Corporal Punishment -A Parental Right or Wrong?

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

Still not justified, lol. "Parents know best"? Let's change "parent" to the "party", or "state", or "General Secretary" and you would be up in arms.

No actually I wouldn't. The state does know best, and you should follow the law if you don't want to go to jail.

That is common sense, what I'm talking about is stuff like "Hand over all your property for the good of the state or gulag" kind of stuff you'd see in nations like Stalin's USSR. You are advocating for doing the exact same thing, with the state changed to parents.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

That is common sense, what I'm talking about is stuff like "Hand over all your property for the good of the state or gulag" kind of stuff you'd see in nations like Stalin's USSR. You are advocating for doing the exact same thing, with the state changed to parents.

If I lived there when Stalin was leader, I'd hand over my property. Wouldn't you?

If I live in western Ukraine or Belarus for example, I'd probably run to Poland or Lithuania while burning my property so that they can't take any of it, or if I lived anywhere else, yes but with deep hate against the CPSU and I'd only do it for my own safety - not for "the good of the Soviet Union" or some bullcrap. Now you seem like a person who would say "But Stalin knows better!"

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

Congratulations, you have achieved strawman *Some people don't believe in discipline at all*, incomprehensible sentences *Better sooner, and they lose the kid.*, incorrect statements * They're going to beat the kid sooner or later.*, and advocating for violence *Let them spank*

Many parents spank, but very few have their kids run away or kill the parents. Actually, you never demonstrated any link, just made the spurious claim as though that will always happen.

"Some parents don't believe in discipline at all" was from some other post. It was in reply to Cetacea, you quoting it out of context is what you accused me of: strawmanning.

Spanking is legal in most states, but if you think I'm advocating a crime then report me to moderation.

Not a crime in some places (not criminalized), but still violence.

[Alessandretta]

Certainly parents cannot be blamed if, in case of necessity, they give a bump or a spank to a particularly disobedient or rude child.

That said, it is always common sense to understand if these acts go far enough to lead to abuse.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

If I live in western Ukraine or Belarus for example, I'd probably run to Poland or Lithuania while burning my property so that they can't take any of it, or if I lived anywhere else, yes but with deep hate against the CPSU and I'd only do it for my own safety - not for "the good of the Soviet Union" or some bullcrap. Now you seem like a person who would say "But Stalin knows better!"

This was your analogy. I would obey the state even if it was a horrible dictatorship, because I would fear the punishment. And that's what I'm saying small children should do: obey their parents on things the parent considers particularly important. For fear of a punishment.

Do you believe in any punishments for small children (say 3yo or older)?

See, children are stupid, they're a blank slate. YOU CAN INSTILL WHATEVER VALUES YOU WANT IN THEM, and those better be good ones. And also, you are LITERALLY advocating authority through fear. Forcing your will to change children's minds is ineffective at best and would backfire at worst, but changing children's minds to "force your will" (consider that the parent is well-intentioned in both scenarios) would be more ethical and more effective. In conflicts where the answer in terms of ethics is clear, it's because the unethical option is more effective that they get considered at all. Spanking is neither effective nor ethical.

[-Astoria]

Not all parents know best. But a lot more do spank their kids, than the number who have their kids run away or (lol) kill them.

What is so "lol" about someone taking their life?

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

Certainly parents cannot be blamed if, in case of necessity, they give a bump or a spank to a particularly disobedient or rude child.

That said, it is always common sense to understand if these acts go far enough to lead to abuse.

How disobedient/rude is the point when a child becomes particularly disobedient/rude? You can't just say something exceeds a threshold before pointing out the threshold first.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

Not all parents know best. But a lot more do spank their kids, than the number who have their kids run away or (lol) kill them.

What is so "lol" about someone taking their life?

I don't know, murders aren't a laughing matter, and so are suicides.

[Alessandretta]

Certainly parents cannot be blamed if, in case of necessity, they give a bump or a spank to a particularly disobedient or rude child.

That said, it is always common sense to understand if these acts go far enough to lead to abuse.

How disobedient/rude is the point when a child becomes particularly disobedient/rude? You can't just say something exceeds a threshold before pointing out the threshold first.

I know today is something that is no longer in fashion, but you can always use common sense

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

How disobedient/rude is the point when a child becomes particularly disobedient/rude? You can't just say something exceeds a threshold before pointing out the threshold first.

I know today is something that is no longer in fashion, but you can always use common sense

True, yet some people lack them. And what you deem "common sense" is unthinkable for others. The only things we agree on probably are that murder is wrong, thus it disproves your statement.

[Rojava Free State]

Only people I hit are those who hit me first and have the capability to either run away or fight me. So nah, I don't hit kids even if they're mine.

[Servilis]

One of the eternal debates is whether parents have the right to physically chastise their children to punish them for misbehaviour, and the mass hooliganism of mostly young 'protesting' adults lately in the UK in which public property has been destroyed and police assaulted with missiles has revived the debate.
There are some older people, including me, who understand intuitively this violent antisocial behaviour springs from impulses which were unchecked in childhoods where traditional parental discipline was absent. We have seen the pragmatic common-sense upon which corporal punishment is based and the total, inalienable authority of parents over their children that enables it, superseded by the notion of inalienable human rights which has become enshrined in law, making physical punishment a form of child abuse.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... viral.html

Is this child abuse? The Caribbean mother of the girl aged twelve defended her behaviour to the media by explaining her daughter had been unmanageable since her husband abandoned his family. Despite seeking psychological intervention for her daughter, her behaviour had escalated and that she had hit her daughter with a belt in the last resort after discovering she had been exchanging sexually charged messages and indecent photographs on Facebook with a teenage boy who she had met at school.
Her daughter has since apparently learnt the errors of her behaviour. In a message to the media, she said she was sorry for the shame which her behaviour had inflicted upon her mother, and had a message of appeal for other girls to learn from the video of her beating.

You are a special piece of God’s puzzle.And don’t let what happen to me happen to you also.

It is well known that both Hitler and Stalin were berated by their fathers when they were young, although Hitler's case wasn't the entire reason if not not even most of the reason behind his violent behavior.
Stalin's case was however a major factor in his behavior.


His father abused him quite a lot that it left a mental scar on him.
He became paranoid, so when enough suspicion between his associates spread up, he immediately thought it to be a threat to his leadership.
His paranoia made him so suspicious of Kulaks in Ukraine that instead of just attacking only the Kulaks, he decided to starve Ukrainians in general (this is called the Holodomyr)


Overall, although these examples are quite cliche, I can look around my family and already notice sour spots.
My Half Brother was Corporally Punished in his upbringing, that during an incident last year, when I was having an argument with my family, my brother started to look threatening, and so I moved back and he thought I was going to attack my mother, needless to say he literally demobilized my right arm, I was in an arm cast for a while until my arm recovered enough for me to actually rotate it enough for it to be useful.


Point is, you can look to torture principles and find that Corporal Punishment can get your goals completed.
The thing is, your victim is most likely going to despise you and won't learn from it.

And depending on the integrity of the victim, you may have to dish out more than one punishment in order to get answers.

Same goes for Corporal Punishment regarding children.
You can smack them a bunch, it will solve short term problems but create long term problems.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

I know today is something that is no longer in fashion, but you can always use common sense

Also not in fashion: judgement.

You know if I use that it wouldn't match up with your viewpoints, it's not like what you think lol. We do not live in a one-party state where everyone thinks the same, and that's okay and inevitable, but it crosses the line when your viewpoint advocate for damage towards a person, whether physical or mental.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

Only people I hit are those who hit me first and have the capability to either run away or fight me. So nah, I don't hit kids even if they're mine.

Saying spanking is justified is like saying a dictator can throw people in gulags or genocide ethnicities because it's in their borders or some shit. And yes, I agree with you in this case.

[Rojava Free State]

Only people I hit are those who hit me first and have the capability to either run away or fight me. So nah, I don't hit kids even if they're mine.

Saying spanking is justified is like saying a dictator can throw people in gulags or genocide ethnicities because it's in their borders or some shit. And yes, I agree with you in this case.

What does it say if you beat your kids into submission? That violence is the answer. Like how can you tell your son not to beat on his wife when you hit him with a belt as a kid? You basically let him know that if someone pisses you off, you can just strike them.

[Elevanos]

Have you ever seen the thing on Reddit where it says that strict parents think that they're teaching you how to behave, but then all the stuff they're really teaching (i.e., how to listen for footsteps, appear busy, etc.)? Well it's kind of like that. The kids will probably learn that they can solve their problems with violence, and it's little matter that it could be repeated slapping or whatever other corporal punishment their parents used. And when those relationships become fragile because of fear, we have studies that have shown that the leading factor in unsuccessful lives is not having a 2 parent and together household. So what does that say? Not only will any abuse possibly correlate to violence carried out by the children, but as well, the fear in the children may be a cause for them to commit crimes, fail school, never get a job (things that would probably incite more beatings if they were still living in their parents' home), and then there are millions of kids around the world who are unable to conform into the world.

Of course there are some people who turned out fine after growing up in a corporal punishment household, and that is a very common case, but if it's illegal to hit someone who is an adult and you are an adult, or even if you hit a child that is not your child as an adult, and you'll likely go to prison for assault (assault of a minor on a child, which has a more prolonged sentence in almost every case), why can you hit a child that is in your direct bloodline?

[Alessandretta]

I know today is something that is no longer in fashion, but you can always use common sense

Also not in fashion: judgement.

Right, think It Is a better term to define It.

[Dylar]

Depends on the punishment and depends on the reason for the punishment. For example: spanking. Spanking a kid because he won't be quiet when you're suffering from a migraine is not fine. In fact, that's child abuse. Spanking a kid for not doing what he's told to do is fine, but only if all other forms of non-physical punishment have been exercised.

[Rojava Free State]

My parents never hit me, but my peers did, and the only thing it taught me was violence is the answer. I didn't get my own violence issues under control till age 16 when I almost died, so I really don't wanna make my kids think what I thought as a teen.

[Ariain]

You should only hit a child if they did something like drive your car when they are 12 or something. But if that happens you have bigger issues like "How the duck did that happen?"

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

My parents never hit me, but my peers did, and the only thing it taught me was violence is the answer. I didn't get my own violence issues under control till age 16 when I almost died, so I really don't wanna make my kids think what I thought as a teen.

If my parents hit me, I would have probably done unspeakable things by age 11 or 12. Thankfully they didn't, so they have a pretty good relationship with me.

[Vivolkha]

Corporal punishment has been repeatedly proven to have harmful effects on children, so it's only common sense to ban it. That said, it should be obvious that the lack of corporal punishment alone does not automatically make good parenting.

[Thermodolia]

The thing is, who gets to decide what is "wrong"? Is voting for Trump wrong? How about accidentally making a hammer and sickle sign using hand gestures?

The kind of things little kids do are quite easy to judge right or wrong. Hitting your little sister is wrong, that gets a spanking. Running around the house with no clothes on, not so wrong, no spanking.

Being sent to the corner is just as effective though

[Thermodolia]

Have you ever seen the thing on Reddit where it says that strict parents think that they're teaching you how to behave, but then all the stuff they're really teaching (i.e., how to listen for footsteps, appear busy, etc.)? Well it's kind of like that. The kids will probably learn that they can solve their problems with violence, and it's little matter that it could be repeated slapping or whatever other corporal punishment their parents used. And when those relationships become fragile because of fear, we have studies that have shown that the leading factor in unsuccessful lives is not having a 2 parent and together household. So what does that say? Not only will any abuse possibly correlate to violence carried out by the children, but as well, the fear in the children may be a cause for them to commit crimes, fail school, never get a job (things that would probably incite more beatings if they were still living in their parents' home), and then there are millions of kids around the world who are unable to conform into the world.

Of course there are some people who turned out fine after growing up in a corporal punishment household, and that is a very common case, but if it's illegal to hit someone who is an adult and you are an adult, or even if you hit a child that is not your child as an adult, and you'll likely go to prison for assault (assault of a minor on a child, which has a more prolonged sentence in almost every case), why can you hit a child that is in your direct bloodline?

Oh man does the listen to footsteps and appear to be busy ring true for my childhood.

[Sapporo Hyperspace Riftgate Laboratory]

The kind of things little kids do are quite easy to judge right or wrong. Hitting your little sister is wrong, that gets a spanking. Running around the house with no clothes on, not so wrong, no spanking.

Being sent to the corner is just as effective though

true, and it's more ethical as well