UK Politics Thread XIII: The Brexit Ship Departs

[Fartsniffage]

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

Vaccine bounce.

Labour will still lose the next election but the polls will be closer.

[The Nihilistic view]

Not really a surprise when much of parliment spent three and a half of those years trying to frustrate it. All energy therefore went into making sure it happened so what else do you expect than not enough effort going into actually doing it.

I'm certainly not surprised this result has occurred but then this is also the first time I'm starting to think we should just do whatever. Previous to now I've always thought that's what it is just deal with it.

[The Huskar Social Union]

If i sound snappy or hostile Nihilistic view i apologise, just agitated lately but thats not an excuse. I shouldnt be acting like a dick.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

"Congratulations Keir, your application for the Leader of the Opposition post has been successful."

"T-this isn't the interviews for Butlins?"

[The Huskar Social Union]

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

Vaccine bounce.

Labour will still lose the next election but the polls will be closer.

Thats the best chance Labour has honestly.

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

"Congratulations Keir, your application for the Leader of the Opposition post has been successful."

"T-this isn't the interviews for Butlins?"

rip

[The Blaatschapen]

Got our census letter, gona have to do that some point this week.

Covid can live on letters for up to 10 years, you should quarantine it until 2031.

Northern Ireland counts as a quarantine area anyway.

[The Nihilistic view]

If i sound snappy or hostile Nihilistic view i apologise, just agitated lately but thats not an excuse. I shouldnt be acting like a dick.

No it's fine, you actually live there it's understandable you have much more feeling on the matter than I do.

[The Blaatschapen]

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

The next election is still far way. The rate of vaccinations in the UK is laudable. But it will remain to be seen how much the voters will remember that at the elections. It also depends on the economic aftermath, how to spread the pain of the economic downturn that happened, etc.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Covid can live on letters for up to 10 years, you should quarantine it until 2031.

Northern Ireland counts as a quarantine area anyway.

Rude

But.. yeah

If i sound snappy or hostile Nihilistic view i apologise, just agitated lately but thats not an excuse. I shouldnt be acting like a dick.

No it's fine, you actually live there it's understandable you have much more feeling on the matter than I do.

Thank you

[The Huskar Social Union]

Forgot to mention this the other day but one of the more prominent socialist voices in Northern Ireland, Eamonn McCann has resigned from his position on the derry council due to health issues. He is a member of People Before Profit and is basically one of their leaders in NI and was elected as an MLA to Foyle in 2016 but due to the reduced seat count in 2017's election he narrowly missed out on the last seat to the DUP. He was then elected as councillor in 2019 and was involved in the Civil rights movement during the troubles and even went up against John Hume in an election in the 70s.

Even though ive went off of PBP over brexit, its a shame to see him go but health issues take priority.

[Dresderstan]

Oh and the Tory's have a 13 point lead in the polls over labour so gg Starmer.

Here's my question, how will this impact the local elections 2 months from now? Will we see a Tory Bump? A Labour Bounce Back? A Lib Dem Surge? I've always had a feeling the national picture doesn't always translate into local election, could be wrong though.

[Vassenor]

COVID-19: 1% pay rise for NHS staff 'the most' the government can afford, says minister Nadine Dorries

isitthough.jpg

Especially since in real terms NHS wages have declined over the course of this government as a result of below-inflation raises and seven years of pay cuts - for example a newly qualified nurse earns 10.2% less than they did in 2010. It's all a repeating cycle of "let pay sit stagnant for years, give a flashy pay rise that doesn't make up for the stagnation, then use that flashy pay rise to justify more years of stagnation".

[Ainland]

We face very difficult economic circumstances. Of course we would always like to see doctors, nurses and other NHS staff paid even more. But the government are right to prioritise NHS services, equipment, treatment, within the NHS budget. And they are right to focus support on rebuilding the economy, focussing on those industries which have suffered, people who have lost their jobs, businesses, livelihoods. Those people have suffered enormously. If we help them, it will also help rebuild our economy, following which there should be more money available to further reward NHS staff in the future.

It's all well and good Labour scoring political points, but there is no magic money tree, and it is important to prioritise fairly. It's also worth remembering that NHS staff are just coming to the end of a generous three year pay deal, agreed to by most unions, and will be the only public sector workers receiving any pay rise at all this year. They've also, quite rightly, enjoyed enormous support from the government, the public, and businesses, for the incredible work they do.

We've been through enormously difficult times, and face great economic difficulty ahead. Let's try to come together and work on rebuilding our economy. For the NHS, and for everyone who has suffered both in terms of health, and economically, through this awful pandemic.

[Vassenor]

We face very difficult economic circumstances. Of course we would always like to see doctors, nurses and other NHS staff paid even more. But the government are right to prioritise NHS services, equipment, treatment, within the NHS budget. And they are right to focus support on rebuilding the economy, focussing on those industries which have suffered, people who have lost their jobs, businesses, livelihoods. Those people have suffered enormously. If we help them, it will also help rebuild our economy, following which there should be more money available to further reward NHS staff in the future.

It's all well and good Labour scoring political points, but there is no magic money tree, and it is important to prioritise fairly. It's also worth remembering that NHS staff are just coming to the end of a generous three year pay deal, agreed to by most unions, and will be the only public sector workers receiving any pay rise at all this year. They've also, quite rightly, enjoyed enormous support from the government, the public, and businesses, for the incredible work they do.

We've been through enormously difficult times, and face great economic difficulty ahead. Let's try to come together and work on rebuilding our economy. For the NHS, and for everyone who has suffered both in terms of health, and economically, through this awful pandemic.

Remember, any calling out of the government's mistakes is just Scoring Political Points, especially if that criticism actually involves looking at things as part of the broader context rather than just assuming it is a good thing in a vacuum because the government says it is a good thing.. Everyone must stop criticising the government and come together in the name of unity.

They've also, quite rightly, enjoyed enormous support from the government, the public, and businesses, for the incredible work they do.

Remember, clapping in the street and plastering rainbow stickers on everything is an acceptable substitute for a meaningful pay increase. After all meaningless gestures are what we need, not action. Pay no attention to when Boris said the opposite regarding anti-racism protests.

[Dumb Ideologies]

The magic money tree can be difficult to track down but it currently seems to be in the custody of Bojo's Bizarre Infrastructure Adventure, where he's digging a tunnel to the moon with the hope of making the Clangers pay for it.

[The Free Joy State]

The magic money tree can be difficult to track down but it currently seems to be in the custody of Bojo's Bizarre Infrastructure Adventure, where he's digging a tunnel to the moon with the hope of making the Clangers pay for it.

I thought the first vital infrastructure project was digging to Atlantis in the hopes of finding the realm of The Little Mermaid?

[The Huskar Social Union]

The magic money tree can be difficult to track down but it currently seems to be in the custody of Bojo's Bizarre Infrastructure Adventure, where he's digging a tunnel to the moon with the hope of making the Clangers pay for it.

I thought the first vital infrastructure project was digging to Atlantis in the hopes of finding the realm of The Little Mermaid?

No we are going to Atlantis to get its zero point module.

[The Huskar Social Union]

BREAKING: Court Order shows Boris Johnson misled Parliament over Covid contracts

3 days after the High Court ruled Government had acted unlawfully by failing to publish Covid contracts, Boris Johnson stood up in the House of Commons and reassured MPs and the public that all Covid-related contracts were “on the record”. However, the final Order handed down by the Judge today shows that what the Prime Minister told the House was not true.

The Judge confirmed:

“The Defendant has published 608 out of 708 relevant contracts for supplies and services relating to COVID-19 awarded on or before 7 October 2020. In some or all of these cases, the Defendant acted unlawfully by failing to publish the contracts within the period set out in the Crown Commercial Service’s Publication of Central Government Tenders and Contracts: Central Government Transparency Guidance Note (November 2017).”

Remarkably, the Judge’s Order is based on Government’s own figures – so at the same time as Johnson was falsely reassuring MPs, Government lawyers were preparing a statement contradicting him – revealing 100 contracts and dozens of Contract Award Notices were missing from the public record. You can read the final Court Order here and consequential judgment in full here.

=CONTINUES=

Con +2

[CoraSpia]

BREAKING: Court Order shows Boris Johnson misled Parliament over Covid contracts

3 days after the High Court ruled Government had acted unlawfully by failing to publish Covid contracts, Boris Johnson stood up in the House of Commons and reassured MPs and the public that all Covid-related contracts were “on the record”. However, the final Order handed down by the Judge today shows that what the Prime Minister told the House was not true.

The Judge confirmed:

“The Defendant has published 608 out of 708 relevant contracts for supplies and services relating to COVID-19 awarded on or before 7 October 2020. In some or all of these cases, the Defendant acted unlawfully by failing to publish the contracts within the period set out in the Crown Commercial Service’s Publication of Central Government Tenders and Contracts: Central Government Transparency Guidance Note (November 2017).”

Remarkably, the Judge’s Order is based on Government’s own figures – so at the same time as Johnson was falsely reassuring MPs, Government lawyers were preparing a statement contradicting him – revealing 100 contracts and dozens of Contract Award Notices were missing from the public record. You can read the final Court Order here and consequential judgment in full here.

=CONTINUES=

Con +2

Breaking news: Boris Johnson accused of lying after denying that bears shit in the woods

[Ainland]

Remember, any calling out of the government's mistakes is just Scoring Political Points, especially if that criticism actually involves looking at things as part of the broader context rather than just assuming it is a good thing in a vacuum because the government says it is a good thing.. Everyone must stop criticising the government and come together in the name of unity.

Sarcasm noted. But that's actually nothing like what I said. Political point scoring is taking a difficult economic situation, for which the government are not to blame, and using it to best them with. Whatever they offered, it - by default - would not be enough to satisfy Labour.

Remember, clapping in the street and plastering rainbow stickers on everything is an acceptable substitute for a meaningful pay increase. After all meaningless gestures are what we need, not action. Pay no attention to when Boris said the opposite regarding anti-racism protests.

In my view, they are not meaningless. I think they were, and are, very genuine expressions of gratitude. Some may say, "we don't want your gratitude, we just want cash", but I actually think that showing support and appreciation is very worthwhile. To imply that such gratitude is insincere, or even meaningless, because they aren't being given even more money, I think is a truly awful thing to say. We can disagree about the pay proposal, and government priorities, but we should all be able to recognise the enormous gratitude, support and appreciation the NHS have rightly received from.tjr public, government and businesses.

[Vassenor]

Remember, any calling out of the government's mistakes is just Scoring Political Points, especially if that criticism actually involves looking at things as part of the broader context rather than just assuming it is a good thing in a vacuum because the government says it is a good thing.. Everyone must stop criticising the government and come together in the name of unity.

Sarcasm noted. But that's actually nothing like what I said. Political point scoring is taking a difficult economic situation, for which the government are not to blame, and using it to best them with. Whatever they offered, it - by default - would not be enough to satisfy Labour.

Remember, clapping in the street and plastering rainbow stickers on everything is an acceptable substitute for a meaningful pay increase. After all meaningless gestures are what we need, not action. Pay no attention to when Boris said the opposite regarding anti-racism protests.

In my view, they are not meaningless. I think they were, and are, very genuine expressions of gratitude. Some may say, "we don't want your gratitude, we just want cash", but I actually think that showing support and appreciation is very worthwhile. To imply that such gratitude is insincere, or even meaningless, because they aren't being given even more money, I think is a truly awful thing to say. We can disagree about the pay proposal, and government priorities, but we should all be able to recognise the enormous gratitude, support and appreciation the NHS have rightly received from.tjr public, government and businesses.

So what was the political point scoring in what I said?

And "gratitude is an acceptable substitute for better wages" is just another form of "but we're paying you in Exposure".

#YourFreelancerHasDiedOfExposure

[Ainland]

Sarcasm noted. But that's actually nothing like what I said. Political point scoring is taking a difficult economic situation, for which the government are not to blame, and using it to best them with. Whatever they offered, it - by default - would not be enough to satisfy Labour.


In my view, they are not meaningless. I think they were, and are, very genuine expressions of gratitude. Some may say, "we don't want your gratitude, we just want cash", but I actually think that showing support and appreciation is very worthwhile. To imply that such gratitude is insincere, or even meaningless, because they aren't being given even more money, I think is a truly awful thing to say. We can disagree about the pay proposal, and government priorities, but we should all be able to recognise the enormous gratitude, support and appreciation the NHS have rightly received from.tjr public, government and businesses.

So what was the political point scoring in what I said?

And "gratitude is an acceptable substitute for better wages" is just another form of "but we're paying you in Exposure".

#YourFreelancerHasDiedOfExposure

I did not accuse you of political point scoring, I accused Labour of political point scoring, if you read the post you replied to.

If you really got from that, "gratitude is a substitute for better wages", then you've totally missed that I said. Because it quite clearly was not that. Like I actually said, we can have a discussion and disagreement about spending priorities. But we can surely all acknowledge the huge gratitude the NHS has rightly received from the nation. With money, or without money, I think that appreciate means a lot, and stands on its own. Quite a low blow to try to say people don't care because they're not giving more cash, if indeed that is your implication.

[CoraSpia]

Family of man killed by dwp sanctions regime lose high court claim

My change of headline expresses my opinion on this.

[Vassenor]

So what was the political point scoring in what I said?

And "gratitude is an acceptable substitute for better wages" is just another form of "but we're paying you in Exposure".

#YourFreelancerHasDiedOfExposure

I did not accuse you of political point scoring, I accused Labour of political point scoring, if you read the post you replied to.

If you really got from that, "gratitude is a substitute for better wages", then you've totally missed that I said. Because it quite clearly was not that. Like I actually said, we can have a discussion and disagreement about spending priorities. But we can surely all acknowledge the huge gratitude the NHS has rightly received from the nation. With money, or without money, I think that appreciate means a lot, and stands on its own. Quite a low blow to try to say people don't care because they're not giving more cash, if indeed that is your implication.

And how is Labour engaging in point scoring? Especially because you keep popping up to complain about point scoring and disunity whenever someone actually criticises the government by looking at the wider context and effects of policy rather than just engaging with simplistic conceptions like "lower taxes = more money".

And you keep going on about how it's OK to not give them a meaningful pay rise because that would devalue the gratitude being shown. Sure as hell sounds like you consider gratitude to be an acceptable substitute for adequate payment.

[Ainland]

I did not accuse you of political point scoring, I accused Labour of political point scoring, if you read the post you replied to.

If you really got from that, "gratitude is a substitute for better wages", then you've totally missed that I said. Because it quite clearly was not that. Like I actually said, we can have a discussion and disagreement about spending priorities. But we can surely all acknowledge the huge gratitude the NHS has rightly received from the nation. With money, or without money, I think that appreciate means a lot, and stands on its own. Quite a low blow to try to say people don't care because they're not giving more cash, if indeed that is your implication.

And how is Labour engaging in point scoring? Especially because you keep popping up to complain about point scoring and disunity whenever someone actually criticises the government by looking at the wider context and effects of policy rather than just engaging with simplistic conceptions like "lower taxes = more money".

And you keep going on about how it's OK to not give them a meaningful pay rise because that would devalue the gratitude being shown. Sure as hell sounds like you consider gratitude to be an acceptable substitute for adequate payment.

You literally aren't even reading what you're replying to. In relation to your first paragraph, I've already expanded for you on what political point scoring means (the first and only time I've ever use the term on these forums, I might add). The second paragraph, I haven't said anything anywhere near remotely like that at all. If you think I'm "going on", it is only because you keep replying with stuff I haven't said, ignoring my answer and then repeating yourself again. I have no idea what you're referring to when you say "devaluing the gratitude being shown". They have been shown gratitude, rightly. The discussion on pay and government spending priorities is a separate discussion. We can hopefully both acknowledge they have received sincere appreciation from the nation. This is a fact. It does not mean they should be paid more, or less, it stands on its own.

If you want to know why I think the 1% is justified, try actually reading my initial post on the matter.