How to help those who can't help themselves?

[Dumb Ideologies]

If people are invested in ideas that don't make any sense then they're not very persuadable. If they were looking for logic they wouldn't have taken on the ideas in the first place.

[Risottia]

I will explain immediately what I mean by that. My mother has consumed many Christian fundamentalist ...

The Fundamentalites aren't in complete accord with our Mother, the One, Holy, Roman and Apostolic Church. This means they're haeretics, sent by the Evil One's to undermine the authority of the Church and to test the faith of the true believers.
Call in the Dominicans, that should do the trick.


Got wood?

[Inishavon]

I'm so sorry to hear about your mum. If you keep trying to convince her and it does absolutely nothing, I don't know what you can do. Are you able to move out of her place? As difficult as it must be to make that decision, you might be better off giving up and cutting her off as much as you can if her beliefs are getting to you. I can understand completely why you still want to help her, though - it's up to you.

[Servilis]

It's very hard to bring someone out of the Alt-Right pipeline, the most successful method is getting them into Breadtube, but even then you have to convince them to watch Breadtube.

My dad is hooked on White Genocide theories and has been since he was introduced to them.

A few days back it got so heated that he started sending me Facebook memes.


Speaking of Facebook, oh you'd love to wander where he gets his info from.


The other day he sent me a picture of an injured black girl who suffers from albinism next to a picture of two black men holding machetes, one of them licking their machete.


He was so hooked into it that he didn't even justify his point correctly.
He thought the girl was white, even though you can quite literally see she has Albinism.

[Nakena]

Ask her to proof her theories. Why does she believe the youtuber?

She can't really personally proof other people's theories, the only thing she can do is believe in them and be mad at me for not believing. It's basically like religion.

This pretty much.

Also what kind of conspiracy theories it is?

Most people who follow conspiracy theories have a fractally wrong idea of how the world works.

“The main thing that I learned about conspiracy theory, is that conspiracy theorists believe in a conspiracy because that is more comforting. The truth of the world is that it is actually chaotic. The truth is that it is not The Iluminati, or The Jewish Banking Conspiracy, or the Gray Alien Theory.

The truth is far more frightening - Nobody is in control.

The world is rudderless.”

[Trollzyn the Infinite]

Can't fix stupid. Best to just ignore it and move on. God knows I've tried with my own mom, but gotten nowhere.

[Geneviev]

You can ask her to prove that her claims are correct. Being unable to justify my craziest beliefs made me change them eventually.

[Liburia]

I have given up on trying to get my family members to see the light. I have accepted that parents are addicts who get their daily dose of propaganda administered by Tucker Carlson every evening.

Almost there myself.

you cant help those who dont want it. Your family member is a lost cause, all you can do is hold your ground on the topics and state your reasons instead of convincing them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNvlyycWzQ
this should help you drown out their stupidity.

I suppose that's true.

Keep trying to debate her. Watch the videos she watches, and learn the conspiracy theories. Learn them better than she knows them. Then go about dissecting them. If debating doesn't work, short of hoping for her to have some revelation, there's not much you can do. Having family with abominable opinions is just something we all have to learn to live with.

This.

But even more importantly -- be unfailingly kind to your mom. Be calm but be assertive that those YouTube videos are not the truth of whatever matter she wants clarified.

Remember that it is not her fault she happened to take in conspiracy theories of her choosing, and adjust your behavior accordingly.

I try not to hurt her feelings.

[Bear Stearns]

My family members believe a lot of dumb shit. Some of them think the ongoing protests are a false flag operation being conducted by "white supremacists". Others think Trump is literally an FSB agent. Some of them unironically support big tech companies exercising unilateral control over political debate.

Most of them are lazy wine aunts and metrosexuals who shitpost drunk on Facebook all day about how awful Trump is, even though none of them have ever done shit with their lives. They all inherited millions of dollars from my great-grandpa and have just been living off of that for the last 40 years.

That said, I never engage with them politically. Last family member to come out as right-wing was practically disowned, and I think it's stupid to lose family over politics, so I'm just always friendly with them and smile and nod when they go on their rants. Usually I enjoy visiting them because outside of politics they're pleasant people and many of them are old (and with the amount of booze they think), they probably don't have many years left.

[Liburia]

If people are invested in ideas that don't make any sense then they're not very persuadable. If they were looking for logic they wouldn't have taken on the ideas in the first place.

Makes sense.

I'm so sorry to hear about your mum. If you keep trying to convince her and it does absolutely nothing, I don't know what you can do. Are you able to move out of her place? As difficult as it must be to make that decision, you might be better off giving up and cutting her off as much as you can if her beliefs are getting to you. I can understand completely why you still want to help her, though - it's up to you.

Unfortunately I can't afford to move out so I have to tolerate it.

She can't really personally proof other people's theories, the only thing she can do is believe in them and be mad at me for not believing. It's basically like religion.

This pretty much.

Also what kind of conspiracy theories it is?

Most people who follow conspiracy theories have a fractally wrong idea of how the world works.

“The main thing that I learned about conspiracy theory, is that conspiracy theorists believe in a conspiracy because that is more comforting. The truth of the world is that it is actually chaotic. The truth is that it is not The Iluminati, or The Jewish Banking Conspiracy, or the Gray Alien Theory.

The truth is far more frightening - Nobody is in control.

The world is rudderless.”

The latest theory is about Bill Gates who is supposedly trying to control the minds of people in the world.

[The Twilight Embassy]

Personally, I'd get the hell outta there before they start thinking you're "part of the conspiracy" and try turning you over to ICE or some other Gestapo crap.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

If you want to try to dissuade them, eh, cool. But more often than not, these people aren’t looking to be dissuaded or to reason their positions. All they look for is confirmation.

In essence, I have ceased trying to help them. There’s no point in wasting time in those who have no desire to learn.

[UniversalCommons]

Remember you have to be able to listen to peoples ideas you oppose. If you can't do this, then you can't create either emotionally based arguments or logical arguments in opposition to them. This comes from the idea of having an actively open mind (AOM). It requires a lot of discipline to be able to read things which you don't like and make strong counter arguments. Logic is not always the answer, there is a lot of cruelty in some of the conspiracy theories as well as hatred. Pointing out the cruelty or damaging aspects can be more effective than logic. Being able to talk with people and be considerate allows you to debate with them. If you can't be considerate, no one will debate you. http://journal.sjdm.org/13/13124a/jdm13124a.pdf Using actively open mindedness as a tool can be as useful as critical thinking. There are other tools like understanding confirmation bias. These however are just tools. Being more able to understand multiple viewpoints allows for a greater predictive accuracy in what is happening around you. The majority of the pundits who make singular viewpoints based on narrow thinking make bad decisions.

[Bear Stearns]

“The main thing that I learned about conspiracy theory, is that conspiracy theorists believe in a conspiracy because that is more comforting. The truth of the world is that it is actually chaotic. The truth is that it is not The Iluminati, or The Jewish Banking Conspiracy, or the Gray Alien Theory.

The truth is far more frightening - Nobody is in control.

The world is rudderless.”

The latest theory is about Bill Gates who is supposedly trying to control the minds of people in the world.[/quote]

Conspiracies aside, blindly trusting Bill Gates is pretty dumb on its own. Guy's a robber baron at the end of the day and had a very close relationship to Jeffrey Epstein. He gave us the Windows operating system, and for that he should be thanked, but beyond that he really isn't all that exceptional.

[Cisairse]

The latest theory is about Bill Gates who is supposedly trying to control the minds of people in the world.

Conspiracies aside, blindly trusting Bill Gates is pretty dumb on its own. Guy's a robber baron at the end of the day and had a very close relationship to Jeffrey Epstein. He gave us the Windows operating system, and for that he should be thanked, but beyond that he really isn't all that exceptional.

Windows is not something deserving of praise. It's disgusting and has set back the tech industry decades.

[Rojava Free State]

She can't really personally proof other people's theories, the only thing she can do is believe in them and be mad at me for not believing. It's basically like religion.

This pretty much.

Also what kind of conspiracy theories it is?

Most people who follow conspiracy theories have a fractally wrong idea of how the world works.

“The main thing that I learned about conspiracy theory, is that conspiracy theorists believe in a conspiracy because that is more comforting. The truth of the world is that it is actually chaotic. The truth is that it is not The Iluminati, or The Jewish Banking Conspiracy, or the Gray Alien Theory.

The truth is far more frightening - Nobody is in control.

The world is rudderless.”

Yeah conspiracy theorists think bad things never just happen. There's always some sort of illuminati or deep state involvement behind it.

[Rojava Free State]

Conspiracies aside, blindly trusting Bill Gates is pretty dumb on its own. Guy's a robber baron at the end of the day and had a very close relationship to Jeffrey Epstein. He gave us the Windows operating system, and for that he should be thanked, but beyond that he really isn't all that exceptional.

Windows is not something deserving of praise. It's disgusting and has set back the tech industry decades.

Windows Vista is a war crime.

[Bear Stearns]

This pretty much.

Also what kind of conspiracy theories it is?

Most people who follow conspiracy theories have a fractally wrong idea of how the world works.

Yeah conspiracy theorists think bad things never just happen. There's always some sort of illuminati or deep state involvement behind it.

I think it's just more obvious that the elites of the US, since at least the 1980s but probably before, have become increasingly insulated from the rest of the country and have developed a culture unto themselves, where they act in their own interests as a group, and rely on various social signals and institutions to maintain their power and limit access to them.

Ivy League schools basically control the supply of labor for much of America's white collar professions (especially for journalism/media, finance, and government bureaucracy), and maintain a reciprocal relationship with their alumni in various industries to keep the elite closed off.

[Rojava Free State]

Yeah conspiracy theorists think bad things never just happen. There's always some sort of illuminati or deep state involvement behind it.

I think it's just more obvious that the elites of the US, since at least the 1980s but probably before, have become increasingly insulated from the rest of the country and have developed a culture unto themselves, where they act in their own interests as a group, and rely on various social signals and institutions to maintain their power and limit access to them.

Ivy League schools basically control the supply of labor for much of America's white collar professions (especially for journalism/media, finance, and government bureaucracy), and maintain a reciprocal relationship with their alumni in various industries to keep the elite closed off.

I never said conspiracies don't happen, but as someone who knows a few conspiracy theorists, EVERYTHING is a conspiracy to them.

[Genovianiia]

I would consider looking into cult deprogramming, and using some of the strategies that they use to talk to your mother about what she is consuming. Although it may not be a cult in a traditional sense, conspiracy theories and those that spout them can be just as mind controlling. Steven Hassan, a psychologist and expert at cult deprogramming, talked about similar things about how fox news can have similar effects as cults in his appearances on the podcast, Trumpcast. I believe he also has books and other resources that may be helpful. Hopefully, you can find a way to reach your mom, and she can start to see the truth.

[Cisairse]

I think it's just more obvious that the elites of the US, since at least the 1980s but probably before, have become increasingly insulated from the rest of the country and have developed a culture unto themselves, where they act in their own interests as a group, and rely on various social signals and institutions to maintain their power and limit access to them.

Ivy League schools basically control the supply of labor for much of America's white collar professions (especially for journalism/media, finance, and government bureaucracy), and maintain a reciprocal relationship with their alumni in various industries to keep the elite closed off.

I never said conspiracies don't happen, but as someone who knows a few conspiracy theorists, EVERYTHING is a conspiracy to them.

If everything is a conspiracy, nothing is.

[Rojava Free State]

I never said conspiracies don't happen, but as someone who knows a few conspiracy theorists, EVERYTHING is a conspiracy to them.

If everything is a conspiracy, nothing is.

Ought to say that to my friend Tyler. Just to list his conspiracy theories:

•Tupac ain't dead
•Eminem is a clone
•Drake killed XXXTentacion
•Irish people were actually the first people to be called the N word but that fact was covered up to push multiculturalism
•The United States military created COVID to kill China

[Bear Stearns]

If everything is a conspiracy, nothing is.

Ought to say that to my friend Tyler. Just to list his conspiracy theories:

•Tupac ain't dead
•Eminem is a clone
•Drake killed XXXTentacion
•Irish people were actually the first people to be called the N word but that fact was covered up to push multiculturalism
•The United States military created COVID to kill China

These are probably plausible conspiracies:
>Roosevelt had Soviet sympathies and deliberated baited Japan to attack to the US to enter World War II
>Civil rights & integration in Northern cities in the 1960s was an attempt by Anglo white liberal elites to breakup the power of white ethnic (Irish, Italian, Polish, etc.) neighborhoods and their political machines in cities
>Israel has had disproportionate influence on US foreign policy since the 1980s and US government is riddled with Israeli agents

[Major-Tom]

Mean as it sounds, there are times in the case the OP mentioned where any attempts at having a level-headed discussion are rendered fruitless. Each and every one of us is inherently stubborn, and for most of us, that extends to what we believe. Trying hard to change that in other people doesn't always work, even if it's disheartening to hear people we love spout nonsense 24/7.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

The recommended algorithms that are now popular on the Internet are based on collected user interests.If she watch more of it, YouTube will recommend more of it to her.But you can try to lead her in another direction.Comrade, do you want to take some time of your mother to talk about communism with her?