US won’t expel foreign students whose universities go online

[Neutraligon]

...This is making things unnecessarily difficult for foreign students. Not only will they be dealing with time differences, but they will also have to deal with the fact of moving back. In addition, some of those foreign students have families (wife and children), making the move even more difficult. Also, hat are they going to do about Islamic citizens, where the woman is only allowed abroad to study if they have a man with them. What happens to the woman if her university is open, but the man's is doing online stuff? Is it sufficient for the university to have 1 in person class that only occurs once?

Of courae it does. That's the point. Whether or not Miller was the mastermind of this, the xenophobia is the point.

You know, if I where the university, I would have a five minute class that had not real purpose that students would take on a pass fail basis. All the student would have to do is show up.

[Pilipinas and Malaya]

But foreign students being sent back to their home countries? Won't that cause problems due to the time zone differences...?

Major problems.

Not only time zone, they have risk of bringing home COVID. And other differences I believe other people on the thread have sufficiently explained.

[Diahon]

Of courae it does. That's the point. Whether or not Miller was the mastermind of this, the xenophobia is the point.

You know, if I where the university, I would have a five minute class that had not real purpose that students would take on a pass fail basis. All the student would have to do is show up.

And that would be sussed out almost immediately. More to the point, people will see it for the scam that that it is, and force the students to haul ass.

No, you fight this tooth and nail, not make workarounds around it when you know Miller is dead set on extirpating all signs of foreignness on America's shores.

[Azania-]

I'm am by no means an expert in US politics, but isn't it usually foreign nationals who are fist targeted/blamed when things go wrong? Could this be political sensationalism meant to distract the general public from Trump's incompetent handling of the COVID-19 pandemic? Like I said, I'm not an expert, and I would appreciate if I were corrected.

[Neutraligon]

I'm am by no means an expert in US politics, but isn't it usually foreign nationals who are fist targeted/blamed when things go wrong? Could this be political sensationalism meant to distract the general public from Trump's incompetent handling of the COVID-19 pandemic? Like I said, I'm not an expert, and I would appreciate if I were corrected.

It might be an attempt but I do not think it is gaining much traction in the news cycle. Most people are focused on Trump right now.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Fucking retarded

[The Order of the Holy Inquisitors]

I'm am by no means an expert in US politics, but isn't it usually foreign nationals who are fist targeted/blamed when things go wrong? Could this be political sensationalism meant to distract the general public from Trump's incompetent handling of the COVID-19 pandemic? Like I said, I'm not an expert, and I would appreciate if I were corrected.

I mean it's certainly a potential, though in this specific instance it appears the goal was to keep things quiet. More likely it's the President trying to take advantage of the chaos surrounding COVID to try and advance his nationalistic agenda quickly without being noticed or stopped. He's done this sort of thing in the past, where policies and decisions are kept until the 11th hour, leaving a host of people without a clear path ahead. Especially considering the fact that this move comes with comparatively little warning (like many other actions of his administration in the past), it's meant to catch people off guard and make an impact before people can get themselves to muster a response. Students who may have already made plans and purchases, prepared residences, are being forced to (in a relatively short amount of time for things like immigration processing) completely relocate and make accommodations for study in places which currently aren't letting people from America come (on account of COVID spikes).

[Greed and Death]

This is stupid.

[Esotyrica]

its stupid but if all their classes are online do they need to stay in the usa

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

Honestly this is dumb. Logically consistent with our immigration policy. But dumb.

Yes our policy of accepting vastly more immigrants and refugees than any other country on earth.

Seriously dont understand how people think the US is xenophobic yet somehow is the most diverse country on earth.

Regardless this dumb. Why kick people out who are bettering their lives?

[Neutraligon]

its stupid but if all their classes are online do they need to stay in the usa

Considering time zones...yes. Considering that some may be married with children, yes.

[Vetalia]

What Benefit? Chinese Professors and Students are some of the most brightest in the World and barring them from American Colleges would be a great loss for International Academia Cooperation amongst Nations and just Research in general. I do not like it when Foreign Nationals steal from us but to punish a whole Country is simply unfair and not right at all morally.

When that country is the one that has repeatedly stolen from us, including some very egregious and very serious cases of military espionage, I don't think it's worth it and even if there is a cost, it will cost them much more than it hurts us. After all, the Soviet Union had some of the brightest scientists, engineers and academics in the world but the United States never, ever considered giving them the kind of access citizens of the PRC currently have.

I am certain we can find plenty of brilliant academics in other countries around the world to fill their places, many of whom come from countries with a much healthier attitude towards democracy and human rights.

[The Emerald Legion]

Honestly this is dumb. Logically consistent with our immigration policy. But dumb.

Yes our policy of accepting vastly more immigrants and refugees than any other country on earth.

Seriously dont understand how people think the US is xenophobic yet somehow is the most diverse country on earth.

Regardless this dumb. Why kick people out who are bettering their lives?

Yes. Control the worlds people, control the world.

[The Black Forrest]

Yes our policy of accepting vastly more immigrants and refugees than any other country on earth.

Seriously dont understand how people think the US is xenophobic yet somehow is the most diverse country on earth.

Regardless this dumb. Why kick people out who are bettering their lives?

Yes. Control the worlds people, control the world.

I thought we had to control the spice.

[Vetalia]

I thought we had to control the spice.

Pretty sure that was the basis for the US-Saudi "alliance".

[Farnhamia]

BURN EVERY BRIDGE
FUCK UP EVERY FOREIGNER
MAKE MILLER SMILE AFTER EACH KILL

*** Warned for troll-bait ***

[The New California Republic]

Totally pointless. It just seems like an excuse more than anything else.

[Soiled fruit roll ups]

I mean if you're going to try and change the way tertiary education is handled. Lowering costs by keeping everyone at home seems like a way id start. Charge less so more people can receive the education. Just have chat rooms staffed by educators and online content.

With how the internet has already effected education in fifty years everyone having a degree could be the new high school diploma.

[Cyng]

Based

[The Emerald Legion]

Yes. Control the worlds people, control the world.

I thought we had to control the spice.

The Spice must flow. But it only flows if you have people to mine it.

[Gravlen]

...This is making things unnecessarily difficult for foreign students. Not only will they be dealing with time differences, but they will also have to deal with the fact of moving back. In addition, some of those foreign students have families (wife and children), making the move even more difficult. Also, hat are they going to do about Islamic citizens, where the woman is only allowed abroad to study if they have a man with them. What happens to the woman if her university is open, but the man's is doing online stuff? Is it sufficient for the university to have 1 in person class that only occurs once?

Seems like it...

"Anything short of 100 percent online" would be acceptable to allow foreign students to stay in the U.S., Cuccinelli added.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/506248-cuccinelli-says-rule-forcing-international-students-to-return-home

Cuccinelli also explained why this is happening:

In an interview with CNN, Cuccinelli said that if schools do not reopen physical campuses, "there isn't a reason" for international students to remain in the U.S.

"This is now setting the rules for one semester, which we'll finalize later this month, that will, again, encourage schools to reopen," the secretary said.

Remember that Trump wants all of the schools to be open in the fall, and this can be a tool to force them to stay open.

“We want to reopen the schools. Everybody wants it. The moms want it. The dads want it. The kids want it. It’s time to do it,” Trump said at a White House event Tuesday at which first lady Melania Trump and Vice President Pence also spoke.

https://thehill.com/homenews/the-memo/506305-the-memo-trump-gambles-on-school-push

[Luziyca]

Honestly this is dumb. Logically consistent with our immigration policy. But dumb.

Yes our policy of accepting vastly more immigrants and refugees than any other country on earth.

Seriously dont understand how people think the US is xenophobic yet somehow is the most diverse country on earth.

Regardless this dumb. Why kick people out who are bettering their lives?

Re. America being the most diverse country on Earth: I am very confident that Papua New Guinea is far more diverse than America, given that more than 800 languages are spoken there, and there is no ethnic majority in the same sense America has.

But yes, I agree with most people here that this measure is pretty dumb, given that this is basically one giant "fuck you" to foreign students wishing to study in the USA. Even if it wasn't, this seems to be some sort of blackmail to try and get the universities to reopen for in-person instruction.

[Trsmk2]

maga！！！

[Nobel Hobos 2]

I'm sure it's been said in this thread, but I said it before:

That's a weird, weird policy. Students taking in-person classes can stay. Students taking partially-in-person classes can stay.

But the ones taking virtual classes, which involve the least covid risk ... they have to go.

I don't think this is aimed at the students at all. I think it's aimed at the universities. It's meant to discourage them from offering all-online course options I think.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

...This is making things unnecessarily difficult for foreign students. Not only will they be dealing with time differences, but they will also have to deal with the fact of moving back. In addition, some of those foreign students have families (wife and children), making the move even more difficult. Also, hat are they going to do about Islamic citizens, where the woman is only allowed abroad to study if they have a man with them. What happens to the woman if her university is open, but the man's is doing online stuff? Is it sufficient for the university to have 1 in person class that only occurs once?

Seems like it...

"Anything short of 100 percent online" would be acceptable to allow foreign students to stay in the U.S., Cuccinelli added.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/506248-cuccinelli-says-rule-forcing-international-students-to-return-home

Cuccinelli also explained why this is happening:

In an interview with CNN, Cuccinelli said that if schools do not reopen physical campuses, "there isn't a reason" for international students to remain in the U.S.

"This is now setting the rules for one semester, which we'll finalize later this month, that will, again, encourage schools to reopen," the secretary said.

Remember that Trump wants all of the schools to be open in the fall, and this can be a tool to force them to stay open.

“We want to reopen the schools. Everybody wants it. The moms want it. The dads want it. The kids want it. It’s time to do it,” Trump said at a White House event Tuesday at which first lady Melania Trump and Vice President Pence also spoke.

https://thehill.com/homenews/the-memo/506305-the-memo-trump-gambles-on-school-push

As I said a month ago when my own government did it, opening schools is a good policy. Particularly junior schools and middle schools. Reason being that the risk of infection or transmission among young children is so low, that social restrictions among adults should be tightened instead. Education is being disrupted, and that's just as important over a lifetime as some adult not being able to go to work for a year.

Opening tertiary institutions is a whole other matter. The young people there may have natural resistance in a lesser degree than children do, that would be a point in favor. But tertiary students can much more easily defer their studies, for a year, and colleges should be required to allow that. Colleges could also be compensated by government for the implied lost revenue.

So to my opinion above, I will add that maybe the idea isn't just to shut down online learning. Though somewhere in Betsy DeVos's little mind might be a scheme to do that, protecting commercial colleges from competition of new "colleges" online with lower staff costs and no campus maintenance costs. Maybe it's to force colleges into "hybrid learning" with mostly online work and only a bit of face-to-face. For their own good! Once most of them are using a blend of methods for most courses, the next step would be to require a minimum of face-to-face. Effectively banning online-only courses.

Why? America First. Completely online courses can be off-shored. Teachers in India or China or Russia, and an increasingly large percentage of AI teaching, could do serious damage to the commercial education industry in the US.