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What if the Koreas were opposite governments?

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Tokora
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What if the Koreas were opposite governments?

Postby Tokora » Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:15 pm

Let's say that in the late 70's Park Chung-Hee is never assassinated and a group of North Korean generals decide that they disagree with Kim Il-Song's succession plan and successfully oust him with Chinese backing. South Korea remains a capitalist dictatorship vying for legitimacy with the occasional white terror while North Korea follows the lead of Deng and Gorbachev eventually becoming a democratic-socialist state. What effect does this have on east-asian politics with the US needing to prop up the South while China gets the easy job of a sane neighbor, if not ally?

I can see America's support for democracy becoming even further suspect and North Korea normalizing relations with the rest of the world but other than that I'm not sure what else would change.
Last edited by Tokora on Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Gensokyo Soviet Fairies Republic
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Postby Gensokyo Soviet Fairies Republic » Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:20 pm

South Korea becomes an obscure East Asian nation, with no cute girl and boy idol bands to brag about.

North Korea's sexiest and best girl band however - The Moranbong Band, composed of cute teenage schoolgirls guided by the immortal science of Juche, becomes the world's newest hip pop sensation!
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Postby Sundiata » Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:34 pm

Gensokyo Soviet Fairies Republic wrote:North Korea's sexiest and best girl band however - The Moranbong Band, composed of cute teenage schoolgirls guided by the immortal science of Juche, becomes the world's newest hip pop sensation!

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Cisairse
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Postby Cisairse » Sun Jun 07, 2020 5:20 pm

Tokora wrote:Let's say that in the late 70's Park Chung-Hee is never assassinated and a group of North Korean generals disagree with Kim Il-Song's succession plan. South Korea remains a capitalist dictatorship vying for legitimacy with the occasional white terror while North Korea follows the lead of Deng and Gorbachev eventually becoming a democratic-socialist state. What effect does this have on east-asian politics with the US needing to prop up the South while China gets the easy job of a sane neighbor, if not ally?

I can see America's support for democracy becoming even further suspect and North Korea normalizing relations with the rest of the world but other than that I'm not sure what else would change.

Are we really calling Shock and Awe and Dengism "democratic socialism" now?
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Shanghai industrial complex
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Postby Shanghai industrial complex » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:45 pm

:eyebrow: What means of opposite governments?A capitalist government like South Korea?Wow,the upheaval in East Asia.With the collapse of the Soviet Union, it is not impossible.But I think it's mainly because the four Asian countries have the tradition of centralization and the capitalist camp in Asia is relatively weak.But it's really strange. Only North Korea is still fighting for ideology, and the other three countries have embraced the market economy.And the North Korean regime is clearly out of the essence of socialism.
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Luziyca
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Postby Luziyca » Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:27 pm

I don't think that's what opposite governments mean.

Anyway, K-pop would probably be a niche thing at best, and those #AllLivesMatter and #BlueLivesMatter tags would still be considered by Twitter to be politics, not K-pop.
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Voxija
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Postby Voxija » Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:45 pm

I created a timeline like this once. North Korea was a social democratic hippie state and South Korea was the military dictatorship it once was. South Korea took over North Korea and turned into a horrible corporatist dictatorship that kidnaps kids to turn them into K pop idols.
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Postby South Reinkalistan » Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:07 pm

To be honest, it'd probably be better for world peace. Watching the Americans squirm and try to justify their support of the south would be amusing as well, I guess. The only issue would be if authoritarian Chinese influences subvert the democratic socialist process in North Korea.
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-Astoria
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Postby -Astoria » Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:10 pm

If the US could defend Pinochet's Chile, then they could defend the South from criticism; *maybe* it'd be a better timeline.

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Feyrisshire
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Postby Feyrisshire » Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:13 pm

-Astoria wrote:If the US could defend Pinochet's Chile, then they could defend the South from criticism; *maybe* it'd be a better timeline.


The US is defending Islamic fundamentalist regimes in the Middle East, this really wouldn't be an issue.
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:02 pm

It would have been a lot colder when I was stationed there.
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Tokora
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Postby Tokora » Mon Jun 08, 2020 4:05 pm

Cisairse wrote:Are we really calling Shock and Awe and Dengism "democratic socialism" now?

I just used examples to illustrate North Korea reforming at all. Unlike the USSR it doesn't collapse, and unlike China those reforms lead to an actual democracy.

Shanghai industrial complex wrote::eyebrow: What means of opposite governments?A capitalist government like South Korea?Wow,the upheaval in East Asia.With the collapse of the Soviet Union, it is not impossible.But I think it's mainly because the four Asian countries have the tradition of centralization and the capitalist camp in Asia is relatively weak.But it's really strange. Only North Korea is still fighting for ideology, and the other three countries have embraced the market economy.And the North Korean regime is clearly out of the essence of socialism.

I meant as in opposite forms of government with North Korea becoming a democracy and South Korea remaining a totalitarian dictatorship. North Korea is still socialist anywhere between remaining state-planned to an Asian Sweden while South Korea is still capitalist but with the anyone advocating any semblance of reform labeled a communist and thrown from a helicopter.

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Purpelia
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Postby Purpelia » Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:39 am

The DPRK could newer become anything more liberal than the PRC on account of the fact that it is a PRC vassal. And before that it was a Stalinist vassal. Not having the war happen at all would not really have changed things there. At most we could have ended up with a much richer and prosperous mini China.
Last edited by Purpelia on Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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The above post contains hyperbole, metaphoric language, embellishment and exaggeration. It may also include badly translated figures of speech and misused idioms. Analyze accordingly.

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Tokora
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Postby Tokora » Tue Jun 09, 2020 3:55 pm

Purpelia wrote:The DPRK could newer become anything more liberal than the PRC on account of the fact that it is a PRC vassal. And before that it was a Stalinist vassal. Not having the war happen at all would not really have changed things there. At most we could have ended up with a much richer and prosperous mini China.

Is there anything that would've notably changed with mini China sharing a border with US backed mini imperial Japan? Also the war still happened, things don't change until the Park Chung-hee assassination.

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Tokora
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Postby Tokora » Wed Jun 10, 2020 3:51 pm

I just thought the reversal would be interesting to think about.


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