Greece dumps refugees in Ocean tells Turkey Deal with it

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

youre not entitled to be allowed to live in another country just because you traveled there.

But they shouldnt be forced to be in the sea alone, there should be some legal procces to take care of them.

A process where prospective migrants ensure acceptance by their chosen countries by applying for entrance and passing all prerequisites? That's so crazy it just might work.

[Kowani]

youre not entitled to be allowed to live in another country just because you traveled there.

But they shouldnt be forced to be in the sea alone, there should be some legal procces to take care of them.

A process where prospective migrants ensure acceptance by their chosen countries by applying for entrance and passing all prerequisites? That's so crazy it just might work.

I hate this talking point.
Greece is bound by treaties it has signed, the most important of which being the Refugee convention. Refugees, regardless of legal status, are allowed to enter the country to request asylum, and stay there while the request is being processed. Greece is not pulling people out of the water and sending them back-it is doing this to people who have already reached Greece and are waiting for their claims to be processed. So Greece is responsible for having violated both its own and international law.

[Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum]

Imagine being as desperate for aid as Greece while being so terrible to others in need.

It's Turkey who's shirking their responsibility, not Greece.

Turkophobia is a really bad thing, I wonder what you say based on. Stop blaming the Turks

How about we kick turkey out? They commit mass genocide in Syria ironically. Also, those are illegals, to say its genocide is an overstatement. I swear the number of people supporting turkey is actually fucked and are blinded through their crimes

We don't want terrorists in Turkish borders. Europe and imperial powers, you are no different from Erdoğan. Be patient until 2023, nationalist Turks will support the Asad regime the dreams of Islamists and separatists will fall through

[Cordel One]

Imagine being as desperate for aid as Greece while being so terrible to others in need.

It's Turkey who's shirking their responsibility, not Greece.

Turkey does bad stuff too, but Greece dumped people into the ocean and that's what we're talking about in this thread.

[Crockerland]

NATO as well as anything like sanctioning them

So that Russia can pick them up and make them their new best friend? No thanks.

If we don't befriend every totalitarian rogue state out there, some other country might befriend them. Checkmate Liberals.

[Servilis]

i wouldn't call it genocide, but eitherway it is awful to hear.

[Porotia]

The title is bait. Greece has the right to bar entry to illegal migrants. Illegally immigrating is not acceptable, even if they're fleeing conflict. If they want in, they should claim political asylum instead. Illegally migrating just makes more problems.

In no way is this genocide.

[Navteia]

The article is titled stupidly. It's not genocide.

That being said Greece isn't barring entry to these migrants. They're letting them in and then sending them back out to sea. It is illegal, but that shouldn't even matter. Either you're a decent human being, or you're not, and the Greek officials doing this aren't, plain and simple. There's a lot of people arguing with this based on the completely arbitrary fact that they were born in a better spot as if that somehow entitles them to more than someone else. You're both human. If you don't see a problem with this callous behavior, then you are part of the problem whether you feel like admitting it or not. Sooner or later everyone needs help from someone else, even the people who think this is okay. We can only hope that when they need help, they don't get it either.

[Mannixa Prime]

Another point that should be raised, maybe if the Sunni Gulf states stopped financing terrorism (Israel is no saint either) and contributed to peace in the region the displacement of people wouldn’t be an issue.

Also like I said countless times before we need to stop voting in reactionary neoconservatives and soulless neo liberals.

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

Instead of caving to corporate establishment pressure and flooding Europe with reactionary folks we can use common sense instead.

[Pilipinas and Malaya]

Another point that should be raised, maybe if the Sunni Gulf states stopped financing terrorism (Israel is no saint either) and contributed to peace in the region the displacement of people wouldn’t be an issue.

Also like I said countless times before we need to stop voting in reactionary neoconservatives and soulless neo liberals.

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

Instead of caving to corporate establishment pressure and flooding Europe with reactionary folks we can use common sense instead.

Basically, the Middle East would be less chaotic if almost every country involved in the area decided to stop creating proxy wars with one another.

[Gravlen]

The title is bait. Greece has the right to bar entry to illegal migrants. Illegally immigrating is not acceptable, even if they're fleeing conflict. If they want in, they should claim political asylum instead. Illegally migrating just makes more problems.

It's always curious how some people feel the need to comment on something, when their comments show they haven't even read the article they're commenting on.

[-Astoria-]

Another point that should be raised, maybe if the Sunni Gulf states stopped financing terrorism (Israel is no saint either) and contributed to peace in the region the displacement of people wouldn’t be an issue.

Also like I said countless times before we need to stop voting in reactionary neoconservatives and soulless neo liberals.

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

Instead of caving to corporate establishment pressure and flooding Europe with reactionary folks we can use common sense instead.

Basically, the Middle East would be less chaotic if almost every country involved in the area decided to stop creating proxy wars with one another.

This.

[Porotia]

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

This is what I've tried to tell people as well. People in Europe have different societal norms than people who are from Western Asia/The Middle East, and as a result, it's harder for them to feel comfortable without needing to change European norms. If the places they're migrating from have their problems solved, then they can go back to how they were living before, and wouldn't have to flee their homes for safety.

Co-operation with Syria and Russia is a huge requirement in order to fix that [due to the amount of influence they have in that region], but NATO, the EU, and the UN won't let that happen, as Russia has historically been the enemy for decades.

Only then will migrants not be a problem anymore.

[Mannixa Prime]

Glad to see people agreeing with my points, there really is no other way.

[Betoni]

So, is Turkey now responsible for the ones Greece put out at sea? Apparently they maintain the geographical limitations on the 1951 refugee convention, basically only applies to refugees from Europe. And the UNCHR is fine with this. But what happens when the refugees come back from Europe?

[-Astoria-]

Glad to see people agreeing with my points, there really is no other way.

I'd say 'don't biggen yourself up like that', but you're not wrong, though...

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

This is what I've tried to tell people as well. People in Europe have different societal norms than people who are from Western Asia/The Middle East, and as a result, it's harder for them to feel comfortable without needing to change European norms. If the places they're migrating from have their problems solved, then they can go back to how they were living before, and wouldn't have to flee their homes for safety.

Co-operation with Syria and Russia is a huge requirement in order to fix that [due to the amount of influence they have in that region], but NATO, the EU, and the UN won't let that happen, as Russia has historically been the enemy for decades.

Only then will migrants not be a problem anymore.

Hmm, that's odd. I went to lebanon and it didn't seem all that different from southern europe apart from the weird government they have. So much for societal differences.

[The Lone Alliance]

Really it is, the refugee convention has no method of ensuring compliance, there's no means of punishment and no oversight committee that can enforce the rule.

Basically the only punishment that has been used against those violating it is public shaming and strong condemnations.

Furthermore these migrants are actually violating the convention as well, according to the very writing of the refugee convention all refugees must abide by the national laws of the contracting states.

By illegally immigrating to the country the migrants are in violation of the convention themselves.

That is not true.

The Convention has taken illegal entry into consideration, and deals with that question in Article 31:

1. The Contracting States shall not impose penalties, on account of their illegal entry or presence, on refugees who, coming directly from a territory where their life or freedom was threatened in the sense of article 1, enter or are present in their territory without authorization, provided they present themselves without delay to the authorities and show good cause for their illegal entry or presence.

Illegal entry is clearly not in violation of the Convention when the Convention includes mechanisms for dealing with it.

(By the way, I added a link in the quote, to preempt a commonly stated objection)

Except most of the migrants who sneak into the country don't want present themselves to the authorities because they don't want to get aslyum in Greece for obvious reasons.

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Glad to see people agreeing with my points, there really is no other way.

"Abandon people at sea to die. They're arab and I can't enjoy my vacation if they exist and make me feel worried."

[Borderlands of Rojava]

Another point that should be raised, maybe if the Sunni Gulf states stopped financing terrorism (Israel is no saint either) and contributed to peace in the region the displacement of people wouldn’t be an issue.

Also like I said countless times before we need to stop voting in reactionary neoconservatives and soulless neo liberals.

Instead of dumping them in Greece or Europe we should instead work with the Assad government, Iran, and other legitimate Middle Eastern and African states to create safe zones within the region.

Instead of caving to corporate establishment pressure and flooding Europe with reactionary folks we can use common sense instead.

I thought your solution was to send them adrift at sea till they die of thirst or drown?

[Southern Orbistan]

This thread is a joke

[Fartsniffage]

This thread is a joke

I'm glad you find the idea of abandoning people at sea funny.

[Borderlands of Rojava]

This thread is a joke

I'm glad you find the idea of abandoning people at sea funny.

Apparently European culture is more important than actual human lives. Frankly, I would dump all of european culture in a bonfire and burn it if the alternative was countless numbers of lives lost. Human life always is more important than "we got books and statues and old buildings and stuff." Things which btw won't go anywhere just cause you let new people into the country.

[Sao Nova Europa]

The Greek Prime Minister responded adequately enough about this today on CNN: https://twitter.com/camanpour/status/1296150232976195585?s=19

[Borderlands of Rojava]

The Greek Prime Minister responded adequately enough about this today on CNN: https://twitter.com/camanpour/status/1296150232976195585?s=19

This isn't that film The Invention of Lying. People lie all the time in this universe and the Greek prime minister is physically capable of saying "I didn't do it" when he condemns people to their end on the high seas.