US Anti-Police Protests and Riots Thread II

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Wtf? Protesting is not against the law? Why would the police think "protesting" is bad?

Because they're protesting against the police.

Or they're following orders from superiors who think the voting public likes this sort of thing, either/or.

I'm still wondering about whether or not it constitutes extortion, though; and if it does, why it isn't being opposed from that angle rather than the 1st amendment violation one.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

I doubt it. How many suicides do you think are committed with reckless disregard for whether others die?

Try every single case of Murder\Suicide?

One or two percent then?

There's also "suicide by cop". A suicidal person who doesn't have a gun (or is hesitating to use it) might attack a cop in the expectation they will be killed. That in no way implies they would attack a social worker ... because the social worker doesn't obviously have a gun, nor a reputation for shooting people who attack them.

People who Suicide by cop don't want a social worker, they want a cop, they'll likely just shoot at social worker so they'll be forced to call the cops.

And then the Cops will shoot them then It's just Suicide by cops with extra trauma for the Social Worker.

Very imaginative. So the only response to the report of a suicidal person should be "they MIGHT be one of those scarce people who would commit suicide by cop instead of killing themselves, therefore social workers should never be sent only police".

See what I'm getting at is that police or social workers have no way of knowing from a citizen report, whether it's appropriate to send a gentle person who knows how to talk things over, or a violent person who is going to precipitate a death one way or the other. If social workers are prepared to do this work (without police standing in sight behind them) then why on earth would the default be the way that saves fewest lives?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

I doubt it. How many suicides do you think are committed with reckless disregard for whether others die?

A significant amount tends to jump in front of a train or car or from a building. All are dangers to others. At best it "merely" causes inconvenience (and a trauma for the driver).

A significant amount you say. How many is that?

And haven't we been through all this in the coronavirus thread? Putting a stranger's life at risk is not murder, and you'd struggle to show the suicidal person was targetting a particular individual when they jumped.

One more thing, how likely is jumping in front of a train to derail said train?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Btw, legalizing suicide might help. Wouldn't cost a cent.

[The Alma Mater]

One more thing, how likely is jumping in front of a train to derail said train?

Derail ? It only needs to brake - people tend to get hurt from being inside a vehicle that tries to stop abrubtly. It is not like people wear seatbelts in trains (or busses).

As to the ratio I would have to look it up - I believe it was about 1 in 20. Drugoverdoses being the main.

And I ofc still disagree with the silly and repugnant notion that recklessly endangering others makes one innocent of the consequences.
Heck, I still believe that not doing anything to prevent bad things happening makes one guilty.

[Loben III]

Btw, legalizing suicide might help. Wouldn't cost a cent.

except funeral costs, cleaning up the mess, etc etc.

[-Astoria-]

Btw, legalizing suicide might help. Wouldn't cost a cent.

...is this a joke?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Btw, legalizing suicide might help. Wouldn't cost a cent.

except funeral costs, cleaning up the mess, etc etc.

I would expect you of all people to understand what I meant. It wouldn't cost a cent for government.

It is logically impossible to prosecute someone for their own suicide. Yet this law hasn't been struck down as Biblical nonsense.

Perhaps you'd like to speculate why? Is there still a good reason, or is it just "to show society's disapproval" or such bunk ...

[-Astoria-]

It is logically impossible to prosecute someone for their own suicide. Yet this law hasn't been struck down as Biblical nonsense.

Attempted suicide called.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Btw, legalizing suicide might help. Wouldn't cost a cent.

...is this a joke?

No, not really. Suicidal people might be more inclined to see a cop as "there to help", and less as a threat to them, if they didn't feel guilty about being caught committing (or about to commit) a crime.

I've been suicidal and at the time it felt wrong. It felt like a "sin" (though I was not raised at all religious), as a betrayal of anyone who might like you. While all these feelings are healthy, as they work against the act of suicide, they also put the suicidal person in a place where an armed cop looks like the intervention you least want: being arrested.

If children were raised with moral inhibitions against suicide (which is easier than it sounds: it's hardly more than an adaptation of the will to live we all have) then nothing more is necessary. The inhibition may not be enough, they may develop mental health problems in teenage years or a little later, and kill themselves. But one thing which will not help is to have the thought "on no, I'm committing a crime" as one of the loops and eddies of thought. Nobody is going to get a handle on sanity and self interest, contemplating the government imprisoning them after they're dead.

[Ifreann]

Black Lives Matters protesters could face life sentence for mischief charges in Utah



So life in prison for throwing paint around as an act of protest. Seems perfectly proportional. </s>

"Could" being the operative word here.

Attorney Brent Huff, who is representing co-defendant Madison Alleman, said the charges are the highest degree felony in the state.

“This is usually reserved for murders and rapists,” Huff said.

Salt Lake County District Attorney Sim Gill defended the elevated charges while downplaying the possibility of a life sentence, saying, “I don’t think anyone is going to be going to prison on this.”

Doesn't seem like they are pushing for life in prison. Perhaps the next time they protest, do so sans paint and smashing windows.

Personally I think it'd be better if the response to state injustice was resistance, not capitulation, but I understand that you might think differently.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

It is logically impossible to prosecute someone for their own suicide. Yet this law hasn't been struck down as Biblical nonsense.

Attempted suicide called.

Welcome back to life! You now have a criminal record, you don't have to thank us.

[-Astoria-]

No, not really.

...no?

[Nobel Hobos 2]

No, not really.

...no?

Not joking.
Other than giving police a reason to arrest someone who is attempting suicide, what do you think is good about a law against suicide?

[Thermodolia]

Pigs are out executing people again

I’m getting sick and tired of this shit.

[Des-Bal]

"Remember, only protest in government approved ways."

Correct that to "only protest in ways that the government has not made illegal" because of the whole nulla poena sine lege deal and there's nothing wrong with it. That's exactly how it should be. "I was protesting" does not excuse otherwise criminal behavior.

[Des-Bal]

Not joking.
Other than giving police a reason to arrest someone who is attempting suicide, what do you think is good about a law against suicide?

Suicide is not a crime, there is no punishment for it. Police respond to suicides to stop someone who is a threat to their own life and possibly the lives of others.

[Ifreann]

Pigs are out executing people again

I’m getting sick and tired of this shit.

This content is not available in my country.

[Des-Bal]

Pigs are out executing people again

I’m getting sick and tired of this shit.

This content is not available in my country.

Video of a guy getting killed, seriously

Pretty fucked.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Not joking.
Other than giving police a reason to arrest someone who is attempting suicide, what do you think is good about a law against suicide?

Suicide is not a crime, there is no punishment for it. Police respond to suicides to stop someone who is a threat to their own life and possibly the lives of others.

Hmm. Seems my knowledge on that was badly out of date.

Still, a lot of people interpret police on their doorstep as them being in trouble. That's a bad first step to treating them.
"Come with us, we'll look after you" comes across differently from someone in a uniform and a gun on their hip.

I got into this subject trying to rebut the assertion that people who are a danger to themselves are so likely to be a danger to others, that police are the only appropriate responders. I'd just like to finish by saying that details of the report, and any background the police or social services have on the person, would point to most cases where the police ARE the best option. And if the police have the time to attend nearby but out of sight, in case a social worker needs their help, that would be good too.

[Loben III]

except funeral costs, cleaning up the mess, etc etc.

I would expect you of all people to understand what I meant. It wouldn't cost a cent for government.

It is logically impossible to prosecute someone for their own suicide. Yet this law hasn't been struck down as Biblical nonsense.

Perhaps you'd like to speculate why? Is there still a good reason, or is it just "to show society's disapproval" or such bunk ...

i am talking about the people that would have to deal with it.

[Liriena]

Pigs are out executing people again

I’m getting sick and tired of this shit.

Every "good" cop, if they exist, has a moral, human responsibility to either publicly denounce their peers or quit their job in shame.

[Cordel One]

Pigs are out executing people again

I’m getting sick and tired of this shit.

Every "good" cop, if they exist, has a moral, human responsibility to either publicly denounce their peers or quit their job in shame.

it doesn't matter if you are a good person, the moment you put on that badge you're obligated to act as part of a corrupt and oppressive system.
This isn't quite "all x are y", right?

[Liriena]

Every "good" cop, if they exist, has a moral, human responsibility to either publicly denounce their peers or quit their job in shame.

it doesn't matter if you are a good person, the moment you put on that badge you're obligated to act as part of a corrupt and oppressive system.
This isn't quite "all x are y", right?

The four-letter acronym is banned here iirc, but not expressing that particular opinion the way you did.

[Greed and Death]

https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/blm-p ... -sentence/

BLM protesters are looking at life sentences.