Open Season: "Vigilantes" Shoot Black Jogger in Georgia

[Albrenia]

MAD also tends to not work as a deterrent when self-destruction is one of the goals, but that doesn't apply in this case, since the shooters don't appear to have been suicidal.

[Cannot think of a name]

The same result with a greater risk of collateral damage and an excuse to justify murder? Is that what you're asking?

They already have an excuse. That's been this whole thread.

As we know, we don't treat armed black people the same way we treat armed white people.

Yes.

That's just silly. You're setting yourself up for dissapointment.

No, I'm holding a public institution to a higher standard instead of making their excuses for them.

Sure it does. If it doesn't seem risk free, people won't do it as frequently. Slowly a March towards the perfect ideal of MAD.

It's this mentality that contributed to Ahmaud Arbery being shot in the middle of the street.

[Bombadil]

Anyway, this isn't particularly about the right to own guns, it's about two racist shitbags who hunted down and shot an innocent person trying to protect himself and then a police force that were criminally negligent in their investigations.

[Ifreann]

I would say that there's a subset of racism apologists who are afraid that this undermines their whole 'good guy with a gun' narrative. They've pitched this whole notion that guns are absolutely vital because we live in a wild west hellscape that means you have to be armed at all times to protect yourself. Accepting that these guys were completely in the wrong (as they were) forces them to confront their own Wyatt Earp reality as problematic. So they're willing to twist themselves into a pretzel to justify the murder of a black man because if they're honest with themselves, this is what they've been advocating for the entire time.

I mean. I've kind of pointed out that had be been armed he could have shot them.

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

[Liriena]

I mean. I've kind of pointed out that had be been armed he could have shot them.

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

But what if he had been armed and been accompanied by an armed black militia, huh?

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

[Bombadil]

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

But what if he had been armed and been accompanied by an armed black militia, huh?

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

That's already the case in Michigan.

[Ifreann]

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

But what if he had been armed and been accompanied by an armed black militia, huh?

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

The virgin good guy with a gun vs the Chad half dozen good guys with guns.

[Cannot think of a name]

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

But what if he had been armed and been accompanied by an armed black militia, huh?

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

Wish granted.

[Purdium]

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

You probably get mad whenever an armed protest happens except for this one time

[Gormwood]

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

You probably get mad whenever an armed protest happens except for this one time

When did the Black Panthers threaten government officials who are calling for people to follow coronavirus protocols? Swing and a miss.

[Galloism]

You probably get mad whenever an armed protest happens except for this one time

When did the Black Panthers threaten government officials who are calling for people to follow coronavirus protocols? Swing and a miss.

Notably, when the armed black panthers interrupted the California assembly in the 1960s, it led to sweeping gun control changes in California which largely persist through today.

[Caracasus]

He wasn't armed. He was a normal person out for a jog, so he wasn't carrying a gun and these two fuckheads, one of whom was an ex cop, murdered him. And they would have gotten away with it if there hadn't been undeniable video evidence and pressure because no one was investigating it properly.

Yes. And had he been armed they would be the ones dead right now, wouldn't they?

Probably not, no. Most people don't shoot other people for no damn reason and there's no reason to believe different of this guy. Like I said, he was a normal person going for a jog.

We do know that these two racist pricks will gun down an unarmed person in cold blood though because that's exactly what they did.

Again, the big question is how far the rot goes and why this wasn't investigated properly right from the start.

[The Alma Mater]

He wasn't armed. He was a normal person out for a jog, so he wasn't carrying a gun and these two fuckheads, one of whom was an ex cop, murdered him. And they would have gotten away with it if there hadn't been undeniable video evidence and pressure because no one was investigating it properly.

Yes. And had he been armed they would be the ones dead right now, wouldn't they?

Ex-cop and son with shotgun vs black untrained youth with pistol.
I'd hope not. That would make police training look rather pathetic.

[Cannot think of a name]

Yes. And had he been armed they would be the ones dead right now, wouldn't they?

Ex-cop and son with shotgun vs black untrained youth with pistol.
I'd hope not. That would make police training look rather pathetic.

Well, earlier in the thread we learned that they weren't big on training...

[HC Eredivisie]

''In my defence, the orphanage did attack me first.'''


Why would one go into a construction site though?

You’ve never visited under construction homes before? Or taken a crap in one?

Yes, but that was my uncle's new house under construction with him there and no. I find it weird to just enter a construction site, let alone use the bathroom there but maybe it's a cultural difference.

[Rojava Free State]

He'd probably have gotten shot as soon as he drew his gun if he'd had one.

But what if he had been armed and been accompanied by an armed black militia, huh?

The Emerald Legion is making a very good argument for more Black Panthers on the streets keeping violent racists in check and I for one am all for it.

With how chaotic modern America is getting, militias/civilian defense patrols are gonna be a thing if they aren't already.

You heard of free Derry, but one day there may be a free Dearborn.

[Rojava Free State]

You’ve never visited under construction homes before? Or taken a crap in one?

Yes, but that was my uncle's new house under construction with him there and no. I find it weird to just enter a construction site, let alone use the bathroom there but maybe it's a cultural difference.

Are you American?

[Rojava Free State]

Yes. And had he been armed they would be the ones dead right now, wouldn't they?

Ex-cop and son with shotgun vs black untrained youth with pistol.
I'd hope not. That would make police training look rather pathetic.

This is why I support keeping automatic weapons legal. Yes, you heard right.

Automatic weapons. Much of America is at that point where you would be more than justified to have an AK47 on you.

[Rojava Free State]

When did the Black Panthers threaten government officials who are calling for people to follow coronavirus protocols? Swing and a miss.

Notably, when the armed black panthers interrupted the California assembly in the 1960s, it led to sweeping gun control changes in California which largely persist through today.

This is the real reason governments often support gun control.

[HC Eredivisie]

Yes, but that was my uncle's new house under construction with him there and no. I find it weird to just enter a construction site, let alone use the bathroom there but maybe it's a cultural difference.

Are you American?

Dutch.

[The Alma Mater]

You’ve never visited under construction homes before? Or taken a crap in one?

Yes, but that was my uncle's new house under construction with him there and no. I find it weird to just enter a construction site, let alone use the bathroom there but maybe it's a cultural difference.

I quite liked to explore construction sites (or buildings that were being demolished)...

[Rojava Free State]

Are you American?

Dutch.

Yeah we tend to take massive dumps in construction sites here.

What's that? No one else does that? ...well kids we'll see you next time on That didn't happen.

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

So I watched the videos as they have been released. From what I can tell

Victim was jogging. He repeatedly trespassed into a construction site but did not steal anything. One day a few neighbors saw him doing so and called the police and said he might be armed. After speaking with the police the three of them grabbed their guns and loaded up into two pickup trucks. They followed him and cut him off. He responded by running away in the opposite direction. They turned around and cut him off again. This time Gregory McMichael exited the truck. The neighbor had his cellphone out and was recording as Gregory shot Ahmaud Arbery several times with a shotgun as Ahmaud charged, grabbed the gun, and began punching. The former police officer Travis McMichael, and the other neighbor did not fire their guns. The Victim was pronounced dead at the scene. The initial investigation seems to have been poorly done with only Travis being interviewed conclusively. It was deemed self defense. I cannot find if the video was presented to the officer or kept secret. A couple months later the video was made public. Within 36 hours the McMichael's were arrested and charged for murder (record timing for bureaucrats to reopen a case). There is no evidence of racism besides a "gut feeling" some have.

This case will likely hinge upon whether or not the victim was told that they wanted him to stop so the police could speak with him. It also matters if weapons were pointed at him which is in and of itself a serious crime in the US. If (after repeatedly cutting him off) he was approached without being told why or with guns pointed at him he would have every single right to protect himself. The son will go to prison. Probably for 20 years. The father might be let off as he did not shoot. The neighbor might get arrested if he hid the video from the investigation. The investigator might lose his position if he didn't follow procedure but likely keep his job if he is union. If nobody gets jailtime then dumb people will probably riot and burn down black owned businesses to protest racism just like in Ferguson, LA, Detroit etcetera. Regardless SJW's will propagate the idea that justice was not served regardless of what happens.

[Cannot think of a name]

So I watched the videos as they have been released. From what I can tell

Victim was jogging. Herepeatedly trespassed into a construction site but did not steal anything.

No. On the day, he briefly went into the site and didn't steal or really touch anything. A wide variety of people entered the place on other days including a couple, some kids, and an unidentified man that has not been definitively identified as Ahmaud. The English family that owns the home have been clear, they didn't have a problem with this, did not contact or know the McMicheals nor would they like any part in the attempts to justify the murder of Ahmaud Arbery.

One day a few neighbors saw him doing so and called the police and said he might be armed.

No. No one thought he was armed. The McMichaels didn't even have direct knowledge of him being on the English's property.

After speaking with the police the three of them grabbed their guns and loaded up into two pickup trucks.

The man who took the video denies being part of the McMicheal's 'posse'. Whether that's true or not remains to be seen.

They followed him and cut him off. He responded by running away in the opposite direction. They turned around and cut him off again. This time Gregory McMichael exited the truck. The neighbor had his cellphone out and was recording as Gregory shot Ahmaud Arbery several times with a shotgun as Ahmaud charged, grabbed the gun, and began punching.

McMicheal stood in the middle of the street and by his own admission told Ahmaud to stop. Ahmaud ran around the other side of the truck where the armed McMicheal moved to cut him off once again telling him to stop. At this point Ahmaud has every reason to fear for his life and the McMicheals had no cause or authority to stop him. Ahmaud defended himself unsuccessfully.

The former police officer Travis McMichael, and the other neighbor did not fire their guns. The Victim was pronounced dead at the scene. The initial investigation seems to have been poorly done with only Travis being interviewed conclusively. It was deemed self defense. I cannot find if the video was presented to the officer or kept secret.

The police had the the footage the day of the murder. McMicheals had a relationship with both the first and second prosecutors in the case and went so far as to tell the Arbery family that he was killed in the act of a robbery.

A couple months later the video was made public.

By the worlds worst lawyer.

Within 36 hours the McMichael's were arrested and charged for murder (record timing for bureaucrats to reopen a case). There is no evidence of racism besides a "gut feeling" some have.

History, context, the fact that there was damn near a parade of people entering the house that somehow didn't justify loading up with guns and trying to stop anyone.

This case will likely hinge upon whether or not the victim was told that they wanted him to stop so the police could speak with him.

They did not, nor did they have the authority or cause to stop Ahmaud.

It also matters if weapons were pointed at him which is in and of itself a serious crime in the US.

Weeks after the event Georgia lawmakers sought to change the law in Georgia to make aiming the gun specifically required for the gun to be a threat. At the time of the murder of Ahmaud Arbery brandishing a gun during a confrontation was enough to merit a threat. Which is what McMichaels was doing.

If (after repeatedly cutting him off) he was approached without being told why or with guns pointed at him he would have every single right to protect himself.

Which is exactly what happened. Bonus points, telling him why doesn't matter for shit, they did not have the authority or cause to stop him.

The son will go to prison. Probably for 20 years. The father might be let off as he did not shoot. The neighbor might get arrested if he hid the video from the investigation. The investigator might lose his position if he didn't follow procedure but likely keep his job if he is union.

Two. Two of them eventually had to recuse themselves.

If nobody gets jailtime then dumb people will probably riot and burn down black owned businesses to protest racism just like in Ferguson, LA, Detroit etcetera. Regardless SJW's will propagate the idea that justice was not served regardless of what happens.

It will be a massive miscarriage of justice that people will be rightfully upset about.

[Greed and Death]

So I watched the videos as they have been released. From what I can tell

Victim was jogging. He repeatedly trespassed into a construction site but did not steal anything. One day a few neighbors saw him doing so and called the police and said he might be armed.

So here is the thing with the trespassing. Many people trespassed at that house and the most likely reason they did so was because the front lawn had a faucet, he likely was stopping to get water. Now onto trespassing builders typically don't mind because prospective buyers may be more inclined to buy if they see how a house is built. The sign is there for two reasons 1. it limits the liability of the builder if there is an injury on premise, and 2. It makes it easier to evict squatters.