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Is there a God?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Do you believe in a God or gods?

Yes
22
40%
No
14
25%
Maybe
4
7%
We can't know
3
5%
We can't know, but leaning yes
0
No votes
We can't know, but leaning no
10
18%
Other
2
4%
 
Total votes : 55

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Geneviev
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Is there a God?

Postby Geneviev » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:27 am

In the last week or so, I have been wondering about this question. The most common evidence given for the Christian God can also be used to support the existence of other gods and the truth of other religions, or it seems to rely on fallacies. Pascal's wager doesn't acknowledge the possibility of other gods, evolution seems to disprove an intelligent designer, and so on. That seems to indicate that there is no real evidence for God. Instead, it's possible that belief in God requires having faith with no evidence at all, and potentially evidence that contradicts his existence entirely. So why should we believe in God, NSG? Is there any better evidence that I don't know?

In my opinion, I believe in the Christian God but I believe that there is no way to prove his existence and don't know why I believe in him anymore. So, what say you, NSG?
Last edited by Geneviev on Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:18 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Salandriagado
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Postby Salandriagado » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:29 am

There is absolutely no evidence in favour of such a thing, and mountains of evidence against pretty well every specific god ever proposed, so it would very much appear not.
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Salandriagado wrote:
Notice that the link is to the notes from a university course on probability. You clearly have nothing beyond the most absurdly simplistic understanding of the subject.
By choosing 1, you no longer have 0 probability of choosing 1. End of subject.

(read up the quote stack)

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Picairn
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Postby Picairn » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:33 am

I usually shrug when people ask me this question and tell them I don't know, then move on.
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Kiu Ghesik
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Postby Kiu Ghesik » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:34 am

I mean that's a big question.
Salandriagado wrote:There is absolutely no evidence in favour of such a thing, and mountains of evidence against pretty well every specific god ever proposed, so it would very much appear not.

I haven't seen much evidence besides "we can't see it so it doesn't exist," so have you seen something else?

Geneviev wrote:The most common evidence given for the Christian God can also be used to support the existence of other gods and the truth of other religions, or it seems to rely on fallacies... evolution seems to disprove an intelligent designer...

The most commonly given evidence for the existence of the Christian god is Christ's time on Earth and the miracles he performed. I believe those happened if only because Luke wrote about them from the perspective of a neutral outside observer and returned much the same results as the faithful around Christ.

Evolution doesn't disprove an intelligent designer unless you look at (as an example) the Bible from an anally literal standpoint, and the fact that it uses metaphor and literary devices proves that as kind of dumb. God is literally described as omnipotent. There's no reason that Big G couldn't have just set up the system fourteen billion years ago with expectations it would produce the exact results we see today. Besides, humans are described as being made in God's image (at least in mind), and wouldn't you agree that a perfectly-designed world would be boring?

And you literally can't disprove the existence of something outside of a system from within that system, as you can't observe outside of it. If I'm in a sealed, fixed box I can't prove there's a guy standing just outside the box juggling a ball.
Last edited by Kiu Ghesik on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Grob
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Postby The Grob » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:37 am

What is the point of attempting to argue whether gods exist or not when there is no evidence to support that they do or don't? Both Atheists and the faithful both have a point but most of the time they fail to realize that faith is subjective.
Of course, me being a deist, I probably don't have much room to argue.
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New yugoslavaia
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Postby New yugoslavaia » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:38 am

I don't really care.
But considering no scientific evidence has been produced that I know of which proves a deity does exist, along with the only proof coming from a more than a millennium old book that is could very well be full of bollocks, I don't think there is one.
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Valrifell
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Postby Valrifell » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:39 am

There's no evidence to suggest that some higher power exists, while that doesn't preclude the possibility of one existing or have existed in the past, I think it's more prudent to assume that there's no God or god(s) at all.

But, speaking more specifically, I think we can take all major world religions as mostly false.
Last edited by Valrifell on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Picairn
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Postby Picairn » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:41 am

Kiu Ghesik wrote:I haven't seen much evidence besides "we can't see it so it doesn't exist," so have you seen something else?

Reminds me of a story where an atheist debates a priest. Dunno the source though, it was a long time ago when I read it. Or I am just making the story up based on fractured memories. :)

The atheist said: "There is no evidence that God exists because we never see him", or something along the lines, to which the priest responded by pulling his pants down and showed his butt to the atheist, saying: "You have never seen my butt before, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist!"

You do the interpretation.
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Drew Durrnil
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Postby Drew Durrnil » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:44 am

Picairn wrote:
Kiu Ghesik wrote:I haven't seen much evidence besides "we can't see it so it doesn't exist," so have you seen something else?

Reminds me of a story where an atheist debates a priest. Dunno the source though, it was a long time ago when I read it. Or I am just making the story up based on fractured memories. :)

The atheist said: "There is no evidence that God exists because we never see him", or something along the lines, to which the priest responded by pulling his pants down and showed his butt to the atheist, saying: "You have never seen my butt before, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist!"

You do the interpretation.

The existence of God contradicts the existence of other gods. Its evidence! To solve this question of the existence of God, we must look to other faiths and look into their eyes.
Last edited by Drew Durrnil on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
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The Grob
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Postby The Grob » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:45 am

Ah, this thread should have never been created. It'll just be religious skeptics and the religious arguing back and forth over a question which is futile to think about.
> LOADING DATA. . .
> THE TECHNOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF THE GROX IS AN ACTIVE HYPERPOWER IN THE UNIVERSE OF STARRLIN
> THEY ARE AMONG THE MOST POWERFUL EMPIRES IN THE UNIVERSE, HAVING A LARGE-STANDING MILITARY AND ECONOMY.
> THEIR STATE IDEOLOGY IS GROXOLOGISM.
> THE GROX IS A TIER 10, LEVEL 0 AND TYPE 10 CIVILIZATION ACCORDING TO THE CIVILIZATION INDEX

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Aeritai
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Postby Aeritai » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:46 am

Yes I believe God exist He has helped me overcome the difficulties of this world.
Last edited by Aeritai on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Kiu Ghesik
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Postby Kiu Ghesik » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:47 am

The Grob wrote:Ah, this thread should have never been created. It'll just be religious skeptics and the religious arguing back and forth over a question which is futile to think about.

Image
And that's a religious person saying this. I mean, I'm up for the debate, but...
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Southeastern Xiatao
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Postby Southeastern Xiatao » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:48 am

There is no such thing as God.

However there is such thing as Bob. Bob is awesome he created the universe and the world. Bob is love. Bob is life.
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San Lumen
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Postby San Lumen » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:48 am

I believe there is some sort of higher power. I find it hard to believe that something came from nothing.

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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:50 am

There is a possibility :roll:
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Dumb Ideologies
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:51 am

Probably not. Historical religions seem to serve a social purpose, psychological comfort may be a significant influence on belief, a lot of stories formally taken literally are now "figurative" because they conflict with science we have evidence for, and people's brains work in erratic enough ways under stress that I'm not convinced people having visions or more vaguely feeling the presence of God is enough to take their word for it.

We can't rule it out, but on the balance of probabilities I'm inclined towards skepticism.
Last edited by Dumb Ideologies on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sanghyeok
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Postby Sanghyeok » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:51 am

I do not believe in God. But you can believe in whatever God or Gods you want, as long as you don't use religion to hurt people.
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Valrifell
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Postby Valrifell » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:52 am

Picairn wrote:
Kiu Ghesik wrote:I haven't seen much evidence besides "we can't see it so it doesn't exist," so have you seen something else?

Reminds me of a story where an atheist debates a priest. Dunno the source though, it was a long time ago when I read it. Or I am just making the story up based on fractured memories. :)

The atheist said: "There is no evidence that God exists because we never see him", or something along the lines, to which the priest responded by pulling his pants down and showed his butt to the atheist, saying: "You have never seen my butt before, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist!"

You do the interpretation.


The fact that the priest was standing and/or sitting is, itself, evidence for his butt.
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The Grob
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Postby The Grob » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:53 am

Once again, the thought that there is a god or not is subjective until it is scientifically proven that a god is real or not.
It is futile to argue about this and any of your points will likely get nowhere. It's fun to debate about it, but you will achieve nothing in the process except making somebody slightly more faithful or slightly more skeptical of their religious beliefs.
> LOADING DATA. . .
> THE TECHNOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF THE GROX IS AN ACTIVE HYPERPOWER IN THE UNIVERSE OF STARRLIN
> THEY ARE AMONG THE MOST POWERFUL EMPIRES IN THE UNIVERSE, HAVING A LARGE-STANDING MILITARY AND ECONOMY.
> THEIR STATE IDEOLOGY IS GROXOLOGISM.
> THE GROX IS A TIER 10, LEVEL 0 AND TYPE 10 CIVILIZATION ACCORDING TO THE CIVILIZATION INDEX

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Salandriagado
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Postby Salandriagado » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:54 am

Kiu Ghesik wrote:I mean that's a big question.
Salandriagado wrote:There is absolutely no evidence in favour of such a thing, and mountains of evidence against pretty well every specific god ever proposed, so it would very much appear not.

I haven't seen much evidence besides "we can't see it so it doesn't exist," so have you seen something else?


First off, absence of evidence absolutely is evidence of absence (this is a direct consequence of Bayes' Theorem). Secondly: yes, absolute mountains of it. If you pick one god concept in particular, I can give you the specifics, but it very likely starts with "internal logical inconsistencies" and "makes predictions about the universe that turn out to be completely wrong".
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Anachronous Rex wrote:Good thing most a majority of people aren't so small-minded, and frightened of other's sexuality.

Over 40% (including me), are, so I fixed the post for accuracy.

Vilatania wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:
Notice that the link is to the notes from a university course on probability. You clearly have nothing beyond the most absurdly simplistic understanding of the subject.
By choosing 1, you no longer have 0 probability of choosing 1. End of subject.

(read up the quote stack)

Deal. £3000 do?[/quote]

Of course.[/quote]

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The Grob
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Postby The Grob » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:54 am

(accidental doublepost)
Last edited by The Grob on Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:56 am, edited 2 times in total.
> LOADING DATA. . .
> THE TECHNOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF THE GROX IS AN ACTIVE HYPERPOWER IN THE UNIVERSE OF STARRLIN
> THEY ARE AMONG THE MOST POWERFUL EMPIRES IN THE UNIVERSE, HAVING A LARGE-STANDING MILITARY AND ECONOMY.
> THEIR STATE IDEOLOGY IS GROXOLOGISM.
> THE GROX IS A TIER 10, LEVEL 0 AND TYPE 10 CIVILIZATION ACCORDING TO THE CIVILIZATION INDEX

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Tranzoria
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Postby Tranzoria » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:55 am

I do not believe in God. Religion in my opinion is just a Fantasy for people to explain how things happen or happened to the Earth or them.
However, I do believe that there is some force out there, not as powerful as God, but still powerful enough. Like a ghost, controlling the glitches and luck in the Matrix.
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Valentine Z
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Postby Valentine Z » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:55 am

Theravada Buddhist here! I have a belief in multiple deities, perhaps. While the scientific evidence has not pointed to such an existence as of now, I believe that we have had multiple worlds before us, our world (the Big Bang) came from another universe's demise, and in a far far future, our universe will be crunched into another new one, in an endless cycle of existence and destruction.

I personally don't believe in a single all-seeing God throughout the multiverse, but perhaps the idea of "Multiple universes, multiple gods."



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Salandriagado
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Postby Salandriagado » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:55 am

San Lumen wrote:I believe there is some sort of higher power. I find it hard to believe that something came from nothing.


Oh boy, you're not going to like particle physics.

But also: where, then, do you think this "higher power" came from?
Cosara wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:Good thing most a majority of people aren't so small-minded, and frightened of other's sexuality.

Over 40% (including me), are, so I fixed the post for accuracy.

Vilatania wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:
Notice that the link is to the notes from a university course on probability. You clearly have nothing beyond the most absurdly simplistic understanding of the subject.
By choosing 1, you no longer have 0 probability of choosing 1. End of subject.

(read up the quote stack)

Deal. £3000 do?[/quote]

Of course.[/quote]

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Picairn
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Postby Picairn » Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:56 am

The Grob wrote:Once again, the thought that there is a god or not is subjective until it is scientifically proven that a god is real or not.
It is futile to argue about this and any of your points will likely get nowhere. It's fun to debate about it, but you will achieve nothing in the process except making somebody slightly more faithful or slightly more skeptical of their religious beliefs.

That's why polarization kills every debate.
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But so can jerking off in a subway.

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Atheris wrote:Blaming religion for Trump is like blaming science for tear gas.

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