NATION

PASSWORD

Reddit Starts One-Sided Censorship

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Galloism
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 66135
Founded: Aug 20, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Galloism » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:58 am

Purgatio wrote:
Galloism wrote:Sure, ok.

But that's rather beside the point - there was also the hatred that went with it.


Hatred of who? Believing in the concept of biological sex, distinct from gender identity, isn't synonymous with hating trans people.

I understand, but they also openly hated trans women (and men, incidentally, which is why they hated trans women).
Last edited by Galloism on Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


User avatar
Crockerland
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5359
Founded: Oct 15, 2015
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Crockerland » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:58 am

Wallenburg wrote:Ah yes, shutting down harassment and hate groups is so awful. In fact, it's just as bad as Nazi Germany.

I think the problem is that they're picking and choosing to only ban certain harassment and hate groups and have a double standard for the ones that are sufficiently "woke" and politically correct.

For example:
  • Genocide denier subreddits, such as r/Turkey where users routinely deny the Armenian Genocide, or r/Communism which denies Holodomor
  • Anti-white racist subreddits such as r/FragileWhiteRedditor, r/BlackPeopleTwitter, or r/Racism
  • Anti-miscegenation subs such as r/WMAF, r/Hapas, or r/HandsOffHapas
  • Islamic subreddits such as r/Islam, which are free to promote hatred against Jews, LGBT people, etc. in accordance with Islamic teachings
National Liberalism, Nuclear & Geothermal Power, GMOs, Vaccines, Self-defense, Biodiesel, LGBTI equality, Universal healthcare, Constitutional Carry, Emotional Support Twinks, Right to life


User avatar
Gravlen
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13102
Founded: Jul 01, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Gravlen » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:59 am

Purgatio wrote:
Gravlen wrote:That's up to Reddit to decide. It's their ToS.


And they've applied their ToS in an arbitrary and capricious way, and we're entitled to scrutinise it and criticise it if it doesn't make sense. And in respect of r/GenderCritical, it quite clearly doesn't make sense.

Criticise and cry as much as you want to. It's not going to make a difference however, and it's not going to change the power dynamic.
EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:59 am

Dawn Denac wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Hatred of who? Believing in the concept of biological sex, distinct from gender identity, isn't synonymous with hating trans people.


Cough.

For trans people, the line between the two can tend to blur fairly heavily. Plus multiple sources I've looked at said the sub was viciously transphobic.


They really weren't, I've trawled through the sub many times before it was banned, all the posts were about defending the integrity of sex-segregated spaces, women's athletics, preventing trans activists from erasing female vocabulary when it comes to the female body and policy issues related thereto, that kind of thing. And I understand that trans people might disagree with r/GenderCritical on these issues, and have a differing opinion. Fair enough, there will be differing opinions in a diverse and democratic society. Engage with them, debate with them, don't just try and shut them down in this petty and authoritarian silencing of dissent to your gender ideology.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:00 am

Gravlen wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
And they've applied their ToS in an arbitrary and capricious way, and we're entitled to scrutinise it and criticise it if it doesn't make sense. And in respect of r/GenderCritical, it quite clearly doesn't make sense.

Criticise and cry as much as you want to. It's not going to make a difference however, and it's not going to change the power dynamic.


That's a pretty nihilistic attitude to take. Don't point out an injustice if the injustice is committed by someone powerful. Wow, unbelievable.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
Atlexil
Secretary
 
Posts: 26
Founded: Nov 08, 2016
Democratic Socialists

Postby Atlexil » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:01 am

Purgatio wrote:
Necroghastia wrote:You have got to be fucking kidding me.


Trying to get your intellectual opponents banned off an online platform for having a different definition of feminism is the epitome of intellectual intolerance, parochialism, and close-mindedness. The feminist activists on r/GenderCritical weren't hurting anyone, they just held views that the radical trans activists don't like and disagree with. The Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to their every ideological belief.

Okay, Purgatio. I'm gonna just say this as a cis guy who hangs out in a few LGBT spaces along with knowing some transpeople. But you aware that TERFs consider transwomen to be "dirty orcs" and that transmen are "women brainwashed by the patriarchy", yeah? Seriously, TERFs consider transpeople to be their ideological enemy for some weridass bullshit reason and don't think they're actual people. And on the subject of Rowling and Lineham. Rowling is a shit author because of her stupid as fuck Word of God statements and basically virtue signaling for progressive points. While Lineham was somebody who was obsessed about hating transpeople to the point their family had to do an intervention before cutting ties with them.
Last edited by Atlexil on Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Northern Davincia
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16664
Founded: Jun 10, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Northern Davincia » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:03 am

4chan is better anyway.
Hoppean Libertarian, Acolyte of von Mises, Protector of Our Sacred Liberties
Economic Left/Right: 9.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.05
Conserative Morality wrote:"Two gin-scented tears trickled down the sides of his nose. But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Hoppe."

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:04 am

Galloism wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Hatred of who? Believing in the concept of biological sex, distinct from gender identity, isn't synonymous with hating trans people.

I understand, but they also openly hated trans women (and men, incidentally, which is why they hated trans women).


They really didn't hate trans women, they just didn't think they should be regarded as women, because they were gender-abolitionists who believed women were oppressed on the basic of biological sex, not gender presentation or identity. That's all. No hatred involved there. Just a rational difference of opinion on a controversial social issue.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
HIreland
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 183
Founded: Jan 22, 2019
Corporate Bordello

Postby HIreland » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:04 am

This is an older issue but it might be relevant to the topic at hand. The subreddit r/againsthatesubs was actively running fake accounts to post rule-breaking content on subs they were trying to get banned and then reporting that content with other accounts.
Testimony of a former member
"Joe Steele had but one liver to give for his country, and manfully kept up." — Joe Steele by Harry Turtledove
The brewery of the cell: Government funds project to gene-splice human and yeast mitochondria | Bright stage lights and high blood alcohol count revealed to be responsible for bartender general's spontaneous combustion | Ship runs ashore after crew suffocates in methane cloud produced by HIreland's sewage swamps | Drunken-most's teleprompter hacked, reads speech denouncing own lack of personal hygiene

User avatar
Gravlen
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13102
Founded: Jul 01, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Gravlen » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:06 am

United Dependencies wrote:
Gravlen wrote:Ah, I think I understand.

That's more complicated. It's using mods police as a weapon, but in a quite literal sense. IRL, that can have fatal consequences, and when you call an armed response on someone who're plainly not doing anything wrong it can be problematic. It shouldn't be criminal, however, and the fault of police shooting innocent people ultimately lies with the police - kinda like how Reddit's choice to remove subreddits is something they're ultimately responsible for.

Wouldn't this border on filing a false report? I guess if they don't submit an actual statement in writing it isn't. Do some jurisdictions have laws governing calling the emergency services lines?

It all depends on what they are reporting. Saying "I've seen something suspicious, and I don't know if it's a crime, but..." is on one side, while, say, calling the police on someone and accusing them of trying to break into a church and threatening the caller with a gun when they were unarmed and painting the building (they owned), is over the line and should be prosecuted.
Last edited by Gravlen on Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

User avatar
Dawn Denac
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 59
Founded: Jun 22, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dawn Denac » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:07 am

Purgatio wrote:
Galloism wrote:I understand, but they also openly hated trans women (and men, incidentally, which is why they hated trans women).


They really didn't hate trans women, they just didn't think they should be regarded as women, because they were gender-abolitionists who believed women were oppressed on the basic of biological sex, not gender presentation or identity. That's all. No hatred involved there. Just a rational difference of opinion on a controversial social issue.


Yeah no, hold up. What?

So in the name of equality because women are oppressed on the basic of biological sex, trans women don't have the right to be regarded as women?

:hyperthink:
Hi there, this is my new main. You may know me as:

World Assembly Nation 665

The Ebony Republic

Black Hawk Corporal

User avatar
Bear Stearns
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9111
Founded: Dec 02, 2018
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Bear Stearns » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:08 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:You can nationalize tech companies and then break them up. Or you can give them the ma bell treatment


I don't know how the law has changed, or if it's something about tech companies in particular, but IBM and Microsoft defended themselves just fine.


Because lawmakers are usually retards when it comes to understanding technology
The Bear Stearns Companies, Inc. is a New York-based global investment bank, securities trading and brokerage firm. Its main business areas are capital markets, investment banking, wealth management and global clearing services. Bear Stearns was founded as an equity trading house on May Day 1923 by Joseph Ainslie Bear, Robert B. Stearns and Harold C. Mayer with $500,000 in capital.
383 Madison Ave,
New York, NY 10017
Vince Vaughn

User avatar
Gravlen
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13102
Founded: Jul 01, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Gravlen » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:08 am

Purgatio wrote:
Gravlen wrote:Criticise and cry as much as you want to. It's not going to make a difference however, and it's not going to change the power dynamic.


That's a pretty nihilistic attitude to take. Don't point out an injustice if the injustice is committed by someone powerful. Wow, unbelievable.

Oh no, have fun pointing it out. I, too, have shaken my fist against percieved injustice and then gone about my day doing absolutely nothing to change things, as you seem to be doing. :)
EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:08 am

Atlexil wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Trying to get your intellectual opponents banned off an online platform for having a different definition of feminism is the epitome of intellectual intolerance, parochialism, and close-mindedness. The feminist activists on r/GenderCritical weren't hurting anyone, they just held views that the radical trans activists don't like and disagree with. The Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to their every ideological belief.

Okay, Purgatio. I'm gonna just say this as a cis guy who hangs out in a few LGBT spaces along with knowing some transpeople. But you aware that TERFs consider transwomen to be "dirty orcs" and that transmen are "women brainwashed by the patriarchy", yeah? Seriously, TERFs consider transpeople to be their ideological enemy for some weridass bullshit reason and don't think they're actual people. And on the subject of Rowling and Lineham. Rowling is a shit author because of her stupid as fuck Word of God statements and basically virtue signaling for progressive points. While Lineham was somebody who was obsessed about hating transpeople to the point their family had to do an intervention before cutting ties with them.


Whatever you think about Rowling and Linehan, they did not deserve the harassment and abuse that they received for simply having an opinion that the trans activists and agitators disagreed with. Regardless, gender-critical feminists don't hate trans women or trans men. They believe that trans women and trans men should not be referred to based on their gender identity, but their innate biological sex, because they want to maintain a coherent vision of radical feminism and women's liberation, and they believe, rightly or wrongly, that oppression under patriarchy rests on biological sex, the belief that biologically-female people are normatively-expected to perform gendered roles associated with that sex (pregnancy, making babies, child-rearing, being a submissive house-wife, sacrificing career etc. etc.), but that opinion does not come with any inherent hatred, bigotry, or dehumanisation of trans men and women, just a difference of opinion as to whether language like "he" or "she" should flow from biological sex, or gender identity. Gender-critical feminists believe it should be the former, because they are worried if trans men and women get their way in terms of vocabulary, it would erase female vocabulary in respect of policy issues that concern natal women and girls (i.e. saying "pregnant people" instead of "expectant mothers" or "pregnant women", saying "menstruators" instead of "women", that kind of thing), and thus nullifies the ability of gender-critical feminists to call out the sexism and misogyny involved in such policy issues.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
Vedan
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 13
Founded: Mar 15, 2014
Father Knows Best State

Postby Vedan » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:09 am

That's a bunch of racist BS!! "We here at Reddit are against hate speech of all kinds...unless its directed at whites." I think I'm gonna go ahead and leave reddit, they obviously dont want my business. If your going to enact anti hate speech rules at least make them apply to everyone equally. Whoever came up with that last part specifically excluding hate speech against "the majority" is a racist and should be fired.

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:09 am

Dawn Denac wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
They really didn't hate trans women, they just didn't think they should be regarded as women, because they were gender-abolitionists who believed women were oppressed on the basic of biological sex, not gender presentation or identity. That's all. No hatred involved there. Just a rational difference of opinion on a controversial social issue.


Yeah no, hold up. What?

So in the name of equality because women are oppressed on the basic of biological sex, trans women don't have the right to be regarded as women?

:hyperthink:


If you are fighting for women's liberation, and your definition of the oppressed class at issue, "women", is based on biological sex, then yeah, trans women aren't biologically-female, and therefore not "women" in the eyes of a women's liberation movement based around biological sex. Its perfectly rational.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
No State Here
Diplomat
 
Posts: 737
Founded: Jun 10, 2019
Anarchy

Postby No State Here » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:11 am

Vedan wrote:That's a bunch of racist BS!! "We here at Reddit are against hate speech of all kinds...unless its directed at whites." I think I'm gonna go ahead and leave reddit, they obviously dont want my business. If your going to enact anti hate speech rules at least make them apply to everyone equally. Whoever came up with that last part specifically excluding hate speech against "the majority" is a racist and should be fired.

The majority isn’t white people though, meaning it’s okay to be racist against Han Chinese now

Kung Flu spam here I come!
Anarchy = Money
Anarchy = Freedom
New York Anarcho-Capitalist
Theme
Anthem

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:11 am

Gravlen wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
That's a pretty nihilistic attitude to take. Don't point out an injustice if the injustice is committed by someone powerful. Wow, unbelievable.

Oh no, have fun pointing it out. I, too, have shaken my fist against percieved injustice and then gone about my day doing absolutely nothing to change things, as you seem to be doing. :)


You know, you are allowed to express opinions without those opinions changing the world overnight? If your criteria for when you're allowed to speak is your opinion must enact radical policy changes that solve earth-ending problems, then you can't ever speak your mind on anything. This is such an intellectually-disingenuous argument.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
Dawn Denac
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 59
Founded: Jun 22, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dawn Denac » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:11 am

Purgatio wrote:
Atlexil wrote:Okay, Purgatio. I'm gonna just say this as a cis guy who hangs out in a few LGBT spaces along with knowing some transpeople. But you aware that TERFs consider transwomen to be "dirty orcs" and that transmen are "women brainwashed by the patriarchy", yeah? Seriously, TERFs consider transpeople to be their ideological enemy for some weridass bullshit reason and don't think they're actual people. And on the subject of Rowling and Lineham. Rowling is a shit author because of her stupid as fuck Word of God statements and basically virtue signaling for progressive points. While Lineham was somebody who was obsessed about hating transpeople to the point their family had to do an intervention before cutting ties with them.


Whatever you think about Rowling and Linehan, they did not deserve the harassment and abuse that they received for simply having an opinion that the trans activists and agitators disagreed with. Regardless, gender-critical feminists don't hate trans women or trans men. They believe that trans women and trans men should not be referred to based on their gender identity, but their innate biological sex, because they want to maintain a coherent vision of radical feminism and women's liberation, and they believe, rightly or wrongly, that oppression under patriarchy rests on biological sex, the belief that biologically-female people are normatively-expected to perform gendered roles associated with that sex (pregnancy, making babies, child-rearing, being a submissive house-wife, sacrificing career etc. etc.), but that opinion does not come with any inherent hatred, bigotry, or dehumanisation of trans men and women, just a difference of opinion as to whether language like "he" or "she" should flow from biological sex, or gender identity. Gender-critical feminists believe it should be the former, because they are worried if trans men and women get their way in terms of vocabulary, it would erase female vocabulary in respect of policy issues that concern natal women and girls (i.e. saying "pregnant people" instead of "expectant mothers" or "pregnant women", saying "menstruators" instead of "women", that kind of thing), and thus nullifies the ability of gender-critical feminists to call out the sexism and misogyny involved in such policy issues.


Rowling and Linehan actively spread their own brand of hatred and rhetoric. These gender-critical people are well aware of what they're doing and you know it. The entire point of a woman or man to transition in that manner is to be utterly regarded as the gender they are transitioning to. The argument of our rights being erased from policy issues is flimsy at best, considering how long woman's suffrage has been going on for even before the transgender movement started to gain traction and I'm going to be damn vocal in making sure that's understood.
Hi there, this is my new main. You may know me as:

World Assembly Nation 665

The Ebony Republic

Black Hawk Corporal

User avatar
Pilipinas and Malaya
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1893
Founded: Jun 23, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Pilipinas and Malaya » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:13 am

Purgatio wrote:
Pilipinas and Malaya wrote:
I hear Parler houses a good bunch of the people on the right side of the spectrum now.

Also, I'd like to ask. I'm a bit out of the loop. What's the drama behind r/GenderCritical?


Feminist activists fighting for women's liberation were silenced by a bunch of close-minded people who have an intellectual disagreement with how they define 'feminism'. That's literally it. They got banned for defining the meaning of 'feminism' in a way that some people and activists don't like. Now their platform is banned from Reddit. Its outrageous.


Was it even the sort of sub that would post stuff that denied trans women were women or like that? Ngl, this post still lacked quite a bit of context.

Edit: Now I see the issue. It seems to be as a result of the sub referring to the trans people by their biological sex.
Last edited by Pilipinas and Malaya on Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
Federative States of Pilipinas and Malaya
Member of Europe

Hello there, welcome to my thoughts.
I also control puppets in Thaecia and Forest, so you may know me by those puppets.
Yes, my nation does represent a good chunk of my views, deal with it.
I still like K-Pop, no, I am not one of those very annoying stans. Anyways, please watch Day6.
Soups are among my favourite kinds of food.
Am too lazy to deal with a bunch of canon stuff, expect them to be completed never.
Civ 6's Frontier Pass seems very exciting, maybe we'll finally get a Filipino civ?

User avatar
Necroghastia
Minister
 
Posts: 3228
Founded: May 11, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Necroghastia » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:14 am

Purgatio wrote:
Necroghastia wrote:You have got to be fucking kidding me.


Trying to get your intellectual opponents banned off an online platform for having a different definition of feminism is the epitome of intellectual intolerance, parochialism, and close-mindedness. The feminist activists on r/GenderCritical weren't hurting anyone, they just held views that the radical trans activists don't like and disagree with. The Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to their every ideological belief.

The nazi activists on Stormfront aren't hurting anyone, they just hold views that radical nonwhite activists don't like and disagree with!
Yeah, no. "Gender critical" ideology is based upon intellectual ignorance and closed-mindedness. It's an insult to even call them "intellectual opponents" when the whole thing is based on lies, conspiracy theories, and bigotry.
You are right about one thing, though - the Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to ideological beliefs. Which is why Reddit's perfectly free to ask them to take their business elsewhere.
The Land of Spooky Scary Skeletons!

Pronouns: she/her

User avatar
Dawn Denac
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 59
Founded: Jun 22, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Dawn Denac » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:14 am

Necroghastia wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Trying to get your intellectual opponents banned off an online platform for having a different definition of feminism is the epitome of intellectual intolerance, parochialism, and close-mindedness. The feminist activists on r/GenderCritical weren't hurting anyone, they just held views that the radical trans activists don't like and disagree with. The Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to their every ideological belief.

The nazi activists on Stormfront aren't hurting anyone, they just hold views that radical nonwhite activists don't like and disagree with!
Yeah, no. "Gender critical" ideology is based upon intellectual ignorance and closed-mindedness. It's an insult to even call them "intellectual opponents" when the whole thing is based on lies, conspiracy theories, and bigotry.
You are right about one thing, though - the Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to ideological beliefs. Which is why Reddit's perfectly free to ask them to take their business elsewhere.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This.
Hi there, this is my new main. You may know me as:

World Assembly Nation 665

The Ebony Republic

Black Hawk Corporal

User avatar
United Dependencies
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13611
Founded: Oct 22, 2007
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby United Dependencies » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:15 am

Purgatio wrote:If you are fighting for women's liberation, and your definition of the oppressed class at issue, "women", is based on biological sex, then yeah, trans women aren't biologically-female, and therefore not "women" in the eyes of a women's liberation movement based around biological sex. Its perfectly rational.

The notion that trans women are men pretending to be women for the purpose of entering women's locker rooms and other women only spaces is not rational. In fact, it is a stereotype that works to harm trans women. Just one of the ideas that people like Rowling spread.
Last edited by United Dependencies on Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Do I not destroy my enemies when I make them my friends?"
-- Abraham Lincoln

Alien Space Bats wrote:2012: The Year We Lost Contact (with Reality).

Cannot think of a name wrote:
Obamacult wrote:Maybe there is an economically sound and rational reason why there are no longer high paying jobs for qualified accountants, assembly line workers, glass blowers, blacksmiths, tanners, etc.

Maybe dragons took their jobs. Maybe unicorns only hid their jobs because unicorns are dicks. Maybe 'jobs' is only an illusion created by a drug addled infant pachyderm. Fuck dude, if we're in 'maybe' land, don't hold back.

This is Nationstates we're here to help

Are you a native or resident of North Carolina?

User avatar
Purgatio
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: May 18, 2018
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Purgatio » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:17 am

Dawn Denac wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Whatever you think about Rowling and Linehan, they did not deserve the harassment and abuse that they received for simply having an opinion that the trans activists and agitators disagreed with. Regardless, gender-critical feminists don't hate trans women or trans men. They believe that trans women and trans men should not be referred to based on their gender identity, but their innate biological sex, because they want to maintain a coherent vision of radical feminism and women's liberation, and they believe, rightly or wrongly, that oppression under patriarchy rests on biological sex, the belief that biologically-female people are normatively-expected to perform gendered roles associated with that sex (pregnancy, making babies, child-rearing, being a submissive house-wife, sacrificing career etc. etc.), but that opinion does not come with any inherent hatred, bigotry, or dehumanisation of trans men and women, just a difference of opinion as to whether language like "he" or "she" should flow from biological sex, or gender identity. Gender-critical feminists believe it should be the former, because they are worried if trans men and women get their way in terms of vocabulary, it would erase female vocabulary in respect of policy issues that concern natal women and girls (i.e. saying "pregnant people" instead of "expectant mothers" or "pregnant women", saying "menstruators" instead of "women", that kind of thing), and thus nullifies the ability of gender-critical feminists to call out the sexism and misogyny involved in such policy issues.


Rowling and Linehan actively spread their own brand of hatred and rhetoric. These gender-critical people are well aware of what they're doing and you know it. The entire point of a woman or man to transition in that manner is to be utterly regarded as the gender they are transitioning to. The argument of our rights being erased from policy issues is flimsy at best, considering how long woman's suffrage has been going on for even before the transgender movement started to gain traction and I'm going to be damn vocal in making sure that's understood.


Pretty sure the agitation for trans-inclusive language wasn't a thing when the suffragettes were fighting for the right to vote. Regardless, the argument of gender-critical feminists is they object to attempts to erase female vocabulary that describes the reality of biological sex, and that in turn nullifies their ability to call our sexism on issues that directly concern or pertain to biological sex. For instance, talking about period equity, so many organisations like Planned Parenthood would retweet information about the 'tampon tax' and have to use the word 'menstruators' instead of 'women', in order to be trans-inclusive. Or, when discussing abortion rights and reproductive oppression, so many organisations speak of 'pregnant persons' instead of 'pregnant women'. Trans activists forced a women's college to end their staging of the Vagina Monologues, because the reference to 'vagina' was apparently offensive and bigoted against trans women. Trans activists have spoken up against free-bleeding protests at feminist marches, against the 'pussy hates' at the Women's March etc. etc., slowly the concept of biological sex is being erased from political discourse, the very word 'women' is being erased from issues in which biological femaleness is clearly at play. The issue, then, is gender-critical feminists are slowly losing the lexicon and the vocabulary needed to call out institutional sexism where it exists and arises, because of the demand for 'trans-inclusive language' erasing female vocabulary on all these issues.
An Introduction to Purgatio

Results
Work, Liberty, Order
Essentialism - 57%
Punitive Justice - 93%
Progressivism - 71%
Nationalism - 64%
Capitalism - 100%
Laissez-faire - 100%
Productivism - 93%
Reformism - 86%
Other Values - Monarchism

Results
Fanatic Unitary - 94%
Fanatic Authoritarian - 94%
Moderate Isolationist - 62%
Militarist - 78%
Extreme Security - 86%
Fanatic Markets - 98%
Moderate Religious - 62%
Progressive - 58%
Fanatic Assimilationist - 90%

User avatar
Gormwood
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14733
Founded: Mar 25, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Gormwood » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:18 am

Atlexil wrote:
Purgatio wrote:
Trying to get your intellectual opponents banned off an online platform for having a different definition of feminism is the epitome of intellectual intolerance, parochialism, and close-mindedness. The feminist activists on r/GenderCritical weren't hurting anyone, they just held views that the radical trans activists don't like and disagree with. The Internet doesn't exist to conform and comport to their every ideological belief.

Okay, Purgatio. I'm gonna just say this as a cis guy who hangs out in a few LGBT spaces along with knowing some transpeople. But you aware that TERFs consider transwomen to be "dirty orcs" and that transmen are "women brainwashed by the patriarchy", yeah? Seriously, TERFs consider transpeople to be their ideological enemy for some weridass bullshit reason and don't think they're actual people. And on the subject of Rowling and Lineham. Rowling is a shit author because of her stupid as fuck Word of God statements and basically virtue signaling for progressive points. While Lineham was somebody who was obsessed about hating transpeople to the point their family had to do an intervention before cutting ties with them.

Calling them gender infiltrators seeking to undermine "true" feminism for some strange reason.
Last edited by Gormwood on Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bloodthirsty savages who call for violence against the Right while simultaneously being unarmed defenseless sissies who will get slaughtered by the gun-toting Right in a civil war.
Breath So Bad, It Actually Drives People Mad

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Aeritai, Alternamerica, Celritannia, Convergence, Corrian, Dazchan, Ethel mermania, Google [Bot], Kanadorika, Kowani, Liriena, Loben III, Navich, Navy Hill, Nejii, Nuroblav, Pulsroth, Serica-, Shrillland, The Alma Mater, The Black Forrest, The Greater Ohio Valley, The Notorious Mad Jack, Washington Resistance Army

Advertisement

Remove ads