150 public figures sign open letter decrying cancel culture

[Stellar Colonies]

A major problem with 'cancel culture' is that the mob can be riled up by a lie, and trash someone's life for something they didn't even do. Even if they get back whatever was wrongly stripped away from them because of the 'crisis' and are judged innocent, they have that on their record forever.

[Dumb Ideologies]

They are correct that it is a profoundly negative social development. The toothpaste is out of the tube, however. The vindictive pleasure of the behaviour and the self-sanctifying cover of "we are only being cunts to protect other people" means that there is little possibility of forcing it back in. Perhaps through some kind of social credit system where people faced penalties for posts that didn't strictly break the rules, but does the "free world" have appetite for that?

[Asle Leopolka]

They are correct that it is a profoundly negative social development. The toothpaste is out of the tube, however. The vindictive pleasure of the behaviour and the self-sanctifying cover of "we are only being cunts to protect other people" means that there is little possibility of forcing it back in. Perhaps through some kind of social credit system where people faced penalties for posts that didn't strictly break the rules, but does the "free world" have appetite for that?

Karma/"what goes around comes around" may bite them in the ass, but if they don't stray too far from their circles of influence I doubt it'll be equal to the damage they caused others.

[Liriena]

What a dogshit poll question jesus christ.

I'm going for the 4th option: "cancel culture", whatever the fuck you think it means, is not going to "dismantle democracy". What the hell do you think democracy is, OP?

Do I think there are problems with the current way in which online discourse reacts to controversies? Yes. But I think it's pretty telling that many of the most prominent figures who signed this letter are privileged assholes with a fuck ton of media clout who've either been caught maliciously lying to defame an entire community (J.K. Rowling) or op-ed failsons with idiotic politics who couldn't handle criticism (Bari Weiss and David Brooks).

[Liriena]

A major problem with 'cancel culture' is that the mob can be riled up by a lie, and trash someone's life for something they didn't even do. Even if they get back whatever was wrongly stripped away from them because of the 'crisis' and are judged innocent, they have that on their record forever.

But that isn't really something new or specific to cancel culture, though. People being riled up by a lie and hurting innocent people has been a thing since time immemorial, and it has been a thing in modernity as well (see: the satanic panic).

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

>this tweet is unavailable

From what I can see, the dumb ass with a gun is the crazy one. The cops seemed to agree that she was also the crazy one as she was arrested.

She reacted to repeated threats of non-lethal force and the other party preventing them from leaving the altercation with lethal force. That's not allowable in Michigan. You can only react to imminent threat of non-lethal harm with non-lethal force. IE, if someone threatens to "beat your ass" (as the woman in question did at least twice during the video), you can't draw a gun on them. You can punch them if you are in imminent fear of non-lethal force, but you can't pull a gun on them.

And he took the tweet down, but here's a youtube reference:

https://youtu.be/iZhdMcrBuDU

(That tweet had both videos mashed up and time sync'd, which helped - this is just the other video)

From the video description:

Psychology of the Left — Jamie Glazov
Yuri Bezmenov Communist Subversion Lectures

List of recommended for you videos based on that one video (watched in incognito)

Why The Left Can't Handle Donald Trump | Russell Brand
(Mixed Fox News videos)

Hmm, I don't know how I feel about this yt channel that uploaded the video. Seems a little too much into the anti sjw youtube echo chamber rabbit hole for my likeing.

After seeing the video up to the point where she pulls a gun on her yeah I'm going to say both are groups of assholes.

Don't pull out a gun for something like this and don't harass people who just bump into you and call them racist. The mom and her daughter are the two bigger assholes in this situation but the lady isn't entirely innocent either.

[Liriena]

tbf political correctness has gotten too far. in the beginning it was ok now it's morphing into a lowkey version of what the nazis did, just under a red/pink coat of paint.

What exactly do you think the nazis did?

[Kowani]

Ah, yes, 150 rich people whose lives will not be negatively impacted by being canceled in any form whatsoever because they're already insulated from the consequences of their decisions!

[Dumb Ideologies]

What a dogshit poll question jesus christ.

I'm going for the 4th option: "cancel culture", whatever the fuck you think it means, is not going to "dismantle democracy". What the hell do you think democracy is, OP?

Now that it's here perhaps we should democratise it. Let's vote people out of society like a reality TV show but make it official. We could use government petition sites to set who gets on the ballot every week. Twitter or whatever could just be one of the feeders, everyone could get involved. Get corporate sponsors in and have them show that they're good people by doing billboards and TV ad space saying how the enemies of the week violate their company values.

[Liriena]

Ah, yes, 150 rich people whose lives will not be negatively impacted by being canceled in any form whatsoever because they're already insulated from the consequences of their decisions!

There's something darkly hilarious about the online anti-PC crowd celebrating an open letter signed by J.K. Rowling, the most "politically correct" bestselling author today.

[Dresderstan]

EMP the world, we don't need social media or technology anyway, it's become nothing but a burden.

[Grootfries Rijk]

I don't hold a positive opinion of Cancel Culture -and its deviations. In theory I support it -people should be held responsible for their behavior and beliefs, and a certain number of behaviors and beliefs are outright unacceptable as far as I'm concerned. In practice however, since its in large part a mob thing, I don't trust it. People are quick to jump to emotional conclusions and disproportional punishment. The judicial process is already flimsy as it is. Destroying people's lives and livelihoods over evidence that might turn out to be taken out of context or just outright falsified is not good -especially since you can't expect 'everyone who Canceled me' to compensate you if you were wrongly Canceled.

Mind you, I don't give a flying fuck what JKR talks about. Her intentional cognitive resonance for the pure and singular reason of continuing to be a bigot stopped being funny when she was playing the "Dumbledore was gay when he was with Grindenwald then he became asexual" card. Her decades-long transphobia (not to mention other forms of bigotry) is perfect justification to just remove her from the fandom and banish her to the obscurity she well deserves and does nothing but try to claw her way out of. Also, your poll is the exemplar of professionalism and neutrality, OP.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

tbf political correctness has gotten too far. in the beginning it was ok now it's morphing into a lowkey version of what the nazis did, just under a red/pink coat of paint.

What exactly do you think the nazis did?

Apparently the Nazis where sexuality harassed on twitter PM's by top players in the Smash/fighting game community.

[Galloism]

After seeing the video up to the point where she pulls a gun on her yeah I'm going to say both are groups of assholes.

And that's the right answer.

But we should notice the way the narrative was spun - mother and daughter as innocent victims of racism, wife a racist karen pulling guns on people.

That's not what went down. What went down is a number of asshole actions by both parties with clear off ramps that no one (except the husband) tried to take.

Don't pull out a gun for something like this and don't harass people who just bump into you and call them racist. The mom and her daughter are the two bigger assholes in this situation but the lady isn't entirely innocent either.

Indeed. And here's the thing, they were inside of a vehicle with doors that lock. Proper answer would be to lock the doors, call police, and wait for them to clear a path for your departure. Only if they break a window do you start taking more hostile actions.


And, in the realm of cancel culture (thread topic), I think it's interesting that the only one to get fired... was the husband - who repeatedly tried to deescalate (aside form one slip up in the "who do you think you are" category), didn't appear to point his gun at anyone although he did draw it, and ultimately just repeatedly tried to escape the bad situation.

Because the mob didn't wait to get the facts. They just latched onto one little section of video, took it as gospel, and the college was afraid.

[New Bremerton]

Ah, yes, 150 rich people whose lives will not be negatively impacted by being canceled in any form whatsoever because they're already insulated from the consequences of their decisions!

And being rich and famous is a strike against them how exactly?

[Rojava Free State]

Explain to me why I'm supposed to feel bad for a couple clowns who turned a bump into a racial issue and then blocked the car of the woman who was trying to leave and began striking it.

The people who ought to be cancelled are that mom and daughter, but based on their limited vocabulary, profanity and dipshit logic, I assume they don't have a job or much else to lose.

I can't seem to find a sauce on that that backs that up but pulling out a gun for this is still nuts so at the very least this is an everyone is an asshole situation.

Oh I’ve only really heard cancel culture used in reference to inappropriate statements made by someone five years ago that someone else brought up just to have something to be offended over. Idk why I thought that accusations of criminal activity fell under another name.

See thats what the anti cancel culture people say. When it's actual sexual abuse backed up by evidence it's magically not cancel culture but when it is something horrific like the WaPo situation it is cancel culture.

When in realty they both are under the broad banner of cancel culture. You take the good with the bad like everything else.

To me the situation with the mom and the armed white lady is something that happens often here. Unfortunately for the gun woman she was white, because otherwise it wouldn't have even made the news unless she actually pulled the trigger.

[Xmara]

What a dogshit poll question jesus christ.

I'm going for the 4th option: "cancel culture", whatever the fuck you think it means, is not going to "dismantle democracy". What the hell do you think democracy is, OP?

Now that it's here perhaps we should democratise it. Let's vote people out of society like a reality TV show but make it official. We could use government petition sites to set who gets on the ballot every week. Twitter or whatever could just be one of the feeders, everyone could get involved. Get corporate sponsors in and have them show that they're good people by doing billboards and TV ad space saying how the enemies of the week violate their company values.

If you get voted out of society then you die and your execution is broadcast on national television

[Rojava Free State]

Now that it's here perhaps we should democratise it. Let's vote people out of society like a reality TV show but make it official. We could use government petition sites to set who gets on the ballot every week. Twitter or whatever could just be one of the feeders, everyone could get involved. Get corporate sponsors in and have them show that they're good people by doing billboards and TV ad space saying how the enemies of the week violate their company values.

If you get voted out of society then you die and your execution is broadcast on national television

The execution is death by being thrown out of a helicopter into Mount Rainier.

[Liriena]

I don't hold a positive opinion of Cancel Culture -and its deviations. In theory I support it -people should be held responsible for their behavior and beliefs, and a certain number of behaviors and beliefs are outright unacceptable as far as I'm concerned. In practice however, since its in large part a mob thing, I don't trust it. People are quick to jump to emotional conclusions and disproportional punishment. The judicial process is already flimsy as it is. Destroying people's lives and livelihoods over evidence that might turn out to be taken out of context or just outright falsified is not good -especially since you can't expect 'everyone who Canceled me' to compensate you if you were wrongly Canceled.

Mind you, I don't give a flying fuck what JKR talks about. Her intentional cognitive resonance for the pure and singular reason of continuing to be a bigot stopped being funny when she was playing the "Dumbledore was gay when he was with Grindenwald then he became asexual" card. Her decades-long transphobia (not to mention other forms of bigotry) is perfect justification to just remove her from the fandom and banish her to the obscurity she well deserves and does nothing but try to claw her way out of. Also, your poll is the exemplar of professionalism and neutrality, OP.

That's the thing, though: the most prominent signatories in this letter aren't helpless, powerless people. J.K. Rowling specifically has a huge platform, lots of clout and massive wealth. The worst she's faced from "cancel culture" is online harassment, which is a serious issue, but not one created by "cancel culture" nor exclusive to it. These people's livelihoods aren't in peril. Being on the receiving end of "cancel culture" hasn't hurt their economic status nor deprived them of their platforms. J.K. Rowling acts like she's been "cancelled" and that her ability to speak out is in danger, but in practice she has not been silenced at all. She has been more than able to repeatedly express her views however she wants with no consequences other than receiving a ton of well-deserved criticism from people with a lot less power than she has.

This letter wasn't signed by the people who could perhaps be considered actual victims of "cancel culture": innocent private individuals who were publicly shamed and harassed, who truly had no platform, no clout and no wealth to fall back on when facing off against hundreds or thousands of voices turned against them.

[Necroghastia]

>JKR
It's like the "anti-PC" people are trying to discredit themselves lmao

[Grootfries Rijk]

That's the thing, though: the most prominent signatories in this letter aren't helpless, powerless people. J.K. Rowling specifically has a huge platform, lots of clout and massive wealth. The worst she's faced from "cancel culture" is online harassment, which is a serious issue, but not one created by "cancel culture" nor exclusive to it. These people's livelihoods aren't in peril. Being on the receiving end of "cancel culture" hasn't hurt their economic status nor deprived them of their platforms. J.K. Rowling acts like she's been "cancelled" and that her ability to speak out is in danger, but in practice she has not been silenced at all. She has been more than able to repeatedly express her views however she wants with no consequences other than receiving a ton of well-deserved criticism from people with a lot less power than she has.

This letter wasn't signed by the people who could perhaps be considered actual victims of "cancel culture": innocent private individuals who were publicly shamed and harassed, who truly had no platform, no clout and no wealth to fall back on when facing off against hundreds or thousands of voices turned against them.

Don't get me wrong, this letter is just outright hogwash and JKR and her fellows are just riding the coattails of a quasi-serious backlash against the practice that has come into prominence over the issue of historical figures being Cancelled. It's not like she -at least- doesn't have a long history of this anyway. I just meant the principle of the thing.

[Liriena]

Ah, yes, 150 rich people whose lives will not be negatively impacted by being canceled in any form whatsoever because they're already insulated from the consequences of their decisions!

And being rich and famous is a strike against them how exactly?

Kowani made it pretty clear: they're insulated from the consequences of their decisions. For all this talk about the dangers of "cancel culture", none of the most prominent signatories of that open letter have had their lives diminished by it. J.K. Rowling still has millions of followers and many supporters within established institutions, a platform where she's able to freely communicate with them, and the resources to single-handedly make her views materialize in reality, regardless of criticism.

By her own admission, the worst she's actually faced from "cancel culture" is random people online saying emotionally hurtful things to her.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

After seeing the video up to the point where she pulls a gun on her yeah I'm going to say both are groups of assholes.

And that's the right answer.

But we should notice the way the narrative was spun - mother and daughter as innocent victims of racism, wife a racist karen pulling guns on people.

That's not what went down. What went down is a number of asshole actions by both parties with clear off ramps that no one (except the husband) tried to take.

Don't pull out a gun for something like this and don't harass people who just bump into you and call them racist. The mom and her daughter are the two bigger assholes in this situation but the lady isn't entirely innocent either.

Indeed. And here's the thing, they were inside of a vehicle with doors that lock. Proper answer would be to lock the doors, call police, and wait for them to clear a path for your departure. Only if they break a window do you start taking more hostile actions.


And, in the realm of cancel culture (thread topic), I think it's interesting that the only one to get fired... was the husband - who repeatedly tried to deescalate (aside form one slip up in the "who do you think you are" category), didn't appear to point his gun at anyone although he did draw it, and ultimately just repeatedly tried to escape the bad situation.

Because the mob didn't wait to get the facts. They just latched onto one little section of video, took it as gospel, and the college was afraid.

TBF the facts or at least a slice of the facts where there. It's not like the first video I linked is entirely inaccurate to what happened, just the second part in a play where the two partys aside from the husband where acting like dicks.

The husband shouldn't have been fired. The mom in that video should face about the same level of punishment as the gun wielder.

I can't seem to find a sauce on that that backs that up but pulling out a gun for this is still nuts so at the very least this is an everyone is an asshole situation.



See thats what the anti cancel culture people say. When it's actual sexual abuse backed up by evidence it's magically not cancel culture but when it is something horrific like the WaPo situation it is cancel culture.

When in realty they both are under the broad banner of cancel culture. You take the good with the bad like everything else.

To me the situation with the mom and the armed white lady is something that happens often here. Unfortunately for the gun woman she was white, because otherwise it wouldn't have even made the news unless she actually pulled the trigger.

Man that sucks. Hope things get better where you are.

[The Emerald Legion]

I don't hold a positive opinion of Cancel Culture -and its deviations. In theory I support it -people should be held responsible for their behavior and beliefs, and a certain number of behaviors and beliefs are outright unacceptable as far as I'm concerned. In practice however, since its in large part a mob thing, I don't trust it. People are quick to jump to emotional conclusions and disproportional punishment. The judicial process is already flimsy as it is. Destroying people's lives and livelihoods over evidence that might turn out to be taken out of context or just outright falsified is not good -especially since you can't expect 'everyone who Canceled me' to compensate you if you were wrongly Canceled.

Mind you, I don't give a flying fuck what JKR talks about. Her intentional cognitive resonance for the pure and singular reason of continuing to be a bigot stopped being funny when she was playing the "Dumbledore was gay when he was with Grindenwald then he became asexual" card. Her decades-long transphobia (not to mention other forms of bigotry) is perfect justification to just remove her from the fandom and banish her to the obscurity she well deserves and does nothing but try to claw her way out of. Also, your poll is the exemplar of professionalism and neutrality, OP.

That's the thing, though: the most prominent signatories in this letter aren't helpless, powerless people. J.K. Rowling specifically has a huge platform, lots of clout and massive wealth. The worst she's faced from "cancel culture" is online harassment, which is a serious issue, but not one created by "cancel culture" nor exclusive to it. These people's livelihoods aren't in peril. Being on the receiving end of "cancel culture" hasn't hurt their economic status nor deprived them of their platforms. J.K. Rowling acts like she's been "cancelled" and that her ability to speak out is in danger, but in practice she has not been silenced at all. She has been more than able to repeatedly express her views however she wants with no consequences other than receiving a ton of well-deserved criticism from people with a lot less power than she has.

This letter wasn't signed by the people who could perhaps be considered actual victims of "cancel culture": innocent private individuals who were publicly shamed and harassed, who truly had no platform, no clout and no wealth to fall back on when facing off against hundreds or thousands of voices turned against them.

This is kind of a ridiculous complaint. "Cancel culture failed to destroy her, therefore her concerns are invalid."

[Kragholm Free States]

I don't hold a positive opinion of Cancel Culture -and its deviations. In theory I support it -people should be held responsible for their behavior and beliefs, and a certain number of behaviors and beliefs are outright unacceptable as far as I'm concerned. In practice however, since its in large part a mob thing, I don't trust it. People are quick to jump to emotional conclusions and disproportional punishment. The judicial process is already flimsy as it is. Destroying people's lives and livelihoods over evidence that might turn out to be taken out of context or just outright falsified is not good -especially since you can't expect 'everyone who Canceled me' to compensate you if you were wrongly Canceled.

Mind you, I don't give a flying fuck what JKR talks about. Her intentional cognitive resonance for the pure and singular reason of continuing to be a bigot stopped being funny when she was playing the "Dumbledore was gay when he was with Grindenwald then he became asexual" card. Her decades-long transphobia (not to mention other forms of bigotry) is perfect justification to just remove her from the fandom and banish her to the obscurity she well deserves and does nothing but try to claw her way out of. Also, your poll is the exemplar of professionalism and neutrality, OP.

That's the thing, though: the most prominent signatories in this letter aren't helpless, powerless people. J.K. Rowling specifically has a huge platform, lots of clout and massive wealth. The worst she's faced from "cancel culture" is online harassment, which is a serious issue, but not one created by "cancel culture" nor exclusive to it. These people's livelihoods aren't in peril. Being on the receiving end of "cancel culture" hasn't hurt their economic status nor deprived them of their platforms. J.K. Rowling acts like she's been "cancelled" and that her ability to speak out is in danger, but in practice she has not been silenced at all. She has been more than able to repeatedly express her views however she wants with no consequences other than receiving a ton of well-deserved criticism from people with a lot less power than she has.

This letter wasn't signed by the people who could perhaps be considered actual victims of "cancel culture": innocent private individuals who were publicly shamed and harassed, who truly had no platform, no clout and no wealth to fall back on when facing off against hundreds or thousands of voices turned against them.

If this letter was signed by innocent private individuals who were publicly shamed and harassed, who truly had no platform, no clout and no wealth to fall back on when facing off against hundreds or thousands of voices turned against them, it would never even have seen the light of day. To be sure, it's not ideal that the words may ring a little hollow from celebrity signatories whose lives cancel culture can't truly ruin, but it is still to the benefit of society that this letter exists in a well-publicised, accessible format, opens a high-profile discourse on a very real issue, and gives voice to many of the views of the now-voiceless.