2020 US General Election Thread VIII: Cs, Ds, and Es

[The Greater Ohio Valley]

Given American nationalism didn't really become a mainstream thing until a few years ago

Dude, where’ve you been since 1776? Nationalism has been pretty ingrained in much of American society since the start with only relatively low dips here and there depending on the presidency and political situations in a given time.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Given American nationalism didn't really become a mainstream thing until a few years ago

Dude, where’ve you been since 1776? Nationalism has been pretty ingrained in much of American society since the start with only relatively low dips here and there depending on the presidency and political situations in a given time.

There's a very large difference between the chest pounding patriotism of old and the modern sort of American nationalism.

[Major-Tom]

I can't speak for Iceland, but rigorous nationalism has torn my country apart. From polarizing and pitting people against each other all under the guise of "who is a patriot and who is a seditionist." It's ruined families, social relationships, and the fabric of the otherwise unified state we've had in the past.

I'm fine with civic nationalism, the type that says "love your neighbor, regardless of who they are, what they look like, and what values they espouse." But that is not the type of nationalism being promoted in my country, or in many countries abroad. And I feel it's important to make that distinction.

Given American nationalism didn't really become a mainstream thing until a few years ago I'm doubtful of that claim.

What tore this country apart was a lack of anything to be united over and a complete and total breakdown of the fabric of society, the reasonings of which go back quite a long time.

Sure, I think we've always had a sort of American nationalism, it just used to be broader, IE, we loved and stood for all that was American and all the people here, as opposed to a narrow definition of what we believe to be American and a narrow definition of what we believe to be the values we share are.

So, while this surge of hyper-nationalism veiled in patriotism isn't the sole thing that tore this nation apart, it certainly contributed and was a natural result of decades upon decades of failed policies (something you alluded to in your post).

[Indian Empire]

I got back from a political event a few hours ago. I'm a Kentucky Democrat, so Amy McGrath was there, along with my candidate for congress (KY-04) and several state legislators/candidates. Two of them recognized me, which felt surreal.

My candidate for state house is based- the guy looks like Santa and advertises this on his signs!

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Dude, where’ve you been since 1776? Nationalism has been pretty ingrained in much of American society since the start with only relatively low dips here and there depending on the presidency and political situations in a given time.

There's a very large difference between the chest pounding patriotism of old and the modern sort of American nationalism.

You mean American Fascism?

[San Lumen]

I got back from a political event a few hours ago. I'm a Kentucky Democrat, so Amy McGrath was there, along with my candidate for congress (KY-04) and several state legislators/candidates. Two of them recognized me, which felt surreal.

My candidate for state house is based- the guy looks like Santa and advertises this on his signs!

That’s awesome. I hope they all win.

[Washington Resistance Army]

There's a very large difference between the chest pounding patriotism of old and the modern sort of American nationalism.

You mean American Fascism?

I've actually read fascist theory and understand most all forms of the ideology so no I don't.

[Indian Empire]

I got back from a political event a few hours ago. I'm a Kentucky Democrat, so Amy McGrath was there, along with my candidate for congress (KY-04) and several state legislators/candidates. Two of them recognized me, which felt surreal.

My candidate for state house is based- the guy looks like Santa and advertises this on his signs!

That’s awesome. I hope they all win.

I'm hoping so too, my region of the state is pretty red though so not terribly optimistic about it.

[Major-Tom]

I got back from a political event a few hours ago. I'm a Kentucky Democrat, so Amy McGrath was there, along with my candidate for congress (KY-04) and several state legislators/candidates. Two of them recognized me, which felt surreal.

My candidate for state house is based- the guy looks like Santa and advertises this on his signs!

Y'all doing in-person or virtual events? The AZ Dems are doing exclusively virtual for all campaign events, big or small.

[Indian Empire]

I got back from a political event a few hours ago. I'm a Kentucky Democrat, so Amy McGrath was there, along with my candidate for congress (KY-04) and several state legislators/candidates. Two of them recognized me, which felt surreal.

My candidate for state house is based- the guy looks like Santa and advertises this on his signs!

Y'all doing in-person or virtual events? The AZ Dems are doing exclusively virtual for all campaign events, big or small.

Event was in person, but masks required & social distancing. Crowd was smaller than would be typical, as expected, but that's not really a big deal. Nothing will ever compare in scale to the Bernie rally I went to last year. At least, I don't think so.

[Uiiop]

So i heard CNN town hall was a complete contrast between the last one and the reason no one posting about is biden couldn't fuck up as hard.

Like the closest i could find is the well-intended ablest framing a few days ago but that wasn't that bad(But it is kinda like saying a category 3 isn't a 5. At least to my mentally different ass.)

[Borderlands of Rojava]

You mean American Fascism?

I've actually read fascist theory and understand most all forms of the ideology so no I don't.

American ISIS?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

So i heard CNN town hall was a complete contrast between the last one and the reason no one posting about is biden couldn't fuck up as hard.

Like the closet i could find is the well-intended ablest framing a few days ago but that wasn't that bad(But it is kinda like saying a category 2 isn't a 5. At least to my mentally different ass.)

We should indeed make an honest effort to criticize Biden.

Leftists should always be prepared to self-criticize.
Without criticism, wrong assumptions can flourish.
And without Republicans who can tell right from wrong,
who else but leftists themselves will criticize?

(It's a joke, R's, don't come back with No U, be funny)

[Major-Tom]

Y'all doing in-person or virtual events? The AZ Dems are doing exclusively virtual for all campaign events, big or small.

Event was in person, but masks required & social distancing. Crowd was smaller than would be typical, as expected, but that's not really a big deal. Nothing will ever compare in scale to the Bernie rally I went to last year. At least, I don't think so.

Bernie rallies are insane, yeah.

[Major-Tom]

So i heard CNN town hall was a complete contrast between the last one and the reason no one posting about is biden couldn't fuck up as hard.

Like the closest i could find is the well-intended ablest framing a few days ago but that wasn't that bad(But it is kinda like saying a category 3 isn't a 5. At least to my mentally different ass.)

Biden's town hall was...fine? Look, he's not a master orator, let's say it was Romney vs Biden in 2012 for some reason, and Biden performed the way he's performing now, he'd be politically unsalvageable. But despite his mediocrity on the stump, it is such a stark contrast to Trump, that it does make him seem fresh and just something that is overall much more palatable to many Americans, if the polls are to believed anyways.

[Uiiop]

So i heard CNN town hall was a complete contrast between the last one and the reason no one posting about is biden couldn't fuck up as hard.

Like the closet i could find is the well-intended ablest framing a few days ago but that wasn't that bad(But it is kinda like saying a category 2 isn't a 5. At least to my mentally different ass.)

We should indeed make an honest effort to criticize Biden.

Leftists should always be prepared to self-criticize.
Without criticism, wrong assumptions can flourish.
And without Republicans who can tell right from wrong,
who else but leftists themselves will criticize?

(It's a joke, R's, don't come back with No U, be funny)

What kind of a world would we live in?

So i heard CNN town hall was a complete contrast between the last one and the reason no one posting about is biden couldn't fuck up as hard.

Like the closest i could find is the well-intended ablest framing a few days ago but that wasn't that bad(But it is kinda like saying a category 3 isn't a 5. At least to my mentally different ass.)

Biden's town hall was...fine? Look, he's not a master orator, let's say it was Romney vs Biden in 2012 for some reason, and Biden performed the way he's performing now, he'd be politically unsalvageable. But despite his mediocrity on the stump, it is such a stark contrast to Trump, that it does make him seem fresh and just something that is overall much more palatable to many Americans, if the polls are to believed anyways.

Figures it was a snooze.
The ableism seen earlier did freak me out tho

[Indian Empire]

Event was in person, but masks required & social distancing. Crowd was smaller than would be typical, as expected, but that's not really a big deal. Nothing will ever compare in scale to the Bernie rally I went to last year. At least, I don't think so.

Bernie rallies are insane, yeah.

Yeah, I went to one August of last year in Louisville. shook hands with Bernie. it was incredible

[Kowani]

Event was in person, but masks required & social distancing. Crowd was smaller than would be typical, as expected, but that's not really a big deal. Nothing will ever compare in scale to the Bernie rally I went to last year. At least, I don't think so.

Bernie rallies are insane, yeah.

Bernie rallies are the best

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
6. This complies well with my perception that judges (in particular) tend towards leniency when they find the written law too harsh, and towards harshness when they find the written law too lenient.

Note that in the US, when black men are involved or when an election is nearby, the trend is towards harshness regardless.

(from the previous thread)

Firstly, I overgeneralized before. I said that minimum sentences were originally motivated by an attempt to reduce racial disparity in sentencing. Actually they're much older than that, and what I was thinking of was Federal Sentencing Guidelines. I made the further mistake of thinking the legislation was binding on all judges in the US. Originally it was, but SCOTUS pranged it so now judges are required to consider the guidelines but are not bound by them.

This would be one of those "old geezer remembers it from when it happened but hasn't kept up to date on it since" things. Yeah, I literally remember US politics that happened in 1984. So elect me.

When I first heard about this uniform sentencing standard, I was all for it. I didn't realize the dire consequences of removing sentencing discretion from judges. I just wanted sentencing to be less racist. I feel that's where the majority are now in the question of 'ideal policing'. New to the subject, idealistic perhaps but burdened with subjective impressions based on what current policing is actually like.

I'm trying to soften the blow here, but I believe the US is in danger of limiting police discretion in each case, the way they tried to limit judicial discretion (and with the help of state laws, largely have). Making judges or police stick too strictly to the letter of the law is just a wrong idea, which has not solved the problem in sentencing (probably, and I should check this, displacing it onto conviction) and won't solve the problem in policing.

We shouldn't try and regulate racist institutions into compliance. It's only treating the symptoms or even worse, covering up the symptoms. When we're done, and have completely extinguished the feedback from good judges or good cops about what the law should be, broken their morale because now they are just robots to the law and their individual knowledge or skills are not rewarded, all we will produce are Robojudges or Robocops, who act in every moment according to an exhaustive list of conditions.

There's no "permitted to shoot to kill suspect" option. Therefore "shoot to kill suspect, 3 times".

Let's not throw away the human expertise, and moral judgement, of employees of the state. It sets a terrible example to the private sector, for one thing. "To avoid getting sued, hire robots".

Instead, government should do what a private enterprise would do. This is not a joke.
Government is that far down a really bad path, that pulling tricks out of the capitalist playbook is the best way out.

Productivity is going down on the factory floor?
Sack the workers with lowest productivity, get some new ones.
New workers have low productivity, but should revert to the mean.
Retained workers increase productivity for fear of being sacked.

When your judges are racist, sack the most racist judges.
When your cops are racist, sack the most racist cops.

I'm not saying institutional reform is futile. I am saying, sack the bastards.

[Sundiata]

Joe Biden has my vote. I can't wait to see his public option for healthcare.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Joe Biden has my vote. I can't wait to see his public option for healthcare.

Darling, you've brought that up before. Either it's the blandest bait I've ever seen, or you are campaigning!

[Borderlands of Rojava]

https://news.yahoo.com/inspired-by-le-b ... 23066.html

Joe Biden is looking to engage black men on the issues? Thats a first for one of the biggest enablers of mass incarceration in America. I sure wish he engaged black men on the issues before separating families with his mandatory sentencing policies. If his engagement goes like it did last time, he'll scream at them that they're not black if they don't vote for him this November. I know Trump is a grade F president but can we stop wearing rose colored glasses when talking about Biden?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

https://news.yahoo.com/inspired-by-le-bron-james-biden-looks-to-engage-black-men-on-issues-and-rapper-jeezy-approves-224423066.html

Joe Biden is looking to engage black men on the issues?

Yeah. Like a small town hall, but in barber-shops.

Thats a first for one of the biggest enablers of mass incarceration in America. I sure wish he engaged black men on the issues before separating families with his mandatory sentencing policies. If his engagement goes like it did last time, he'll scream at them that they're not black

I'm aware of the incident. Biden raised his voice to say "... THEN YOU'RE NOT BLACK". With a nod. Like: 'your turn.'

The only mistake Biden made there, is he thought the black man he was talking to had a pair of balls. Biden was trying to start an argument. With a black man, about his race. That is, you must admit, rather ballsy for a privileged old white guy.

If you look at it from a victim point of view, it's "oh no, Biden was racist and rude and arrogant ... to a black man"

If you look at it from my point of view, it's "excellent way to start an argument, give him a big target to slug away at, listen for the ideological handles to wrestle the opponent to the ground er, address in my reply"

i.e. Biden was baiting, not trolling

if they don't vote for him this November. I know Trump is a grade F president but can we stop wearing rose colored glasses when talking about Biden?

He'd look better with rose-colored glasses, actually. He's a bit pale.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

If my foreign impression of barber-shops is correct, getting camera crews and secret service in there will make it quite crowded.

Regular customers won't be happy. Barbarous black men in MAGA caps will go viral on Twitter.
Gormwood or Gauthier if you're out there, drop me a TG. I learned so much from you, and miss you!

[No State Here]

https://news.yahoo.com/inspired-by-le-bron-james-biden-looks-to-engage-black-men-on-issues-and-rapper-jeezy-approves-224423066.html

Joe Biden is looking to engage black men on the issues? Thats a first for one of the biggest enablers of mass incarceration in America. I sure wish he engaged black men on the issues before separating families with his mandatory sentencing policies. If his engagement goes like it did last time, he'll scream at them that they're not black if they don't vote for him this November. I know Trump is a grade F president but can we stop wearing rose colored glasses when talking about Biden?

Black man: I won’t be voting for Biden-

Biden pops out of nowhere

"That’s it, your melanin is now mine"

Proceeds to remove all melanin from his body