a lol attack.

President Trump campaigned, Hillary Clinton campaigned, they debated each other, and President Trump won the election, according to the electoral college votes.

If it were not for California s huge population, President Trump would have gotten the majority of the popular vote. If you subtract the votes in California, President Trump won the overall popular vote in the other states, I did the math, I love math, I love doing that kind of stuff.

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this. This is the way I am posting as I believe, the key word is seems.

Do you agree with any parts of my post? Do any of you agree with any parts of my post?
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:00 am, edited 4 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:01 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
There was a conspiracy to affect the 2016 election, led by Russian agents of GRU and "Internet Research Agency".

I'm not saying Trump was involved. Nor even that any of his staff were involved.

I am just asking you to acknowledge that Russia did interfere in the election, and that wasn't a "scam hoax".

Yes, I admit to a certain extent the Russians did interfere, but they wasted their money no matter which side they supported.

I think it did not change many voters mind either way.

The Russians are laughing their A s off at the Americans political reaction too it, in this sense to them they did not waste their money, they loved it.

President Trump campaigned, Hillary Clinton campaigned, they debated each other, and President Trump won the election, according to the electoral college votes.

If it were not for California s huge population, President Trump would have gotten the majority of the popular vote. If you subtract the votes in California, President Trump won the overall popular vote in the other states, I did the math, I love math, I love doing that kind of stuff.

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this. This is the way I am posting as I believe, the key word is seems.

Do you agree with any parts of my post? Do any of you agree with any parts of my post?


The first three words.

There were official statements about the Russian interference, from many agencies including the FBI. There were House and Senate enquiries. There was the Mueller Report. There were indictments. That's an absolute mass of evidence, but still it took a direct question to get from you "to some extent but it made no difference".

So tell me why I should take this:

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this


... as anything but you believing one of Trump's lies?
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:18 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:Yes, I admit to a certain extent the Russians did interfere, but they wasted their money no matter which side they supported.

I think it did not change many voters mind either way.

The Russians are laughing their A s off at the Americans political reaction too it, in this sense to them they did not waste their money, they loved it.

President Trump campaigned, Hillary Clinton campaigned, they debated each other, and President Trump won the election, according to the electoral college votes.

If it were not for California s huge population, President Trump would have gotten the majority of the popular vote. If you subtract the votes in California, President Trump won the overall popular vote in the other states, I did the math, I love math, I love doing that kind of stuff.

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this. This is the way I am posting as I believe, the key word is seems.

Do you agree with any parts of my post? Do any of you agree with any parts of my post?


The first three words.

There were official statements about the Russian interference, from many agencies including the FBI. There were House and Senate enquiries. There was the Mueller Report. There were indictments. That's an absolute mass of evidence, but still it took a direct question to get from you "to some extent but it made no difference".

So tell me why I should take this:

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this


... as anything but you believing one of Trump's lies?

It made no difference because we are not here to agree with other, we are here to share our views and argue with each other.

It made no difference because we strongly disagree, we as is most Republicans.

It made no difference because I and most of my fellow Republicans believe what I posted on this post you are quoting. I said many, I did not say all.

I know you say you have a temper at times you cant control, and you need to leave for awhile as you say. You are not going to like my answer.

The Muller Report proved nothing. There does seem to be evidence the Obama Administration and certain officials, including Obama at least knew, they spied on the Trump campaign to undermined it.

I said there seems to be evidence, the key word I believe is seems.

Many Republicans believe this.

As Trump said, Mr, President, they tried, Russia, Russia, Russia, and that did not work out too well. They tried the impeachment scam hoax.

The Democrats are biased, against Trump and the Republicans, for their selfish Political goals, this is called Politics.

I do not believe Trump's lies as you say. I mean everything I post.

You strongly disagreed with my other post above, you called bullshit, and I call Facts, and my fellow Republicans call Facts, which are Facts.

At least on this one I said seems.

I know you all strongly disagree with my 2 Posts above.

I mean everything I Post. Just like you guys mean everything you Post.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:46 am, edited 10 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:46 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
The first three words.

There were official statements about the Russian interference, from many agencies including the FBI. There were House and Senate enquiries. There was the Mueller Report. There were indictments. That's an absolute mass of evidence, but still it took a direct question to get from you "to some extent but it made no difference".

So tell me why I should take this:

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this


... as anything but you believing one of Trump's lies?

It made no difference because we are not here to agree with other, we are here to share our views and argue with each other.

It made no difference because we strongly disagree, we as is most Republicans.

It made no difference because I and most of my fellow Republicans believe what I posted on this post you are quoting. I said many, I did not say all.


Yeah, I don't believe that. On the contrary, I think most registered Republicans believe that Russia interfered in 2016.

But you made the claim ...


I know you say you have a temper at times you cant control, and you need to leave for awhile as you say. You are not going to like my answer.

The Muller Report proved nothing. There does seem to be evidence the Obama Administration and certain officials, including Obama at least knew, they spied on the Trump campaign to undermined it.

I said there seems to be evidence, the key word I believe is seems.


Present the evidence.

All I've heard is that Trump claimed it. If that's all there is, I'll assume it's a BIG FAT LIE.

And I will think poorly of you if you've brought it up again, AGAIN claiming there is evidence, but you cannot find any.



Many Republicans believe this.

I do not believe Trump's lies as you say. I mean everything I post.

You strongly disagreed with my other post above, you called bullshit, and I call Facts, and my fellow Republicans call Facts, which are Facts.


You claimed the Russian interference was a "scam hoax" and then you claimed that as Fact.

You caved in pretty easily, and admitted that Russia did interfere in 2016.

That's good. I like people who can admit that they were wrong.

But not if they remember it as "I was right".

So we have to go through it all again? You claimed something that was wrong as a "Fact". Do you admit you were wrong when you called the Russia affair a hoax?

Btw, here is a survey from mid last year, showing that even a majority of Republicans accept the Mueller report.

That was an investigation, not a "witch-hunt" as Trump claimed, and the way I know that is that it found no evidence of Trump colluding. If it had been a witch-hunt it would have caught a witch.
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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:53 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
The first three words.

There were official statements about the Russian interference, from many agencies including the FBI. There were House and Senate enquiries. There was the Mueller Report. There were indictments. That's an absolute mass of evidence, but still it took a direct question to get from you "to some extent but it made no difference".

So tell me why I should take this:

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this


... as anything but you believing one of Trump's lies?

It made no difference because we are not here to agree with other, we are here to share our views and argue with each other.

It made no difference because we strongly disagree, we as is most Republicans.

It made no difference because I and most of my fellow Republicans believe what I posted on this post you are quoting. I said many, I did not say all.

I know you say you have a temper at times you cant control, and you need to leave for awhile as you say. You are not going to like my answer.

The Muller Report proved nothing. There does seem to be evidence the Obama Administration and certain officials, including Obama at least knew, they spied on the Trump campaign to undermined it.

I said there seems to be evidence, the key word I believe is seems.

Many Republicans believe this.

As Trump said, Mr, President, they tried, Russia, Russia, Russia, and that did not work out too well. They tried the impeachment scam hoax.

The Democrats are biased, against Trump and the Republicans, for their selfish Political goals, this is called Politics.

I do not believe Trump's lies as you say. I mean everything I post.

You strongly disagreed with my other post above, you called bullshit, and I call Facts, and my fellow Republicans call Facts, which are Facts.

At least on this one I said seems.

I know you all strongly disagree with my 2 Posts above.

I mean everything I Post. Just like you guys mean everything you Post.


Nah, NationStates didn't use to be like this. There used to be like, actual discussion.

Then everything changed when the Trump Conspiracy theorists attacked.

Well first it was Flat Earthers, then it was Obama Birthers, then it was Deep Staters, and then it was Trump people.

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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:05 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:It made no difference because we are not here to agree with other, we are here to share our views and argue with each other.

It made no difference because we strongly disagree, we as is most Republicans.

It made no difference because I and most of my fellow Republicans believe what I posted on this post you are quoting. I said many, I did not say all.


Yeah, I don't believe that. On the contrary, I think most registered Republicans believe that Russia interfered in 2016.

But you made the claim ...


I know you say you have a temper at times you cant control, and you need to leave for awhile as you say. You are not going to like my answer.

The Muller Report proved nothing. There does seem to be evidence the Obama Administration and certain officials, including Obama at least knew, they spied on the Trump campaign to undermined it.

I said there seems to be evidence, the key word I believe is seems.


Present the evidence.

All I've heard is that Trump claimed it. If that's all there is, I'll assume it's a BIG FAT LIE.

And I will think poorly of you if you've brought it up again, AGAIN claiming there is evidence, but you cannot find any.



Many Republicans believe this.

I do not believe Trump's lies as you say. I mean everything I post.

You strongly disagreed with my other post above, you called bullshit, and I call Facts, and my fellow Republicans call Facts, which are Facts.


You claimed the Russian interference was a "scam hoax" and then you claimed that as Fact.

You caved in pretty easily, and admitted that Russia did interfere in 2016.

That's good. I like people who can admit that they were wrong.

But not if they remember it as "I was right".

So we have to go through it all again? You claimed something that was wrong as a "Fact". Do you admit you were wrong when you called the Russia affair a hoax?

Btw, here is a survey from mid last year, showing that even a majority of Republicans accept the Mueller report.

That was an investigation, not a "witch-hunt" as Trump claimed, and the way I know that is that it found no evidence of Trump colluding. If it had been a witch-hunt it would have caught a witch.

Thank you for reading my post, quoting it and posting to me.

I should not have posted, I admit to a certain extent, it gives the wrong impression. I stand by the rest of my post.
We all know the evidence, we have all seen and read it.

I don't need to present the evidence we as is most Republicans strongly disagree with you guys on.

I don't need to bother to look it up, none of you need to bother to look it up, I have seen it and read it, we all have seen it and read it.

But if any of you wish to bother, look it up and posted too me, do so, it is not going to change my mind and most Republicans mind, because we all seen it and strongly disagree on it.

Perhaps we should agree to disagree on it, :) lol.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:07 am, edited 3 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:16 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:I don't need to bother to look it up, none of you need to bother to look it up, I have seen it and read it, we all have seen it and read it.

But if any of you wish to bother, look it up and posted too me, do so, it is not going to change my mind and most Republicans mind, because we all seen it and strongly disagree on it.

Perhaps we should agree to disagree on it, :) lol.


Donald Trump lied. You believed him.

I certainly am not going to look for evidence against a claim based on no evidence. What a waste of time.
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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:45 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:I don't need to bother to look it up, none of you need to bother to look it up, I have seen it and read it, we all have seen it and read it.

But if any of you wish to bother, look it up and posted too me, do so, it is not going to change my mind and most Republicans mind, because we all seen it and strongly disagree on it.

Perhaps we should agree to disagree on it, :) lol.


Donald Trump lied. You believed him.

I certainly am not going to look for evidence against a claim based on no evidence. What a waste of time.

All of you are entitled to your views and to post them too me.

We as in most Republicans I have talked too strongly disagree with you guys.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Borderlands of Rojava
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Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:47 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Why do they even fly the flag anymore? People like Mitch McConnell and of course the president are more than willing to harm the United States if it accomplishes their selfish goals.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax they did not succeed with, for their selfish political purposes.


Correction: Donald Trump'a campaign did have connections to the Russians whether you wanna live in the real world or in Trumpworld, and he didnt get removed from office because it turns out that intimidating witnesses into silence (like Michael Cohen) and having the jury rigged in your favor (Republican Senate) allows you to get away with shit. Russia Russia Russia gets talked about because the guy you support is a treasonous piece of dog shit, and instead of making america great again, he made america a shithole country that gets pity from everyone around the world. I wouldnt be surprised if they start filming save the children PSAs here soon.
Leftist, commie and Antifa Guy. Democratic Confederalist, Anti-racist

"The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you."

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Borderlands of Rojava
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Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:49 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
There was a conspiracy to affect the 2016 election, led by Russian agents of GRU and "Internet Research Agency".

I'm not saying Trump was involved. Nor even that any of his staff were involved.

I am just asking you to acknowledge that Russia did interfere in the election, and that wasn't a "scam hoax".

Yes, I admit to a certain extent the Russians did interfere, but they wasted their money no matter which side they supported.

I think it did not change many voters mind either way, if any.

The Russians are laughing their A s off at the Americans and American Politicians Political reaction too it, in this sense to them they did not waste their money, they loved it. They are having a lol attack.

President Trump campaigned, Hillary Clinton campaigned, they debated each other, and President Trump won the election, according to the electoral college votes.

If it were not for California s huge population, President Trump would have gotten the majority of the popular vote. If you subtract the votes in California, President Trump won the overall popular vote in the other states, I did the math, I love math, I love doing that kind of stuff.

There seems to be evidence, the Obama administration including Obama and his officials spied on the Trump campaign, and tried to undermine Trump, I said there seems to be evidence of this. This is the way I am posting as I believe, the key word is seems.

Do you agree with any parts of my post? Do any of you agree with any parts of my post?


Ah, the good old conspiracy theories again? And you're damn right the russians are having a "lol attack." They can fuck with our country and the president lets them do it.
Leftist, commie and Antifa Guy. Democratic Confederalist, Anti-racist

"The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you."

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Page
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Page » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:50 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Why do they even fly the flag anymore? People like Mitch McConnell and of course the president are more than willing to harm the United States if it accomplishes their selfish goals.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax they did not succeed with, for their selfish political reasons.

The biased partisan Democrats like Adam Schiff tried to get Trump impeached for the Ukraine Gate charges, to hurt President Trump politically, for their selfish political reasons.

The biased partisan Democrats tried to destroy Brett Kavanaugh's reputation and career as a highly qualified US Supreme Court Justice, for their selfish political reasons.

During the US Supreme Court hearings.

The biased partisan Democrats for their selfish political reasons, want to impeach Trump again, if he nominates a US Supreme Court Justice during his term in office, as the US democratic constitution grants him the right to do at anytime he wishes.

I can see it all now, Mr President, they tried the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax, they tried the Ukraine Gate, scam hoax, and now here we go again, with anything they can think of.

Trump has an obligation and a duty to do so to the voters who elected him based on his campaign promises to do so.

With a 4 to 4 Political divide in the court, President Trump has a right, a duty and an obligation to nominate a US Supreme Court justice and try to get him or her confirmed, anytime he wishes during his term.

As the Democratic US constitution allows him too.

A Republican President would nominate and try to confirm a highly qualified right wing Conservative Republican US Supreme Court Justice candidate.

A Democrat President would nominate and try to confirm a highly qualified Leftist Liberal Democrat US Supreme Court Justice candidate, if the situation were reversed or not reversed.

I share these three stories with my fellow Republican Trump supporter nations who post on this thread that care and with all my fellow nations, as I can do so:

Today I met a lady who says they have a Trump sign in front of their house, and they have noticed the mail man in their area is not delivering mail to her house, tomorrow they are going to their area s post office to file an official complaint against the mail man in question.

If this story is true, it shows that certain mail man might delay in delivering mail in ballots they think might be of Republicans. Might throw away certain ballots they think might be of Republicans.

Today as I was walking by this usually busy street, wearing my Republican Red shirt and my Republican Red Trump 2020 Maga Cap Hat, a black American in his car passed by and beeped his car horn towards me, looks at me and holds his thumb up in support of President Trump, It was awesome, I am not lying.

Now I know at least 13 African Americans supporters of President Trump who are going to vote for President Trump. Naturally, I cant personally know the over 100,000 black Americans who are going to vote for President Trump. Just like Democrat supporters cant personally know the millions of black Americans who are going to vote for Biden.


It's so special how you unironically use words like biased and partisan in a derisive way.
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Greater Miami Shores
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Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:14 am

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:The biased partisan Democrats tried to charge President Trump with the Russia, Russia, Russia, scam hoax they did not succeed with, for their selfish political purposes.


Correction: Donald Trump'a campaign did have connections to the Russians whether you wanna live in the real world or in Trumpworld, and he didnt get removed from office because it turns out that intimidating witnesses into silence (like Michael Cohen) and having the jury rigged in your favor (Republican Senate) allows you to get away with shit. Russia Russia Russia gets talked about because the guy you support is a treasonous piece of dog shit, and instead of making america great again, he made america a shithole country that gets pity from everyone around the world. I wouldnt be surprised if they start filming save the children PSAs here soon.

Correction: Everything I posted is a Fact. President Trump has Made America Great Again, according to our Republican Points of view.

You seem to hate President Trump, and there is nothing wrong with it, from your Political Perspective.

You guys seem to hate President Trump, and there is nothing wrong with it from your Political Perspectives.

Many of you guys seem to want me too agree with you no matter what.

Many of you guys seem to want us Republican supporters of President Trump, who agree with him and the Republicans on most issues, to agree with you guys no matter what.

We are not here to agree with each other, we are here to share our different views and argue.

Changing other persons mind on both sides, rarely happens on NS.

Because we are all Political Junkies on NS with our views.

We are all biased towards our own views we have, lets all admit it.

I just post my posts and leave it there, you all should do as I do.

But until that changes, from now from now on, I will declare all my posts as facts, just like you guys do to us Republicans.

As you yourself say Corrections and Facts.

So can we Republicans say corrections and Facts.

Thank you for your post to me.

I don't put any fellow nations on ignore, when I strongly disagree with them. When they insult me with personal and political insults, actionable or non actionable.

But please, don't make them actionable, I hate to see any fellow nation banned from NS forever, because we all love NS, including myself.

I don't report anyone unless I have too, if I think they might have broken an NS rule of decency towards me, or I think they might have gone too far, and I don't have a choice.

I don't report anyone over an RP, not even the RPs are safe anymore on NS, it is sad, very, very said.

Granted, if they bait, flame, and troll than it is ok to do so.

Even then I have looked the other way many times.

I might report on behalf of those I think I owe a favor too.

But other persons report on my behalf and on the behalf of others.

I hate the culture we have on NS of reporting on each other for anything we can think of to hurt our fellow nations.

This is a good time and a perfect time to share with all my fellow nations, my regional poll, opened to all nations, I know I can do so.

Read the OP introduction post first.

Related to Trump, the Republican, the Democrats, and this thread.

17 voters so far have voted on it, more than I expected.

That will close in about 3 days and 6 hours so far.

You may all vote on it, if you wish too.

If you don't wish too, no problems, I cant force any of you.

I am proud of this regional poll, and the related polls I plan to create and share with all my fellow nations, as I know I can.

https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... ami_shores

Thank you and thank you for your post too me.

GMS. I love to sign my TGs and Posts, no matter what anyone tells me.
Last edited by Greater Miami Shores on Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:32 am, edited 3 times in total.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Ex-Nation

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:19 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:You guys seem to hate President Trump, and there is nothing wrong with it from your Political Perspectives.


Personally I've hated Donald Trump since I first saw him talking about something, in the 1990's.

"What is this fucking idiot doing on TV? ... oh, he's rich, that explains it"

He was quite handsome then too. I should have known that TV would make him a celebrity :(
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
High rate of Nobel prizes and other academic achievements.

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Greater Miami Shores
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Founded: Aug 06, 2010
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Greater Miami Shores » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:24 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Greater Miami Shores wrote:You guys seem to hate President Trump, and there is nothing wrong with it from your Political Perspectives.


Personally I've hated Donald Trump since I first saw him talking about something, in the 1990's.

"What is this fucking idiot doing on TV? ... oh, he's rich, that explains it"

He was quite handsome then too. I should have known that TV would make him a celebrity :(


lol, I am having a lol attack, :) :rofl:

Thank you for a lol attack.

GMS.
I once tried to K Me. Posted It and Reported. Locked by Mods. I am Autistic accounts for Repetitive Nature. I am Very Civil and Respectful to all on NS and off NS. My Opinions Are Not Bad Opinions No Ones Opinions Are Bad Opinons. We are on NS, to share, discuss, argue, disagree, on Trump, elections, Republicans, Democrats, Socialists, Libertarians and whatevers, with respect. This Respect Is Given It Is Not Earned, This Respect Is Called Freedom of Expression and Democracy. This Man Always Says What He Means, I Am The Real Thing. I Make Ted Cruz look like a Leftist. I have been on NS For over 10 Years with a Perfect Record of No Baiting, Trolling, Flaming, or Using Foul Language. I Am Very Proud of It and Wish To Keep My Record Clean. But I Am Not The Only One On NS. GMS. I'm Based.

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Founded: Dec 04, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:30 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Personally I've hated Donald Trump since I first saw him talking about something, in the 1990's.

"What is this fucking idiot doing on TV? ... oh, he's rich, that explains it"

He was quite handsome then too. I should have known that TV would make him a celebrity :(


lol, I am having a lol attack, :) :rofl:

Thank you for a lol attack.

GMS.


It's not really funny. Wrestling and Miss America and The Apprentice (?) raised Trump's public profile to that of a major-State Governor or a Senator. A whole lot of people thought they "knew" him already, and for some crazy reason trusted him.

Did you like him before he announced he was a Republican ... and ran for President?
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
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San Lumen
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Posts: 81272
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:30 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Personally I've hated Donald Trump since I first saw him talking about something, in the 1990's.

"What is this fucking idiot doing on TV? ... oh, he's rich, that explains it"

He was quite handsome then too. I should have known that TV would make him a celebrity :(


lol, I am having a lol attack, :) :rofl:

Thank you for a lol attack.

GMS.

Your broken record posts are getting very annoying. Can you at least try to engage in actual debate?

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