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by Slavakino » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:39 am
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:39 am
Slavakino wrote:Vassenor wrote:
Environmental distribution of uranium and other trace elements at selected Kosovo sites
Examination of the health status of populations from depleted-uranium-contaminated regions
So, what is the evidence that DU use has caused contamination?
Never said contamination. I said that DU was used during the bombings
by Slavakino » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:40 am
Vassenor wrote:Slavakino wrote:Never said contamination. I said that DU was used during the bombings
And what makes using DU munitions more of a war crime than non-DU munitions? Why did you start going on about dirty bombs, weapons which are designed to cause radioactive contamination as a form of area denial?
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:46 am
Slavakino wrote:Vassenor wrote:
And what makes using DU munitions more of a war crime than non-DU munitions? Why did you start going on about dirty bombs, weapons which are designed to cause radioactive contamination as a form of area denial?
I was using it as a blanket term which I apologise for, but still, DU, cancer, war crimes. I was referring to Nuclear Waste because DU literally is nuclear waste
by Slavakino » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:52 am
Vassenor wrote:Slavakino wrote:I was using it as a blanket term which I apologise for, but still, DU, cancer, war crimes. I was referring to Nuclear Waste because DU literally is nuclear waste
So you're not going to provide evidence that DU use has had actual health implications? Especially in response to the paper I cited showing no evidence of such?
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:56 am
Slavakino wrote:Vassenor wrote:
So you're not going to provide evidence that DU use has had actual health implications? Especially in response to the paper I cited showing no evidence of such?
Well firstly those sources seem to be a bit dated, since 2004. Secondly, DU still has a half-life and will decay. Not to mention DU may still reside in cities if they have not been picked up. Not to mention contamination of soil. No point continuing this stupid argument as you are never going to stop, its well known YOU Vass isn't going to stop with retarded arguments and prolonging them
by Thermodolia » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:11 am
Gravlen wrote:Risottia wrote:https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53201476
Surprise surprise, after more than 20 years turns out that the KLA weren't exactly a band of poor victims.
Of course, the very same country/breakaway province that once whined about Serbia non giving up its politicians to the Hague court now whines about the evil pro-Serbian Hague court that wants to try its president for war crimes, boo hoo.
Can one be more hypocritical? Can we just split up Kosovo in a Serbian part, an Albanian part, and be done with this useless "country" whose only purpose is hosting criminals?
Why aren't you providing a more up-to-date source?Kosovo President Hashim Thaci will go to The Hague on Monday to be interviewed by international war crimes prosecutors.
Thaci was a top commander of the Kosovo Liberation Army, which fought a guerrilla war for independence from Serbia in the late 1990s. He announced his appearance on his Facebook page on Wednesday.
A special international court has indicted Thaci and other former fighters for alleged war crimes by the KLA, including murder, kidnapping and torture. Thaci has denied the charges.
“While my compatriots as well as me will face international justice with dignity and integrity, I call upon you to stand united in dealing with the challenges that our country is facing,” he said on Facebook.
A pretrial judge in the Kosovo Specialist Chambers has yet to decide whether to put Thaci and the others on trial or throw out the case.
Thaci has told Kosovars that if he is tried, he will “will immediately resign as your president and face the accusations.”
https://www.voanews.com/europe/war-crimes-prosecutors-interview-kosovo-presidentWar%20Crimes%20Prosecutors%20to%20Interview%20Kosovo%20President
And then you can explain where the hypocricy is...
by Gravlen » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:42 am
Thermodolia wrote:Gravlen wrote:Why aren't you providing a more up-to-date source?Kosovo President Hashim Thaci will go to The Hague on Monday to be interviewed by international war crimes prosecutors.
Thaci was a top commander of the Kosovo Liberation Army, which fought a guerrilla war for independence from Serbia in the late 1990s. He announced his appearance on his Facebook page on Wednesday.
A special international court has indicted Thaci and other former fighters for alleged war crimes by the KLA, including murder, kidnapping and torture. Thaci has denied the charges.
“While my compatriots as well as me will face international justice with dignity and integrity, I call upon you to stand united in dealing with the challenges that our country is facing,” he said on Facebook.
A pretrial judge in the Kosovo Specialist Chambers has yet to decide whether to put Thaci and the others on trial or throw out the case.
Thaci has told Kosovars that if he is tried, he will “will immediately resign as your president and face the accusations.”
https://www.voanews.com/europe/war-crimes-prosecutors-interview-kosovo-presidentWar%20Crimes%20Prosecutors%20to%20Interview%20Kosovo%20President
And then you can explain where the hypocricy is...
Oh so it looks like the OP is manipulating the facts. I wonder why?
Kosovo President Hashim Thaci said on Thursday evening after that the Kosovo Specialist Prosecutor’s Office, which questioned him for four days in a row this week, should conclude that he is innocent.
“I am very pleased that for four days I had the opportunity to give evidence on all issues related to my activity during the war period, and my efforts for peace, stability, development and progress,” Thaci, who was a Kosovo Liberation Army leader during the 1998-99 war, told media.'
Thaci said he gave the Hague prosecutors, who are probing wartime and post-war crimes in Kosovo, “information about my role, my responsibilities during the war”.
He said that “now it is up to the prosecutor and the judge to evaluate my testimonies impartially”.
“If they do it professionally, they can easily conclude that I have not committed any war crimes,” he added.
The Specialist Prosecutor’s Office announced last month that it has prepared an indictment charging Thaci, as well as senior Kosovo politician Kadri Veseli and other former KLA fighters, with war crimes and crimes against humanity. The indictment still needs to be approved by a judge.
[...]
If the indictment is confirmed, Thaci faces trial at the Kosovo Specialist Chambers in The Hague. He has denied any wrongdoing and has said he will step down as president if he is put on trial.
by Thermodolia » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:58 am
Gravlen wrote:Thermodolia wrote:Oh so it looks like the OP is manipulating the facts. I wonder why?
Yeah, who can say? Not the OP, who seems to not have returned to the thread.
Regardless, here's a little update:Kosovo President Hashim Thaci said on Thursday evening after that the Kosovo Specialist Prosecutor’s Office, which questioned him for four days in a row this week, should conclude that he is innocent.
“I am very pleased that for four days I had the opportunity to give evidence on all issues related to my activity during the war period, and my efforts for peace, stability, development and progress,” Thaci, who was a Kosovo Liberation Army leader during the 1998-99 war, told media.'
Thaci said he gave the Hague prosecutors, who are probing wartime and post-war crimes in Kosovo, “information about my role, my responsibilities during the war”.
He said that “now it is up to the prosecutor and the judge to evaluate my testimonies impartially”.
“If they do it professionally, they can easily conclude that I have not committed any war crimes,” he added.
The Specialist Prosecutor’s Office announced last month that it has prepared an indictment charging Thaci, as well as senior Kosovo politician Kadri Veseli and other former KLA fighters, with war crimes and crimes against humanity. The indictment still needs to be approved by a judge.
[...]
If the indictment is confirmed, Thaci faces trial at the Kosovo Specialist Chambers in The Hague. He has denied any wrongdoing and has said he will step down as president if he is put on trial.
I'm still waiting to hear more about that hypocricy.
by Gravlen » Thu Jul 23, 2020 3:28 am
Thermodolia wrote:Gravlen wrote:Yeah, who can say? Not the OP, who seems to not have returned to the thread.
Regardless, here's a little update:Kosovo President Hashim Thaci said on Thursday evening after that the Kosovo Specialist Prosecutor’s Office, which questioned him for four days in a row this week, should conclude that he is innocent.
“I am very pleased that for four days I had the opportunity to give evidence on all issues related to my activity during the war period, and my efforts for peace, stability, development and progress,” Thaci, who was a Kosovo Liberation Army leader during the 1998-99 war, told media.'
Thaci said he gave the Hague prosecutors, who are probing wartime and post-war crimes in Kosovo, “information about my role, my responsibilities during the war”.
He said that “now it is up to the prosecutor and the judge to evaluate my testimonies impartially”.
“If they do it professionally, they can easily conclude that I have not committed any war crimes,” he added.
The Specialist Prosecutor’s Office announced last month that it has prepared an indictment charging Thaci, as well as senior Kosovo politician Kadri Veseli and other former KLA fighters, with war crimes and crimes against humanity. The indictment still needs to be approved by a judge.
[...]
If the indictment is confirmed, Thaci faces trial at the Kosovo Specialist Chambers in The Hague. He has denied any wrongdoing and has said he will step down as president if he is put on trial.
I'm still waiting to hear more about that hypocricy.
Oh so the facts say that this guy is innocent strange how that happened
by Gormwood » Thu Jul 23, 2020 3:39 am
Vassenor wrote:Slavakino wrote:I was using it as a blanket term which I apologise for, but still, DU, cancer, war crimes. I was referring to Nuclear Waste because DU literally is nuclear waste
So you're not going to provide evidence that DU use has had actual health implications? Especially in response to the paper I cited showing no evidence of such?
by Vivolkha » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:15 am
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:17 am
by Gormwood » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:28 am
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:31 am
by Punished UMN » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:40 am
Vassenor wrote:Gormwood wrote:Seriously? DU has been hypothesized as the likely cause of Gulf War Syndrome.
OK I think we're drifting here. The claim was that the use of DU munitions in Kosovo specifically is a war crime because of the impact on the local environment and on the civilian population. But the research on the matter does not bear either of these claims out.
by Gormwood » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:41 am
Vassenor wrote:Gormwood wrote:Seriously? DU has been hypothesized as the likely cause of Gulf War Syndrome.
OK I think we're drifting here. The claim was that the use of DU munitions in Kosovo specifically is a war crime because of the impact on the local environment and on the civilian population. But the research on the matter does not bear either of these claims out.
by Vassenor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:53 am
Gormwood wrote:Vassenor wrote:
OK I think we're drifting here. The claim was that the use of DU munitions in Kosovo specifically is a war crime because of the impact on the local environment and on the civilian population. But the research on the matter does not bear either of these claims out.
It's not a war crime because it's not a purpose made chemical weapon, otherwise there'd be Gulf War tribunals. But it will likely have long term health effects on the population. Don't be surprised if repeats of GWS start getting reported.
by Gravlen » Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:14 am
Gormwood wrote:Vassenor wrote:
OK I think we're drifting here. The claim was that the use of DU munitions in Kosovo specifically is a war crime because of the impact on the local environment and on the civilian population. But the research on the matter does not bear either of these claims out.
It's not a war crime because it's not a purpose made chemical weapon, otherwise there'd be Gulf War tribunals. But it will likely have long term health effects on the population. Don't be surprised if repeats of GWS start getting reported.
by Gormwood » Thu Jul 23, 2020 6:12 am
Gravlen wrote:Gormwood wrote:It's not a war crime because it's not a purpose made chemical weapon, otherwise there'd be Gulf War tribunals. But it will likely have long term health effects on the population. Don't be surprised if repeats of GWS start getting reported.
Well, let's not be too optimistic. The US would not agree to such tribunals (whether for actions during the Gulf War or during the Kosovo war), so even if chemical weapons had been used directly nobody would have been held accountable.
by Shofercia » Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:19 am
Vassenor wrote:Gormwood wrote:Seriously? DU has been hypothesized as the likely cause of Gulf War Syndrome.
OK I think we're drifting here. The claim was that the use of DU munitions in Kosovo specifically is a war crime because of the impact on the local environment and on the civilian population. But the research on the matter does not bear either of these claims out.
Gravlen wrote:Thermodolia wrote:Oh so the facts say that this guy is innocent strange how that happened
Well to be fair, he says he is innocent. There's still facts to sort out before we can conclude for sure.
But the OP has hastily concluded that he isn't innocent (despite no indictment and, importantly, no trial and no judgement), and that he represents the pinnacle of hypocricy for whining about the court wanting to interview him (despite him submitting to their request, being interviewed for four days, and promising to step down if a judge does move to indict him).
So yeah, the title of the thread is still completely wrong, something the OP knew or should have known when he made it.
Slavakino wrote:Shofercia wrote:
You're actually calling out someone who's own mother suffered from the bombing as if they're bullshitting? What the actual fuck? Is this a demonstration of how to show sympathy for the cause of the underdog? Noted!
One might criticise my dad for fighting for the Serbs in Bosnia but my dad fought to protect Serbia and Montenegro at the time. Not because of race or religion. My dad went as far as to help civilians no matter the race (although my dad does refer to Bosnians and Albanians as "The n*ggers of Europe" but mainly as a joking manner). He went as far as to threaten mutiny and murder of his group if they didn't let go of an 11-year-old Bosnian boy
by Novus America » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:29 am
Slavakino wrote:Vassenor wrote:
"We're going to look into whether this happened" is not evidence a thing happened in and of itself.
It is well known during the war that NATO did use DU munitions. Using DU in mass amounts is like dumping nuclear waste in a city, oh wait that's literally what happened. You cannot deny the war crimes that NATO and the USA have brought upon the Serbs.
by Novus America » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:36 am
by Novus America » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:40 am
Slavakino wrote:>inb4 "Kosovo should be independent or annexed by Albania because its majority Albanian!"
Ok by that logic the Serb parts of Bosnia should be independent or annexed by Serbia same with the Croat parts
by Novus America » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:49 am
Vassenor wrote:Gormwood wrote:It's not a war crime because it's not a purpose made chemical weapon, otherwise there'd be Gulf War tribunals. But it will likely have long term health effects on the population. Don't be surprised if repeats of GWS start getting reported.
The Gulf War also involved a much greater quantity of DU munitions use - somewhere on the order of 315-350 tons compared to 15 in Kosovo.
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