Violence Outbreak in Kenosha WI

[Thermodolia]

I totally support the use of Tranqs. No one gets hurt hopefully and they aren't deadly.

>tranquillisers aren't deadly

Reminder: Elijah McCain died because the police ordered the paramedics to overdose him with Ketamine in order to sedate him.

Overdoses are known to kill. A tranquilizer shot isn’t the same as an overdose of Ketamine.

[Thermodolia]

I totally support the use of Tranqs. No one gets hurt hopefully and they aren't deadly.

There are taser round for shotguns irc, stands to reason they can miniaturize it for pistols and assault rifles.

I don’t know why that’s not more widespread

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Nazeroth literally was celebrating the attempted murder of an unarmed man in this thread about 4 hours ago, and defending Trump's claim that Mexican Americans are everyone Mexico didn't want. Everyone is a leftist to him.

Uhhh wat

Mexican isn't a unique race it's a mixture of native american and white spaniards and the truth is Mexico isn't sending their best.

"Mexico isnt sending its best people" translates into "Mexican Americans are Mexico's trash."

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Sedatives seem quite risky to me. Stimulant drugs would make it ineffective, while depressants like opioid or alcohol would be potentiated. If there's an ambulance nearby the subject is probably going to be OK, but if there's not they could die.

Reminder: Elijah McCain died because the police ordered the paramedics to overdose him with Ketamine in order to sedate him.

Yeah cause they overdid it. One tranquilizer dart isn't gonna kill most people and its alot less deadly than several bullets to the back.

[San Lumen]

Nazeroth literally was celebrating the attempted murder of an unarmed man in this thread about 4 hours ago, and defending Trump's claim that Mexican Americans are everyone Mexico didn't want. Everyone is a leftist to him.

Uhhh wat

You still have yet to give a concrete answer as to why most urban centers don’t vote for Republican mayors or city councils.

You’ve given insults and shown you don’t understand how government programs or municipal governments work. So far you’ve given reasons why they should continue voting for Democrats .

You have also yet to say how elections in cities are highly influenced

[Loben III]

I totally support the use of Tranqs. No one gets hurt hopefully and they aren't deadly.

>tranquillisers aren't deadly

Reminder: Elijah McCain died because the police ordered the paramedics to overdose him with Ketamine in order to sedate him.

Key word is overdose.

[Vassenor]

Reminder: Elijah McCain died because the police ordered the paramedics to overdose him with Ketamine in order to sedate him.

Yeah cause they overdid it. One tranquilizer dart isn't gonna kill most people and its alot less deadly than several bullets to the back.

Tranquilliser doses have to be calculated in order to be safe. How are you going to do that in a situation like this?

[Galloism]

Yeah cause they overdid it. One tranquilizer dart isn't gonna kill most people and its alot less deadly than several bullets to the back.

Tranquilliser doses have to be calculated in order to be safe. How are you going to do that in a situation like this?

Oh Vassenor, you skipped all this. Just wanted to remind you.

They were white women fighting?

The video posted shows three bystanders at the time of the shooting, and all three appear to be black women.

So, Vassenor's refusal to engage notwithstanding, the video shows the women involved (presuming the same women causing the disturbance were the ones in the video) were black women.

This is not for me to cast aspersions on black people or black women, but to point out Vassenor's point should be applied the actual situation. Here's what Vassenor Posted.

Jacob Blake wasn’t committing any crime. Instead of asking why he didn’t comply, ask why an officer who was called to the scene for two white women fighting somehow shifted his attention to this Black man, drew his gun on him, and shot him seven times in the back.

Here's what Vassenor SHOULD have posted:

Jacob Blake wasn’t committing any crime. Instead of asking why he didn’t comply, ask why an officer who was called to the scene for two black women fighting somehow shifted his attention to this Black man, drew his gun on him, and shot him seven times in the back.

That's a great question Alternate Universe Vassenor. Why aren't we asking that question?

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

The last time somebody seriously tried sleeping agents was the Moscow Theatre so...

[Vassenor]

Tranquilliser doses have to be calculated in order to be safe. How are you going to do that in a situation like this?

Oh Vassenor, you skipped all this. Just wanted to remind you.

So, Vassenor's refusal to engage notwithstanding, the video shows the women involved (presuming the same women causing the disturbance were the ones in the video) were black women.

This is not for me to cast aspersions on black people or black women, but to point out Vassenor's point should be applied the actual situation. Here's what Vassenor Posted.



Here's what Vassenor SHOULD have posted:



That's a great question Alternate Universe Vassenor. Why aren't we asking that question?

Did you pull something reaching for that gotcha?

[Galloism]

Oh Vassenor, you skipped all this. Just wanted to remind you.

Did you pull something reaching for that gotcha?

So why aren’t we asking that question?

I think it’s interesting that you assumed it was two white women even when that’s not reported and not what’s shown in the video, and jump from that assumption to the conclusion it was racism. In point of fact, it was probably two black women, and the actual reason for the focus change - the question you asked - was sexism.

Then sexism and racism working together got him shot.

See, you asked a good question. I think you should follow it so it’s logical conclusion.

So why aren’t we asking that question?

[Thermodolia]

Did you pull something reaching for that gotcha?

So why aren’t we asking that question?

I think it’s interesting that you assumed it was two white women even when that’s not reported and not what’s shown in the video, and jump from that assumption to the conclusion it was racism. In point of fact, it was probably two black women, and the actual reason for the focus change - the question you asked - was sexism.

Then sexism and racism working together got him shot.

See, you asked a good question. I think you should follow it so it’s logical conclusion.

So why aren’t we asking that question?

Because asking that question would lead to very uncomfortable situations that many don’t want to acknowledge

[Vassenor]

Did you pull something reaching for that gotcha?

So why aren’t we asking that question?

I think it’s interesting that you assumed it was two white women even when that’s not reported and not what’s shown in the video, and jump from that assumption to the conclusion it was racism. In point of fact, it was probably two black women, and the actual reason for the focus change - the question you asked - was sexism.

Then sexism and racism working together got him shot.

See, you asked a good question. I think you should follow it so it’s logical conclusion.

So why aren’t we asking that question?

Because you're more interested in pressing the wording rather than answering the question.

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Did you pull something reaching for that gotcha?

So why aren’t we asking that question?

I think it’s interesting that you assumed it was two white women even when that’s not reported and not what’s shown in the video, and jump from that assumption to the conclusion it was racism. In point of fact, it was probably two black women, and the actual reason for the focus change - the question you asked - was sexism.

Then sexism and racism working together got him shot.

See, you asked a good question. I think you should follow it so it’s logical conclusion.

So why aren’t we asking that question?

I think they shot him just cause they didn't like that he ignored their asses and left. That oversized ego couldn't take it.

[Page]

>tranquillisers aren't deadly

Overdoses are known to kill. A tranquilizer shot isn’t the same as an overdose of Ketamine.

There is no substance that instantly renders someone unconscious without significant risk of harm.

[Thermodolia]

Overdoses are known to kill. A tranquilizer shot isn’t the same as an overdose of Ketamine.

There is no substance that instantly renders someone unconscious without significant risk of harm.

I didn’t say that there was. I never said anything about instantly. If a tranquilizer shot takes a few seconds to work but the person lives then that’s better than outright killing them

[Vassenor]

There is no substance that instantly renders someone unconscious without significant risk of harm.

I didn’t say that there was. I never said anything about instantly. If a tranquilizer shot takes a few seconds to work but the person lives then that’s better than outright killing them

So how do you make sure you're delivering a dose that will safely and quickly render a given person unconscious?

[Dumb Ideologies]

People have different amounts of resistance to different things. If you want to reliably knock someone down and make them immobile there is always the risk that someone with a greater susceptibility to whatever method you're using may die from it.

Clearly, for a similar level of police training and competence there will be fewer deaths from using incapacitating weapons that have a lower lethality rate. Combine this with better training and you can reduce the numbers further, but inevitably not to zero because some people will always have underlying health problems and susceptabilities that won't be obvious and maybe even they don't know about.

Alternative methods do not need to be perfect to be better.

[Thermodolia]

I didn’t say that there was. I never said anything about instantly. If a tranquilizer shot takes a few seconds to work but the person lives then that’s better than outright killing them

So how do you make sure you're delivering a dose that will safely and quickly render a given person unconscious?

It won’t do it instantly but you can shoot a dart that will have them knocked out in about 60 seconds or so. You’re not going to have anything quicker than that. But hey that’s the draw back for safety.

Either that or you mass produce darts for every body weight and teach cops to guess the nearest weight of a person. But either way after the person is unconscious you call for medical support who would monitor the person and administer antidotes.

Or we just use tasers. But all of these options are less lethal than a gun, and you can’t use the death of Elijah McCain as a mark against it as the police knowingly ordered an overdose.

You don’t use an overdose you won’t have that problem. Granted it’s gonna take longer but hey safety is everything

[Thermodolia]

People have different amounts of resistance to different things. If you want to reliably knock someone down and make them immobile there is always the risk that someone with a greater susceptibility to whatever method you're using may die from it.

Clearly, for a similar level of police training and competence there will be fewer deaths from using incapacitating weapons that have a lower lethality rate. Combine this with better training and you can reduce the numbers further, but inevitably not to zero because some people will always have underlying health problems and susceptabilities that won't be obvious and maybe even they don't know about.

Alternative methods do not need to be perfect to be better.

Exactly. Tasers can kill people who have heart issues. However a lot of times these aren’t known at the time. However the likelihood that someone will survive being shot by a taser or tranq dart is far far greater than getting shot with a gun

[Ifreann]

There are taser round for shotguns irc, stands to reason they can miniaturize it for pistols and assault rifles.

I don’t know why that’s not more widespread

I believe the use of a shotgun taser was implicated in the death of a man in England. He had a gun to his own head, an officer used their shotgun taser, and he shot himself.

---

Reminder: Elijah McCain died because the police ordered the paramedics to overdose him with Ketamine in order to sedate him.

Yeah cause they overdid it. One tranquilizer dart isn't gonna kill most people and its alot less deadly than several bullets to the back.

Tranquillisers really don't work like that. You shoot a dart at someone and most likely it'll bounce harmlessly off their clothes. If it actually sticks into them, obviously they're gonna try and pull it out. But you can't possibly know how quickly they'll pull it out, so you can't really control how much of a dose they get. So is it safe to use a second dart if they don't go down? Did the first dart deliver a dangerous dose? No way to know. Anaesthesiology isn't just difficult to spell, it's difficult to do. Knocking someone unconscious with drugs without hurting or killing them is really tricky.

[Page]

There is no substance that instantly renders someone unconscious without significant risk of harm.

I didn’t say that there was. I never said anything about instantly. If a tranquilizer shot takes a few seconds to work but the person lives then that’s better than outright killing them

All substances that rapidly induce unconsciousness have significant risks and the safer ones are ineffective.

Let's go through some examples:

- Propofol: Even slightly too much can easily cause a lethal overdose.

- Opioids: Same as above.

- Barbiturates: Same as above.

- Benzodiazepines: People can consume a huge amount of benzodiazepines without losing consciousness. Note that massive overdoses of midazolam during lethal injections have often failed to sedate the victim. Also can cause fatal respiratory depression if one is under the influence of alcohol.

- Antipsychotics: Not fast acting and have a great deal of terrible side effects.

- Ketamine: See Elijah McClain.

- Anesthetics used in surgery: Doctors spend over a decade of their life training to administer these drugs. They must know the precise weight of the patient, what substances the patient uses, and when is the last time they ate, or they may die. Do you really want cops shooting people up with these?

So tell me, what are we tranquilizing people with?

[Ifreann]

I didn’t say that there was. I never said anything about instantly. If a tranquilizer shot takes a few seconds to work but the person lives then that’s better than outright killing them

All substances that rapidly induce unconsciousness have significant risks and the safer ones are ineffective.

Let's go through some examples:

- Propofol: Even slightly too much can easily cause a lethal overdose.

- Opioids: Same as above.

- Barbiturates: Same as above.

- Benzodiazepines: People can consume a huge amount of benzodiazepines without losing consciousness. Note that massive overdoses of midazolam during lethal injections have often failed to sedate the victim. Also can cause fatal respiratory depression if one is under the influence of alcohol.

- Antipsychotics: Not fast acting and have a great deal of terrible side effects.

- Ketamine: See Elijah McClain.

- Anesthetics used in surgery: Doctors spend over a decade of their life training to administer these drugs. They must know the precise weight of the patient, what substances the patient uses, and when is the last time they ate, or they may die. Do you really want cops shooting people up with these?

So tell me, what are we tranquilizing people with?

Give the police MDMA darts and people will want to cuddle instead of resist arrest.

[Thermodolia]

I don’t know why that’s not more widespread

I believe the use of a shotgun taser was implicated in the death of a man in England. He had a gun to his own head, an officer used their shotgun taser, and he shot himself.

That doesn’t discount the use of tasers but shows that cops shouldn’t be responding to mental health emergencies

[Thermodolia]

All substances that rapidly induce unconsciousness have significant risks and the safer ones are ineffective.

Let's go through some examples:

- Propofol: Even slightly too much can easily cause a lethal overdose.

- Opioids: Same as above.

- Barbiturates: Same as above.

- Benzodiazepines: People can consume a huge amount of benzodiazepines without losing consciousness. Note that massive overdoses of midazolam during lethal injections have often failed to sedate the victim. Also can cause fatal respiratory depression if one is under the influence of alcohol.

- Antipsychotics: Not fast acting and have a great deal of terrible side effects.

- Ketamine: See Elijah McClain.

- Anesthetics used in surgery: Doctors spend over a decade of their life training to administer these drugs. They must know the precise weight of the patient, what substances the patient uses, and when is the last time they ate, or they may die. Do you really want cops shooting people up with these?

So tell me, what are we tranquilizing people with?

Give the police MDMA darts and people will want to cuddle instead of resist arrest.

Sounds great to me