LGBT Issues/Support Thread

[Floofybit]

Leftists on their way to bump a 2 year old thread just so they can spew their blatantly incorrect view of something that is clearly not true.

And which side of the political spectrum is currently trying to legislate LGBT+ people out of existence any way they can?

I'd have to say... Neither. Neither right nor left. Anyone who wants to exterminate a specific group of people wouldn't fall on the spectrum, but rather a completely different outlier would, such as murderous, genocidal fascists. Luckily, you don't see much of this present day

[Dimetrodon Empire]

in America, yes we do have such movements.

[Palmyrion]

This is the consequence of spending so much time in political echo chambers.

Time to unpack.

As a conservative, no, your average conservative does not want to kill LGBT people.

Your normal conservative wants:

• Recriminalization of homosexuality, and the criminalization of transgenderism and gender non-conformity
• Ban gay marriage (see previous point); any existing gay marriage will be legally voided, the couple forcibly separated.
• "Freedom" to deny LGBT people healthcare across the board. (This just happened in Arkansas; if you're gay and have terminal cancer, a doctor can simply deny treating you not because your disease is outside their skillset but because of anti-LGBT hatred.)
• Make it impossible for transgender adults to modify their bodies as they wish so they can live according to their desired gender. (see my point on them wanting to criminalize transgenderism)
• Criminalize all depiction of LGBT people and relationships in media

So, not exactly kill, but corner them into a closet, into a place where they can be easily corralled for repression and segregation.

I really don't know where you got this from.

These are the sentiments I get from interacting with Filipino social conservative movements online, especially in Facebook. I have since then took their words as representative of all conservatives (less so for American conservatives).

Being on the internet shows you a leftist leaning community (the internet is Leftist-leaning) with most conservatives staying mostly quiet, and only the radicals speaking their opinions. This corrupts your viewpoint.

The reason conservatives stay mostly quiet is because if they do voice their ultimate goal regarding LGBT people, everyone is going to hound on them.

Many conservatives are perfectly fine with LGBT people, they just disagree on to which level they should represent themselves or how they should be represented (me personally, I'm a social moderate, so I don't have many opinions on the matter)

They are "fine" with LGBT people in the sense that they agree LGBT people should be forced back into the closet.

You need to interact with normal conservatives, not the loud minority. I did the same with normal liberals and it really helped me.

As I said, I interact on the regular with Filipino social conservatives in Facebook, such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines". Your definition of "normal" conservatives and liberals is drastically different from mine, in large part because you and I live in opposite parts of the world.

[Palmyrion]

And which side of the political spectrum is currently trying to legislate LGBT+ people out of existence any way they can?

I'd have to say... Neither. Neither right nor left. Anyone who wants to exterminate a specific group of people wouldn't fall on the spectrum, but rather a completely different outlier would, such as murderous, genocidal fascists. Luckily, you don't see much of this present day

The Republicans, responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now being passed in the United States, are neither right nor left how?

[Sagadahock]

This is the consequence of spending so much time in political echo chambers.

Time to unpack.

As a conservative, no, your average conservative does not want to kill LGBT people.

Your normal conservative wants:

• Recriminalization of homosexuality, and the criminalization of transgenderism and gender non-conformity
• Ban gay marriage (see previous point); any existing gay marriage will be legally voided, the couple forcibly separated.
• "Freedom" to deny LGBT people healthcare across the board. (This just happened in Arkansas; if you're gay and have terminal cancer, a doctor can simply deny treating you not because your disease is outside their skillset but because of anti-LGBT hatred.)
• Make it impossible for transgender adults to modify their bodies as they wish so they can live according to their desired gender. (see my point on them wanting to criminalize transgenderism)
• Criminalize all depiction of LGBT people and relationships in media

So, not exactly kill, but corner them into a closet, into a place where they can be easily corralled for repression and segregation.

I really don't know where you got this from.

These are the sentiments I get from interacting with Filipino social conservative movements online, especially in Facebook. I have since then took their words as representative of all conservatives (less so for American conservatives).

Being on the internet shows you a leftist leaning community (the internet is Leftist-leaning) with most conservatives staying mostly quiet, and only the radicals speaking their opinions. This corrupts your viewpoint.

The reason conservatives stay mostly quiet is because if they do voice their ultimate goal regarding LGBT people, everyone is going to hound on them.

Many conservatives are perfectly fine with LGBT people, they just disagree on to which level they should represent themselves or how they should be represented (me personally, I'm a social moderate, so I don't have many opinions on the matter)

They are "fine" with LGBT people in the sense that they agree LGBT people should be forced back into the closet.

You need to interact with normal conservatives, not the loud minority. I did the same with normal liberals and it really helped me.

As I said, I interact on the regular with Filipino social conservatives in Facebook, such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines". Your definition of "normal" conservatives and liberals is drastically different from mine, in large part because you and I live in opposite parts of the world.

Your conservatives just sound like Fascists, honestly. I can't say your average American conservative would support any of these points, or at least the majority of them. Other than that I can't argue with you because I don't live in the Phillipines.

[Floofybit]

I'd have to say... Neither. Neither right nor left. Anyone who wants to exterminate a specific group of people wouldn't fall on the spectrum, but rather a completely different outlier would, such as murderous, genocidal fascists. Luckily, you don't see much of this present day

The Republicans, responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now being passed in the United States, are neither right nor left how?

And the liberal extremists suppressing media if it doesn't agree with leftist ideals is better? Not a single people in my community, or shares political ideals as me, wishes to exterminate anyone.

[Sordhau]

Time to unpack.


Your normal conservative wants:

• Recriminalization of homosexuality, and the criminalization of transgenderism and gender non-conformity
• Ban gay marriage (see previous point); any existing gay marriage will be legally voided, the couple forcibly separated.
• "Freedom" to deny LGBT people healthcare across the board. (This just happened in Arkansas; if you're gay and have terminal cancer, a doctor can simply deny treating you not because your disease is outside their skillset but because of anti-LGBT hatred.)
• Make it impossible for transgender adults to modify their bodies as they wish so they can live according to their desired gender. (see my point on them wanting to criminalize transgenderism)
• Criminalize all depiction of LGBT people and relationships in media

So, not exactly kill, but corner them into a closet, into a place where they can be easily corralled for repression and segregation.


These are the sentiments I get from interacting with Filipino social conservative movements online, especially in Facebook. I have since then took their words as representative of all conservatives (less so for American conservatives).


The reason conservatives stay mostly quiet is because if they do voice their ultimate goal regarding LGBT people, everyone is going to hound on them.



They are "fine" with LGBT people in the sense that they agree LGBT people should be forced back into the closet.


As I said, I interact on the regular with Filipino social conservatives in Facebook, such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines". Your definition of "normal" conservatives and liberals is drastically different from mine, in large part because you and I live in opposite parts of the world.

Your conservatives just sound like Fascists, honestly. I can't say your average American conservative would support any of these points, or at least the majority of them. Other than that I can't argue with you because I don't live in the Phillipines.

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

[Palmyrion]

Conservatives ultimately want to move the Overton Window to a point where LGBT genocide is policy. It doesn't matter if they are by today's Overton window coverage "radical" or "moderate", for it is the ultimate goal for conservatives.

How often do you talk politics in real life? Not really very often. That's where the majority of conservatives are. The radicals tend to be the one who spend their time online, where most people talk politics. Talk to more conservatives before making such harmful accusations, it does nothing but make things worse.

Another unpacking it seems.

How often do you talk politics in real life? Not really very often.

With my parents, relatives, and close family friends, shit can get political when doing small talk, especially when I talk about me being politically outspoken and they tell me to be politically silent. They literally believe that if I get tortured, killed, disappeared for voicing out my criticism and opposition of the Philippine government, I deserved it.

The radicals tend to be the one who spend their time online, where most people talk politics.

And the moderates have a tendency to march behind the radicals. This is true for both sides of the political spectrum.

Talk to more conservatives before making such harmful accusations, it does nothing but make things worse.

I have mentioned that I regularly talk with social conservatives in Facebook such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines" that say they want to create a Philippines where homosexuality, transgenderism, and gender non-conformity are socially ostracised and even criminalized (complete with morality police) but homosexuals, transgenders, and gender non-conformists should be embraced and be changed.

Plus, I don't care if those accusations are harmful, they only need to be true. Besides, the only reason they're harmful is because they mercilessly strike a whole lot of nerves.

[Floofybit]

Your conservatives just sound like Fascists, honestly. I can't say your average American conservative would support any of these points, or at least the majority of them. Other than that I can't argue with you because I don't live in the Phillipines.

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

No, no it doesn't. Not a single conservative I know believes that all gay people are bad.

[Armeattla]

It depends on what type of conservativism is being mentioned. I don't think the Tories are going to persecute the LGBT+ community in Britain for example, but the American Republican party absolutely would, and is currently fighting to do so.

The current Tory leader is very much for reintroducing Section 28.
So much for that.

[Sagadahock]

Your conservatives just sound like Fascists, honestly. I can't say your average American conservative would support any of these points, or at least the majority of them. Other than that I can't argue with you because I don't live in the Phillipines.

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

No, it really doesn't. As a moderate, wouldn't you agree that I am a little less biased on this than you, a radical leftist?

[Dimetrodon Empire]

The Republicans, responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now being passed in the United States, are neither right nor left how?

And the liberal extremists suppressing media if it doesn't agree with leftist ideals is better? Not a single people in my community, or shares political ideals as me, wishes to exterminate anyone.

I'm dismissing whataboutism off the bat. Also, your community does not encompass all of American conservatism.

I also doubt they know you're a furry who is probably in the LGBT+ community. I'm sure if they knew that, some in your community would treat you very differently.

[Palmyrion]

The Republicans, responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now being passed in the United States, are neither right nor left how?

And the liberal extremists suppressing media if it doesn't agree with leftist ideals is better?

Stop with the whataboutism.

Not a single people in my community, or shares political ideals as me, wishes to exterminate anyone.

Yet conservatives are responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now.

[Vassenor]

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

No, no it doesn't. Not a single conservative I know believes that all gay people are bad.

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

[Palmyrion]

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

No, no it doesn't. Not a single conservative I know believes that all gay people are bad.

Every conservative I know believes homosexuality bad, gay marriage bad.

[Sagadahock]

No, no it doesn't. Not a single conservative I know believes that all gay people are bad.

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

[Vassenor]

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

Anti-LGBT legislation in the GOP predates Trumpism but go off.

[Bewaffnete Krafte]

How often do you talk politics in real life? Not really very often. That's where the majority of conservatives are. The radicals tend to be the one who spend their time online, where most people talk politics. Talk to more conservatives before making such harmful accusations, it does nothing but make things worse.

Another unpacking it seems.

How often do you talk politics in real life? Not really very often.

With my parents, relatives, and close family friends, shit can get political when doing small talk, especially when I talk about me being politically outspoken and they tell me to be politically silent. They literally believe that if I get tortured, killed, disappeared for voicing out my criticism and opposition of the Philippine government, I deserved it.

The radicals tend to be the one who spend their time online, where most people talk politics.

And the moderates have a tendency to march behind the radicals. This is true for both sides of the political spectrum.

Talk to more conservatives before making such harmful accusations, it does nothing but make things worse.

I have mentioned that I regularly talk with social conservatives in Facebook such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines" that say they want to create a Philippines where homosexuality, transgenderism, and gender non-conformity are socially ostracised and even criminalized (complete with morality police) but homosexuals, transgenders, and gender non-conformists should be embraced and be changed.

Plus, I don't care if those accusations are harmful, they only need to be true. Besides, the only reason they're harmful is because they mercilessly strike a whole lot of nerves.

Firstly, that's awful and I'm sorry that your family believes that. Clearly the political climate in the Phillipines is vastly different than that of the US. I assumed originally that your were american.
Secondly, they are harmful because they are false, and because they villainize and demonize an entire half of the population by calling them evil.

[Armeattla]

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

I agree with this.
The democrat party is closer to any conservative party than the Republican party is - they straight up are ultraconservatives, nationalists, ultranationalists and fascists.
And their media lapdogs are absolutely no different.

[Palmyrion]

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative

Say that again. Are you trying to make a joke? Because if so that was a really badly-constructed joke.

Pretty much everything he said applies to US Conservatives too.

No, it really doesn't. As a moderate, wouldn't you agree that I am a little less biased on this than you, a radical leftist?

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

[Sagadahock]

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

Anti-LGBT legislation in the GOP predates Trumpism but go off.

He certainly hasn't made it better.
Also, isn't there a bit of irony in saying that because a conservative party does something, that conservatives support it? Haven't leftists been saying the Democratic party isn't representative of liberals for years?

[Dimetrodon Empire]

I guess he is saying that the GOP is more reactionary than conservative.

[Transsibiria]

I have mentioned that I regularly talk with social conservatives in Facebook such as the "Philippine Social Conservative Movement" and "Conservatives in the Philippines" that say they want to create a Philippines where homosexuality, transgenderism, and gender non-conformity are socially ostracised and even criminalized (complete with morality police) but homosexuals, transgenders, and gender non-conformists should be embraced and be changed.

Plus, I don't care if those accusations are harmful, they only need to be true. Besides, the only reason they're harmful is because they mercilessly strike a whole lot of nerves.

Where such extreme sentiments always present in philippine political discourse or did appear at some point, and if so around what time they did appear?

[Sagadahock]

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative and was traumatized by that orange bastard past the point of recognition.

Because the main conservative party is hardly conservative

Say that again. Are you trying to make a joke? Because if so that was a really badly-constructed joke.

No, it really doesn't. As a moderate, wouldn't you agree that I am a little less biased on this than you, a radical leftist?

So why is the main conservative party trying to legislate the LGBT+ community out of existence?

He called the republican party the main conservative party. I was using his term before refuting it.

[Armeattla]

The Republicans, responsible for ALL of the anti-LGBT legislation we are seeing now being passed in the United States, are neither right nor left how?

And the liberal extremists suppressing media if it doesn't agree with leftist ideals is better? Not a single people in my community, or shares political ideals as me, wishes to exterminate anyone.

Since when are liberals left?
Oh wait, they never were.
They are pseudo-progressives. They take up the aesthetics of progressivism while upholding the status quo with minimal concessions.
The Democrats aren't even social liberals which would be centre/centre-left.
Liberals are opposed to any serious leftist ideal because it would undermine any facade of the status quo.