ICE detention centre detainees undergo mass hysterectomies

[Novus America]

No they aren't. I find it hilarious however that for all their assertions their enemies are Nazis the Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis. What was this one called? The big lie? Just keep repeating a lie over and over in the hopes it catches on?

Just like your spiritual liege.

So putting people in internment camps without trial or due process and sterilizing them is not Naziish but telling a lie is? Hard reach bro.

Detaining people for unauthorized immigration, with a legal hearing (yes not a full trial, but there is still some legal due process) for an average of 30 days is different than imprisoning your own citizens en masse based only on ethnicity.

Sure what some of these private prisons have done is truly horrible, and we need to build proper government run refugee camps and immigrant processing centers, and stop outsourcing to poorly supervised private prisons, there are still some major differences.

This is more a matter of neglect and poor supervision, not a concentrated effort to wipe out all minorities in the US.

Detaining unauthorized immigrants until the can be vetted is fine.
Detaining then in bad conditions is NOT fine, and needs to stop, but that is still different than rounding up minorities of amongst your own citizens for the purpose of eliminating their identity.

[Ifreann]

I don't know why you bring up the Democrats when I criticise the Republicans. Do you think I like the Democrats?

You do. Otherwise you wouldn't spend the time you do defending their ideas.

The Democrats are less bad that the Republicans. That doesn't mean I like them.

[Aureumterra]

So putting people in internment camps without trial or due process and sterilizing them is not Naziish but telling a lie is? Hard reach bro.

Detaining people for unauthorized immigration, with a legal hearing (yes not a full trial, but there is still some legal due process) for an average of 30 days is different than imprisoning your own citizens en masse based only on ethnicity.

Sure what some of these private prisons have done is horrible, and we need to build proper government run refugee camps and immigrant processing centers, and stop outsourcing to poorly supervised private prisons, there are still some major differences.

This is more a matter neglect and poor supervision, not a concentrated effort to wipe out all minorities in the US.

I don’t understand where race comes from, since there are plenty of white illegal migrants in these centers as well.

Could it be, race is just used as a political propaganda tool?!

Race gets inserted into discourse which involves no race at all many times, often in an attempt to tag every action as being racially motivated

[Novus America]

Detaining people for unauthorized immigration, with a legal hearing (yes not a full trial, but there is still some legal due process) for an average of 30 days is different than imprisoning your own citizens en masse based only on ethnicity.

Sure what some of these private prisons have done is horrible, and we need to build proper government run refugee camps and immigrant processing centers, and stop outsourcing to poorly supervised private prisons, there are still some major differences.

This is more a matter neglect and poor supervision, not a concentrated effort to wipe out all minorities in the US.

I don’t understand where race comes from, since there are plenty of white illegal migrants in these centers as well.

Could it be, race is just used as a political propaganda tool?!

This is true, there are some Eastern European for example unauthorized immigrants in detention as well. So it is not based on race, sure most are Hispanic, (which is not a race) but that is simply because most unauthorized immigrants are Hispanic. If there was a massive surge of illegal immigration from say the U.K., we would see many British in immigration detention. The reason we have few from the U.K. is people from the U.K. rarely immigrate to the US without legal authorization.

Detention of unauthorized immigrants while they are being vetted is perfectly permissible under US and international law, and is not a bad thing.

The problem is the detention conditions, (yes some of the private prisons are really bad) not usually why they are being detained.

[The Greater Ohio Valley]

Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis.

Considering that, like ‘regular’ fascism, a core part of Nazism is authoritarian ultranationalism, they really aren’t.

[Cordel One]

I remember hearing various history teachers ask their classes if the United States could become like Nazi Germany, and many people said no because we know better. It's very obvious that we don't.

Dude, if you think this is anything close to Nazi Germany, then you really don't know anything about Nazi Germany.

They're definitely not as terrible as the Nazi ones, but there are a lot of similarities and in both cases they're disgusting and immoral concentration camps.

[Major-Tom]

The federal government is operating concentration camps on American soil right now and you can see in this very thread that some people are fully supportive of it.

No they aren't. I find it hilarious however that for all their assertions their enemies are Nazis the Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis. What was this one called? The big lie? Just keep repeating a lie over and over in the hopes it catches on?

Just like your spiritual liege.

I can't even tell if you're taking yourself seriously at this point, honestly.

[Liriena]

No they aren't. I find it hilarious however that for all their assertions their enemies are Nazis the Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis. What was this one called? The big lie? Just keep repeating a lie over and over in the hopes it catches on?

Just like your spiritual liege.

I can't even tell if you're taking yourself seriously at this point, honestly.

The Emerald Legion turned into r/forwardsfromgrandma and we didn't even notice.

[Vassenor]

The federal government is operating concentration camps on American soil right now and you can see in this very thread that some people are fully supportive of it.

No they aren't. I find it hilarious however that for all their assertions their enemies are Nazis the Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis. What was this one called? The big lie? Just keep repeating a lie over and over in the hopes it catches on?

Just like your spiritual liege.

So let's see actual examples of the Democrats implementing Nazi positions.

[Major-Tom]

I can't even tell if you're taking yourself seriously at this point, honestly.

The Emerald Legion turned into r/forwardsfromgrandma and we didn't even notice.

Really wish I hadn't opened that subreddit. My eyes are in pain.

[Kowani]

The Emerald Legion turned into r/forwardsfromgrandma and we didn't even notice.

Really wish I hadn't opened that subreddit. My eyes are in pain.

Wait 'till you see r/forwardsfromklandma

[Major-Tom]

Really wish I hadn't opened that subreddit. My eyes are in pain.

Wait 'till you see r/forwardsfromklandma

No, I don't think I will.

[Cordel One]

Wait 'till you see r/forwardsfromklandma

No, I don't think I will.

Or r/forwardsfromreddit for cringe from younger generations

[The Emerald Legion]

No they aren't. I find it hilarious however that for all their assertions their enemies are Nazis the Democrats more and more every day act like the Nazis. What was this one called? The big lie? Just keep repeating a lie over and over in the hopes it catches on?

Just like your spiritual liege.

I can't even tell if you're taking yourself seriously at this point, honestly.

If I was taking myself seriously would I be here?

[Aureumterra]

I can't even tell if you're taking yourself seriously at this point, honestly.

If I was taking myself seriously would I be here?

Oh shit

[State of Turelisa]

Are people still gonna deny these places are concentration camps?

That's a rather melodramatic comparison.

The 'inmates' chose to breach the borders illegally. These are not civilians displaced by an invading enemy nor a racial group segregated and detained in a camp by a racist police state. They're criminals illegal aliens and they're being contained until their claims for asylum are verified, in which case they can be settled. Otherwise they'll be deported.

Immigration Customs Enforcement, which coordinates the treatment of illegal immigrants,
has said "anonymous, unproven allegations, made without any fact-checkable specifics, should be treated with the appropriate scepticism they deserve".

[Syrgastan]

Are people still gonna deny these places are concentration camps?

Why don’t you go to Auschwitz and actually see one dumbass. Like half my family died in the holocaust, don’t you think it’s a bit disrespectful to compare the two? One was an innocent group of people well the other (whether you like it or not) Committed a crime

[Kowani]

Are people still gonna deny these places are concentration camps?

The 'inmates' chose to breach the borders illegally. These are not civilians displaced by an invading enemy. They're criminals and they're being contained until their claims for asylum are verified or they're deported having been proven to be bogus.

No. Illegal immigration is a civil offense, not a criminal one. By definition, they are not criminals.
Secondly, we are not allowing people to declare asylum, because we are detaining them at the border (or whatever place they get caught) before they are physically able to reach the places where they can fill out the paperwork to declare asylum.

Immigration Customs Enforcement, which coordinates the treatment of illegal immigrants,
has said "anonymous, unproven allegations, made without any fact-checkable specifics, should be treated with the appropriate scepticism they deserve".

Ah, yes, ICE deserves the benefit of the doubt. :^)

[Kowani]

Are people still gonna deny these places are concentration camps?

Why don’t you go to Auschwitz and actually see one dumbass. Like half my family died in the holocaust, don’t you think it’s a bit disrespectful to compare the two? One was an innocent group of people well the other (whether you like it or not) Committed a crime

illegal immigration is not a criminal offense

[Novus America]

Are people still gonna deny these places are concentration camps?

The 'inmates' chose to breach the borders illegally. These are not civilians displaced by an invading enemy nor a racial group segregated and detained in a camp by a racist police state. They're criminals and they're being contained until their claims for asylum are verified, in which case they can be settled. Otherwise they'll be deported.

Immigration Customs Enforcement, which coordinates the treatment of illegal immigrants,
has said "anonymous, unproven allegations, made without any fact-checkable specifics, should be treated with the appropriate scepticism they deserve".

Fair points, it should be noted claiming refugee status is an affirmative defense, that is the burden of proof is on the refugee to show they are a refugee. That is they are suspected of being here illegally until they can show otherwise because they do not deny that they entered the US without prior legal authorization. An affirmative defense to a crime or civil offense generally changes the burden of proof to the defendant.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_defense

Although there is serious concerns over the private prisons issue. There are many well documented cases of private prisons engaging in abusive behaviors and having poor conditions.

It is fair to point that out, and I agree that we should stop outsourcing immigrant detention to poorly supervised for profit prisons, and use a proper system of spartan but safe, clean, government regulated, run and owned immigration centers, with independent outside oversight and audits, providing adequate food care and housing, and adequate medical care with informed consent.

Not only from a moral perspective, but because stuff like this is also very bad for our image too.

[Novus America]

Why don’t you go to Auschwitz and actually see one dumbass. Like half my family died in the holocaust, don’t you think it’s a bit disrespectful to compare the two? One was an innocent group of people well the other (whether you like it or not) Committed a crime

illegal immigration is not a criminal offense

It actually is, if you cross the border without legal authority.
“The first offense is a misdemeanor according to the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965, which prohibits non-nationals from entering or attempting to enter the United States at any time or place which has not been designated by an immigration officer, and also prohibits non-nationals from eluding inspection by immigration officers.“ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal ... ted_States

Overstaying a visa is a civil offense, but illegal entry IS a crime. Refugee status is an affirmative defense, but the burden of proof is on the defendant.

[Kowani]

illegal immigration is not a criminal offense

It actually is, if you cross the border without legal authority.
“The first offense is a misdemeanor according to the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965, which prohibits non-nationals from entering or attempting to enter the United States at any time or place which has not been designated by an immigration officer, and also prohibits non-nationals from eluding inspection by immigration officers.“ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal ... ted_States

Overstaying a visa is a civil offense, but illegal entry IS a crime. Refugee status is an affirmative defense, but the burden of proof is on the defendant.

Huh. I stand corrected. My bad.

That said, my point about us not allowing immigrants to declare affirmative asylum still stands.

[Novus America]

It actually is, if you cross the border without legal authority.
“The first offense is a misdemeanor according to the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965, which prohibits non-nationals from entering or attempting to enter the United States at any time or place which has not been designated by an immigration officer, and also prohibits non-nationals from eluding inspection by immigration officers.“ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal ... ted_States

Overstaying a visa is a civil offense, but illegal entry IS a crime. Refugee status is an affirmative defense, but the burden of proof is on the defendant.

Huh. I stand corrected. My bad.

That said, my point about us not allowing immigrants to declare affirmative asylum still stands.

I mean if we are doing that, that is wrong. But they do get a hearing, where they can claim it.
Admittedly the fact they do not necessarily have a lawyer or understanding of the law can mean they do not know how to do it. They should be better informed of their rights. Because they usually are given a civil hearing first, they do not get a lawyer always, which is a legitimate concern.

They should receive better legal representation.

The thing is there is a middle ground between “the current situation is perfectly fine” (it obviously is not) and “this is literally Nazism”, (it obviously is not) although unfortunately nuance between hyperbolic extremes is a lost art.

[Kowani]

Huh. I stand corrected. My bad.

That said, my point about us not allowing immigrants to declare affirmative asylum still stands.

I mean if we are doing that, that is wrong. But they do get a hearing, where they can claim it.
Admittedly the fact they do not necessarily have a lawyer or understanding of the law can mean they do not know how to do it. They should be better informed of their rights. Because they usually are given a civil hearing first, they do not get a lawyer always, which is a legitimate concern.

They should receive better legal representation.

The thing is there is a middle ground between “the current situation is perfectly fine” (it obviously is not) and “this is literally Nazism”, (it obviously is not) although unfortunately nuance between hyperbolic extremes is a lost art.

Hey, you haven’t seen me make Nazi comparisons. I don’t think they’re rhetorically useful.

[Novus America]

I mean if we are doing that, that is wrong. But they do get a hearing, where they can claim it.
Admittedly the fact they do not necessarily have a lawyer or understanding of the law can mean they do not know how to do it. They should be better informed of their rights. Because they usually are given a civil hearing first, they do not get a lawyer always, which is a legitimate concern.

They should receive better legal representation.

The thing is there is a middle ground between “the current situation is perfectly fine” (it obviously is not) and “this is literally Nazism”, (it obviously is not) although unfortunately nuance between hyperbolic extremes is a lost art.

Hey, you haven’t seen me make Nazi comparisons. I don’t think they’re rhetorically useful.

Fair, but many have.

Here is what I propose:
We should stop outsourcing immigrant detention to inadequately supervised for profit prisons, and use a proper system of spartan and military barracks like, but safe, clean, government regulated, run and owned immigration centers, with independent outside oversight and audits, providing basic but adequate food, clothing and housing, and adequate medical care with informed consent. Men, women, families and LGBT persons would be housed separately for safety.

The facilities should be run and secured by ICE, but each would have lawyers from USCIS assigned to the facility supported by volunteer lawyers and law students from civil rights groups.

These would advise detainees of their rights, assist in filing asylum claims, and investigate allegations of mistreatment or abuse, and forward well founded allegations of crimes against them to the appropriate US attorney to investigate further.

Thus would still allow us to detain unauthorized border crossers, but also fairly address concerns by immigration rights groups and such regarding allegations of mistreatment.

I think that is a reasonable compromise.
But sadly people often seem more interested in scoring cheap political points over actual workable solutions.