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World without police?

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The Marlborough
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Founded: May 27, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Marlborough » Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:49 pm

Neanderthaland wrote:We could just build police robots.

You Have 20 Seconds To Comply.

They tried that and it killed itself.
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The New California Republic
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Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:51 pm

Neanderthaland wrote:We could just build police robots.

You Have 20 Seconds To Comply.

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The Great Imperator Jeffrey
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Founded: Jun 23, 2018
Corporate Police State

Postby The Great Imperator Jeffrey » Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:51 pm

How about we put televisions that double up as cameras in every room of your house and everywhere in public (we'll call them telescreens). If you are caught doing any crime or even conspiring to do a crime, the Thought Police will make you disappear overnight.
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Tokora
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Founded: Oct 08, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tokora » Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:03 pm

Personally I prefer retraining over abolition.

Mzeusia wrote:In times before a proper police force, the army was used, and slaves in ancient Greece had some policing responsibilities.

I'd love to see the irony of the South keeping their slaves only to find out that the police are black now. Let's see how worth it slavery is then. :p

Cetacea wrote:The French Gendamerie and Italian Carabinieri seem to work okay as part of the Defence Forces. As do those of the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain and most civilized countriers around the world.
Really I think the Police should be considered the branch of the military and trained as peacekeepers with an emphasis on protection of the vulnerable, human rights and humanitarian assistance, community mentoring, communication and negotiation skills, crisis management and de-escalation, first aid and personal safety.

Not a horrible idea.

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Upper-Africa
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Founded: Oct 07, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Upper-Africa » Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:08 pm

The Great Imperator Jeffrey wrote:How about we put televisions that double up as cameras in every room of your house and everywhere in public (we'll call them telescreens). If you are caught doing any crime or even conspiring to do a crime, the Thought Police will make you disappear overnight.

:twisted: The solution to every problem.
Last edited by Upper-Africa on Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Gig em Aggies
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Founded: Aug 15, 2009
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Gig em Aggies » Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:14 pm

Upper-Africa wrote:
The Great Imperator Jeffrey wrote:How about we put televisions that double up as cameras in every room of your house and everywhere in public (we'll call them telescreens). If you are caught doing any crime or even conspiring to do a crime, the Thought Police will make you disappear overnight.

:twisted: The solution to every problem.

yeah that's what we need right now to propose 1984 polices that will make everyone happy
“One of the serious problems of planning against Aggie doctrine is that the Aggies do not read their manuals nor do they feel any obligations to follow their doctrine.”
“The reason that the Aggies does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the Aggies practices chaos on a daily basis.”
“If we don’t know what we are doing, the enemy certainly can’t anticipate our future actions!”

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Narland
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Founded: Apr 19, 2013
Anarchy

Postby Narland » Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:48 pm

Purple Rats wrote:I wanna discuss the police issue in general matter, not only U.S based. I know in lot of places the police is not as extreme as in some other areas, but still I have been thinking about the alternatives. There are still terrible people who would abuse their freedom. So which could be alternatives if there would be no police in a way we have now?

The World in General
When speaking of the issue of police in general, it isn't a matter of alternatives to police power. Policing oneself and others from force and fraud is a part of human nature. The question is, wherein does the police power lay; and how then should it be distributed?

Everyone is going to at least try police themselves, their loved ones, and what is rightfully theirs (as individuals (the People), as the body politic (the government), or as the prevailing order (the state)) from force and fraud as best they can when given the chance. No one can police themselves 24/7 from force or fraud perpetrated against their life, liberty and justly gained property. So they must delegate the responsibility to others (whether in whole or in part, regularly or irregularly, organized or unorganized) through the best means they know how. There will always be police powers, the question is who gets to protect your interests, by what means, and how forcefully.

Of course there are those who call themselves police, and are no such thing. They are bullies, despots, liars, thieves, destroyers, and murderers. They need to be called out for their crimes and tried, so those who are lawfully policing the interests of their community justly can be given the respect deserved for their public service.

The United States in Particular
In the United States all police powers reside in the People (each and every one), and are delegated to police as Peace Officers subservient to them (the People) to protect the rights, privileges and immunities of the People (each and every one). They are members of the community of Americans in general, and the community their precincts in particular. Or at least that is the foundation for how our country was established.

The steady Marxification of the United States from Progressivist Era to create administration not by self-government but by "rational administrative state" (their words) / illegitimate bureaucracy (my words) to gradually implement Socialism is what created the concept of "Law Enforcement" (really a gendarmie of foreign style inspectors with a gun and badge and no proper military regimentation) as currently practiced, that owe allegiance not to the Constitution (although they pretend to swear by it) but to their own concept of the nation as a series of interlocking bureaucratic institutions apart from and over the People and the neo-Marxist principles, the procedures of which they emulate, has no place our Constitutional Republic.

Some have suggested reinstituting Peelian principles, but they are a compromise that exacerbates the problem. Returning to civic virtue of the People once again taking on their responsibility to police themselves firstly needs to be reinstalled as concepts in the body politic. Police who are not local and independent from the State, that are not wholly dependent upon the community they must needs be part, are a danger to the People, and cannot legitimately be called Police.

Almost everything wrong with police powers in the United States stem from the constant drift from Liberty and Equality of Classical Liberal Americanism based on the Self-Government by Common Law and Constitutional administration to increasing adoption of European Civil Law concepts, administration of Marxian Statism (via a confluence of manifold agency (generic term)) and thinking like a victimized unruly mob of unrealistic malcontents instead of like justly resolute individuals equipped to overcome life's obstacles come hell or high water.

I always assist a policeman when acting as a Peace Officer, always -- he is representing my interest. But I lawfully question every action of one when merely being law enforcement agents of an unelected bureaucracy, or especially when unconstitutionally acting as revenue agents of the Judiciary (especially). And when asked, am fully prepared to explain my actions, and behaviour as a law abiding citizen of the United States and as a resident of the State in which my Citizenship resides, and entreat the officer to do likewise. It isn't hard to understand that Police in the United States are given two mutually exclusive job descriptions (duly constituted Peace Officer protecting the life, liberty and property of each and every individual vs basely unconstitutional Law Enforcement Agent enforcing each and every regulation upon the hapless citizenry at the point of a gun) to go along with their low pay, and high stress -- a little bit of empathy for the plight of him who acts as Peace Officer above and beyond a mere Law Enforcement Agent goes a long way.
Last edited by Narland on Tue Jun 02, 2020 7:03 pm, edited 11 times in total.

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American Pere Housh
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Founded: Jan 12, 2019
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby American Pere Housh » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:02 pm

Neanderthaland wrote:We could just build police robots.

You Have 20 Seconds To Comply.

Robocop hell yeah
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Union of Sovereign States and Republics
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Founded: Nov 16, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Union of Sovereign States and Republics » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:08 pm

American Pere Housh wrote:
Neanderthaland wrote:We could just build police robots.

You Have 20 Seconds To Comply.

Robocop hell yeah

i'm still mad that he got put into MK11 and doomslayer didn't
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A m e n r i a
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Founded: Jun 08, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby A m e n r i a » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:21 pm

Ideal Britain wrote:
A m e n r i a wrote:
Probably far-right Islamic fundamentalists with machetes and sickles, maybe hammers too (heh). Way worse than our current police.

What about the Army?


Oh I thought we were talking about citizens enforcing order and excluding all government institutions. Now, the army, I can trust more than the FPI.
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Diarcesia
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Founded: Aug 21, 2016
Democratic Socialists

Postby Diarcesia » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:25 pm

A m e n r i a wrote:
Ideal Britain wrote:What about the Army?


Oh I thought we were talking about citizens enforcing order and excluding all government institutions. Now, the army, I can trust more than the FPI.

That didn't go well in Tiananmen.

Also, the world has been without Police since 2008. It's a shame, depending on who you ask.
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A m e n r i a
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Founded: Jun 08, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby A m e n r i a » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:28 pm

Diarcesia wrote:
A m e n r i a wrote:
Oh I thought we were talking about citizens enforcing order and excluding all government institutions. Now, the army, I can trust more than the FPI.

That didn't go well in Tiananmen.

Also, the world has been without Police since 2008. It's a shame, depending on who you ask.


What are you talking about? The police are doing better than ever, have you seen that video of the badass motorcycle chase? Or when they arrested that idiot wannabe influencer?
The Empire of Amenria (亚洲帝国)


Sinocentric Asian theocratic absolute monarchy. Set 28 years in the future, Amenria reflects the prosperity that would be brought about by a real, modernist, Islamic government.


Save yourselves from yourselves.

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Diarcesia
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Founded: Aug 21, 2016
Democratic Socialists

Postby Diarcesia » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:32 pm

A m e n r i a wrote:
Diarcesia wrote:That didn't go well in Tiananmen.

Also, the world has been without Police since 2008. It's a shame, depending on who you ask.


What are you talking about? The police are doing better than ever, have you seen that video of the badass motorcycle chase? Or when they arrested that idiot wannabe influencer?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Police
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Did you ever hear the tragedy of Leo "the Wise"?
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A m e n r i a
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Founded: Jun 08, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby A m e n r i a » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:36 pm

Diarcesia wrote:
A m e n r i a wrote:
What are you talking about? The police are doing better than ever, have you seen that video of the badass motorcycle chase? Or when they arrested that idiot wannabe influencer?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Police


Oh..lol
The Empire of Amenria (亚洲帝国)


Sinocentric Asian theocratic absolute monarchy. Set 28 years in the future, Amenria reflects the prosperity that would be brought about by a real, modernist, Islamic government.


Save yourselves from yourselves.

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Gig em Aggies
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Founded: Aug 15, 2009
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Gig em Aggies » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:38 pm

Diarcesia wrote:
A m e n r i a wrote:
What are you talking about? The police are doing better than ever, have you seen that video of the badass motorcycle chase? Or when they arrested that idiot wannabe influencer?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Police

well that's the only Police we could do without cause there music stinks
“One of the serious problems of planning against Aggie doctrine is that the Aggies do not read their manuals nor do they feel any obligations to follow their doctrine.”
“The reason that the Aggies does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the Aggies practices chaos on a daily basis.”
“If we don’t know what we are doing, the enemy certainly can’t anticipate our future actions!”

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Union of Sovereign States and Republics
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Founded: Nov 16, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Union of Sovereign States and Republics » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:40 pm

Gig em Aggies wrote:

well that's the only Police we could do without cause there music stinks

Take that back.
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In 1991, a plane carrying would-be conspirators of an armed coup crashed in the Crimean Peninsula. Without the coup, the Union of Sovereign States treaty was signed; and the USSR survived... NS states are not canon.
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Purple Rats
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Founded: Mar 20, 2020
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Purple Rats » Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:44 am

Sorry for sharing Facebook post, but I'm too lazy atm to start sharing all these pictures one by one here.

I do not know this person, someone in my friendslist just shared it, so just check the pictures. :)

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Greed and Death
Khan of Spam
 
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Founded: Mar 20, 2008
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Greed and Death » Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:48 am

A world without police ? Like the Judge Dredd system ?

Yes I could deal with that.
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Gig em Aggies
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Founded: Aug 15, 2009
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Gig em Aggies » Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:48 am

Greed and Death wrote:A world without police ? Like the Judge Dredd system ?

Yes I could deal with that.

well that system didn't work either one corrupt cop brought down the whole system. But on my regions rmb on of my region mates linked a story saying that Minneapolis was looking to dismantle the MPD and replace with something else. would that work with a city the size of Minneapolis.
“One of the serious problems of planning against Aggie doctrine is that the Aggies do not read their manuals nor do they feel any obligations to follow their doctrine.”
“The reason that the Aggies does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the Aggies practices chaos on a daily basis.”
“If we don’t know what we are doing, the enemy certainly can’t anticipate our future actions!”

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Region of Dwipantara
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Posts: 628
Founded: Dec 12, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Region of Dwipantara » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:23 pm

Are criminal investigation units, FBI (or substitute), and other agencies also erased in this scenario? I get the points about the brutalies and whatnot, but I don't really see how the alternative could be better at dealing with serial murder cases, hard drug trafficking, child porn industry, gang violence and just basic public laws.

A m e n r i a wrote:
Ideal Britain wrote:What about the Army?


Oh I thought we were talking about citizens enforcing order and excluding all government institutions. Now, the army, I can trust more than the FPI.


If anything, moderate Banser would prolly have a better shot than the FPI as they are more liked, more stability-friendly, and less likely to end up with burning churches and civil conflict. The nationalist Pemuda Pancasila might also have a shot, though according to my dad (who works in real estate), they are basically just thugs who likes to come and extort your money.
Last edited by Region of Dwipantara on Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Esteptanskia
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Founded: Jun 05, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Esteptanskia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:24 pm

Alternatives to the police include vigilantes, bounty hunters, militia, military, and private security companies, all of which would be horrible ideas. Police are good, at least where I am from they are. American police could certainly use some reform, though.
Last edited by Esteptanskia on Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Greater Ohio Valley
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Founded: Jan 19, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Greater Ohio Valley » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:27 pm

Neanderthaland wrote:We could just build police robots.

You Have 20 Seconds To Comply.

Image
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Region of Dwipantara
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Founded: Dec 12, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Region of Dwipantara » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:30 pm

Esteptanskia wrote:Alternatives to this police include vigilantes, bounty hunters, militia, military, and private security companies, all of which would be horrible ideas. Police are good, at least where I am from they are. American police could certainly use some reform, though.

Don't forget about gangs, cartels, and mafia organizations which may actually offer protection for its members.
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This sig is hacked by the FABULOUS #y0uNG_fOX3S. ¡RESTORE THE REPUBLIC, DESTROY THE KHILAFAH! Join the Alliance and the Fox today and we will Make Dwipantara Merdeka Again! ^OWO^
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 RADIO FREE SOUTHEAST ASIA | Charta Politica February polling: Pro-Khilafah  35.6% (PKI 28.7%, SI 6.9%); Pro-Republiken 64.4% (PAN 7.4%, PKB 13.2%, PRD 5.8%, PDDP 37.9%)

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Esteptanskia
Secretary
 
Posts: 26
Founded: Jun 05, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Esteptanskia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:34 pm

Region of Dwipantara wrote:
Esteptanskia wrote:Alternatives to this police include vigilantes, bounty hunters, militia, military, and private security companies, all of which would be horrible ideas. Police are good, at least where I am from they are. American police could certainly use some reform, though.

Don't forget about gangs, cartels, and mafia organizations which may actually offer protection for its members.


They will also protect your business at the cost of only 80% of your profits.

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Mandorus
Civilian
 
Posts: 1
Founded: Jun 05, 2020
Tyranny by Majority

Postby Mandorus » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:36 pm

I like the idea but I will probably die from shock just by seeing them... :eyebrow: :( ;)

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