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Major-Tom
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Founded: Mar 09, 2016
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Postby Major-Tom » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:43 am

Indian Empire wrote:I hate to be that guy, but as an amateur politico, this thread title is extremely inaccurate. He claimed/proposed it, but he can't actually do anything. Congress sets the times for these elections, for one, and for two, the 20th Amendment requires the terms end in January, and if the Presidential Term expires he just makes Nancy Pelosi acting President anyway. In short, no, this isn't possible. The senate GOP will just act like they didn't see it and it'll fade from the headlines in favor of coronavirus information within a 24-48 hours.


We're all amateur politicos, it's not an honor, it's a burden.

Regardless, you're generally right with this, it's unprecedented that a President would ask to push back Election Day, but really, he just can't,
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:43 am

The New California Republic wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:
As a side question, if that is such a big concern, why is the USA not digital yet ? It is 2020. You do your taxes online, manage your pension and insurance online, your medical records are online, all banking is online etc. And lets be fair - my savings matter much more than who is president ;)

So why not the elections ? Yes, there would be a barrier for poor people and people who fear computers; but the current system is also filled with barriers to prevent certain demographics to vote. So that would not be a change of principles.

Tbh it's the same in the UK, we still rely on paper ballots. Electronic voting machines have been discussed but since nobody is really pressing the matter then it hasn't really gone anywhere.


There are good reasons for that.
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Postby HC Eredivisie » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:43 am

Drystar wrote:
Indian Empire wrote:
Mail-in voting happens every election, they're called Absentee ballots. And someone in Utah or Oregon correct me if I'm wrong, but it's completely safe and secure.


Since I’m from Oregon, and have been voting by mail since 2001, I can tell you a few things about it. First, you register at either DMV or at the county electors office. On your registration card you sign your name, this is what they check your ballot against. Now come election season, first you get your voters pamphlet, and those tend to be different depending on your registration. Then a few days later you get your ballot. Big thick white envelope, with the words ballot enclosed stamped on it. Inside you’ll find three things, a ballot, a ballot envelope with a place for your signature, and a return envelope. Now you don’t have to actually mail your ballot back, you can drop it off at various secure drop boxes, normally at sheriffs offices, county courthouses, places of that nature, right up to the election deadline. But if you do want to mail it in, then you place the completed ballot in the secure envelope, which if tampered with invalidates the ballot, then you place that envelope inside the return mail envelope and drop it in the mail. It has to be postmarked by a certain date if sent by mail, but like I mentioned before, if you miss that date, you can still drop it off at the secure locations. Then all the ballots go to one counting location from all over the state. Works pretty well for us, but then we tend to be uncomplicated unlike all you trying to borrow trouble.
That seems fine.
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Valrifell
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Postby Valrifell » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:43 am

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:
Geneviev wrote:Right right right. How could I forget? Everything is his fault.


Everything!

9/11? Obama.
Vietnam? Obama.
Nazi Germany? Obama.
Civil War? Obama.
Black Death? Obama.
Crusades? Obama.
Fall of Rome? Obama.
Jesus' Crucifixion? Obama.
Adam & Eve? Obama.


Obama killed Archduke Franz Ferdinand.
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New Vedan
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Postby New Vedan » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:43 am

The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.

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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:44 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Drongonia wrote:The mail-in vote thing is a legitimate concern. I would never want to mail in a vote for anything, ever.


As a side question, if that is such a big concern, why is the USA not digital yet ? It is 2020. You do your taxes online, manage your pension and insurance online, your medical records are online, all banking is online etc. And lets be fair - my savings matter much more than who is president ;)

So why not the elections ? Yes, there would be a barrier for poor people and people who fear computers; but the current system is also filled with barriers to prevent certain demographics to vote. So that would not be a change of principles.


Because electronic voting actually is insecure.
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:44 am

New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.


Sketchy for what reason?
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:45 am

New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.


No significant evidence exists that mail-in voting is more fraudulent.
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Valrifell
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Postby Valrifell » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:45 am

Lower Nubia wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Tbh it's the same in the UK, we still rely on paper ballots. Electronic voting machines have been discussed but since nobody is really pressing the matter then it hasn't really gone anywhere.


There are good reasons for that.


Digital voting machines can be affected remotely because they're usually connected to some kind of network for faster counting. This leaves them vulnerable to all sorts of spooky software shenanigans

Heck, even cosmic rays can flip a bit and then your machine's fucked.
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No State Here
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Postby No State Here » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:45 am

Indian Empire wrote:I hate to be that guy, but as an amateur politico, this thread title is extremely inaccurate. He claimed/proposed it, but he can't actually do anything. Congress sets the times for these elections, for one, and for two, the 20th Amendment requires the terms end in January, and if the Presidential Term expires he just makes Nancy Pelosi acting President anyway. In short, no, this isn't possible. The senate GOP will just act like they didn't see it and it'll fade from the headlines in favor of coronavirus information within a 24-48 hours.

Instead of "Trump proposes possible delay of election" and elaborating on the process required to do so in the OP, the OP has decided to go with "Trump to delay the election" and "So NSG it has begun"

Classy website I must say
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Picairn
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Postby Picairn » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:45 am

New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.

Unfortunately I must disagree. I do not want to sacrifice innocent lives when there are tried and true alternatives like mail in ballots, which have worked beautifully in Oregon and Washington.
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Drongonia wrote:The mail-in vote thing is a legitimate concern. I would never want to mail in a vote for anything, ever.


As a side question, if that is such a big concern, why is the USA not digital yet ? It is 2020. You do your taxes online, manage your pension and insurance online, your medical records are online, all banking is online etc. And lets be fair - my savings matter much more than who is president ;)

So why not the elections ? Yes, there would be a barrier for poor people and people who fear computers; but the current system is also filled with barriers to prevent certain demographics to vote. So that would not be a change of principles.


Because it's much easier for a regime to fiddle the result that's spat out of a computer than it is to buy off all the vote-counters and ensure their silence.
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Major-Tom
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Postby Major-Tom » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.


We've used mail in ballots forever, don't be daft. Trump votes by mail, Pence votes by mail, most D.C politicians vote by mail...I vote by mail, the list goes on and on. It's proven to be safe.
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No State Here
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Postby No State Here » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

Geneviev wrote:Please tell me this isn't real. This can't be real.

What’s not real?
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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.

I think letting people die to vote is a terrible idea. It will stop people from voting, and it will kill people.
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

Valrifell wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
There are good reasons for that.


Digital voting machines can be affected remotely because they're usually connected to some kind of network for faster counting. This leaves them vulnerable to all sorts of spooky software shenanigans

Heck, even cosmic rays can flip a bit and then your machine's fucked.


Or when you're given one paper slip, and you alone have your address, it's hard to stuff the ballots.
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Major-Tom
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Postby Major-Tom » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:46 am

Vassenor wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:
As a side question, if that is such a big concern, why is the USA not digital yet ? It is 2020. You do your taxes online, manage your pension and insurance online, your medical records are online, all banking is online etc. And lets be fair - my savings matter much more than who is president ;)

So why not the elections ? Yes, there would be a barrier for poor people and people who fear computers; but the current system is also filled with barriers to prevent certain demographics to vote. So that would not be a change of principles.


Because electronic voting actually is insecure.


I do wonder, though, if we could ever perfect it in a way that it's both accessible to all (IE for those without real online access) and secure. If we could do that, then I'd say go for it.
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:47 am

Major-Tom wrote:
New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.


We've used mail in ballots forever, don't be daft. Trump votes by mail, Pence votes by mail, most D.C politicians vote by mail...I vote by mail, the list goes on and on. It's proven to be safe.


It's actually safer than going to a polling station.
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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:47 am

No State Here wrote:
Geneviev wrote:Please tell me this isn't real. This can't be real.

What’s not real?

Trump trying to delay the election.
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Major-Tom
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Postby Major-Tom » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:47 am

Lower Nubia wrote:
Major-Tom wrote:
We've used mail in ballots forever, don't be daft. Trump votes by mail, Pence votes by mail, most D.C politicians vote by mail...I vote by mail, the list goes on and on. It's proven to be safe.


It's actually safer than going to a polling station.


Especially now, seeing as, well y'know.
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:47 am

Major-Tom wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
It's actually safer than going to a polling station.


Especially now, seeing as, well y'know.


Ironic isn't it.
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Hurdergaryp
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Postby Hurdergaryp » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:48 am

Geneviev wrote:
New Vedan wrote:The Mail in ballots are a super sketchy idea and should never be used. At the same time tho the election has always been held in November and we should not push it back for nothing. I hate to say it, but we should just force everyone to go to the polls like normal and hope for the best. If it causes a coronavirus spike then so be it.

I think letting people die to vote is a terrible idea. It will stop people from voting, and it will kill people.

Voting by mail has been done before and actually works. Any civilized nation can do it.


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No State Here
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Postby No State Here » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:48 am

Geneviev wrote:
No State Here wrote:What’s not real?

Trump trying to delay the election.

Obviously not, the OP, much like the modern day media, seems to be an expert at spinning the facts to make tabloid-like headlines
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Lower Nubia
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Postby Lower Nubia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:49 am

Hurdergaryp wrote:
Geneviev wrote:I think letting people die to vote is a terrible idea. It will stop people from voting, and it will kill people.

Voting by mail has been done before and actually works. Any civilized nation can do it.


We're talking about the same civilisation that thinks masks are the sign of the beast.
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:49 am

No State Here wrote:
Geneviev wrote:Please tell me this isn't real. This can't be real.

What’s not real?

Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality.
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