Is there a God?

[Greater Mobile]

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[La Xinga]

Well we humans aren’t exactly peachy all the time, so I couldn't blame God if they exists for doing that.

But then again, 2020 seems a tad excessive. Hold on...maybe COVID was just punishment to China to avenge the Uyghurs, but it spread? Why would an all-powerful god not think that disease would spread..hm.. I‘m lost.

It might be that the entire world was deserving of punishment?

[Awesomeland012345]

How did God make them do it?

(we're not talking about a specific god here)
You quoted a piece of text that stated that a god was all-powerful and all-knowing. The god controls everything. The god controls the people and made them do it's bidding.

Or if it doesn't control the people. If it's all powerful, it can just make it so that all of the people are good. No punishment dealt. Because, no offense to anybody, but the human race is never going to be completely peaceful. There's always going to be war around.

[La Xinga]

La xinga, say person A hurt group B, then God, seeing this, hurt A and B. That’d hurt B, and they didn’t do anything wrong. Why would the all-loving God do this?

It's possible that person B had his/her own sin in this life or another and now he's getting payed back for it.

[La Xinga]

If a god was almighty, and they let these things happen, and then punish people for doing the things that the god made them do... seems like a god that wants to torture innocent people. Not trying to be rude, but just trying to follow your line of logic.

How did God make them do it?

(we're not talking about a specific god here)
You quoted a piece of text that stated that a god was all-powerful and all-knowing. The god controls everything. The god controls the people and made them do it's bidding.

Or if it doesn't control the people. If it's all powerful, it can just make it so that all of the people are good. No punishment dealt. Because, no offense to anybody, but the human race is never going to be completely peaceful. There's always going to be war around.[/quote]
Why should he give reward if people don't do anything good? Would you give reward to someone if you made them do it?

[Awesomeland012345]

Why should he give reward if people don't do anything good? Would you give reward to someone if you made them do it?

That logic can be used against you. If you give someone free will, can you expect them to act perfectly and not do anything bad? Why should you punish them for the exact thing that you did to them? They can't help it, it was your fault.

[La Xinga]

Why should he give reward if people don't do anything good? Would you give reward to someone if you made them do it?

That logic can be used against you. If you give someone free will, can you expect them to act perfectly and not do anything bad? Why should you punish them for the exact thing that you did to them? They can't help it, it was your fault.

Yes, you can. In fact, you give them the ability to repent and don't punish them right away! You could help it! Why cannot you?

[Awesomeland012345]

That logic can be used against you. If you give someone free will, can you expect them to act perfectly and not do anything bad? Why should you punish them for the exact thing that you did to them? They can't help it, it was your fault.

Yes, you can. In fact, you give them the ability to repent and don't punish them right away! You could help it! Why cannot you?

There are very generous people that give almost their entire fortune to charity or adopt so many children they live in poverty. Because of their selfless actions, they live in bad houses, in bad conditions. Meanwhile, there are corrupt dictators that keep power for their entire lives and have no regrets whatsoever. If you're going to punish them, why not? And if you gave them the ability to repent, why wouldn't it be compulsory? You give them the ability, but that's generally not going to happen, because you made it that way. They can't help that they're made that way, because that's how you made them.

[La Xinga]

Yes, you can. In fact, you give them the ability to repent and don't punish them right away! You could help it! Why cannot you?

There are very generous people that give almost their entire fortune to charity or adopt so many children they live in poverty. Because of their selfless actions, they live in bad houses, in bad conditions. Meanwhile, there are corrupt dictators that keep power for their entire lives and have no regrets whatsoever. If you're going to punish them, why not?

Sometimes, according to religion, God punishes evil people above and rewards good people above. Not all the time, but sometimes.

And if you gave them the ability to repent, why wouldn't it be compulsory? You give them the ability, but that's generally not going to happen, because you made it that way. They can't help that they're made that way, because that's how you made them.

Compulsory repentance does not seem like repentance at all....

[Awesomeland012345]

There are very generous people that give almost their entire fortune to charity or adopt so many children they live in poverty. Because of their selfless actions, they live in bad houses, in bad conditions. Meanwhile, there are corrupt dictators that keep power for their entire lives and have no regrets whatsoever. If you're going to punish them, why not?

Sometimes, according to religion, God punishes evil people above and rewards good people above. Not all the time, but sometimes.

And if you gave them the ability to repent, why wouldn't it be compulsory? You give them the ability, but that's generally not going to happen, because you made it that way. They can't help that they're made that way, because that's how you made them.

Compulsory repentance does not seem like repentance at all....

So, according to you, there is a god. The god sometimes punishes those who are evil, sometimes doesn't. Same with the generous. It's just random. That's why this virus is killing random people and wars claim innocent lives. But, if the people are evil, the god gives them the right to repent. The only thing is, the god gives them the nature to not repent and still do bad things.

I'm not trying to twist your words. I'm just trying to lay out what you've said. Is this right?

[La Xinga]

Sometimes, according to religion, God punishes evil people above and rewards good people above. Not all the time, but sometimes.

Compulsory repentance does not seem like repentance at all....

So, according to you, there is a god. The god sometimes punishes those who are evil, sometimes doesn't. Same with the generous. It's just random. That's why this virus is killing random people and wars claim innocent lives. But, if the people are evil, the god gives them the right to repent. The only thing is, the god gives them the nature to not repent and still do bad things.

I'm not trying to twist your words. I'm just trying to lay out what you've said. Is this right?

Almost. There is not a nature to repent nor the opposite.

[Awesomeland012345]

So, according to you, there is a god. The god sometimes punishes those who are evil, sometimes doesn't. Same with the generous. It's just random. That's why this virus is killing random people and wars claim innocent lives. But, if the people are evil, the god gives them the right to repent. The only thing is, the god gives them the nature to not repent and still do bad things.

I'm not trying to twist your words. I'm just trying to lay out what you've said. Is this right?

Almost. There is not a nature to repent nor the opposite.

so... what is it then. I'm confused. It's random?

[La Xinga]

Almost. There is not a nature to repent nor the opposite.

so... what is it then. I'm confused. It's random?

It's neutral.

Bye.

[Geneviev]

There is no way for God to end suffering without creating worse problems. He stays with people and loves them instead, and that almost ends suffering.

Then he is not omnipotent.

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

[Godular]

Then he is not omnipotent.

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

In which case he's just sadistic.

[The Alma Mater]

yes
/thread

Ans his name is Odin Allfather.
/thread

[Region of Dwipantara]

Probably

Yes, though I would add that how big is the probability of a presented scenario matters.

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

In which case he's just sadistic.

You just don't understand His love, so i will repeat it again. God is a yandere.

[The Grey Parrot]

I truly don't know. I believe there might be a higher power due to people with Near-Death Experiences experiencing things or gathering information we would otherwise deem as impossible. However, I don't think I can ever know for certain.
I was raised Atheist but now I believe I'm an Agnostic.

[Neanderthaland]

Then he is not omnipotent.

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

If he does not end unnecessary suffering, then he is not omnibenevolent.

[SHAH-MAT]

The definition of God is at the least tricky.
Is he a a Supreme being who controls everything or one who just puts everything in motion like a clockmaker?
Is he a manifestation of the imagination or a real spirit?
Is he the universe likening to Mother Nature or an independent Person?
There are many connotations to “God”, and there is to every culture their God

[SHAH-MAT]

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

If he does not end unnecessary suffering, then he is not omnibenevolent.

Yes, but is it unnecessary?
Did 6 million Jews die in vain?

[Geneviev]

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

In which case he's just sadistic.

It can seem that way. But he does care for people anyway.

He is omnipotent. He uses that omnipotence to be with people when they need him. God just doesn't interfere with his creation that much to end suffering, and even if we don't understand it, he still stays with us.

If he does not end unnecessary suffering, then he is not omnibenevolent.

He does help people get through it, which is reducing the suffering. He just doesn't end it.

[Neanderthaland]

If he does not end unnecessary suffering, then he is not omnibenevolent.

Yes, but is it unnecessary?
Did 6 million Jews die in vain?

I don't blame you for not following the entire chain of conversation, but I am limiting this discussion only to parasitic wasps, and their victims. Creatures that have nothing to do with humanity. Whose suffering is irrelevant to human experience. But who suffer anyway.

Now if you think a caterpillar being eaten alive from the inside while a wasp's neurotoxin slowly corrupts it's brain is necessary, I'd like you to show your work.

[Neanderthaland]

If he does not end unnecessary suffering, then he is not omnibenevolent.

He does help people get through it, which is reducing the suffering. He just doesn't end it.

We were talking about caterpillars, remember? Does he help caterpillars "get through it?"

If so, show your work.

[Katganistan]

But what if you subscribe to another religion, like Buddhism or Hinduism?

Temporary purgatory.

Yeaaaah, this is why people have a problem with Catholicism. IF there is only one God, then why would He punish us for worshiping Him in different ways?

Sounds like a human problem, not a divine one -- "MY church is the only TRUE church."