In Defence of All Lives Matter

[Valrifell]

You do benefit from racism. Even if you as a person never did anything that could even be slightly construed as racist, even if you were the perfect ally, your life is made easier by institutionalized racism than the life of a POC. Racial oppression is in favor of white people, and as a white person who doesn't experience institutionalized racism, you cannot relate on the same level to racial oppression that a POC does. And POC are perfectly valid to distrust white people when white people are where the oppression comes from. They can't sit around and vet you before you walk through the meeting room doors.

The demand that you be allowed in every space, especially spaces that you cannot relate to on the same level, is entitlement of the highest fucking caliber.

I bet the system was really oppressive toward the likes of Barack Obama, Kamala Harris etc, but do go on about how white people benefit so heavily from the system.

Also, if black people can have black only spaces, whites can have their own too. You don't get to pick and choose who gets to segregate.

Survivorship bias is a poor basis to build an argument. That certain people under specific conditions made it is not evidence that anyone can do it or racism doesn't exist or whatever.

[The Two Jerseys]

You do benefit from racism. Even if you as a person never did anything that could even be slightly construed as racist, even if you were the perfect ally, your life is made easier by institutionalized racism than the life of a POC. Racial oppression is in favor of white people, and as a white person who doesn't experience institutionalized racism, you cannot relate on the same level to racial oppression that a POC does. And POC are perfectly valid to distrust white people when white people are where the oppression comes from. They can't sit around and vet you before you walk through the meeting room doors.

The demand that you be allowed in every space, especially spaces that you cannot relate to on the same level, is entitlement of the highest fucking caliber.

Quick question, are Japanese people in Japan the “oppressors”? Or has that flown out the window now that white people are in Japan?

Tell me what you think. I want to know your opinion on my example.

And following that, a lecture on why Bob Mugabe did nothing wrong...

[Ifreann]

You do benefit from racism. Even if you as a person never did anything that could even be slightly construed as racist, even if you were the perfect ally, your life is made easier by institutionalized racism than the life of a POC. Racial oppression is in favor of white people, and as a white person who doesn't experience institutionalized racism, you cannot relate on the same level to racial oppression that a POC does. And POC are perfectly valid to distrust white people when white people are where the oppression comes from. They can't sit around and vet you before you walk through the meeting room doors.

The demand that you be allowed in every space, especially spaces that you cannot relate to on the same level, is entitlement of the highest fucking caliber.

I bet the system was really oppressive toward the likes of Barack Obama, Kamala Harris etc, but do go on about how white people benefit so heavily from the system.

Also, if black people can have black only spaces, whites can have their own too. You don't get to pick and choose who gets to segregate.

Can any of you explain the relevance of this tangent to a defence the phrase "All Lives Matter"? Are you defending it? Is Stagnant Axon Terminal? Is ArenaC?

[Purple Rats]

It's no longer associated with that particular context, it's mostly used as a response to "black lives matter"

"Black lives matter"
"All lives matter, so put down that chicken".

I can see how they would not like that being chanted against them.

Animal right activist are not trying to bring down other equality movements. While I do stand up for animal rights, I don't see any benefit with answering like that to "black lives matter" statements.

About the thread: "all lives matter" kind of sounds like "straight pride", to be honest. Just being jealous that someone else has attention for while....

[Rojava Free State]

I bet the system was really oppressive toward the likes of Barack Obama, Kamala Harris etc, but do go on about how white people benefit so heavily from the system.

Also, if black people can have black only spaces, whites can have their own too. You don't get to pick and choose who gets to segregate.

Survivorship bias is a poor basis to build an argument. That certain people under specific conditions made it is not evidence that anyone can do it or racism doesn't exist or whatever.

I never said racism doesn't exist, but this idea that the system is just hunting black people for fun is a horrific oversimplification of the dynamics of race in America, and frankly i think class matters more than race.

What makes more sense to you? A race based white supremacist government where there's a shitload of minorities within it, or a class based government with zero poor members?

[Somerania]

Do Nazi lives matter? (I just want to through ethnicity out the window and focus on ideologies)

[Rojava Free State]

Do Nazi lives matter? (I just want to through ethnicity out the window and focus on ideologies)

That's a good question. I don't think we should kill people for being nazis but do nazi lives matter?

[The Two Jerseys]

Do Nazi lives matter? (I just want to through ethnicity out the window and focus on ideologies)

That's a good question. I don't think we should kill people for being nazis but do nazi lives matter?

Let's just operate under the assumption that they do, before we go down the "well then criminal lives don't matter either, let's forget trying to rehabilitate them and just hang 'em high!" tunnel.

[Valrifell]

That's a good question. I don't think we should kill people for being nazis but do nazi lives matter?

Let's just operate under the assumption that they do, before we go down the "well then criminal lives don't matter either, let's forget trying to rehabilitate them and just hang 'em high!" tunnel.

Every being with the capacity to reason is equally valid.

Thus Nazi lives do not matter.

[Rojava Free State]

Let's just operate under the assumption that they do, before we go down the "well then criminal lives don't matter either, let's forget trying to rehabilitate them and just hang 'em high!" tunnel.

Every being with the capacity to reason is equally valid.

Thus Nazi lives do not matter.

You just invalidated 6ix9ine's right to live.

[Alvecia]

The problem as I see it isn't that "All Live Matter" is a disagreeable stance, but that the phrase grew out of an opposition to the statement "Black Lives Matter". Thus (despite the content of the phrase) it comes across as implicitly disagreeing that black lives matter.

[Rojava Free State]

The problem as I see it isn't that "All Live Matter" is a disagreeable stance, but that the phrase grew out of an opposition to the statement "Black Lives Matter". Thus (despite the content of the phrase) it comes across as implicitly disagreeing that black lives matter.

I really don't like to take sides in that fight because all lives matter types tend to be like "you should respect the police" and because of what the police have done, I really can't.

But then BLM makes this all about black people and has segregated meetings and I can't get down with that either.

[Alvecia]

The problem as I see it isn't that "All Live Matter" is a disagreeable stance, but that the phrase grew out of an opposition to the statement "Black Lives Matter". Thus (despite the content of the phrase) it comes across as implicitly disagreeing that black lives matter.

I really don't like to take sides in that fight because all lives matter types tend to be like "you should respect the police" and because of what the police have done, I really can't.

But then BLM makes this all about black people and has segregated meetings and I can't get down with that either.

In a way I get it. I don't think they should be obliged to allow anyone to join if they want to keep the club more exclusive, so to speak. I'm sure there are plenty of other groups who are willing to do so.

[Rojava Free State]

I really don't like to take sides in that fight because all lives matter types tend to be like "you should respect the police" and because of what the police have done, I really can't.

But then BLM makes this all about black people and has segregated meetings and I can't get down with that either.

In a way I get it. I don't think they should be obliged to allow anyone to join if they want to keep the club more exclusive, so to speak. I'm sure there are plenty of other groups who are willing to do so.

Doesn't make them less bigoted. They have a right to be racist, but not a right to avoid criticism for it.

[Rusozak]

I think The Daily Show described it best (least I think I remember who said it correctly, may be wrong). It went something like this:

Responding to "Black Lives Matter" with "All lives matter" is like going to the doctor with an injured knee saying it needs attention, and the doctor's response is "all of our knees need attention" and dismissing you.

[Qabea]

The mainstream right: "All lives matter."
Also the mainstream right: endless wars against non-existent enemies, death penalty, healthcare and social security cuts, environmental degradation, etc.

[Page]

"All Lives Matter" isn't a movement and it isn't even a sentence meant to be taken literally, it's an obtuse and ignorant catchphrase used by people who are either ignorant of or refuse to acknowledge the disproportionate killing of black people by police.

It's not dissimilar from other instances of people reacting with hostility to movements in which they don't have a personal stake in. "Why are you only concerned with curing breast cancer? All cancers should be cured!" "Why do LGBT people celebrate their sexual orientation/gender identity, I don't base my whole identity on being straight and cisgender!"

Some demographics have unique struggles that other demographics don't deal with or at least to nowhere near the same extent, this isn't difficult to understand.

[ArenaC]

Well all lives matter, black, white, gay, Asian, you name it.

lol imagine believing all lives matter except white people

That strike was kinda me protesting being white.

[ArenaC]

"All Lives Matter" isn't a movement and it isn't even a sentence meant to be taken literally, it's an obtuse and ignorant catchphrase used by people who are either ignorant of or refuse to acknowledge the disproportionate killing of black people by police.

It's not dissimilar from other instances of people reacting with hostility to movements in which they don't have a personal stake in. "Why are you only concerned with curing breast cancer? All cancers should be cured!" "Why do LGBT people celebrate their sexual orientation/gender identity, I don't base my whole identity on being straight and cisgender!"

Some demographics have unique struggles that other demographics don't deal with or at least to nowhere near the same extent, this isn't difficult to understand.

I have one question.

Why are police shooting black people? Like they have NO RIGHT to discriminate

[Alvecia]

In a way I get it. I don't think they should be obliged to allow anyone to join if they want to keep the club more exclusive, so to speak. I'm sure there are plenty of other groups who are willing to do so.

Doesn't make them less bigoted. They have a right to be racist, but not a right to avoid criticism for it.

I dunno, is it bigoted to create a demographic exclusive club?

Like if I make an atheist club, no religious allowed. Is that discriminatory?
If I make a boys only club, no girls allowed. Is that discriminatory?

What about other factors? If I make a club that you have to pass a maths test to join, is that discriminatory against those less learned in maths?

[ArenaC]

lol imagine believing all lives matter except white people

Hot take: no lives matter

my God you’re right

[ArenaC]

Doesn't make them less bigoted. They have a right to be racist, but not a right to avoid criticism for it.

I dunno, is it bigoted to create a demographic exclusive club?

Like if I make an atheist club, no religious allowed. Is that discriminatory?
If I make a boys only club, no girls allowed. Is that discriminatory?

What about other factors? If I make a club that you have to pass a maths test to join, is that discriminatory against those less learned in maths?

Boys: yes! Only girls clubs are GREAT! ONly boys clubs are sexist! Get the idea? Double standard?!

[Rojava Free State]

"All Lives Matter" isn't a movement and it isn't even a sentence meant to be taken literally, it's an obtuse and ignorant catchphrase used by people who are either ignorant of or refuse to acknowledge the disproportionate killing of black people by police.

It's not dissimilar from other instances of people reacting with hostility to movements in which they don't have a personal stake in. "Why are you only concerned with curing breast cancer? All cancers should be cured!" "Why do LGBT people celebrate their sexual orientation/gender identity, I don't base my whole identity on being straight and cisgender!"

Some demographics have unique struggles that other demographics don't deal with or at least to nowhere near the same extent, this isn't difficult to understand.

Black people arent the only people killed by police for no good reason though. Even if you wanna pretend that police never shoot unarmed white people or rarely do, what about latinos or native americans?

[Purple Rats]

If "black lives matter" group is making black-only spaces, and discuss the movement, then the outcome of it would not be harmful for society. And I don't see a reason why black-only groups would be bad.

If there is white-only groups, there is way higher change of it to turn into white supremacy groups. because honestly, what race issues do we have that we would need to discuss in white-only groups?
I understand that in some areas being white would also lead to problems, but generally I just don't see the need of these groups.
it sounds fair to have white-only, if we have black-only groups, as "if they can, we can"... but in practice, it would be bad idea..

[Rojava Free State]

Doesn't make them less bigoted. They have a right to be racist, but not a right to avoid criticism for it.

I dunno, is it bigoted to create a demographic exclusive club?

Like if I make an atheist club, no religious allowed. Is that discriminatory?
If I make a boys only club, no girls allowed. Is that discriminatory?

What about other factors? If I make a club that you have to pass a maths test to join, is that discriminatory against those less learned in maths?

What if there was a white only club?