Is Antifa a terrorist group and should it be banned?

[Atheris]

North Korea has elections and it's a republic. I don't see the problem.

Its democracy is a farce and by all accounts it's a monarchy by another name.

It was an obvious joke, mein Freund.

[Proctopeo]

Its democracy is a farce and by all accounts it's a monarchy by another name.

It was an obvious joke, mein Freund.

It's hard to tell on the Internet.

[Atheris]

It was an obvious joke, mein Freund.

It's hard to tell on the Internet.

Good point.

[Picairn]

It's hard to tell on the Internet.

That's why a sarcastic font is badly needed.

[Proctopeo]

It's hard to tell on the Internet.

That's why a sarcastic font is badly needed.

There is the irony mark: "⸮". That, or just going /sarcasm.

[Cisairse]

There is no "identity" of antifa. You are an antifa if you oppose fascism.

And North Korea is still a democratic republic. Labels don't mean anything if they have been abused and their nature hijacked by other radical groups.

North Korea is a discrete entity. You can point to the government of North Korea and say, "this is the government of North Korea." From that standpoint, you can make judgements about whether they live up to their name.

There is no discrete "Antifa" organization. You can't say "Antifa doesn't live up to its name!" because there is no "Antifa."

[Kedri]

I don't like Antifa at all, but I don't think membership should be banned. Freedom of association and all that. We should arrest those that do assault others, though.

[Kowani]

I don't like Antifa at all, but I don't think membership should be banned. Freedom of association and all that. We should arrest those that do assault others, though.

You can’t ban “membership” in Antifa because there is no organization in which to become a member beyond the local level. For example, Seattle Antifa, and day, Queens Antifa, have no organizational contact.

[Strahcoin]

I don't like Antifa at all, but I don't think membership should be banned. Freedom of association and all that. We should arrest those that do assault others, though.

I understand and sympathize with that point. However, if the group/movement is centered around, and commonly practices, terrorism, then shouldn't there be limits to freedom for association - just like how freedom of speech does not extend to directly advocating for murder/assault of innocents?

For example, ISIS is declared a terrorist organization as a whole, even if there might be peaceful individuals who associate with it yet don't wish to harm anyone (for example, if they were forced to join). Also, maybe there are peaceful individuals who associate with the KKK, yet the group/movement is centered around, and commonly practices, white-supremacist terrorism, so (I think) it should be banned. The same should apply to Antifa.

[Picairn]

North Korea is a discrete entity. You can point to the government of North Korea and say, "this is the government of North Korea." From that standpoint, you can make judgements about whether they live up to their name.

There is no discrete "Antifa" organization. You can't say "Antifa doesn't live up to its name!" because there is no "Antifa."

Here we go with semantics. Antifa may not be a permanent organization, but it rallies behind a common cause and use peer-to-peer network and social media to communicate and organize events. That makes Antifa a movement or more precisely, a group.

This group and its name are one of the most recognizable things in the US. If there is no "Antifa", then why when you invoke the name, people immediately know what group that is - a militant anarcho-communist group? Why not any other group of people who is also anti-fascist? Or is it what it is, a movement mainly created by communists, infamous for their violent activities?

[Necroghastia]

North Korea is a discrete entity. You can point to the government of North Korea and say, "this is the government of North Korea." From that standpoint, you can make judgements about whether they live up to their name.

There is no discrete "Antifa" organization. You can't say "Antifa doesn't live up to its name!" because there is no "Antifa."

Here we go with semantics. Antifa may not be a permanent organization, but it rallies behind a common cause and use peer-to-peer network and social media to communicate and organize events. That makes Antifa a movement or more precisely, a group.

This group and its name are one of the most recognizable things in the US. If there is no "Antifa", then why when you invoke the name, people immediately know what group that is - a militant anarcho-communist group? Why not any other group of people who is also anti-fascist? Or is it what it is, a movement mainly created by communists, infamous for their violent activities?

But that's not what group that is. Antifa activists are hardly limited to "militant anarcho-communists."

[Cisairse]

North Korea is a discrete entity. You can point to the government of North Korea and say, "this is the government of North Korea." From that standpoint, you can make judgements about whether they live up to their name.

There is no discrete "Antifa" organization. You can't say "Antifa doesn't live up to its name!" because there is no "Antifa."

Here we go with semantics. Antifa may not be a permanent organization, but it rallies behind a common cause and use peer-to-peer network and social media to communicate and organize events. That makes Antifa a movement or more precisely, a group.

This group and its name are one of the most recognizable things in the US. If there is no "Antifa", then why when you invoke the name, people immediately know what group that is - a militant anarcho-communist group? Why not any other group of people who is also anti-fascist? Or is it what it is, a movement mainly created by communists, infamous for their violent activities?

Again, you have a flawed conception of what antifa is. Antifa is not a group; antifa is an idea, and an associate movement of people who identify with the idea. It is not a group.

It is not my problem if many people have a deeply flawed view of the world.

[Paleocacher]

Although there are allegations that Antifa is an organized movement, (most notable among the alleged boogeymen responsible for their actions is the billionaire George Soros) there is not much hard evidence to support this.

So designating them a terrorist organization and banning them wouldn't really do much. They are mostly loosely organized local groups of radical activists whose actions are coordinated on the deep web. They are similar to Anonymous in this way. That way there is no specific organization or hierarchy for law enforcement to target.

Antifa in many of its actions fits the definition of a terrorist organization.
Terrorist: a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

Looting stores, burning down buildings, and assaulting people you disagree with are all acts of terrorism when they are done under the guise of a political agenda. Members of Antifa have done these things.

Rather ironically, I realized something. The largest neo-nazi organization in the US has less than 500 members. The KKK has less than five thousand. Nationwide there are at most a few tens of thousands of people who are members of far-right hate organizations. Yet these people are portrayed as the ultimate boogeymen. While they certainly commit acts of violence, (the El Paso shooting comes to mind) they for the most part only occasionally rally and gather to promote their views. When they gather there are only a few hundred of them at a time and they don't generally engage in violence. For all the hate they preach against Jews, Blacks, abortion doctors and such they don't practice it much other than isolated cases.

Whereas Antifa, who claim to be antifascist and against Nazis, regularly act like Nazis. One of the most notable pre-WW2 acts of violence against Jews in Germany was the Kristallnacht. Nazi Brownshirts incited crowds of people to loot and burn Jewish owned businesses. Antifa has hijacked peaceful protests and started looting and burning buildings. They assault people who speak out against them. They act more like Nazis than the actual Neo-Nazi groups do.

It must be universally known that a distinction must be drawn between the radical, violent left-wing activists represented by Antifa and the regular everyday people, the people who are marching and trying to affect genuine change without violence. The peaceful protesters should be supported by the media and the government and the people trying to hijack their message should be condemned.

[Picairn]

Again, you have a flawed conception of what antifa is. Antifa is not a group; antifa is an idea, and an associate movement of people who identify with the idea. It is not a group.

Antifa is an idea that has active followers rallying behind it, which makes it a movement, and its followers a group. Is a movement not a group of people with a unified cause? Do you say the labor movement in the 19th century, which concentrated around clear goals, policies and aims, was not a group either? Don't be ridiculous.

It is not my problem if many people have a deeply flawed view of the world.

And it is not my problem that some people subtitute their opinions as facts, or playing semantics to downplay the actions of a violent group.

[Cisairse]

Again, you have a flawed conception of what antifa is. Antifa is not a group; antifa is an idea, and an associate movement of people who identify with the idea. It is not a group.

Antifa is an idea that has active followers rallying behind it, which makes it a movement, and its followers a group. Is a movement not a group of people with a unified cause? Do you say the labor movement in the 19th century, which concentrated around clear goals, policies and aims, was not a group either? Don't be ridiculous.

It is not my problem if many people have a deeply flawed view of the world.

And it is not my problem that some people subtitute their opinions as facts, or playing semantics to downplay the actions of a violent group.

Feel free to prove that antifa is somehow a "violent group" despite not being an organized group.

[Picairn]

Feel free to prove that antifa is somehow a "violent group" despite not being an organized group.

Sure, it is a movement with followers rallying behind a common cause and using of social media to organize events. That's as much a group as it gets.

Feel free to tell me "It's not a movement" with a straight face.

[Cisairse]

Feel free to prove that antifa is somehow a "violent group" despite not being an organized group.

Sure, it is a movement with followers rallying behind a common cause and using of social media to organize events. That's as much a group as it gets.

Feel free to tell me "It's not a movement" with a straight face.

I've read your post six times and I can't find any proof that antifa is a violent group in it.

[Picairn]

I've read your post six times and I can't find any proof that antifa is a violent group in it.

Are you living under a rock? This thread alone provided massive proof for your demand.

[Pangurstan]

So designating them a terrorist organization and banning them wouldn't really do much. They are mostly loosely organized local groups of radical activists whose actions are coordinated on the deep web. They are similar to Anonymous in this way. That way there is no specific organization or hierarchy for law enforcement to target.

Antifa member is vague enough to make banning Antifa a great excuse for Trump to arrest his political opponents.

Antifa in many of its actions fits the definition of a terrorist organization.
Terrorist: a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

To be a terrorist organization, antifa has to be an organization

Looting stores, burning down buildings, and assaulting people you disagree with are all acts of terrorism when they are done under the guise of a political agenda. Members of Antifa have done these things.

They’ve attacked neo-nazis, but haven’t done the other 2

Rather ironically, I realized something. The largest neo-nazi organization in the US has less than 500 members. The KKK has less than five thousand. Nationwide there are at most a few tens of thousands of people who are members of far-right hate organizations. Yet these people are portrayed as the ultimate boogeymen. While they certainly commit acts of violence, (the El Paso shooting comes to mind) they for the most part only occasionally rally and gather to promote their views. When they gather there are only a few hundred of them at a time and they don't generally engage in violence. For all the hate they preach against Jews, Blacks, abortion doctors and such they don't practice it much other than isolated cases.

For people “who don’t generally engage in violence,” they do shoot a lot of people. Do you remember Charlottesville? Where the neo-nazis were so peaceful that they hit a woman with a car while driving into a crowd.

Whereas Antifa, who claim to be antifascist and against Nazis, regularly act like Nazis. One of the most notable pre-WW2 acts of violence against Jews in Germany was the Kristallnacht. Nazi Brownshirts incited crowds of people to loot and burn Jewish owned businesses. Antifa has hijacked peaceful protests and started looting and burning buildings.

There’s no evidence to support the claim that antifa is behind the rioting

They assault people who speak out against them. They act more like Nazis than the actual Neo-Nazi groups do.

So the people who chant “gas the jews” are less nazi than the people protesting them?

[Liriena]

Whereas Antifa, who claim to be antifascist and against Nazis, regularly act like Nazis. One of the most notable pre-WW2 acts of violence against Jews in Germany was the Kristallnacht. Nazi Brownshirts incited crowds of people to loot and burn Jewish owned businesses. Antifa has hijacked peaceful protests and started looting and burning buildings. They assault people who speak out against them. They act more like Nazis than the actual Neo-Nazi groups do.

This is an association fallacy, and a historically idiotic one at that. Nazis didn't invent political violence, nor are they the sole intellectual proprietors of it.

[Atheris]

Whereas Antifa, who claim to be antifascist and against Nazis, regularly act like Nazis. One of the most notable pre-WW2 acts of violence against Jews in Germany was the Kristallnacht. Nazi Brownshirts incited crowds of people to loot and burn Jewish owned businesses. Antifa has hijacked peaceful protests and started looting and burning buildings. They assault people who speak out against them. They act more like Nazis than the actual Neo-Nazi groups do.

That's just... wrong. As Liriena said, the Nazis didn't invent political violence and weren't the only ones who used it. To add onto that, Kristallnacht wasn't caused by just mad groups of people who didn't like Jews. It was a pogrom that was enacted and supported by the German government. Antifa isn't supported by any government.

[Cisairse]

"Antifa are the real fa!" is such a Fox News-tier take that I wouldn't even bother posting about it if Paleocacher didn't also falsely claim that Antifa is "looting and burning buildings."

Antifa isn't "looting and burning buildings." Stop getting all your info from OANN lmao.

[The Volnaya Territoriya]

A few things:

1. The argument that "Antifa isn't just limited to evil mean anarchists and commies! There are many who are just liberal democrats and make graffiti art of Putin and Trump kissing and stuff!" is a great reminder to leftists that liberals are never truly your friends.

2. The fact that conservatives are so eager to see a diverse movement of various organizations, groups and ideological tendencies blanket criminalized and given the boot of the DHS just so that their important Ben Shapiro lectures can go unmolested is a great reason why we don't have laws for classifying groups as domestic terrorists. If given that power, virtually every major environmentalist, antifascist and Black Lives Matter group would be outlawed as "domestic terrorists" by the GOP by now.

[Slavakino]

North Korea has elections and it's a republic. I don't see the problem.

Its democracy is a farce and by all accounts it's a monarchy by another name.

HAIL THE JUCHE

[Slavakino]

Antifa when they see a PGM by an F-15E landing on top of CHAZ