Why you should eat Biblical apple

[Alcala-Cordel]

They already did know right from wrong, the apple didnt give them that power they already had it

No they did not, as shown by the verse I keep quoting.

So that story was written to reinforce the belief that god creates morality?

[Elsa De Arendelle]

Neutral, you didn't read any of my explanations I provided that Adam and Eve knew the consequences and still took it.
Some people have never been burnt by fire or fallen from a great height before. Do they need to experience it first before they make a decision to actually jump into a fire or off a cliff? Adam and Eve understood what death is (yhere's your answer).


Death is a concept as well as a person/entity (off topic aside from that)

[Dominant Oppressors]

They already did know right from wrong, the apple didnt give them that power they already had it

No they did not, as shown by the verse I keep quoting.

They do know right from wrong, as when God tells them not to do something, they know it would be wrong not to follow and when Satan tells them God was 'lying', they release that it is wrong to lie and so they think it ok to defy Him as He was 'lying' i.e. doing something wrong, all of this happens before the apple part.

[Anime Skynet]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

[Alcala-Cordel]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

idk god seems kinda like an insecure jerk in the book

[Neutraligon]

No they did not, as shown by the verse I keep quoting.

So that story was written to reinforce the belief that god creates morality?

I am not sure why it came into existence, it seems like a variation of older stories. it does seem to be a bit of a just so story.

[Neutraligon]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

Except there is no evidence that adam or eve thought they knew better.

[The Peasant Republic]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

The entire point is that she doesn't know anything. Which is why she eats the apple that god said "don't eat because I said so" and a snake says "eat so you can understand". So she can understand. God could have told them why. Or not put the tree where people with the naivete of a child would get their hands to it. Or not let a snake get in and trick children into trying to steal from his precious little metaphorical cookie jar.

[New haven america]

fair enough.

Before anyone asks I am mentally ok and life isn't bad, but I wouldn't be happy with a god if it stood by while all that happened

Well, Christianity's kinda bi-polar.

Like, God is all knowing and all powerful and dictatorial and you have to follow everything he says, but it also preaches that you should be a kind a good person, and that your punishment for not being a good person is an eternal afterlife of suffering. Like, it's just as against the gain of knowledge as the other Abrahamic religions, but it also says that you should try to help lift up and improve the lives of those around you, which usually requires the gain of knowledge. You see the issue here.


It might be kinda fun since everyone has infinite power and can't die, on the other hand it would be very chaotic and there would definitely be people using it for evil.
So yeah, it's a bit odd in that sense.

It is a little vague on that, early Christianity used to hardly focus on hell. Fear of the devil only emerged later as part of the religion

That's because early Christians used the threat of eternal damnation and apocalyptic wars as a marketing tool to get people to convert or risk moral and eternal hellfire.

There were actually quite a few sects of early Christianity that didn't even believe in eternal damnation or had the more Jewish idea that everyone goes to Hell to have their souls cleansed before ascending to Heaven.

[Dominant Oppressors]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

Except there is no evidence that adam or eve thought they knew better.

They are literally told to do it because "“For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”"

[Neutraligon]

No they did not, as shown by the verse I keep quoting.

They do know right from wrong, as when God tells them not to do something, they know it would be wrong not to follow and when Satan tells them God was 'lying', they release that it is wrong to lie and so they think it ok to defy Him as He was 'lying' i.e. doing something wrong, all of this happens before the apple part.

Except they did not know that it would be wrong not to follow. nor did they realize a thing about lying, since in that story god was the only liar. They where simply naive enough to believe the snake. that passage i link explcitly state that them knowing good from evil is new to after them eating the apple.

[Alcala-Cordel]

It is a little vague on that, early Christianity used to hardly focus on hell. Fear of the devil only emerged later as part of the religion

That's because early Christians used the threat of eternal damnation and apocalyptic wars as a marketing tool to get people to convert or risk moral and eternal hellfire.

There were actually quite a few sects of early Christianity that didn't even believe in eternal damnation or had the more Jewish idea that everyone goes to Hell to have their souls cleansed before ascending to Heaven.

It's really interesting how religions evolve over time, if we ever successfully invent a time machine we should have some ancient Christians and modern ones discuss their religion. This wouldn't be to push an agenda or anything, just to hear what they have to say

[Neutraligon]

Except there is no evidence that adam or eve thought they knew better.

They are literally told to do it because "“For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”"

The snake did indeed say that, it does not indicate that adam and eve had any concept of what that meant.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

imagine god exists and this retard eats the forbidden apple because he thinks he knows better an all-knowing deity literally incapable of being wrong

The "retard" wants some knowledge which god hasn't given them. Knowledge in fact, which god has forbidden.

What does that apple taste like? Maybe it was forbidden to me because it too good? Or too bad?

You have to have some sympathy for the retard, surely.
They couldn't possibly have foreseen the apple being too good AND too bad!

[Dominant Oppressors]

They do know right from wrong, as when God tells them not to do something, they know it would be wrong not to follow and when Satan tells them God was 'lying', they release that it is wrong to lie and so they think it ok to defy Him as He was 'lying' i.e. doing something wrong, all of this happens before the apple part.

Except they did not know that it would be wrong not to follow. nor did they realize a thing about lying, since in that story god was the only liar. They where simply naive enough to believe the snake. that passage i link explcitly state that them knowing good from evil is new to after them eating the apple.

But they do know that is wrong not to follow for when tempted to do it, she doesn't want to at first because "but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’" and she only goes against that when she is told God is 'lying'

[Dominant Oppressors]

They are literally told to do it because "“For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”"

The snake did indeed say that, it does not indicate that adam and eve had any concept of what that meant.

If that was not the main driver for it, then why did they have to wait for Satan to say it to them to eat it?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Except they did not know that it would be wrong not to follow. nor did they realize a thing about lying, since in that story god was the only liar. They where simply naive enough to believe the snake. that passage i link explcitly state that them knowing good from evil is new to after them eating the apple.

But they do know that is wrong not to follow for when tempted to do it, she doesn't want to at first because "but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’" and she only goes against that when she is told God is 'lying'

You must not touch it puts paid to my "destroy the apples" plan. Maybe I could fashion an axe?

[Neutraligon]

Except they did not know that it would be wrong not to follow. nor did they realize a thing about lying, since in that story god was the only liar. They where simply naive enough to believe the snake. that passage i link explcitly state that them knowing good from evil is new to after them eating the apple.

But they do know that is wrong not to follow for when tempted to do it, she doesn't want to at first because "but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’" and she only goes against that when she is told God is 'lying'

No, they do not know, because they do not know it is good to obey, or bad disobey. She does not want to the same way a very young child who has been told not to do something does not know. She goes "against" god when she i convinced due to her naivety and not knowing right from wrong. The torah is very explicit that they did not know right from wrong before eating the apple, and so could not know to obey

[Neutraligon]

The snake did indeed say that, it does not indicate that adam and eve had any concept of what that meant.

If that was not the main driver for it, then why did they have to wait for Satan to say it to them to eat it?

For the same reason a child would obey a parent, because they have not thought about doing otherwise.

[Risottia]

Knowledge and wisdom without God leads to misery and existential futility.

France, 1000 years ago: everyone religious, scarce knowledge, most people died by age 25 of war, disease, overworking and hunger.
France, now: mostly atheist, universal literacy, life expectancy in the order of 80.
Uhm.

That is the ultimate lesson God was trying to teach Adam and Eve.

And he failed. Talk about omnipotence, shall we.

Today, New Age-become-your-very-own-Christ is the new religion. It is all selfish.

I reject New Age, Christianity, and all that religious stuff. I don't need deities.

Everyone wants to become all powerful but they still can't create anything of value.

I don't care about being omnipotent (I bet your deity is still angry about not being omnipotent, eh!) and if you say that creating better humans by giving them knowledge has no value, you deserve a sound raspberry.

They will die like mere mortals.

So will you. Got a problem with the idea of personal death, the inevitable destruction of the Solar System and the unescapable thermodynamical death of the Universe?
Looks like your religion isn't helping you a lot.

Only through obedience will you have all you wanted and more permanently.

So I could become omnipotent forever and dethrone the non-omnipotent previous deities? That sounds interesting. Golpe of the Heavens!

God only has good will for us.

Evidently not. You just said he's offering a barter: obedience in exchange for "not dying like a mere mortal". Your words.
A barter, or extortion if you want, considering how a threat is involved, but still, if he had only good will, he'd give stuff for free - like when I give gifts, no strings attached, no extortion involved.

And Adam and Eve were perfect.

Apart from the lack of evidence for their existance (and the squicky consequences of Biblical literalism), no, evidently they weren't because they weren't able to resist to temptation.
Wait, maybe you think that perfection is just about the body and not about mind and soul.
Ah, I see. You're a materialist.

They were not mindless brutes. They were the greatest minds that ever lived. The best of all the genes, the highest IQ, and the greatest aesthetics.

And of course you were there to check their IQ and to take a sample of their DNA.

Eve was more beautiful than even Elsa from Frozen. Without God, they are nothing.

Actually we have more evidence for the existance of Elsa than for the existance of God or Adam and Eve.
At least for Elsa we have pictures. What do you have for God? Bit of translations of translations from some 2500 years ago deriving from Bronze-age oral traditions of Levantine shepherds?

[Dominant Oppressors]

But they do know that is wrong not to follow for when tempted to do it, she doesn't want to at first because "but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’" and she only goes against that when she is told God is 'lying'

No, they do not know, because they do not know it is good to obey, or bad disobey. She does not want to the same way a very young child who has been told not to do something does not know. She goes "against" god when she i convinced due to her naivety and not knowing right from wrong. The torah is very explicit that they did not know right from wrong before eating the apple, and so could not know to obey

But does that not defy the purpose of the chapter? If she does not know right from wrong, then she is not committing mortal sin, for which you must know you are doing wrong, and original sin is a mortal sin, so the story doesn't make sense if they do not understand it is wrong. The story is meant to teach first and foremost, so it does not accomplish that if they do not know. I know you have linked this several times but I havent seen it, so would you mind re-linking it again, so we can compare the translation to some other versions? Thank you and I apologize for the inconvenience

[Neutraligon]

No, they do not know, because they do not know it is good to obey, or bad disobey. She does not want to the same way a very young child who has been told not to do something does not know. She goes "against" god when she i convinced due to her naivety and not knowing right from wrong. The torah is very explicit that they did not know right from wrong before eating the apple, and so could not know to obey

But does that not defy the purpose of the chapter? If she does not know right from wrong, then she is not committing mortal sin, for which you must know you are doing wrong, and original sin is a mortal sin, so the story doesn't make sense if they do not understand it is wrong. The story is meant to teach first and foremost, so it does not accomplish that if they do not know. I know you have linked this several times but I havent seen it, so would you mind re-linking it again, so we can compare the translation to some other versions? Thank you and I apologize for the inconvenience

Well first Judaism does not have the concept of original sin. Second it is questionable what the story was meant to teach. However the story does explcitly states that knowing good from evil is a new state for mankind, and the where banished from the garden due to god not wanting them to eat the fruit of the tree of life, and thus become immortal.

22Now the Lord God said, "Behold man has become like one of us, having the ability of knowing good and evil, and now, lest he stretch forth his hand and take also from the Tree of Life and eat and live forever." https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cd ... pter-3.htm

Notice that it says has become like us, knowing good and evil.

[Alcala-Cordel]

On a really dark note I'd eat that apple just to get back at him for apathetically killing people I care about

On second thought it's clear he planned the whole apple thing out in this story because he wanted to teach a lesson. The way to get back at him would be to ignore it.

By the way, I just realized my past few posts came off as really antireligious. I'm apologize if I came off that way.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

On a really dark note I'd eat that apple just to get back at him for apathetically killing people I care about

On second thought it's clear he planned the whole apple thing out in this story because he wanted to teach a lesson. The way to get back at him would be to ignore it.

And have it always there on your mind? Destroy it I say.

Aaaand, straight to Hell for being a rules lawyer.

[Alcala-Cordel]

On second thought it's clear he planned the whole apple thing out in this story because he wanted to teach a lesson. The way to get back at him would be to ignore it.

And have it always there on your mind? Destroy it I say.

Aaaand, straight to Hell for being a rules lawyer.

You're right, a controlled burn on the apple tree would be the way to go, and I'd plant new stuff where the tree was.