Australian Political & Infrastructure Discussion Thread

[Lura]

Gladys has been given Australian of the Year by The Australien. (not that that's a problem)

Honestly, I'd think Dan would deserve it more. Despite being somewhat incompetent, I think he'd do a better job because he's consistent with his beliefs, and despite it not always turning out, works hard. I mean, so does Gladys, but I'd say Dan moreso. Along with remaining (mostly) consistent, he's still pretty popular, compared to how Michael O'Crying's doing.

Speaking of the Australien,
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/subscribe/news/1/?sourceCode=TAWEB_WRE170_a&dest=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theaustralian.com.au%2Fcommentary%2Fno-slowdown-in-scary-climate-prophecy-phenomenon%2Fnews-story%2F809751bde4bd4350a7ac95328e0b300f&memtype=anonymous&mode=premium

only 19 days into the year and they're out with a climate denial piece.


To wrap this up,
honest question,

who do you think's done better in 2020?

Dan
OR
Gladys
OR
Anna
OR
Clive
OR
WA Premier
OR
SA Premier?
OR
Debbie?

Gosh, you don't even know the name of Mark McGowan or Steven Marshall? I already knew we were irrelevant to the eastern states but dang. Honestly I might be biased as a South Aussie (though I think the Libs are crap so there's that) but Steven Marshall handled it the best. Gladys and Anna wouldn't get it mostly for reasons people have already brought up about how mediocre they are (also Ruby Princess anyone?). Dan can't get it because of the Victorian second wave. Sure he gets credit for ending it but he also started it, so... there's that. And Mark McGowan is a hypochondriac who would jump out of a plane if he heard someone on the total other side cough even a little (Bonus negative points for closing the border with SA when the Parafield cluster started and forcing people already in the air on the way from Adelaide to Perth to quarantine on arrival or fly home immediately. That was f**ked and he should not be allowed to do that). The other two are irrelevant since they aren't heading a state. Same goes for the Tasmainan premier because Tasmania is too small to matter (more like too small to get much press, they seem to have done fine with the pandemic but they're small, irrelevant and an island which all help to control the spread of the virus).

[Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts]

Gosh, you don't even know the name of Mark McGowan or Steven Marshall? I already knew we were irrelevant to the eastern states but dang. Honestly I might be biased as a South Aussie (though I think the Libs are crap so there's that) but Steven Marshall handled it the best. Gladys and Anna wouldn't get it mostly for reasons people have already brought up about how mediocre they are (also Ruby Princess anyone?). Dan can't get it because of the Victorian second wave. Sure he gets credit for ending it but he also started it, so... there's that. And Mark McGowan is a hypochondriac who would jump out of a plane if he heard someone on the total other side cough even a little (Bonus negative points for closing the border with SA when the Parafield cluster started and forcing people already in the air on the way from Adelaide to Perth to quarantine on arrival or fly home immediately. That was f**ked and he should not be allowed to do that). The other two are irrelevant since they aren't heading a state. Same goes for the Tasmainan premier because Tasmania is too small to matter (more like too small to get much press, they seem to have done fine with the pandemic but they're small, irrelevant and an island which all help to control the spread of the virus).

Honestly,
and this is a joke,
but I think Eastern and Western Australia are two different continents.
I keep forgetting though.

And yeah, not a huge fan of the Liberals either.
I live in the QLD bubble, so yeah, I don't know a heap about SA other than the Clipsal 500 was held there once, it has a huge 9v battery and really good wine. Oh, and Rundle Mall.

[Kenobot]

Trumpism is wrong comrades.

We must look to our great asian brethren in China with admiration, not confrontation.

It is high time all reactionary conservatives and traditionalists are wiped out.

Straya must join the world revolution against the deplorables and begin to prepare lists of reactionary undesirables.

It is only scientific after all to make sure down under follows WHO and IPCC directives to save the planet and the workers.



"No gain in keeping, no loss in weeding out"

Look at the totalitarian genocidal ultranationalist government of China....with admiration?
I think you'll find that China's bullying against Australia has hardened attitudes against China, including many of the business community whom Beijing clearly were trying to use as a political tool to force change.
But sure you join the ethno-nationalist internationale and see just how committed to Marxist ideals the Chinese Communist Party truly is. (Hint: They were purged a long time ago) Also enjoy the ASIO raids!

[Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts]

Trumpism is wrong comrades.

We must look to our great asian brethren in China with admiration, not confrontation.

It is high time all reactionary conservatives and traditionalists are wiped out.

Straya must join the world revolution against the deplorables and begin to prepare lists of reactionary undesirables.

It is only scientific after all to make sure down under follows WHO and IPCC directives to save the planet and the workers.



"No gain in keeping, no loss in weeding out"

Look at the totalitarian genocidal ultranationalist government of China....with admiration?
I think you'll find that China's bullying against Australia has hardened attitudes against China, including many of the business community whom Beijing clearly were trying to use as a political tool to force change.
But sure you join the ethno-nationalist internationale and see just how committed to Marxist ideals the Chinese Communist Party truly is. (Hint: They were purged a long time ago) Also enjoy the ASIO raids!

ASIO raids?

[Lura]

Gosh, you don't even know the name of Mark McGowan or Steven Marshall? I already knew we were irrelevant to the eastern states but dang. Honestly I might be biased as a South Aussie (though I think the Libs are crap so there's that) but Steven Marshall handled it the best. Gladys and Anna wouldn't get it mostly for reasons people have already brought up about how mediocre they are (also Ruby Princess anyone?). Dan can't get it because of the Victorian second wave. Sure he gets credit for ending it but he also started it, so... there's that. And Mark McGowan is a hypochondriac who would jump out of a plane if he heard someone on the total other side cough even a little (Bonus negative points for closing the border with SA when the Parafield cluster started and forcing people already in the air on the way from Adelaide to Perth to quarantine on arrival or fly home immediately. That was f**ked and he should not be allowed to do that). The other two are irrelevant since they aren't heading a state. Same goes for the Tasmainan premier because Tasmania is too small to matter (more like too small to get much press, they seem to have done fine with the pandemic but they're small, irrelevant and an island which all help to control the spread of the virus).

Honestly,
and this is a joke,
but I think Eastern and Western Australia are two different continents.
I keep forgetting though.

And yeah, not a huge fan of the Liberals either.
I live in the QLD bubble, so yeah, I don't know a heap about SA other than the Clipsal 500 was held there once, it has a huge 9v battery and really good wine. Oh, and Rundle Mall.

Western Australia might as well be another country, especially given how Mark McGowan handles their border. He single-handedly made me pro-WA-indepedence and I'm not even Western Australian, lol.

And I can admit that my knowledge on the eastern states isn't brilliant, though I hear about them more than you probably hear about us.

Also the Clipsal 500 was still happening until recently, though Clipsal no longer sponsor it so it's just the Adelaide 500 now. Or it was, until the Liberals decided to axe it because Holden's dead or something. Supercars are apparently displeased with this and Labor vowed to bring it back should they be elected next time. Gosh, I'll give the SA Libs credit for handling the pandemic well, but I'll be darned if they ever do anything else I approve of. I approve of the battery too I guess, but saying that they'll probably find an excuse to privatise that like they did everything else.

[Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts]

And sell the battery off to those tax-dodgers like Energy Australia or AGL.

[Australian rePublic]

In my opinion, the NSW LNP are really good at building transpirt infrastructure really badly

[Australian rePublic]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

[Dazchan]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

It’s not an either/or situation. You can work to resolve the challenges face by Aboriginal Australians and change the date of Australia Day to something less controversial.

Also, I’d like some statistics on the proportion of Aboriginal people who don’t support the movement to change the date. What are you basing your claim that they’re “few and far between” on?

[Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

Well said mate.
C
Regarding those who complain, I'd point to those clickbaity rubbish sites like BuzzFeed (no longer in Australia), Pedestrian and Junkee, who, at worst, use the debate to sell advertising space to banks with questionable lending practices. (eg the big 4) At best, they're annoying people who can't go five articles without using 'racist' or 'sexist' in the title, because IdPol. (Identity politics)

To sum it up, those who often complain and yell about Australia Day celebrating genocides often act like they care, despite only being interested in themselves.
There are some good debaters out there though

Besides, most Aussies don't see Australia Day as a celebration of genocide.
They mostly do it just to show off their souped-up Commodores and Skylines, crack a tinnie and have a good old time. And to me at least, that's totally fine.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

Changing the date is absolutely effortless. I say just go with whatever Aboriginal people want, and dismiss any opposition as surely motivated by racism.

Maybe we could use the Census as an informal referendum on where Aborigines stand on it.

[Imperial isa]

W self-rightous white who complain about it.

Most i have run into going on about it are not from here to start with.


In other news oh no Google threatens to disable search in Australia if media code becomes law who they think they are China ?

[Albrenia]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I'm pretty Green in most of my politics, but I'm against changing the date myself. We're not celebrating the ill deeds our ancestors committed, we're celebrating our shared Australian history.

[Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts]

W self-rightous white who complain about it.

Most i have run into going on about it are not from here to start with.


In other news oh no Google threatens to disable search in Australia if media code becomes law who they think they are China ?

Maybe it's to protest the News Media Bargaining Code designed to entrench big media conglomerates.

[Kenobot]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I don't see a good reason to not change the date tbh. "Because tradition" isn't a good reason. We could make it any number of days; for instance 1st of January (Foundation of the Commonwealth of Australia) or in the future, the day we become a republic.
Obviously we have a lot more to do to actually make a difference and close the gap, which hasn't progressed well in any government over the past 10 years.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I don't see a good reason to not change the date tbh. "Because tradition" isn't a good reason. We could make it any number of days; for instance 1st of January (Foundation of the Commonwealth of Australia) or in the future, the day we become a republic.
Obviously we have a lot more to do to actually make a difference and close the gap, which hasn't progressed well in any government over the past 10 years.

1st Jan is not that well founded really. It's already known as Federation Day, but I guess too many people are sleeping in or hung over to celebrate it much. It passed the British Parliament on 5 July 1900 and was given the nod by Queen Victoria on 9 July 1900. It being later proclaimed and coming into force on 1 January 1901 has something arbitrary about it.

The "holiday season" being in summer, from at least Dec 25 to Dec 31 (New Year's Eve) is fortuitously one week long. Doubling it by making Australia day Jan 6 or so, and avoiding the symbolism of what else might have happened on that day, seems about right.

"Fixed feasts" ... exact dates of the year that should be a holiday, aren't well honored in the modern calendar. Those which are notionally a public holiday, tend to get an actual holiday on the following Monday, if they fall on Saturday or Sunday that year. That kind of defeats the point. So maybe "the first Monday after January 2" ... a moveable feast ... would be better than any fixed date, while also avoiding later discoveries that there was a massacre on Jan 6th many years ago. Having more long weekends begin on Friday deserves consideration too.

[Lura]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I'm pretty left-leaning, but I don't think changing the date is necessary. As others have already mentioned, it doesn't celebrate Aboriginal genocide, just the nation of Australia as it exists now.

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to. We can't change it to January 1 since that is already New Year's Day and I don't think anyone wants to lose a public holiday. It also can't be an unfixed date as suggested (the example above is "first Monday after January 2") because it's our national day and the date has to have some importance or it defeats the purpose. Australia Day, like every other country's national day(s), is on the day that it is because that day holds significance, however problematic it may be. And given how often the colonists genocided Aboriginals, it's unlikely that any day is capable of being free from controversy.

EDIT: It's also worth noting that while plenty of people request that we "change the date", no one ever actually suggests a day to change it to (at least in the mainstream conversation I have seen). The "change the date" camp might win more people over (possibly including me) if they actually had a plan.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I'm pretty left-leaning, but I don't think changing the date is necessary. As others have already mentioned, it doesn't celebrate Aboriginal genocide, just the nation of Australia as it exists now.

Does it? Britain claimed the East of Australia (then known as New Holland) on 26 January 1788, by landing a fleet of convicts. That's not "the nation of Australia as it exists now" as colonies are not nations. The nation of Australia came into existence with Federation, a process which could be more easily reversed that the US Federation, but still looks pretty strong for a while yet.

Imagine it from the point of view of Aboriginal Australia. They didn't gain much immediately from Federation and the democratic governments it allowed. Eventually though, they got citizenship and voting rights (through a referendum by the Federation rules), then won the right to claim any land not "alienated by the Crown". Extended later with the decision that government granting a lease is not alienation.

That may not be much but it's a hell of a lot better than the century before: formally a British colony though with increasing self-rule. Your objection that January 1 is "taken" is noted, but your defense of 26 January will not pass. Britain claimed for itself the eastern seaboard, which though the most heavily populated and developed side of Australia now, still includes Aboriginal land recognized by the High Court.

What began on 26 January 1788 was annexation by Britain, and white settlement. Not the nation of Australia as we know it, which began with Federation.

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to. We can't change it to January 1 since that is already New Year's Day and I don't think anyone wants to lose a public holiday. It also can't be an unfixed date as suggested (the example above is "first Monday after January 2") because it's our national day and the date has to have some importance or it defeats the purpose.

There are two significant days, the First Fleet and Federation. The former is (more correctly) Invasion Day, and the latter is "taken". Well so what if it's taken. New Year's Day can be Australia Day, New Year's Eve can be the celebration of the New Year (as it pretty much is).

So you want another public holiday? New Year's Eve. Or abandon the idea that a numbered day of the month is necessary to give public holidays 'legitimacy,' pick a cause and pick a day as far as possible from any other public holiday. Because that's when a public holiday will be most appreciated.

Australia Day, like every other country's national day(s), is on the day that it is because that day holds significance, however problematic it may be. And given how often the colonists genocided Aboriginals, it's unlikely that any day is capable of being free from controversy.

EDIT: It's also worth noting that while plenty of people request that we "change the date", no one ever actually suggests a day to change it to (at least in the mainstream conversation I have seen). The "change the date" camp might win more people over (possibly including me) if they actually had a plan.

I'd make every public holiday a moveable feast, to either Monday or Friday, because random weekdays annoy business and whenever a fixed feast falls on a weekend, the government gives everyone a "real" public holiday on Monday (er, States may differ, nvm). That, as you would say "defeats the point" of having a fixed day. Is Saturday when we should be celebrating the Snowy Hydro Scheme? Or Monday? Which one is the "real" holiday?

Snowy Hydro Day is a joke, but really something like that. National Parks Day perhaps? I feel there should be something to celebrate the land itself, which the highly urbanized Australian population have become rather callous to.

[Dazchan]

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to.

January 1 - Federation
March 3 - the passing of the Australia Act, which gave Australia political independence from Britain
May 9 - the opening of federal parliament
May 27 - the referendum that allowed Aboriginal Australians to be treated equally to other races in regard to legislation and the census
9 July - the ratification of our constitution by Queen Victoria
October 24 - the speech Henry Parkes gave at Tenterfield, which started the federation movement

[Lura]

Oh, boy, what have I created.

I'm pretty left-leaning, but I don't think changing the date is necessary. As others have already mentioned, it doesn't celebrate Aboriginal genocide, just the nation of Australia as it exists now.

Does it? Britain claimed the East of Australia (then known as New Holland) on 26 January 1788, by landing a fleet of convicts. That's not "the nation of Australia as it exists now" as colonies are not nations. The nation of Australia came into existence with Federation, a process which could be more easily reversed that the US Federation, but still looks pretty strong for a while yet.

Imagine it from the point of view of Aboriginal Australia. They didn't gain much immediately from Federation and the democratic governments it allowed. Eventually though, they got citizenship and voting rights (through a referendum by the Federation rules), then won the right to claim any land not "alienated by the Crown". Extended later with the decision that government granting a lease is not alienation.

That may not be much but it's a hell of a lot better than the century before: formally a British colony though with increasing self-rule. Your objection that January 1 is "taken" is noted, but your defense of 26 January will not pass. Britain claimed for itself the eastern seaboard, which though the most heavily populated and developed side of Australia now, still includes Aboriginal land recognized by the High Court.

What began on 26 January 1788 was annexation by Britain, and white settlement. Not the nation of Australia as we know it, which began with Federation.

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to. We can't change it to January 1 since that is already New Year's Day and I don't think anyone wants to lose a public holiday. It also can't be an unfixed date as suggested (the example above is "first Monday after January 2") because it's our national day and the date has to have some importance or it defeats the purpose.

There are two significant days, the First Fleet and Federation. The former is (more correctly) Invasion Day, and the latter is "taken". Well so what if it's taken. New Year's Day can be Australia Day, New Year's Eve can be the celebration of the New Year (as it pretty much is).

So you want another public holiday? New Year's Eve. Or abandon the idea that a numbered day of the month is necessary to give public holidays 'legitimacy,' pick a cause and pick a day as far as possible from any other public holiday. Because that's when a public holiday will be most appreciated.

Australia Day, like every other country's national day(s), is on the day that it is because that day holds significance, however problematic it may be. And given how often the colonists genocided Aboriginals, it's unlikely that any day is capable of being free from controversy.

EDIT: It's also worth noting that while plenty of people request that we "change the date", no one ever actually suggests a day to change it to (at least in the mainstream conversation I have seen). The "change the date" camp might win more people over (possibly including me) if they actually had a plan.

I'd make every public holiday a moveable feast, to either Monday or Friday, because random weekdays annoy business and whenever a fixed feast falls on a weekend, the government gives everyone a "real" public holiday on Monday (er, States may differ, nvm). That, as you would say "defeats the point" of having a fixed day. Is Saturday when we should be celebrating the Snowy Hydro Scheme? Or Monday? Which one is the "real" holiday?

Snowy Hydro Day is a joke, but really something like that. National Parks Day perhaps? I feel there should be something to celebrate the land itself, which the highly urbanized Australian population have become rather callous to.

Ok, first, I think you've missed the point of what I meant, though that could be my fault with regards to how I worded it. I mean that the holiday itself (Australia Day) doesn't celebrate the landing of the First Fleet, it celebrates the Commonwealth of Australia as a nation, not unlike how Independence Day is a celebration of the United States. We hold this celebration on the 26th of January because like it or not, it does hold significance to the history of Australia, like how Independence Day is on July 4 because as the name suggests it's the date of American independence. January 26 may not be our date of independence, but I doubt that you can convince me that Australia as it exists now would exist had we not been colonised by the United Kingdom. I'm not going to say that it was a good thing, but you cannot deny that Australia would be a radically different country without the British influences and demographic makeup.

I am Australian and do know what happened on the 26th of January, and I do understand why the date is viewed as problematic for some. My point has less to do with the events of the day itself, but more so what happened as a result of the events of the day, which is what warrants the significance, even if it is negative.

I think the main reason most people oppose January 1 is because it is already a public holiday, not just me. I am opposed to the suggestion that we just pick a random date with no meaning or symbolism because then what is the point. It works fine for some holidays to not have a fixed date, but there are days of national significance that are appropriate to hold a national celebration on, and as I keep saying, January 26 absolutely has significance to Australia, even if you don't like that fact.

Make every holiday an unfixed date? The days we have public holidays on are all significant to the thing they are about, and what logic would it make to hold any other holiday on a day with no meaning? And I didn't think there was even a debate about when holidays fall on weekends and a day off for it is held on a different day. I thought it was obvious that the holiday is celebrated on the day it usually is on, and the Monday or Friday that everyone gets off of work is just to make up for the fact that many people don't work on weekends so they can have a day off. Have you ever heard of a dawn service for Anzac Day being held on April 27 or whatever day Anzac Day Holiday might fall on?

I'm not opposed to a holiday for celebrating the land or nature, but I'd imagine it would have to have some meaning or importance to be considered.

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to.

January 1 - Federation
March 3 - the passing of the Australia Act, which gave Australia political independence from Britain
May 9 - the opening of federal parliament
May 27 - the referendum that allowed Aboriginal Australians to be treated equally to other races in regard to legislation and the census
9 July - the ratification of our constitution by Queen Victoria
October 24 - the speech Henry Parkes gave at Tenterfield, which started the federation movement

Some of these suggestions are good. January 1 I've done to death that it's already a public holiday, though of all the events I would deem it the most significant alternative. May 9 and July 9 don't feel important enough to make Australia Day. Of all these suggestions, my favourite would probably be October 24 since I could see a case being made for it being of comparable significance to January 26, without any negative baggage that I can see. If the "change the date" movement could rally around literally any one date instead of suggesting like 10 of varying degrees of suitability, maybe it could gain more traction.

Hopefully I haven't lit another powderkeg.

[Imperial isa]

Talking of public holiday what with the different dates for the queens birthday we got going on here?

[Albrenia]

Talking of public holiday what with the different dates for the queens birthday we got going on here?

The Queen exists in multiple timelines at once. We all take a piece to make sure she is properly celebrated at all respective birth times.

[Dazchan]

May 9 and July 9 don't feel important enough to make Australia Day.

You don’t feel that the adoption of Australia’s constitution, the highest law of the land and literally the document that defines Australia as a country, is important enough for a national holiday?

[Kenobot]

What do you guys make of the change the date (of Australia Day) debate? If you ask me, it's just window dressing. There are serious problems in Aboriginal communities, but trying to solve them would require actual effort, so let's just to clutch onto straws to try to solve imaginary problems. That way, it looks like we're solving Indigenous problems whilst we're actually sitting on our arse. For the most part, it's mostly self-rightous white who complain about it. Actual Aboriginals who complain about it are few and far between

I'm pretty left-leaning, but I don't think changing the date is necessary. As others have already mentioned, it doesn't celebrate Aboriginal genocide, just the nation of Australia as it exists now.

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to. We can't change it to January 1 since that is already New Year's Day and I don't think anyone wants to lose a public holiday. It also can't be an unfixed date as suggested (the example above is "first Monday after January 2") because it's our national day and the date has to have some importance or it defeats the purpose. Australia Day, like every other country's national day(s), is on the day that it is because that day holds significance, however problematic it may be. And given how often the colonists genocided Aboriginals, it's unlikely that any day is capable of being free from controversy.

EDIT: It's also worth noting that while plenty of people request that we "change the date", no one ever actually suggests a day to change it to (at least in the mainstream conversation I have seen). The "change the date" camp might win more people over (possibly including me) if they actually had a plan.

Well there's a few good dates, but maybe fold it into ANZAC Day? Would that be too radical? Obviously very different tone from the usual Australia Day, but perhaps brings more reflection on ourselves than it currently does

My biggest complaint with the idea of changing the date is that there aren't any other days significant enough, in my opinion, to change it to.

January 1 - Federation
March 3 - the passing of the Australia Act, which gave Australia political independence from Britain
May 9 - the opening of federal parliament
May 27 - the referendum that allowed Aboriginal Australians to be treated equally to other races in regard to legislation and the census
9 July - the ratification of our constitution by Queen Victoria
October 24 - the speech Henry Parkes gave at Tenterfield, which started the federation movement

October 24th! We don't have enough holidays in the back end of the year!

[Lura]

May 9 and July 9 don't feel important enough to make Australia Day.

You don’t feel that the adoption of Australia’s constitution, the highest law of the land and literally the document that defines Australia as a country, is important enough for a national holiday?

I think the main issue with the constitution is that it isn't sacred and can be changed or even rewritten and replaced. If we were to adopt a new constitution, say, if we became a Republic, would we have to change the day again? And given some of the other examples, the constitution ratification seems a bit minor and less important than January 26.