NCFM Vice President Murdered

[Stellar Colonies]

Men haven't stopped being chattel.

Ignoring that practically all modern governments are male dominated plus or minus a few token women figureheads, ranting about men "still" being chattel is grounded in the dogwhistle implication that they're forced into that position by female domination.

Society has historically forced both men and women into gender roles.

There has a large push to free women from their gender roles, and it has been succeeding in some areas, although there is no pressure on a similar scale to do the same for men.

[Atheris]

A shame. As someone who activates for men's rights, especially recognition of heightened male suicide rates, workplace dangers for men, and child custody percentages, this death is a blow to me. That being said, I'm with OP; I personally don't think it's related to his politics.

Not really?

Hmm where were you the morning of July 11th 2020?

Celebrating my mom's birthday. Hi, Mom!

Ignoring that practically all modern governments are male dominated plus or minus a few token women figureheads, ranting about men "still" being chattel is grounded in the dogwhistle implication that they're forced into that position by female domination.

Society has historically forced both men and women into gender roles.

There has a large push to free women from their gender roles, and it has been succeeding in some areas, although there is no pressure on a similar scale to do the same for men.

This is one of my personal largest issues on my stance on men's rights. If women are allowed to be free from their societal gender roles, then men should too - but that's getting into threadjack territory.

[Gormwood]

Ignoring that practically all modern governments are male dominated plus or minus a few token women figureheads, ranting about men "still" being chattel is grounded in the dogwhistle implication that they're forced into that position by female domination.

Society has historically forced both men and women into gender roles.

There has a large push to free women from their gender roles, and it has been succeeding in some areas, although there is no pressure on a similar scale to do the same for men.

And the MRAs rant as if that's women's fault.

[Soiled fruit roll ups]

Society has historically forced both men and women into gender roles.

There has a large push to free women from their gender roles, and it has been succeeding in some areas, although there is no pressure on a similar scale to do the same for men.

And the MRAs rant as if that's women's fault.

Women, no longer accepting responsibility for actions they take.

[Stellar Colonies]

Society has historically forced both men and women into gender roles.

There has a large push to free women from their gender roles, and it has been succeeding in some areas, although there is no pressure on a similar scale to do the same for men.

And the MRAs rant as if that's women's fault.

In some ways it is, since feminism has monopolized the discussion on ending gender roles and framed it as only a female problem, although it affects both men and women. In a perfect world, I'd love to see MRAs and feminists working together as a single movement to advance rights in general, although the current...disputes...make that difficult.

---

Although this is straying from the discussion of the murder, so we should probably shift back towards that.

[Romextly]

While I agree women should have equal rights in like everything (You needed a man and a women to start humanity), Sometimes they go to far.

[Trollzyn the Infinite]

And that's why what he did was necessary.

Oh right, we keep forgetting that women were the true rulers of civilization throughout human history and their chattel status was just an elaborate deception.

Inequality is not monopolized by women, Gorm.

Just as women often lack certain privileges and rights that men enjoy in excess, so to is the inverse also true. If you were a proper progressive you'd take the plights of men just as seriously as you would the plights of women.

The steady increase of human rights is not a competition.

[Ostroeuropa]

Odd that there's not much reporting of it frankly.

[Soiled fruit roll ups]

Odd that there's not much reporting of it frankly.

Its not the flavour of identity that people who are easily separated from their money would be convinced to be separated from their money to read about. So its market share is going to be a lot lower.

[Xmara]

Odd that there's not much reporting of it frankly.

I don’t think he was really that well known unless you follow the MRM.

Anyway, I don’t really know much about him, but based on what I read in the op, it sounds like he did some good work advocating for male victims of domestic violence.

[Galloism]

Despite efforts to threadjack and downplay the heroic efforts of a dead man to piss on his grave, Marc Angelucci was a good man doing good things.

He helped a friend of a friend get VA medical benefits for PTSD after he was raped by a female soldier, and the VA declared men do not suffer PTSD from being raped. A couple of (legally threatening) letters and a call to a member of congress, and he was able to get therapy for this soldier's PTSD.

[Xmara]

Despite efforts to threadjack and downplay the heroic efforts of a dead man to piss on his grave, Marc Angelucci was a good man doing good things.

He helped a friend of a friend get VA medical benefits for PTSD after he was raped by a female soldier, and the VA declared men do not suffer PTSD from being raped. A couple of (legally threatening) letters and a call to a member of congress, and he was able to get therapy for this soldier's PTSD.

Seriously VA?

Ugh, the VA needs so many reforms. It’s ridiculous.

[Ostroeuropa]

Odd that there's not much reporting of it frankly.

I don’t think he was really that well known unless you follow the MRM.

Anyway, I don’t really know much about him, but based on what I read in the op, it sounds like he did some good work advocating for male victims of domestic violence.

The question is why that is the case. What is it about the work Marc did that makes our society not want to acknowledge and celebrate it?

[Galloism]

Despite efforts to threadjack and downplay the heroic efforts of a dead man to piss on his grave, Marc Angelucci was a good man doing good things.

He helped a friend of a friend get VA medical benefits for PTSD after he was raped by a female soldier, and the VA declared men do not suffer PTSD from being raped. A couple of (legally threatening) letters and a call to a member of congress, and he was able to get therapy for this soldier's PTSD.

Seriously VA?

Ugh, the VA needs so many reforms. It’s ridiculous.

Yeah. The unnamed people in this thread who want all the men to shut up basically just want men to suffer and die due to their gender, without a care in the world, and then try to piss on the grave of one of the very few men who took concrete legal steps to help them - after he was murdered.

[Uiiop]

Seriously VA?

Ugh, the VA needs so many reforms. It’s ridiculous.

Yeah. The unnamed people in this thread who want all the men to shut up basically just want men to suffer and die due to their gender, without a care in the world, and then try to piss on the grave of one of the very few men who took concrete legal steps to help them - after he was murdered.

Way to exaggerate other viewpoints and biases to the point of disconnecting from reality.
This is exactly the same logic that frames any criticism of BLM as literal nazis. That hyperbolic shit is makes me befudded.
Yeah those posters suck for misunderstanding you and i'm sure that shit hurts but not everyone who misunderstands you is literally the most extreme straw-man for doing so.

[Galloism]

Yeah. The unnamed people in this thread who want all the men to shut up basically just want men to suffer and die due to their gender, without a care in the world, and then try to piss on the grave of one of the very few men who took concrete legal steps to help them - after he was murdered.

Way to exaggerate other viewpoints and biases to the point of disconnecting from reality.
This is exactly the same logic that frames any criticism of BLM as literal nazis. That hyperbolic shit is makes me befudded.
Yeah those posters suck for misunderstanding you and i'm sure that shit hurts but not everyone who misunderstands you is literally the most extreme straw-man for doing so.

Of course not. Plenty of fine people are uninformed or misunderstand and take time to listen. Some come to agree and some don’t

But the ones who I’m talking about know who they are. It’s not a misunderstanding. They’ve seen the data. They know the data. They even accept the data. And argue against doing anything about it because “men in legislature”. They even take time to piss on the grave of a dead man in a drive by. It’s gendered hatred.

[Uiiop]

Way to exaggerate other viewpoints and biases to the point of disconnecting from reality.
This is exactly the same logic that frames any criticism of BLM as literal nazis. That hyperbolic shit is makes me befudded.
Yeah those posters suck for misunderstanding you and i'm sure that shit hurts but not everyone who misunderstands you is literally the most extreme straw-man for doing so.

Of course not. Plenty of fine people are uninformed or misunderstand and take time to listen. Some come to agree and some don’t

But the ones who I’m talking about know who they are. It’s not a misunderstanding. They’ve seen the data. They know the data. They even accept the data. And argue against doing anything about it because “men in legislature”. They even take time to piss on the grave of a dead man in a drive by. It’s gendered hatred.

Where the hell was this? For all of Vass's and Gauth's shit arugments i never read that.

Yes i'm going to be explicit in their name. The post is practically obvious bait for them to shit on you regardless on what you say it is and mean. I honesty don't think the mods would be less lenient either way.

[Ostroeuropa]

Yeah. The unnamed people in this thread who want all the men to shut up basically just want men to suffer and die due to their gender, without a care in the world, and then try to piss on the grave of one of the very few men who took concrete legal steps to help them - after he was murdered.

Way to exaggerate other viewpoints and biases to the point of disconnecting from reality.
This is exactly the same logic that frames any criticism of BLM as literal nazis. That hyperbolic shit is makes me befudded.
Yeah those posters suck for misunderstanding you and i'm sure that shit hurts but not everyone who misunderstands you is literally the most extreme straw-man for doing so.

It's really not a good look to be defending the kind of blatant misandry we've seen here. If you feel called out, maybe examine that about yourself.

It's not hyperbolic to call a spade a spade.

There's a difference between criticism of say, BLM, and someone who openly adheres to a racist ideology and worldview dismissing its concerns outright as ridiculous and not worth consideration.

Calling the latter a Nazi might not always be strictly accurate, but it's close enough. Noting that such a person basically wanted black people to shut up and die would be accurate.

There is no exaggeration or bias in Gallos assessment. Denial of mens issues, experiences, and thus their humanity is a constant theme. That it makes you uncomfortable that you share a movement with those types of people is not our problem, and your need to try and humanize and excuse away their open hatred as them "Misunderstanding" is questionable, almost like you point blank refuse to believe that open hatred of men exists and have made a hobby out of rationalizing it away as explicable, normal, something else behind it.

I'll also note that your need to try and defend this open misandry by acting like it isn't there and saying its a strawman serves the same purpose of derailing the thread away from discussion of Marc, his career, and the broader context on mens issues that his murder will have.

Imagine there were a bunch of neo-nazis spouting anti-Semitic shit in a thread about a Jewish activist, and someone noted it was happening and called it out. Then you come in and start whining about the open white supremacy occurring, saying it's not there, they're just misunderstood and so on.

Have some self-awareness. Turn some of that energy onto calling yourself out instead.

As for Marc, this was a man who spent his entire life battling for men and he knows fully well how feminists don't help with that and often actively oppose it. He was probably the most accomplished mens rights activist in recent decades, and he was firmly of the opinion that feminism was anti-male, and could cite dozens of ways that's the case. The presence of this kind of shit even in a thread dedicated to his work just shows how there's much more to be done.

[Galloism]

Of course not. Plenty of fine people are uninformed or misunderstand and take time to listen. Some come to agree and some don’t

But the ones who I’m talking about know who they are. It’s not a misunderstanding. They’ve seen the data. They know the data. They even accept the data. And argue against doing anything about it because “men in legislature”. They even take time to piss on the grave of a dead man in a drive by. It’s gendered hatred.

Where the hell was this? For all of Vass's and Gauth's shit arugments i never read that.

Yes i'm going to be explicit in their name. The post is practically obvious bait for them to shit on you regardless on what you say it is and mean. I honesty don't think the mods would be less lenient either way.

Theres an easily discernible pattern.

Last post on this. This thread is about Marc and his work, and not those who would seek to denigrate it.

[Cedoria]

And women are still the tyrannical overladies. Sure.

Hmm.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_incredulity

"Arguments from incredulity can sometimes arise from inappropriate emotional involvement, the conflation of fantasy and reality, a lack of understanding, or an instinctive 'gut' reaction"

Hmm.

So, most MRA arguments then?

[Soiled fruit roll ups]

Yall this is about a dead dude. Maybe we shouldn't argue other shit here hey bros.

[Galloism]

As for Marc, this was a man who spent his entire life battling for men and he knows fully well how feminists don't help with that and often actively oppose it. He was probably the most accomplished mens rights activist in recent decades, and he was firmly of the opinion that feminism was anti-male, and could cite dozens of ways that's the case. The presence of this kind of shit even in a thread dedicated to his work just shows how there's much more to be done.

He has a great history. He was actually honored by SPLC once upon a time. He was an honoree on the Wall of Tolerance.

He fought against unconstitutional denial of services for men who were victims of domestic violence. He led the charge against the gendered draft. He was suing over an illegal land grab by the county, leaving a man homeless. And he was investigating and pursuing rampant corruption in CPS before he was murdered.

[Ostroeuropa]

Where the hell was this? For all of Vass's and Gauth's shit arugments i never read that.

Yes i'm going to be explicit in their name. The post is practically obvious bait for them to shit on you regardless on what you say it is and mean. I honesty don't think the mods would be less lenient either way.

Theres an easily discernible pattern.

Last post on this. This thread is about Marc and his work, and not those who would seek to denigrate it.

https://ncfm.org/advisor-board/marc-angelucci/

This is a link to his profile and contains his recent cases.

The receivership business is something I don't understand, but the one before that was a title-9 suit into whether women's-only college programmes violated title 9, somewhat linked to a title-9 case where a feminist professor was calling for the castration and murder of white males. That professor was also banned from Tumblr for violating community guidelines against supporting terrorism. But apparently the university didn't see an issue.
But no, it's not a hate movement. These are a series of isolated incidents.

Anyway, looks like someone else will have to take that case.

We also have some lovely beyond the grave commentary from Marc here that might be relevant to the discussion;

Jasta on May 2, 2019 at 3:31 PM
Why do you hate women so much?

Marc on September 19, 2019 at 1:03 PM
Wow, you are incredibly stupid, Jasta.

Showing that even people who do this for a living and have made incredible and historic strides for civil rights don't have much tolerance for this nonsense.

Prior to that it was his case to get the male-only draft ruled unconstitutional.

[Uiiop]

Way to exaggerate other viewpoints and biases to the point of disconnecting from reality.
This is exactly the same logic that frames any criticism of BLM as literal nazis. That hyperbolic shit is makes me befudded.
Yeah those posters suck for misunderstanding you and i'm sure that shit hurts but not everyone who misunderstands you is literally the most extreme straw-man for doing so.

It's really not a good look to be defending the kind of blatant misandry we've seen here. If you feel called out, maybe examine that about yourself.

It's not hyperbolic to call a spade a spade.

There's a difference between criticism of say, BLM, and someone who openly adheres to a racist ideology and worldview dismissing its concerns outright as ridiculous and not worth consideration.

Calling the latter a Nazi might not always be strictly accurate, but it's close enough. Noting that such a person basically wanted black people to shut up and die would be accurate.

There is no exaggeration or bias in Gallos assessment. Denial of mens issues, experiences, and thus their humanity is a constant theme. That it makes you uncomfortable that you share a movement with those types of people is not our problem, and your need to try and humanize and excuse away their open hatred as them "Misunderstanding" is questionable, almost like you point blank refuse to believe that open hatred of men exists and have made a hobby out of rationalizing it away as explicable, normal, something else behind it.

I'll also note that your need to try and defend this open misandry by acting like it isn't there and saying its a strawman serves the same purpose of derailing the thread away from discussion of Marc, his career, and the broader context on mens issues that his murder will have.

Imagine there were a bunch of neo-nazis spouting anti-Semitic shit in a thread about a Jewish activist, and someone noted it was happening and called it out. Then you come in and start whining about the open white supremacy occurring, saying it's not there, they're just misunderstood and so on.

Have some self-awareness. Turn some of that energy onto calling yourself out instead.

As for Marc, this was a man who spent his entire life battling for men and he knows fully well how feminists don't help with that and often actively oppose it. He was probably the most accomplished mens rights activist in recent decades, and he was firmly of the opinion that feminism was anti-male, and could cite dozens of ways that's the case. The presence of this kind of shit even in a thread dedicated to his work just shows how there's much more to be done.

I'm merely viewing them as having a "White moderate and/or second least bad kind of Republican" ideology rather than a "Neo-Nazi" one.

The former ideologies still suck ass and do cause harm(and they are being disrespectful to this guy.) but involve different tactics than conflating them with the latter and accuse everyone who disagrees with you as a bigot while going "But this offends me! Beleive!".

Straw man of SJW are present in social movement but aren't the one driving success and political power.

Where the hell was this? For all of Vass's and Gauth's shit arugments i never read that.

Yes i'm going to be explicit in their name. The post is practically obvious bait for them to shit on you regardless on what you say it is and mean. I honesty don't think the mods would be less lenient either way.

Theres an easily discernible pattern.

Last post on this. This thread is about Marc and his work, and not those who would seek to denigrate it.

I was there when those posts were made and i respectfully disagree.
I thank you for at least backing down over shit that's practically going to kick the hornets and hope the mods are lenient towards you.
This is my last post on this subject in this thread....if Ostero's want to preach "Feminist fragility"(even if don't actually feel attached to the movement) to me i'll request he'll keep to telegrams if i feel like bothering.

[Ostroeuropa]

Hmm.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_incredulity

"Arguments from incredulity can sometimes arise from inappropriate emotional involvement, the conflation of fantasy and reality, a lack of understanding, or an instinctive 'gut' reaction"

Hmm.

So, most MRA arguments then?

If you can find an example of an argument from incredulity being made by MRAs, by all means, call it out where it's appropriate.

As for Marc, this was a man who spent his entire life battling for men and he knows fully well how feminists don't help with that and often actively oppose it. He was probably the most accomplished mens rights activist in recent decades, and he was firmly of the opinion that feminism was anti-male, and could cite dozens of ways that's the case. The presence of this kind of shit even in a thread dedicated to his work just shows how there's much more to be done.

He has a great history. He was actually honored by SPLC once upon a time. He was an honoree on the Wall of Tolerance.

He fought against unconstitutional denial of services for men who were victims of domestic violence. He led the charge against the gendered draft. He was suing over an illegal land grab by the county, leaving a man homeless. And he was investigating and pursuing rampant corruption in CPS before he was murdered.

Yeah, there's also the title-9 work.