NATION

PASSWORD

So what's plan B if defunding cops creates anarchy?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Mirjt
Diplomat
 
Posts: 621
Founded: Mar 23, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirjt » Wed Jul 08, 2020 9:52 pm

Liberals have long been in favor of police and prison reform, whereas leftists consider police and prison reform to be good but want to go further and are in favor of police and prison abolition. Both the reform movements and abolition movements have been active for decades, but the reform movement is more pallateable to the liberal, neoliberal, and conservative establishment and therefore got more attention. Reformers and abolitionists often both work together on several protests, policies, projects, etc... but their goals are different and sometimes contradictory with one another.

Black Lives Matters has many chapters, some favor reform, others abolition (though abolition seems to be growing right now), but reform and abolition are not only racial issues, social democrats have often been in favor of reform or abolition, socialists (while some are more comfortable with reform) have often favored abolition (especially libertarian socialists, like anarcho-communists), the queer movement historically was in favor of abolition as police and prisons were used to criminalize and police the bodies and lives of the LGBTQIA+ (though the liberal queer movement wants to focus more on marriage to the exclusion of the material aspects of LBQTQIA+ marginalization and oppression), disabled people have long since known the dangers of the prison-industrial-complex and fought against a version of it known as disability institutionalization and mental illness institutionalization, many people have been supporting some aspects of abolition for a while in the form of opposing immigrant detention and ICE as well as the support for easier legal immigration (and citizenship process) or even open borders, etc...

The defund the police movement/tactic was originally abolitionist, who sought to reduce the power of the police and the police state, and redirecting that funding towards social programs to reduce poverty (which will reduce crime), to provide community education (to reduce social attitudes that lead to crime and to help better communities so they don't need to rely on crime), to support diversion programs that keep people out of prisons and in their communities for rehabilitation and the process of restorative and transformative justice, and so on. Reformers realized the potential in that tactic, seeing as their previous reforms did not work and adopted it for themselves as it does not have to necessitate the abolition of the police. As a result you have different versions of the Defund the Police movement, the original version which is most popular among actual leftists including a sizeable portion of the Black Lives Matter movement looks at defunding the police as step one, whereas the versions being pushed by the media are the more tame reformist versions. Vox did an article discussing the various versions of what defunding the police means, but I don't like the article very much because it only covers reformists versions, with one exception and it tried to tone down the policy positions of the abolitionist meaning to sound more ambiguous.
About Me | RL Politics | Likes/Dislikes (WIP) | Mirjt's Stance on NS Stats | Mirjt's Factbooks
I'm back from my break from NationStates (though I may take another at any time)
I'm on an SSRI anti-depressant now.

“Your Honor, years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth. I said then, and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free.” ― Eugene V. Debs

User avatar
Nobel Hobos 2
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14114
Founded: Dec 04, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:12 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
If you're not even going to try, not even one word, then I'll find someone else who will.

Maybe stop being "for" something you're embarrassed to put into your own words?

I have already explained it in my own words multiple times in the main threads. Since that apparently did not clarify it for you, I aided by directing you to a video where a nice British white man takes 15 minutes to explain it, in the hopes that that is more clear.


OK then, I'll just sit back and watch as you defend "Defund the Police" against The Emerald Legion. Maybe I'll learn something.
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
High rate of Nobel prizes and other academic achievements.

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60885
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:It's a decentralized hate mob,

It's literally the opposite of a hate mob.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Mirjt
Diplomat
 
Posts: 621
Founded: Mar 23, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirjt » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:10 am

Liriena wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:It's a decentralized hate mob,

It's literally the opposite of a hate mob.


Exactly
About Me | RL Politics | Likes/Dislikes (WIP) | Mirjt's Stance on NS Stats | Mirjt's Factbooks
I'm back from my break from NationStates (though I may take another at any time)
I'm on an SSRI anti-depressant now.

“Your Honor, years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth. I said then, and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free.” ― Eugene V. Debs

User avatar
Slavakino
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1457
Founded: Sep 25, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Slavakino » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:11 am

Stylan wrote:
Slavakino wrote:PMC's overrun or Martial Law. Defunding cops is stupid, its only a wet dream for stupid AnCaps or AnComs who don't realise anarchism will ruin their lives

Not related, but your views are the most fucking obnoxious, Internet-era contradictory beliefs ever.


Anyway, yeah anarchism sucks.

Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals
Military Titoist Republic of Slavakino
A great nation built on socialism, science & unity. Come visit us for a holiday
Australian-Serb attempting to finish in Chemical Engineering. Fanatic about weapons, science and history from 1720-2000.
Pro: Titosim, Firearms, WMD, Science, Industrialisation, Militarism, Nuclear, Federalism, Authoritarianism, Assad, Hololive Vtubers

Neutral: Unitary State, Religion, Conservativism, Abortion Laws, Renewable Energy, Democracy, Trump, Juche

Anti: LGBT, Green Politics, Fascism, Anarchism, Primitivism, Islam, ANTIFA, Totalitarianism, Libertarianism, Biden
Sakura Miko (Elite)
Inugami Korone (Yubi! Yubi!)
Kiryu Coco (Shitposting dragon)
Akai Haato (HAACHAMA)

User avatar
Nobel Hobos 2
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14114
Founded: Dec 04, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:19 am

Liriena wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:It's a decentralized hate mob,

It's literally the opposite of a hate mob.


A love mob?
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
High rate of Nobel prizes and other academic achievements.

User avatar
Nobel Hobos 2
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14114
Founded: Dec 04, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:21 am

Slavakino wrote:
Stylan wrote:Not related, but your views are the most fucking obnoxious, Internet-era contradictory beliefs ever.


Anyway, yeah anarchism sucks.

Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals


You realize only the last sentence is them agreeing with you?
I report offenses if and only if they are crimes.
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
High rate of Nobel prizes and other academic achievements.

User avatar
Slavakino
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1457
Founded: Sep 25, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Slavakino » Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:29 am

Liriena wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:It's a decentralized hate mob,

It's literally the opposite of a hate mob.

It's a decentralized race riot at this damn point
Last edited by Slavakino on Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
Military Titoist Republic of Slavakino
A great nation built on socialism, science & unity. Come visit us for a holiday
Australian-Serb attempting to finish in Chemical Engineering. Fanatic about weapons, science and history from 1720-2000.
Pro: Titosim, Firearms, WMD, Science, Industrialisation, Militarism, Nuclear, Federalism, Authoritarianism, Assad, Hololive Vtubers

Neutral: Unitary State, Religion, Conservativism, Abortion Laws, Renewable Energy, Democracy, Trump, Juche

Anti: LGBT, Green Politics, Fascism, Anarchism, Primitivism, Islam, ANTIFA, Totalitarianism, Libertarianism, Biden
Sakura Miko (Elite)
Inugami Korone (Yubi! Yubi!)
Kiryu Coco (Shitposting dragon)
Akai Haato (HAACHAMA)

User avatar
ImperialRussia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1037
Founded: May 16, 2019
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby ImperialRussia » Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:32 am

Private police from other companies don't seem any better it seems worse than the original police because this private police can just integrate you and your right won't matter to them since there run by companies of the wealthy elite this is you're a criminal caught by private police
Last edited by ImperialRussia on Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Anurial
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 44
Founded: Feb 17, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Anurial » Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:42 am

LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:So we're hearing a lot of talk about defunding police and putting that money into social services instead. The idea, presumably, is that if these "social services" could somehow address every other possible motive for committing crime in the first place, we wouldn't need as much policing.

Here's the problem with that proposal... since when was anyone any good at predicting anyone else's motives for what they do?

No, really. I recall 2016, when the notion that respondents who claimed they'd vote Clinton if she were the candidate were lying through their teeth were met with "why would they lie"? Doesn't matter. They did. People do what they do for reasons neither you nor I nor the so-called "experts" who got it wrong could ever hope to comperehend. The delusion that if you do not anticipate their motives, such motives cannot exist, feels like a false dichotomy fit to rival "God of the gaps."

So now proposals to defund the police invoke the delusion that they have every possible motive for crime figured out; and they want us to, based on this tenuous reasoning, weaken the one institution known to hold crime back.

My question to them is; what if you're wrong? What is your plan B, if people have reasons for committing crimes that you fail to anticipate, predict, or comprehend, and these reasons are all unleashed? Is a return to policing as it was before possible, or would the change, or at least some of the effects thereof, be permanent? Is there a third option you could jump to from there, that might be relatively safer? If so, what is it?

My alternative? If we think we know why crime happens, then rather than defunding the police, why not address those supposed motives first, and then weaken police presence very slowly and gradually so if it works out badly we can reverse the trend before it's too late?


That's not what defunding the police means. It means social services respond to situations that police aren't even trained to in the first place. Why send a cop to deal with a drunk homeless man for instance. Also, criminology and sociology are the fields of study that aim to seek out the causes of crime. Lastly, defunding the police on a local scale does seem to have been rather effective so far, like in this town of 170,000.

This appears to just be a misunderstanding of what defunding the police actually means. Most policy proposals are trialled at lower levels of governance beforehand too. This is why Finland funded a study for UBI instead of just implementing it, and why the UK Labour party promised to begin trials for a UBI program in 2019 if they were elected, rather than just implementing it. This is also why people are looking at these already tried and tested changes in the institution of police in towns.

As always with these kinds of threads, I haven't read what comes before my post because it's usually very painful to do so. Therefore, if I've missed some sort of context given or misunderstanding cleared up, I apologise.
"When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called "the People's Stick".
Free Land of Anurial
Overview (W.I.P) - Government and Departments - Political Parties - Legislative Elections - Legislative Assembly
21st October
✉ Anarquía Mirror: 7 remaining Liberal MLAs form the Independent Group | International Mirror: Right-wing militias join Karsian military in fight against communist militias | Politipoll Weekly: PSF 42.3%, PDS 36.3%, SU 4.3%, AF 0.1%, CU 3.1%, PP 5.1%, Co 3.6%, IL 1.1%, CG 4.1%

User avatar
Dumb Ideologies
Post Czar
 
Posts: 45993
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:14 am

Plans for police reform vary a lot and hopefully when it comes to local decisions about what to do some of the crazier edges will get knocked off by the reality of bureaucracy and having to listen to at-length technical matters which tend to bore big-picture radicals away. You're not going to see the police abolished or funding brought back to the real bare bones. You're probably going to get more community-led oversight committees to look into controversial incidents, but in many ways getting people oversight of boring stuff like equipment contracts and how budgets are spent would be more important.
Are these "human rights" in the room with us right now?
★彡 Professional pessimist. Reactionary socialist and gamer liberationist. Coffee addict. Fun at parties 彡★
Freedom is when people agree with you, and the more people you can force to act like they agree the freer society is
You are the trolley problem's conductor. You could stop the train in time but you do not. Nobody knows you're part of the equation. You satisfy your bloodlust and get away with it every time

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:15 am

Liriena wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:It's a decentralized hate mob,

It's literally the opposite of a hate mob.


No it's not. Having a different color of skin doesn't change who you are.
Last edited by The Emerald Legion on Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
Thepeopl
Minister
 
Posts: 2646
Founded: Feb 24, 2019
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Thepeopl » Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:54 am

Anurial wrote:
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:So we're hearing a lot of talk about defunding police and putting that money into social services instead. The idea, presumably, is that if these "social services" could somehow address every other possible motive for committing crime in the first place, we wouldn't need as much policing.

Here's the problem with that proposal... since when was anyone any good at predicting anyone else's motives for what they do?

No, really. I recall 2016, when the notion that respondents who claimed they'd vote Clinton if she were the candidate were lying through their teeth were met with "why would they lie"? Doesn't matter. They did. People do what they do for reasons neither you nor I nor the so-called "experts" who got it wrong could ever hope to comperehend. The delusion that if you do not anticipate their motives, such motives cannot exist, feels like a false dichotomy fit to rival "God of the gaps."

So now proposals to defund the police invoke the delusion that they have every possible motive for crime figured out; and they want us to, based on this tenuous reasoning, weaken the one institution known to hold crime back.

My question to them is; what if you're wrong? What is your plan B, if people have reasons for committing crimes that you fail to anticipate, predict, or comprehend, and these reasons are all unleashed? Is a return to policing as it was before possible, or would the change, or at least some of the effects thereof, be permanent? Is there a third option you could jump to from there, that might be relatively safer? If so, what is it?

My alternative? If we think we know why crime happens, then rather than defunding the police, why not address those supposed motives first, and then weaken police presence very slowly and gradually so if it works out badly we can reverse the trend before it's too late?


That's not what defunding the police means. It means social services respond to situations that police aren't even trained to in the first place. Why send a cop to deal with a drunk homeless man for instance. Also, criminology and sociology are the fields of study that aim to seek out the causes of crime. Lastly, defunding the police on a local scale does seem to have been rather effective so far, like in this town of 170,000.

This appears to just be a misunderstanding of what defunding the police actually means. Most policy proposals are trialled at lower levels of governance beforehand too. This is why Finland funded a study for UBI instead of just implementing it, and why the UK Labour party promised to begin trials for a UBI program in 2019 if they were elected, rather than just implementing it. This is also why people are looking at these already tried and tested changes in the institution of police in towns.

As always with these kinds of threads, I haven't read what comes before my post because it's usually very painful to do so. Therefore, if I've missed some sort of context given or misunderstanding cleared up, I apologise.

^^

More compassion, less jail time.
Last edited by Thepeopl on Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Slavakino
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1457
Founded: Sep 25, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Slavakino » Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:16 pm

Thepeopl wrote:
Anurial wrote:
That's not what defunding the police means. It means social services respond to situations that police aren't even trained to in the first place. Why send a cop to deal with a drunk homeless man for instance. Also, criminology and sociology are the fields of study that aim to seek out the causes of crime. Lastly, defunding the police on a local scale does seem to have been rather effective so far, like in this town of 170,000.

This appears to just be a misunderstanding of what defunding the police actually means. Most policy proposals are trialled at lower levels of governance beforehand too. This is why Finland funded a study for UBI instead of just implementing it, and why the UK Labour party promised to begin trials for a UBI program in 2019 if they were elected, rather than just implementing it. This is also why people are looking at these already tried and tested changes in the institution of police in towns.

As always with these kinds of threads, I haven't read what comes before my post because it's usually very painful to do so. Therefore, if I've missed some sort of context given or misunderstanding cleared up, I apologise.

^^

More compassion, less jail time.

No. Reform and Labour for prison. They are to have a working life in prison while being reformed. Also, the police should always refer to a baton and martial arts in case of someone disobeying orders instead of always drawing out their gun, they should only draw out their gun in a situation where the suspect has a lethal weapon with them.
Military Titoist Republic of Slavakino
A great nation built on socialism, science & unity. Come visit us for a holiday
Australian-Serb attempting to finish in Chemical Engineering. Fanatic about weapons, science and history from 1720-2000.
Pro: Titosim, Firearms, WMD, Science, Industrialisation, Militarism, Nuclear, Federalism, Authoritarianism, Assad, Hololive Vtubers

Neutral: Unitary State, Religion, Conservativism, Abortion Laws, Renewable Energy, Democracy, Trump, Juche

Anti: LGBT, Green Politics, Fascism, Anarchism, Primitivism, Islam, ANTIFA, Totalitarianism, Libertarianism, Biden
Sakura Miko (Elite)
Inugami Korone (Yubi! Yubi!)
Kiryu Coco (Shitposting dragon)
Akai Haato (HAACHAMA)

User avatar
West Leas Oros 2
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6004
Founded: Jul 15, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby West Leas Oros 2 » Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:06 pm

Slavakino wrote:
Stylan wrote:Not related, but your views are the most fucking obnoxious, Internet-era contradictory beliefs ever.


Anyway, yeah anarchism sucks.

Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals

Considering Stylan considers themself a “tankie” (apparently), it’s safe to assume they don’t hold “libertarian” beliefs either.
Last edited by West Leas Oros 2 on Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
WLO Public News: Outdated Factbooks and other documents in process of major redesign! ESTIMATED COMPLETION DATE: <error:not found>
How many South Americans need to be killed by the CIA before you realize socialism is bad?
I like to think I've come a long way since the days of the First WLO.
Conscientious Objector in the “Culture War”

NationStates Leftist Alternative only needs a couple more nations before it can hold its constitutional convention!

User avatar
Bassoe
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 182
Founded: Apr 12, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Bassoe » Fri Jul 10, 2020 7:55 pm

Step #1. Disband the police.

Step #2. Inevitable colossal rise in crime.

Step #3. Introduce the CAREN act, under which crime is less likely to be officially reported due to the risk of ruinous fines and being targeted by the Two Minute Hate Cancel Culture if the reporter and the judge in the inevitable lawsuit isn't absolutely sure it was justified.

Step #4. Less officially reported crime, less crime charges.

Step #5. "What crime! You've got no evidence!"

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19428
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Rojava Free State » Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:09 pm

Roof Koreans. They get the job done.

/thread
Last edited by Rojava Free State on Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Rojava Free State wrote:Listen yall. I'm only gonna say it once but I want you to remember it. This ain't a world fit for good men. It seems like you gotta be monstrous just to make it. Gotta have a little bit of darkness within you just to survive. You gotta stoop low everyday it seems like. Stoop all the way down to the devil in these times. And then one day you look in the mirror and you realize that you ain't you anymore. You're just another monster, and thanks to your actions, someone else will eventually become as warped and twisted as you. Never forget that the best of us are just the best of a bad lot. Being at the top of a pile of feces doesn't make you anything but shit like the rest. Never forget that.

User avatar
Stylan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1475
Founded: Sep 01, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Stylan » Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:09 pm

Bassoe wrote:Step #1. Disband the police.

Step #2. Inevitable colossal rise in crime.

Step #3. Introduce the CAREN act, under which crime is less likely to be officially reported due to the risk of ruinous fines and being targeted by the Two Minute Hate Cancel Culture if the reporter and the judge in the inevitable lawsuit isn't absolutely sure it was justified.

Step #4. Less officially reported crime, less crime charges.

Step #5. "What crime! You've got no evidence!"

Disbanding the police has reduced crime in every single city it has been tried in, plus few say we should abolish the police, and almost none advocate for no dispensers of authority.
[align=center]Christian.

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19428
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Rojava Free State » Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:11 pm

West Leas Oros 2 wrote:
Slavakino wrote:Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals

Considering Stylan considers themself a “tankie” (apparently), it’s safe to assume they don’t hold “libertarian” beliefs either.


Damn isn't Slavkino an authoritarian leftist too? I think he's Balkan so maybe?
Rojava Free State wrote:Listen yall. I'm only gonna say it once but I want you to remember it. This ain't a world fit for good men. It seems like you gotta be monstrous just to make it. Gotta have a little bit of darkness within you just to survive. You gotta stoop low everyday it seems like. Stoop all the way down to the devil in these times. And then one day you look in the mirror and you realize that you ain't you anymore. You're just another monster, and thanks to your actions, someone else will eventually become as warped and twisted as you. Never forget that the best of us are just the best of a bad lot. Being at the top of a pile of feces doesn't make you anything but shit like the rest. Never forget that.

User avatar
Stylan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1475
Founded: Sep 01, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Stylan » Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:12 pm

Slavakino wrote:
Stylan wrote:Not related, but your views are the most fucking obnoxious, Internet-era contradictory beliefs ever.


Anyway, yeah anarchism sucks.

Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals

>me
>a libertarian
lmfao dude

I just think it's funny you call yourself a commie when in reality you're basically just a strasserist, or even worse a social democrat who hates gays and blacks.
[align=center]Christian.

User avatar
Big Jim P
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 55158
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Big Jim P » Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:40 pm

Ifreann wrote:What's plan B if funding the police doesn't stop crime?


Big Jim P wrote:Plan B? A helluva lot more people adopting plan A. Buying and using guns in self and property defense. It's already started in fact.
Hail Satan!
Happily married to Roan Cara, The first RL NS marriage, and Pope Joan is my Father-in-law.
I edit my posts to fix typos.

User avatar
Slavakino
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1457
Founded: Sep 25, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Slavakino » Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:39 pm

Stylan wrote:
Slavakino wrote:Sorry, I'm an authoritarian. I don't agree with stupid libertarian ideals

>me
>a libertarian
lmfao dude

I just think it's funny you call yourself a commie when in reality you're basically just a strasserist, or even worse a social democrat who hates gays and blacks.

I consider myself a Titoist (or Marxist-Leninist if you wanna go that route) with socially conservative views. I'm not a modern commie, I want my Yugo back. I dislike Stalinists, progressive lefties and these "fake commies" heavily
Last edited by Slavakino on Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Military Titoist Republic of Slavakino
A great nation built on socialism, science & unity. Come visit us for a holiday
Australian-Serb attempting to finish in Chemical Engineering. Fanatic about weapons, science and history from 1720-2000.
Pro: Titosim, Firearms, WMD, Science, Industrialisation, Militarism, Nuclear, Federalism, Authoritarianism, Assad, Hololive Vtubers

Neutral: Unitary State, Religion, Conservativism, Abortion Laws, Renewable Energy, Democracy, Trump, Juche

Anti: LGBT, Green Politics, Fascism, Anarchism, Primitivism, Islam, ANTIFA, Totalitarianism, Libertarianism, Biden
Sakura Miko (Elite)
Inugami Korone (Yubi! Yubi!)
Kiryu Coco (Shitposting dragon)
Akai Haato (HAACHAMA)

User avatar
Purpelia
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34249
Founded: Oct 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Purpelia » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:32 am

Slavakino wrote:
Stylan wrote:>me
>a libertarian
lmfao dude

I just think it's funny you call yourself a commie when in reality you're basically just a strasserist, or even worse a social democrat who hates gays and blacks.

I consider myself a Titoist (or Marxist-Leninist if you wanna go that route) with socially conservative views. I'm not a modern commie, I want my Yugo back. I dislike Stalinists, progressive lefties and these "fake commies" heavily

If by fake communists you mean the identiarian left that has usurped our side of the spectrum from the truth which is materialistic AKA class and wealth socialism than I feel your pain. Sadly we are a dying breed as we actually represent a threat to the establishment. Or to put it another way, the rich fund the identitarians and progressives because they will happily see all statues in the world torn down before they give up a cent of their wealth to the poor.
Purpelia does not reflect my actual world views. In fact, the vast majority of Purpelian cannon is meant to shock and thus deliberately insane. I just like playing with the idea of a country of madmen utterly convinced that everyone else are the barbarians. So play along or not but don't ever think it's for real.



The above post contains hyperbole, metaphoric language, embellishment and exaggeration. It may also include badly translated figures of speech and misused idioms. Analyze accordingly.

User avatar
Baltenstein
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11008
Founded: Jan 25, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Baltenstein » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:35 am

Slavakino wrote:
Stylan wrote:>me
>a libertarian
lmfao dude

I just think it's funny you call yourself a commie when in reality you're basically just a strasserist, or even worse a social democrat who hates gays and blacks.

I consider myself a Titoist (or Marxist-Leninist if you wanna go that route) with socially conservative views. I'm not a modern commie, I want my Yugo back. I dislike Stalinists, progressive lefties and these "fake commies" heavily


Titoism died when Tito died. It was an artificial construct whose continuing existence depended largely on the personal charisma and force of will of a single person.
O'er the hills and o'er the main.
Through Flanders, Portugal and Spain.
King George commands and we obey.
Over the hills and far away.


THE NORTH REMEMBERS

User avatar
Purpelia
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34249
Founded: Oct 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Purpelia » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:42 am

Baltenstein wrote:
Slavakino wrote:I consider myself a Titoist (or Marxist-Leninist if you wanna go that route) with socially conservative views. I'm not a modern commie, I want my Yugo back. I dislike Stalinists, progressive lefties and these "fake commies" heavily


Titoism died when Tito died. It was an artificial construct whose continuing existence depended largely on the personal charisma and force of will of a single person.

Historical evidence does not really corroborate that though. Tito died in 1980 and yet his country survived for another decade. Rather, it appears to me that the existence of Yugoslavia was largely predicated on its position as the de facto leader of the third world block which was the nonaligned movement a power block that made sense in the cold war days but basically lost all meaning in a world without two superpowers staring each other down nukes drawn. That is to say, they were politically neutral and head of a powerful block which made both sides of the cold war want to keep them that way as opposed to having them side with the other. Better a non-ally than an enemy as it were. Thus for as long as they did not openly align with either superpower both had an interest in not trying to destabilize the country and cause it to collapse. Which is exactly what the west did as soon as the Soviets were out of the picture.

I mean, let's be real for a moment. What happened down there was not just some random revolution. It was a civil war. And one where the largest nonaligned army in the world with modern equipment and excellent training lost. And when you combine that with how the whole thing was treated by the west at the time there is no way in hell that it was not a foreign sponsored war like those we see in the middle east.
Last edited by Purpelia on Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
Purpelia does not reflect my actual world views. In fact, the vast majority of Purpelian cannon is meant to shock and thus deliberately insane. I just like playing with the idea of a country of madmen utterly convinced that everyone else are the barbarians. So play along or not but don't ever think it's for real.



The above post contains hyperbole, metaphoric language, embellishment and exaggeration. It may also include badly translated figures of speech and misused idioms. Analyze accordingly.

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Gun Manufacturers, Ifreann, ML Library, Qahrania, Soviet Haaregrad, Statesburg, Uiiop, Uvolla

Advertisement

Remove ads