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LGBT Issues/Support Thread

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Which of these best describe your identity?

Heterosexual
256
15%
Homosexual
128
8%
Bisexual
169
10%
Pansexual/Polysexual
73
4%
Asexual/Aro
101
6%
Cisgender
222
13%
Transgender
84
5%
He/Him
396
24%
She/Her
124
7%
They/Them or Other
110
7%
 
Total votes : 1663

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sat Oct 22, 2022 11:23 pm

Senkaku wrote:Who is this "average conservative candidate" you're speaking about here? It sounds very much to me like you've created an image of a moderate pro-business type with no strong beliefs on social issues that is not at all related to the reality of the culture war occurring across the Anglosphere and the West generally, mostly to assuage your own doubts about the increasingly genocidal tilt of your whole tendency's rhetoric.

What is this "genocidal tilt" you're talking about? A few edge-case laws in the United States regarding trans issues does not equal worldwide genocide of an entire demographic by these fictional conservative fascists you're dreaming up.

Would you like me to make some sweeping generalisations based on outliers too, since that seems to be your specialty? Should I start saying trans people are all groomers (because there have been a handful of cases)? Should I say that all immigrants are criminals (because some dirt poor people commit crime)? That's the caliber of argument you're making.

Meguminsk wrote:I have a question, and please don't take it as anything malicious I'm just genuinely and sincerely asking for advice.

My friend just recently came out and I've been meaning to ask how should I address him (or her?) now.
I come from quite a conservative family but I never really did latch on to their ideology but I guess it still somewhat seeped into my brain as I'm a bit apprehensive about coming up to him (or her) and asking about it.
fuck idk what to do man, please help

It's good that they had the confidence to come out to you (or everyone). You should probably just address them however they'd like to be addressed. The small bit of understandable apprehension you feel about using different pronouns would be felt by them hundreds of times over whenever they explain their identity to someone.
Last edited by Drongonia on Sat Oct 22, 2022 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:06 am

Drongonia wrote:
Senkaku wrote:Who is this "average conservative candidate" you're speaking about here? It sounds very much to me like you've created an image of a moderate pro-business type with no strong beliefs on social issues that is not at all related to the reality of the culture war occurring across the Anglosphere and the West generally, mostly to assuage your own doubts about the increasingly genocidal tilt of your whole tendency's rhetoric.

What is this "genocidal tilt" you're talking about? A few edge-case laws in the United States regarding trans issues does not equal worldwide genocide of an entire demographic by these fictional conservative fascists you're dreaming up.

Would you like me to make some sweeping generalisations based on outliers too, since that seems to be your specialty? Should I start saying trans people are all groomers (because there have been a handful of cases)? Should I say that all immigrants are criminals (because some dirt poor people commit crime)? That's the caliber of argument you're making.

Meguminsk wrote:I have a question, and please don't take it as anything malicious I'm just genuinely and sincerely asking for advice.

My friend just recently came out and I've been meaning to ask how should I address him (or her?) now.
I come from quite a conservative family but I never really did latch on to their ideology but I guess it still somewhat seeped into my brain as I'm a bit apprehensive about coming up to him (or her) and asking about it.
fuck idk what to do man, please help

It's good that they had the confidence to come out to you (or everyone). You should probably just address them however they'd like to be addressed. The small bit of understandable apprehension you feel about using different pronouns would be felt by them hundreds of times over whenever they explain their identity to someone.

No one has to dream them up.

6 of them are on SCOTUS right now.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:17 am

New haven america wrote:No one has to dream them up.

6 of them are on SCOTUS right now.

Dunno if you're trolling or just genuinely... I don't know to be honest.

Yep, I'm super scared of Chancellor of the Neolibenreich Amy Coney Barrett (who literally voted in late 2021 to allow a trans patient to sue a Catholic hospital for being denied a hysterectomy) alright. Give it a break, this is really a case of "anyone to the right of my arm is a fascist" type nonsense.

User avatar
Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24942
Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:20 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:No one has to dream them up.

6 of them are on SCOTUS right now.

Dunno if you're trolling or just genuinely... I don't know to be honest.

Yep, I'm super scared of Chancellor of the Neolibenreich Amy Coney Barrett (who literally voted in late 2021 to allow a trans patient to sue a Catholic hospital for being denied a hysterectomy) alright. Give it a break, this is really a case of "anyone to the right of my arm is a fascist" type nonsense.

The only thing preventing the neonazi kingmakers in Sweden from tossing the gay "untermenschen" to Kabul is the fact that our Overton window isn't that much capsized yet.

User avatar
Grenartia
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44623
Founded: Feb 14, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Grenartia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:23 am

Floofybit wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
You honestly expect us to believe that the side that openly is waging a culture war against us, and specifically is pursuing policies that actively harm us, is the best side for us to support?

Do you have a deathwish for yourself, and wanna drag us down with you, or what?

It's who I side with, it's who my family sides with, it's who my friends side with, it's who my community sides with

it's who that one cute boy sided with


So...unironic groupthink.
Lib-left. Antifascist, antitankie, anti-capitalist, anti-imperialist (including the imperialism of non-western countries). Christian (Unitarian Universalist). Background in physics.
Mostly a girl. She or they pronouns, please. Unrepentant transbian.
Reject tradition, embrace modernity.
People who call themselves based NEVER are.
The truth about kids transitioning.

User avatar
Transsibiria
Envoy
 
Posts: 222
Founded: Sep 18, 2022
Father Knows Best State

Postby Transsibiria » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:27 am

Senkaku wrote:Who is this "average conservative candidate" you're speaking about here? It sounds very much to me like you've created an image of a moderate pro-business type with no strong beliefs on social issues that is not at all related to the reality of the culture war occurring across the Anglosphere and the West generally, mostly to assuage your own doubts about the increasingly genocidal tilt of your whole tendency's rhetoric.


More like whatever madness and insanity is going on inside the United States, which is by now one of the world leading export nations for toxic garbage ideology.

I propose to build a huge ideological firewall around US and contain it until they get it back together. Until then, they can enjoy their hell they created for themself. I do not see the reason why the rest of the west yet alone the world ought to suffer from US political psychosis.
Last edited by Transsibiria on Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
Official Nation Name: Union of Socialist Soviet States
Government Type: Socialist Federal Republic
Capital: Novosibirsk
Current Year: 2022
Population: 167 Million
Location: Siberia and East Asia

Factbook (work in progress)
Also attempting to get NS stats close to canon
Disclaimer:
This nation is part of a worldbuilding experiment and is a work of fiction.

It does not represents the authors OOC views.
Union of Socialist Soviet States
A cyberpunk influenced world where after an alternate World War II the surviving remannts of the USSR east of the urals have been transformed into a new state known as Transsibiria which encompasses most of Sibiria, Mongolia, Central Asia and parts of northern China.

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:27 am

Transsibiria wrote:
Senkaku wrote:Who is this "average conservative candidate" you're speaking about here? It sounds very much to me like you've created an image of a moderate pro-business type with no strong beliefs on social issues that is not at all related to the reality of the culture war occurring across the Anglosphere and the West generally, mostly to assuage your own doubts about the increasingly genocidal tilt of your whole tendency's rhetoric.


More like whatever madness and insanity is going on inside the United States, which is by now one of the world leading export nations for toxic garbage ideology.

I propose to build a huge ideological firewall around anything ideological coming from the US and contain it until they get it back together. Until then, they can enjoy their hell they created for themself. I do not see the reason why the rest of the west yet alone the world ought to suffer from US political psychosis.

Please!

We will build the firewall and make America pay for it.

User avatar
Grenartia
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44623
Founded: Feb 14, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Grenartia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:29 am

Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are there any militaries in first-world countries that accept refugees into their ranks?

Asking because I’m going to have to leave Russia pretty soon


Also the LGBTQ+ propaganda ban will be approved in the Russian mocking of a parliament pretty soon


Do not take what I'm about to say as a definite, but maybe the French Foreign Legion? I think Biden reinstated accepting LGBT+ refugees, but I'm not sure if the US has ever had a program to allow refugees to serve in the military.
Lib-left. Antifascist, antitankie, anti-capitalist, anti-imperialist (including the imperialism of non-western countries). Christian (Unitarian Universalist). Background in physics.
Mostly a girl. She or they pronouns, please. Unrepentant transbian.
Reject tradition, embrace modernity.
People who call themselves based NEVER are.
The truth about kids transitioning.

User avatar
Mattopilos III
Diplomat
 
Posts: 607
Founded: Oct 11, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Mattopilos III » Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:29 am

Dumb Ideologies wrote:Honestly plenty of our LGBT users aren't the stereotype of pride-flag waving, super progressive libertarian leftists. This is a site full of political nerds, and that means you tend to get a fair share of people who go against the grain in some manner of their politics from what you'd expect of a member of "their community" (particularly if they don't actually have much to do with said community).


And most of them fit under the name you have.
People on here unfortunately tend to fall into treating ideology like going to the supermarket.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:21 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:No one has to dream them up.

6 of them are on SCOTUS right now.

Dunno if you're trolling or just genuinely... I don't know to be honest.

Yep, I'm super scared of Chancellor of the Neolibenreich Amy Coney Barrett (who literally voted in late 2021 to allow a trans patient to sue a Catholic hospital for being denied a hysterectomy) alright. Give it a break, this is really a case of "anyone to the right of my arm is a fascist" type nonsense.

Oh FFS, please for the love of whatever deity fits your fancy, get original material.

Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

This shit is mind numbingly boring. I already know why most conservatives keep up with these points, and it got old 6 years ago.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:24 am, edited 3 times in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Laka Strolistandiler
Senator
 
Posts: 4834
Founded: Jul 14, 2018
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby Laka Strolistandiler » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:27 am

Drongonia wrote:
Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are there any militaries in first-world countries that accept refugees into their ranks?

Asking because I’m going to have to leave Russia pretty soon


Also the LGBTQ+ propaganda ban will be approved in the Russian mocking of a parliament pretty soon

Why specifically the military?

Because they require no experience to get in, pay relatively well and also provide food and living space free of charge. It’s better than unqualified manual hard labor and I don’t mind the possibility of being killed if it’s for a good cause
||||||||||||||||||||
I am not a Russian but a Cameroonian born in this POS.
An autocratic semi feudal monarchy with elements of aristocracy. Society absurdly hierarchical, cosplaying Edwardian Britain. A British-ish colonial empire incorporating some partially democratic nations who just want some WMD’s
Pronouns up to your choice I can be a girl if I want to so refer to me as she/her.
I reserve the right to /stillme any one-liners if my post is at least two lines long

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:28 am

Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are there any militaries in first-world countries that accept refugees into their ranks?

Asking because I’m going to have to leave Russia pretty soon


Also the LGBTQ+ propaganda ban will be approved in the Russian mocking of a parliament pretty soon

French Foreign Legion, but those are basically marines on steroids, so you better learn to enjoy living the <2% body fat lifestyle and living in the African bush dealing with coups and warlords for years at a time.

The US also allows foreign soldiers to join and gain citizenship, but that only applies to people who live in US involved combat zones, and also the US doesn't have the best record getting those people out of their native country...

Finally... Ukraine might actually work. They really need multi-linguals who can help deal with the masses of Russian soldiers deserting and surrendering. That is, if they don't blow you up for crossing the border first...
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:30 am

New haven america wrote:Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

If you can find a genuine reason to call me or anyone else you're accusing of being a fascist I'd like to hear it.
Last edited by Drongonia on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Laka Strolistandiler
Senator
 
Posts: 4834
Founded: Jul 14, 2018
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby Laka Strolistandiler » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:33 am

Grenartia wrote:
Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are there any militaries in first-world countries that accept refugees into their ranks?

Asking because I’m going to have to leave Russia pretty soon


Also the LGBTQ+ propaganda ban will be approved in the Russian mocking of a parliament pretty soon


Do not take what I'm about to say as a definite, but maybe the French Foreign Legion? I think Biden reinstated accepting LGBT+ refugees, but I'm not sure if the US has ever had a program to allow refugees to serve in the military.

They are not what you’d call LGBTQ friendly. I couldn’t find it but I remember a Reddit post made in ~2018 detailing why it would be a very, VERY bad idea for a gay person to join their ranks. Not that I’m gay but to homophobes all non-binaries are lol
||||||||||||||||||||
I am not a Russian but a Cameroonian born in this POS.
An autocratic semi feudal monarchy with elements of aristocracy. Society absurdly hierarchical, cosplaying Edwardian Britain. A British-ish colonial empire incorporating some partially democratic nations who just want some WMD’s
Pronouns up to your choice I can be a girl if I want to so refer to me as she/her.
I reserve the right to /stillme any one-liners if my post is at least two lines long

User avatar
Deuster
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 3
Founded: Oct 22, 2022
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Deuster » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:33 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

If you can find a genuine reason to call me or anyone else you're accusing of being a fascist I'd like to hear it.

Yeah. If you're going to call someone a fascist, then there should be proof and good reasonings. Not everyone is fascist.
Last edited by Deuster on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Lore nation for Calenoa.
Run by the same person who runs Calenoa.
Female
From Deutschland
Living in the US currently
Languages: Deutsch, und Englisch
I am Autistic and tend to take things literally
Spine = Slanted
Currently obsessed with TF2.
Bit of a Geography and History nerd.
Polyamorous-Bisexual
"Führer Günther Ludwig vill be speaking now"
NS STATS CANON UNLESS SAID OTHERWISE!
THIS NATION DOES NOT REPRESENT MY PERSONAL VIEWS
Not very active on forums because of real life.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:36 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

If you can find a genuine reason to call me or anyone else you're accusing of being a fascist I'd like to hear it.

Given we don't have a handy dandy list of all your beliefs, I don't know how you expect me to explain this.

And I mean your actual beliefs, not the ones you use to make yourself feel good about supporting discrimination.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:40 am

New haven america wrote:
Drongonia wrote:If you can find a genuine reason to call me or anyone else you're accusing of being a fascist I'd like to hear it.

Given we don't have a handy dandy list of all your beliefs, I don't know how you expect me to explain this.

Exactly, so you should stop assigning labels to people based on your (wrong) surface-level analysis :)

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:42 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:Given we don't have a handy dandy list of all your beliefs, I don't know how you expect me to explain this.

Exactly, so you should stop assigning labels to people based on your (wrong) surface-level analysis :)

No, I'm willing to go point by point explaining why you're a fascist, I just need the beliefs. :)

And again, I mean your actual beliefs, not the ones you use to make yourself feel good about supporting discrimination.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:42 am

New haven america wrote:
Drongonia wrote:Exactly, so you should stop assigning labels to people based on your (wrong) surface-level analysis :)

No, I'm willing to go point by point explaining why you're a fascist, I just need the beliefs. :)

"You are a fascist, I have no proof, but I know it"

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:43 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:No, I'm willing to go point by point explaining why you're a fascist, I just need the beliefs. :)

"You are a fascist, I have no proof, but I know it"

Then provide the points for the class so I can explain it.

You're the one who wanted this, why are you backtracking so suddenly?
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:45 am

New haven america wrote:
Drongonia wrote:"You are a fascist, I have no proof, but I know it"

Then provide the points so I can explain it.

You're the one who wanted this, why are you backtracking so suddenly?

What?

You said this:
New haven america wrote:Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

You implied I am a fascist. So please either clarify or tell me how, it shouldn't matter whether you have an itemised list of my beliefs or not, since you seemed sure.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43452
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:48 am

Drongonia wrote:
New haven america wrote:Then provide the points so I can explain it.

You're the one who wanted this, why are you backtracking so suddenly?

What?

You said this:
New haven america wrote:Everytime one of you gets called all you can respond with is "Yeah, haha, keep being delusional. All X are fascists to you, haha. I can't come up with an original insult if my life depended on it, haha."

You implied I am a fascist. So please either clarify or tell me how, it shouldn't matter whether you have an itemised list of my beliefs or not, since you seemed sure.

Ok, so stop avoiding the issue and provide a list of your beliefs, I'll explain it to you. :)

You're the one who wanted this, so provide a list of your beliefs, or keep using the same boring tactics the right has been using for decades.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2024

That's all folks~

User avatar
Drongonia
Minister
 
Posts: 3143
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
New York Times Democracy

Postby Drongonia » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:52 am

New haven america wrote:
Drongonia wrote:What?

You said this:
You implied I am a fascist. So please either clarify or tell me how, it shouldn't matter whether you have an itemised list of my beliefs or not, since you seemed sure.

Ok, so stop avoiding the issue and provide a list of your beliefs, I'll explain it to you. :)

You're the one who wanted this, so provide a list of your beliefs, or keep using the same boring tactics the right has been using for decades.

This conversation so far has amounted to:
"You're a fascist"
"How?"
"I'm not sure yet"

What beliefs do you want anyway? I might actually give you your list if you make your demands reasonable and your questions answerable.

User avatar
Palmyrion
Minister
 
Posts: 2373
Founded: Mar 04, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Palmyrion » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:54 am

Drongonia wrote:
Palmyrion wrote:Why would LGBT people endorse conservative candidates even? It's like Jews endorsing Hitler, or women in the US supporting the abolition of the 19th Amendment.

Like I said, not every conservative candidate is calling for anything similar. Comparing the average conservative political candidate to an anti-LGBT candidate is absurd and frankly extremely offensive.

Do you really think someone like Mitt Romney in his heart of hearts dreams of exterminating gays in death camps? No, he likely doesn't care and would rather spend his time chasing money. Same goes for conservative candidates in other countries. When has someone like Nigel Farrage indicated he wants this for the UK. Bill English for New Zealand? Scott Morrison for Australia?

Come off it.

My mistake for not differentiating social and economic conservatives. That's on me.
__PALMYRION: INTO THE PALMYRO-VERSE__
Greater Dienstad (NSMT) | Kali Yuga (Hard MT) | Niteo (AD 5000 FT) | Screwed Reality
Diplomatic Outreach Programme | The Dozen Giants | Storefront | Discord Server

NS stats have been CONFIDENTIAL and [REDACTED] into a [DATA EXPUNGED].

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Calenoa
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 56
Founded: Jul 14, 2022
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Calenoa » Sun Oct 23, 2022 2:54 am

Drongonia wrote:"You're a fascist"
"How?"
"I'm not sure yet"

This can also be applied to other people who will just randomly call others fascists.
Female
From Deutschland
Living in the US currently
Languages: Deutsch, und Englisch
I am Autistic and tend to take things literally
Spine = Slanted
Currently obsessed with TF2.
Bit of a Geography and History nerd.
Polyamorous-Bisexual

Jev Närrin, President of The Community of Calenoa.
Part of the Inferno Stellaria region.
NS Stats canon unless said otherwise.
Not very active on forums because of real life.

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